It was difficult (it usually is) to comment on the game Saturday...emotions..etc. but I want to share my thoughts based on memory and the Highlights I have watched today.This is also based in answer to some of the critism England have kopped (just to make a change) in certain quarters!
Firstly England werent that bad - the way some people are going on you would think they just got knocked out - lets just remember that Argentina are no mugs and are one of the seeded teams having finished 3rd last time out. Of all the top teams - NZ would of put 100 points past Tonga not long ago but looked less than ruthless and dare I say it beatable (I appreciate they will probably get better - but so will everyone), Scotland - well this seems to of gone unnoticed doesnt it - hohoho chuckle chuckle werent Scotland lucky in the end - WHAT - if that was England it would be all over the World press i.e. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10751108 Scotland beat the worst team in the group by the skin of their teeth. France were on the ropes with 25 minutes to go against Japan who are FAR from a world super power who knows what would of happened if Japan had taken the lead, Australia were 6-6 at half time, Ireland coughed and spluttered past the USA (England "only" beat them 28-10 last time and were trashed in the world press), Wales were excellent but unlucky - they lost - and on the flip side SA were nearly beaten by a side that everyone outside of Wales thought should of been beaten by more.
So England got their hardest game in the group out of the way with a victory!
Secondly - the referee
Look - Im not saying he was biased - but come on he wasnt that great and greatly inconsistant - ok he got all the no brainers right and fair play for that - but the offside at the breakdown decisions were picky at best - ridiculous at the worst - his coming off your feet decisions were awful - Im talking against both sides here - I know you have to play the ref but COME ON neither team were well treated. Also 3 pens in 7 minutes and Eng get a warning - 5 in 5 for the Pumas and nothing? - Im not gonna go into individual decisions any deeper - Im just saying Harsh and Inconsistant are the key words here.
Thirdly - The Lawes Citing is a Joke - check out the knee action from Quade Cooper in this clip - guess how long he was banned for - thats right - HE WASNT http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9RYZStDdDI
As for the various points on the team themselves - once you have removed the indiscipline - we wernt that bad - Argentina did what they set out to do - and when Jonny had an off day and the crowd got behind the pumas and the clock ticked away - the pressure was on and any mistakes were magnified - Argentina made a few breaks and we should of stopped them - fair enough - but we stopped them in the end - they never scored did they? ordinarily Agentina are not great at kicking for goal - JW is - we would and should of won by more.
Any critism of JW outside of his kicking is ridiculous - having watched the highlights - his play making and distribution was fine - the Pumas were on red alert for Manu.
Youngs (who is our first choice) came on and gave us the quick ball and new ideas that we needed (this is why he was picked in the first place) - Stevens and Hartley came on and turned our front row into an unstoppable machine - the passion that Stevens showed by the way was amazing.
The fact that it was tight was just the competitiveness of the 2 teams and the tournament as a whole.
In the cold light of day Martin Johnson will be more than happy and possibly the happiest of the NH teams - and to all of the people that want to remain pre occupied with England while your own team are still in the world cup, and to any England fans out there that want to slate your own team and players for winning - well - I feel sorry for you
Match Report - The Dust Has Settled
posted on 13/9/11
Hello Ginger - fancy seeing you here
You are right Dingbat - there is not enough reepect being shown to a lot of teams
As for the citing - we may need to agree to disagree - ive watched it today on the highlights and I just dont see it - I just cant see any intent or malice - just a lumbering lock going toward the man - he slid on his knees - I suppose its subjective and after getting a 2 match ban I have to accept it - but they gave him 2 instead of 3 cos he showed remorse - but he pleaded not guilty - it all stinks of kangeroo court to me - anyway - I know you have your wedding coming up - but have you done your predictions - priorities an all that
posted on 13/9/11
Hi Lydne
I had to ENDURE the last five minutes around a friends house on Saturday morning.
A win is a win as the cliché goes
posted on 14/9/11
Well I think part of that comment was aimed at me in regards to Wilkinson so allow me to go into more detail as you called it "Ridiculous".
I have been critical of him in regards to him providing a platform for our backs to create breaks, something which Toby Flood does much better in my view. Before you misunderstand me, I am not saying he is a bad player, just that if we want explosive backs (I hope we all do) we need to play Flood. The main reasons I feel are as follows. He isnt a threat running with the ball, this allows the defence to not have to worry and concentrate on our runners more. He stands further behind the gain line which in turn makes it harder for people to break it. His pass is more lethargic and not as accurate in my opinion. The difference is subtle but makes a big impact on our backline.
Since the last world cup JW has played many games, can you name me one where our backs have been explosive, making breaks and scoring tries at will? I cant. Flood on the other hand has many such games, is this a coincidence? I think not.
Now we clearly have different views on this but to say any criticism of JW in his gameplay is ridiculous, is quite frankly ridiculous.
