Gary Neville, Jamie Carragher, Rio Ferdinand, Gary Lineker and others write to Government in bid to set up independent football regulator that would outlaw any future attempts to abandon traditional pyramid.
Details for anyone wishing to support this petition and get it to 100k.
Link to petition: https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/584632
Open letter: https://gary-neville.medium.com/an-open-letter-e5b4749fb50a
As football fans, we were appalled by the attempt to set up a European Super League.
It was a direct threat to the integrity of the game; destroying the concept of sporting merit and open competition.
Supporters came together with one voice to oppose the cynical power-grab by a group of wealthy owners. The furious protests were heard and the breakaway fell apart.
Now we must make sure this never happens again. Without swift and direct intervention, the return of a European Super League will be a constant threat.
We welcome the fan-led Government review of the game and hope it leads to lasting change on an array of important concerns; including co-ordinated strategies to deal with racism, supporters’ representation within clubs, LGBTQ issues, ticket costs and the distribution of income. All of those aims can be realised if we take decisive action now.
It is time to act. We support:
• Government legislation to block any Premier League clubs attempting to abandon the country’s football pyramid.
•The appointment of an Independent Football Regulator.
This regulatory body would have a duty to represent the interests of supporters, protect against bad practices, adjudicate as the overarching body on matters involving the FA, Premier League and EFL and, generally, seek to prioritise the wider good of the game, rather than allow clubs to act solely in their own self-interests.
We, the undersigned, have a voice in the media.
We want your voices to join with ours.
Your voices are more important.
Say ‘No’ to a European Super League.
Say ‘Yes’, to changing the game for the better.
Sign this petition to make your voice heard peacefully:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/584632
Signed:
Jan Aage Fjörtoft
Jamie Carragher
Rio Ferdinand
Darren Fletcher
Gary Lineker
Gary Neville
Jamie Redknapp
Micah Richards
Petition for Independent Football Regulator
posted on 17/5/21
Let's just recap the implications of the Super League.
1) It would be controlled by a self-selected group of rich clubs, who would be permanent members of the league (regardless of sporting performance in the SL itself or in their domestic leagues).
2) Some other clubs would be invited to participate from season to season, but without those guarantees or the regular revenue streams involved.
3) It would ring-fence higher revenue for the member clubs in perpetuity, vastly increasing and cementing their existing financial advantage over other clubs.
4) The impact on domestic leagues, should they continue to take part in them, would be catastrophic. The PL would contain 6 clubs that exist in a different financial galaxy to the others, so could blow them out of the water in terms of salaries and transfer fees. In addition, those 6 clubs would never face any jeopardy or incentives to qualify for elite European competition. The remaining 14 clubs might compete to get an invitation to the ESL (in which they would compete at a financial disadvantage) or to qualify for the UEFA CL as the highest placed non-ESL club. It would be a two-tier league which meant much less than before, particularly to the biggest clubs.
-------
I cant decide if this is a description of the status quo or what will happen under an ESL.
All the above are already happening to some extent. All the ESL needed was to incorporate relegation and promotion.
posted on 17/5/21
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 hour, 15 minutes ago
The fact that any football fan could support it is staggering.
It was designed to make the rich, richer, nothing else.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a fact of life, and that won't change.
Football is no different, it's just that people didn't like what they heard and now getting rich/richer is suddenly a bad thing because football is so sacred...nah, EVERYTHING has a price...even our beloved football game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Every single comment here that's speaking up against opposition to bending over for the owners of the richest clubs is based on cynicism. The argument is "money already plays an important part in the sport, so why bother preventing it's total takeover?" The hypocrisy argument ("these people are well paid in an industry corrupted by money and yet they are speaking out against making it even more corrupted?!" is just a variant of the same cynical point of view.
Two things about cynics.
First, they assume things can't get better. They assume the world is always ruled by the worst human instincts. But if you look around you, there are many examples of people setting aside self-interest to make things better through collaboration. From historic achievements that modern democratic society rest upon (like universal healthcare) to the football-specific example of how German regulation has created clubs that are supporter-centred.
