I enjoyed the Euros, generally, thought there were a lot of exciting games and the officiating was refreshingly competent, both on-pitch and VAR.
England were 23 minutes away from winning a competition, after all the nonsense we’ve been through down the years I thought we might actually do it but did have the nagging sense of “Lads, it’s England" and we’d probably find a way to throw it away, as the song goes.
Congratulations to Italy, again getting to the later stages and again leaving with a trophy, the best team in the tournament got what they deserved, imo.
Italy, like England is a football mad nation with around 60 million inhabitants and we know that it won’t be long before they’re back in another final, another 3-4 tournaments perhaps?
They’re able to keep getting to semi’s, finals and winning things through multiple generations of coaches and players and not having to rely on a “crop of gifted players" or a (hate the phrase) “golden generation", they do it with fairly unspectacular teams at times and it’s like the expect to be competitive in a tournament, not just hoping to be.
When they won Euro ‘68, two years after England won the World Cup, they didn’t have to wait 50 years before being back in a final. They actually got to the 1970 World Cup final and won the competition 12 years later.
English football can learn from Italy, imo. Don’t get bogged down with style of football or building for the “next competition", be competitive, defend well and have the belief you can win it.
Learning from Italy
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
Italy produce much better coaches. Look at all the Italians who have won major titles in England and compare it to the English winners. You have to go back to Redknapp at Portsmouth for the last one. Admittedly they haven't always got chances at big clubs but those who have never managed it: Hodgson at Liverpool, Lampard at Chelsea. Redknapp at Spurs was a success albeit he didn't win anything either. Then the ones at lesser clubs failed to have the know-how to win when getting the chances: Bruce at Hull, Sherwood at Villa, Pardew at West Ham. Southgate is no different here, and only got as far as he did thanks to good fortune.
In terms of the personnel I wouldn't say we are any worse at the moment. Our players are improving all the time. It's just the managers we need to improve on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well we’ve had worse!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is we? Spurs or England?
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
Italy produce much better coaches. Look at all the Italians who have won major titles in England and compare it to the English winners. You have to go back to Redknapp at Portsmouth for the last one. Admittedly they haven't always got chances at big clubs but those who have never managed it: Hodgson at Liverpool, Lampard at Chelsea. Redknapp at Spurs was a success albeit he didn't win anything either. Then the ones at lesser clubs failed to have the know-how to win when getting the chances: Bruce at Hull, Sherwood at Villa, Pardew at West Ham. Southgate is no different here, and only got as far as he did thanks to good fortune.
In terms of the personnel I wouldn't say we are any worse at the moment. Our players are improving all the time. It's just the managers we need to improve on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well we’ve had worse!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is we? Spurs or England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Both!
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
Italy produce much better coaches. Look at all the Italians who have won major titles in England and compare it to the English winners. You have to go back to Redknapp at Portsmouth for the last one. Admittedly they haven't always got chances at big clubs but those who have never managed it: Hodgson at Liverpool, Lampard at Chelsea. Redknapp at Spurs was a success albeit he didn't win anything either. Then the ones at lesser clubs failed to have the know-how to win when getting the chances: Bruce at Hull, Sherwood at Villa, Pardew at West Ham. Southgate is no different here, and only got as far as he did thanks to good fortune.
In terms of the personnel I wouldn't say we are any worse at the moment. Our players are improving all the time. It's just the managers we need to improve on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well we’ve had worse!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is we? Spurs or England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Both!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True of course. Southgate looks to be better than Capello and Hodgson I guess. Just not someone that is going to win us anything.
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
Italy produce much better coaches. Look at all the Italians who have won major titles in England and compare it to the English winners. You have to go back to Redknapp at Portsmouth for the last one. Admittedly they haven't always got chances at big clubs but those who have never managed it: Hodgson at Liverpool, Lampard at Chelsea. Redknapp at Spurs was a success albeit he didn't win anything either. Then the ones at lesser clubs failed to have the know-how to win when getting the chances: Bruce at Hull, Sherwood at Villa, Pardew at West Ham. Southgate is no different here, and only got as far as he did thanks to good fortune.