As for the game itself, I dont think it was a disaster at all. Argentina are tough and it was the first game. We won and that is the main point but we could have done better. I am hopeful that will happen but for our backs to flourish I feel we need the Youngs/Flood pair that has been so impressive. This is the team I would like to see if everyone was/is fit:-
Sherdian
Hartley
Stevens
Lawes
Palmer
Croft
Moody
Easter
Youngs
Flood
Ashton
Tindall
Tuilagi
Cueto
Foden
Once more unto the breach!
posted on 14/9/11
Oh, on another note I agree with everything else in your article.
posted on 14/9/11
Aristo - it wasnt aimed at you or anyone in particular - just a general comment on the JW snipes - you are right we will have to agree to disagree Im afraid - I just dont think Flood is good enough - a good player - but not good enough - I watched the highlights yesterday - and its not enough to make a proper assessment - but I suppose it was backed up by my memories of Saturday - Manu was heavily markedthroughout the game it was difficult to let him rip - a bit more experience on his part will maybe free him up - on the Whole JW did a good job - he is a good playmaker but he needs options to work with - either way I wont be so quick to delete the full game next week - so that I can check out what people are saying - I am happy to take another view if its shown to me
Picking Saturdays team is massivly full of opinions - I suppose it depends on your view of Georgia - I think - as today - they will be big up front but lacking the experience to do anything with it - England need a good experienced pack - battle hardened - but I feel we can rest some of our key players
I would play
Corbs
Thompson
Cole
obviously Sheridan has gone home - Stevens was amazing when he came on last week - and his passion was great to see - he loved coming on you could tell - but he plays both tight and loosehead - do the others? If this was a knockout game or game v a better team - I would go with your front row - but for this game I would play the above
Shaw
Palmer
Lawes is banned - Shaw wont get many opportunities and this battle could be perfect for him
Croft
Easter
Moody
I agree with your back row - but Moody for the same reasons as Shaw - the others we could do with resting at some point - I think the back row v Arg was our strongest - we need to rotate the others around games
Youngs
Wilkinson
I would of gone with Flood if JW hadnt missed those kicks - but he could do with starting and kicking
Hape
Manu
Im starting to realise as I write this (Aristodemus) that in your mind you are looking at playing our strongest team - where as Im looking at resting players - isnt sport great
I think we should take the opportunity to rest Tindall - and get Hape some gametime (even though I dont rate him) - Manu needs the games
Ashton
Cueto
Armitage
Simply cos I want to save Foden
I think your team is nearly the team I would play v the Scots - but the games in between - I would be playing similar teams to mine
What do you think of my logic ???
posted on 14/9/11
actually - when I say your front row - obviously Sheridan is un available so is it
Corbs
Hartley
Stevens
or
Stevens
Hartley
Cole
or is someone else coming perhaps?
posted on 14/9/11
I would go with Corbisiero from now on yes. The team I stated was just for England's finest, not for the Georgia match or even for the WC. You can watch the full game at itvplayer too, as for the team against Georgia I could go with that but obviously I want Flood playing. Niggles and such have to be taken into account though.
I am curious as to why you think he isnt good enough, did you see our AI game against Aus last year? I thought he was immense throughout the 6nations and in the two games down under last summer too.
posted on 14/9/11
Yeah he was immense v australia - awesome in fact - and last summer I agree he played well - very good v Wales and excellent v Italy (which by the way was a totally under rated performance by the whole team) - but he did fall away in the 6N for me - and maybe not good enough is sort of the wrong phrase after my comments above - but Im not sure he can grab a game by the scruff of the neck or come up with something special especially when things are not going well - and his kicking (from hand and for goal) is not as strong as Jonnys - Jonny has really only got back to full fitness at the start of last seasonand has had as good a season with Toulon as Flood has had with the Tigers - if not better - and has proved that he is the man for the big occassion - funnily enough I was talking Fly Halfs with a friend this morning - Im starting to think - when this tournament is over - maybe we should throw our weight behind Farrell.
posted on 14/9/11
I am glad you appreciated those performances by him. I think his kicking from hand is better than JW to be fair but he keeps it in hand alot more (which i like). As for changing games that are going badly, maybe you have a case, but I cant think of any instances JW has either. Wilkinson is the man for goal kicking though, which is why he is the perfect guy for the bench. Also you have to tie in the fact that not many games have been going badly with Youngs/Flood.
As for young guys coming through, George Ford is going to be our future. Flood has a few years I think first. You may think I am a Leicester fan now, but I am not.
posted on 14/9/11
On the whole my issues with the JW knocking are based on the fact that people these days rarely look at anything other than his goal kicking - and tend to get creative when judging his game based on selective passages of play and conversion ratios. In fact - if people actually watched him on the field outside of this - his positional play and playmaking is first class - as I have pointed out on here before (broken record time) - he was awarded best foreign player in France last season - and that is the most free flowing, open, running league in the northern hemisphere - remenber the injuries that he has suffered in the last 6 years would of finished most players off - give him the chance to show he is the best - and he wont let us down - by the way - i disagree with your kicking from hand opinion
If Youngs is at his best - the quick ball and new ideas that he provides will work well with JW - the only thing I will say is that Flood is obviously used to playing with Youngs