Secondly, cynics assume that things can't get worse. It's not worth trying to make things better because the world is a static thing, governed by our worst instincts. It can always get worse if, let alone not trying to make things better, you don't care about protecting what you have.
posted on 17/5/21
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - The Artist Formerly Known as Prince (U1282)
posted 9 minutes ago
Let's just recap the implications of the Super League.
1) It would be controlled by a self-selected group of rich clubs, who would be permanent members of the league (regardless of sporting performance in the SL itself or in their domestic leagues).
2) Some other clubs would be invited to participate from season to season, but without those guarantees or the regular revenue streams involved.
3) It would ring-fence higher revenue for the member clubs in perpetuity, vastly increasing and cementing their existing financial advantage over other clubs.
4) The impact on domestic leagues, should they continue to take part in them, would be catastrophic. The PL would contain 6 clubs that exist in a different financial galaxy to the others, so could blow them out of the water in terms of salaries and transfer fees. In addition, those 6 clubs would never face any jeopardy or incentives to qualify for elite European competition. The remaining 14 clubs might compete to get an invitation to the ESL (in which they would compete at a financial disadvantage) or to qualify for the UEFA CL as the highest placed non-ESL club. It would be a two-tier league which meant much less than before, particularly to the biggest clubs.
-------
I cant decide if this is a description of the status quo or what will happen under an ESL.
All the above are already happening to some extent. All the ESL needed was to incorporate relegation and promotion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The lack of relegation and promotion wasn't a bug: it was THE feature. The leaders of the ESL have been lobbying UEFA aggressively to push European competitions in this direction, with some success (see the proposed Swiss model of the future CL). But if what I described is indistinguishable from the status quo, why on earth did the 12 clubs take the step of organising the coup? I put it to you that they wanted a much larger slice of the pie than they get now, they wanted to be liberated from the risk of losing revenue when they underperform, and resented the modest amount of CL revenue that UEFA distributes to the national football associations to support the grassroots game.
No one is seriously arguing that UEFA is an exemplary or transparent organisation and that the current structures don't need reform. But no one can seriously argue that the ESL was doing anything but magnifying all of the very worst aspects of the status quo.
To bring this back to the original point of the thread, some people are now calling for better regulation. The current petition relates to the domestic English game, though there are many who want the same principles extended across European football. Several people on this thread have a starting point seems that the UEFA status quo is to some degree subject to the same corrupting influence of big money as the ESL. But instead of advocating reform of the current regulatory landscape to reduce the way financial clout warps sporting competition, they are hostile to reform, and instead overtly or by implication support the ESL and therefore total capitulation to the footballing plutocrats.
Abject cynicism.
posted on 17/5/21
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 55 minutes ago
the theory of football is a club could be founded tomorrow apply to the lowest league and work its way up the various structures to the premier league. If you have a billion or so spare i'm sure you could do it no problem.
The ESL would have locked that club out of the top european level ,thats all.
----------------------------------------------------------
Not just that club, but any club that manages to overcome the financial disadvantages of their position and, through hard work and clever strategy, outperform the most valuable clubs. Leicester are the most recent example, but throughout the years of the PL there have been various clubs outside the 'Big 6' that have finished in the CL places, and many times that the so-called Big 6 have failed to do so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a nonsensical argument against it to be honest, there are many good arguments against it, this certainly isn't one
In the last 20 years there have been 3? Instances of non big 6 teams claiming a CL spot. And I think that includes Leicester this season.
The ESL would have guaranteed a spot for a team outside the big 6 year after year after year. Literally going from 3 spots in 20 years to 20 spots in 20 years.
Again, the ESL was far from perfect, but your argument is more in favour of the competition than against it. The CL is a closed shop in all but name. Especially with the changes that a) ensure the big teams qualify b) Bigger groups to allow more minnows in, reducing group stage upsets
The ESL was just honest enough to give up the pretence.
posted on 17/5/21
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 55 minutes ago
the theory of football is a club could be founded tomorrow apply to the lowest league and work its way up the various structures to the premier league. If you have a billion or so spare i'm sure you could do it no problem.
The ESL would have locked that club out of the top european level ,thats all.
----------------------------------------------------------
Not just that club, but any club that manages to overcome the financial disadvantages of their position and, through hard work and clever strategy, outperform the most valuable clubs. Leicester are the most recent example, but throughout the years of the PL there have been various clubs outside the 'Big 6' that have finished in the CL places, and many times that the so-called Big 6 have failed to do so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a nonsensical argument against it to be honest, there are many good arguments against it, this certainly isn't one
In the last 20 years there have been 3? Instances of non big 6 teams claiming a CL spot. And I think that includes Leicester this season.
The ESL would have guaranteed a spot for a team outside the big 6 year after year after year. Literally going from 3 spots in 20 years to 20 spots in 20 years.
Again, the ESL was far from perfect, but your argument is more in favour of the competition than against it. The CL is a closed shop in all but name. Especially with the changes that a) ensure the big teams qualify b) Bigger groups to allow more minnows in, reducing group stage upsets
The ESL was just honest enough to give up the pretence.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is just another argument based on cynicism: "it's already pretty stacked in favour of the rich clubs, so why not pull up the drawbridge altogether?" And you're offering this in opposition to the impulse to reform the status quo, not in opposition to those defending the status quo.
You're also factually wrong. In the last 20 years there have been 6 occasions when clubs outside the "Big 6" (namely Leeds, Newcastle, Everton and Leicester) qualified for the CL, not counting Leicester's possible qualification this year. Chelsea's qualification before Abramovich bought the club could arguably be added to that list. There would have been more non-Big-6 instances had the top 4 qualified throughout that period. But setting that aside, that's approximately a third of the time a club outside that group has qualified. Moreover, much more often than not over the same period one or more of the Big 6 has missed out on finishing in the top 6 and therefore other clubs have benefited from European competition.
Of course that's still a picture of too much dominance by clubs with the biggest resources. You seem to be motivated by the aim to accelerate that dominance rather than challenge it. And yet you write disparagingly about the status quo.
posted on 17/5/21
pundits afraid of losing future income want to prevent businesses from breaking away and tie them in to a monopoly
shock horror
posted on 17/5/21
Petition has now received 100,000 signatures! Should find out tomorrow what date parliament will debate it.
posted on 17/5/21
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 5 hours, 23 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 55 minutes ago
the theory of football is a club could be founded tomorrow apply to the lowest league and work its way up the various structures to the premier league. If you have a billion or so spare i'm sure you could do it no problem.
The ESL would have locked that club out of the top european level ,thats all.
----------------------------------------------------------
Not just that club, but any club that manages to overcome the financial disadvantages of their position and, through hard work and clever strategy, outperform the most valuable clubs. Leicester are the most recent example, but throughout the years of the PL there have been various clubs outside the 'Big 6' that have finished in the CL places, and many times that the so-called Big 6 have failed to do so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a nonsensical argument against it to be honest, there are many good arguments against it, this certainly isn't one
In the last 20 years there have been 3? Instances of non big 6 teams claiming a CL spot. And I think that includes Leicester this season.
The ESL would have guaranteed a spot for a team outside the big 6 year after year after year. Literally going from 3 spots in 20 years to 20 spots in 20 years.
Again, the ESL was far from perfect, but your argument is more in favour of the competition than against it. The CL is a closed shop in all but name. Especially with the changes that a) ensure the big teams qualify b) Bigger groups to allow more minnows in, reducing group stage upsets
The ESL was just honest enough to give up the pretence.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is just another argument based on cynicism: "it's already pretty stacked in favour of the rich clubs, so why not pull up the drawbridge altogether?" And you're offering this in opposition to the impulse to reform the status quo, not in opposition to those defending the status quo.
You're also factually wrong. In the last 20 years there have been 6 occasions when clubs outside the "Big 6" (namely Leeds, Newcastle, Everton and Leicester) qualified for the CL, not counting Leicester's possible qualification this year. Chelsea's qualification before Abramovich bought the club could arguably be added to that list. There would have been more non-Big-6 instances had the top 4 qualified throughout that period. But setting that aside, that's approximately a third of the time a club outside that group has qualified. Moreover, much more often than not over the same period one or more of the Big 6 has missed out on finishing in the top 6 and therefore other clubs have benefited from European competition.
Of course that's still a picture of too much dominance by clubs with the biggest resources. You seem to be motivated by the aim to accelerate that dominance rather than challenge it. And yet you write disparagingly about the status quo.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where was the push for reforms before the ESL came up?
UEFA and others won't allow a break away league and won't allow reforms that take away power and money from them. Neither will the big clubs and those are the entities that call the shots. The status quo is written in stone because fans allowed it to happen for decades without uttering a word and only now complaining because its about to be taken away completely.
Your argument is ideological but not practical if you look at the recent history of the game.
posted on 18/5/21
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 day, 4 hours ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 55 minutes ago
the theory of football is a club could be founded tomorrow apply to the lowest league and work its way up the various structures to the premier league. If you have a billion or so spare i'm sure you could do it no problem.
The ESL would have locked that club out of the top european level ,thats all.
----------------------------------------------------------
Not just that club, but any club that manages to overcome the financial disadvantages of their position and, through hard work and clever strategy, outperform the most valuable clubs. Leicester are the most recent example, but throughout the years of the PL there have been various clubs outside the 'Big 6' that have finished in the CL places, and many times that the so-called Big 6 have failed to do so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a nonsensical argument against it to be honest, there are many good arguments against it, this certainly isn't one
In the last 20 years there have been 3? Instances of non big 6 teams claiming a CL spot. And I think that includes Leicester this season.
The ESL would have guaranteed a spot for a team outside the big 6 year after year after year. Literally going from 3 spots in 20 years to 20 spots in 20 years.
Again, the ESL was far from perfect, but your argument is more in favour of the competition than against it. The CL is a closed shop in all but name. Especially with the changes that a) ensure the big teams qualify b) Bigger groups to allow more minnows in, reducing group stage upsets
The ESL was just honest enough to give up the pretence.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is just another argument based on cynicism: "it's already pretty stacked in favour of the rich clubs, so why not pull up the drawbridge altogether?" And you're offering this in opposition to the impulse to reform the status quo, not in opposition to those defending the status quo.
You're also factually wrong. In the last 20 years there have been 6 occasions when clubs outside the "Big 6" (namely Leeds, Newcastle, Everton and Leicester) qualified for the CL, not counting Leicester's possible qualification this year. Chelsea's qualification before Abramovich bought the club could arguably be added to that list. There would have been more non-Big-6 instances had the top 4 qualified throughout that period. But setting that aside, that's approximately a third of the time a club outside that group has qualified. Moreover, much more often than not over the same period one or more of the Big 6 has missed out on finishing in the top 6 and therefore other clubs have benefited from European competition.
Of course that's still a picture of too much dominance by clubs with the biggest resources. You seem to be motivated by the aim to accelerate that dominance rather than challenge it. And yet you write disparagingly about the status quo.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Everton didn't qualify for the CL.
posted on 18/5/21
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 1 day, 7 hours ago
comment by Vorsprung durch Tuchel (U1641)
posted 2 minutes ago
Clubs could easily have competed in all competitions, the new CL proposals have a 10 game group stage, as well as the potential 7 fixtures thereafter, It would only take slightly larger squads and withdrawal/second strings competing in the domestic cups.
———————————
You’re right that they could just have massive squads. I personally believe the ESL were aware of the possibility that they’d have to leave at least some domestic or UEFA competitions for an additional 23 games a season to be feasible. A club going far in all competitions would have to play around 80-90 games in a season which is ridiculous.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
you are taking 23 games (potential, with the majority playing 18) against a potential 17 games under the new CL model (with the majority playing 10)
The difference is literally the second string playing in the League cup. or the FA cup. even if you had these games within two days of a ESL fixture you could still easily field and 18 man squad by boosting the traditional squad size from 24 to 29, thats two sets of starting 11 players plus 7 bench players (able to play in both games)
it was very easily achievable. The fearmongering about withdrawal from domestic competitions was always nonsense, The PL clubs were NEVER going to throw away the circa £175m you get for winning the Premier league
the £350m a year competition was to replace the £100m a year you get if you WIN the CL, nothing else.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The new CL format could be up to 19 games. If you finish 9th to 24th in the group stage them you have a two legged play off to even reach the round of 16.