In terms of the personnel I wouldn't say we are any worse at the moment. Our players are improving all the time. It's just the managers we need to improve on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well we’ve had worse!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is we? Spurs or England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Both!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True of course. Southgate looks to be better than Capello and Hodgson I guess. Just not someone that is going to win us anything.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he came bloody close.
Closer than anybody since Sir Alf Ramsey!
posted on 13/7/21
You forget that the England manager job is a poisoned chalice that the best managers wouldn’t touch with a barge pole.
Remember Graham Taylor being done up like a turnip?!
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 29 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
Italy produce much better coaches. Look at all the Italians who have won major titles in England and compare it to the English winners. You have to go back to Redknapp at Portsmouth for the last one. Admittedly they haven't always got chances at big clubs but those who have never managed it: Hodgson at Liverpool, Lampard at Chelsea. Redknapp at Spurs was a success albeit he didn't win anything either. Then the ones at lesser clubs failed to have the know-how to win when getting the chances: Bruce at Hull, Sherwood at Villa, Pardew at West Ham. Southgate is no different here, and only got as far as he did thanks to good fortune.
In terms of the personnel I wouldn't say we are any worse at the moment. Our players are improving all the time. It's just the managers we need to improve on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well we’ve had worse!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is we? Spurs or England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Both!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True of course. Southgate looks to be better than Capello and Hodgson I guess. Just not someone that is going to win us anything.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he came bloody close.
Closer than anybody since Sir Alf Ramsey!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We had the best chance to win anything since Ramsey to be fair. It will not be the same at Qatar.
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 52 seconds ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 29 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People Variant (U21889)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
Italy produce much better coaches. Look at all the Italians who have won major titles in England and compare it to the English winners. You have to go back to Redknapp at Portsmouth for the last one. Admittedly they haven't always got chances at big clubs but those who have never managed it: Hodgson at Liverpool, Lampard at Chelsea. Redknapp at Spurs was a success albeit he didn't win anything either. Then the ones at lesser clubs failed to have the know-how to win when getting the chances: Bruce at Hull, Sherwood at Villa, Pardew at West Ham. Southgate is no different here, and only got as far as he did thanks to good fortune.
In terms of the personnel I wouldn't say we are any worse at the moment. Our players are improving all the time. It's just the managers we need to improve on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well we’ve had worse!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is we? Spurs or England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Both!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True of course. Southgate looks to be better than Capello and Hodgson I guess. Just not someone that is going to win us anything.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he came bloody close.
Closer than anybody since Sir Alf Ramsey!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We had the best chance to win anything since Ramsey to be fair. It will not be the same at Qatar.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course not.
It will be about a thousand degrees and South America’s teams will be there!
posted on 13/7/21
The old farts at The FA are the problem and have been for donkeys years.
Over the years they have refused to appoint the best candidates (Clough, Redknapp), and essentially sacked those doing a great job (Venables, Hoddle). While at the same time appointing yes men and clowns such as McLaren, Capello and Hodgson etc.
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Kante's Dad-Heavy Jumbo (U20563)
posted 18 hours, 2 minutes ago
comment by Devil (U6522)
posted 26 minutes ago
English football can learn from Italy, imo. Don’t get bogged down with style of football or building for the “next competition", be competitive, defend well and have the belief you can win it.
--------------------------------------------------------
Southgate's England have kind of been that tbh, and I think it's great. He's had a plan/stuck to it, the emphasis has been on defence, and the mental block is getting chipped at (slowly but never the less).
Honestly, just my opinion, but the only thing Southgate's missing is a CV that instils belief in fans so his decisions don't get cross analysed from every angle. We've had FARRRRRRRRRR better managers in his chair overcomplicate the hell out of this job, he keeps it simple and that's exactly what's required
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But we have a good crop of attacking players and virtually no defenders
------------------------------------------------
True, but building on a foundation set by the last tournament where the likes of Foden, Mount & Sancho weren't ready yet, I appreciate the fact Southgate kept consistency in the camp (so undervalued in International football) by incorporating different players but not totally changing up the defensive style. For the Qatar WC, I'd expect that to be evolved once again & we'll keep the majority of the players, but the style will be a bit more aggressive as the squad gel more.
Previous England managers have had a habit of trying to force things either into their own ideology or shove square pegs in round holes. I guarantee a different England manager this tournament would've played the same way, but still attempted to shoehorn Grealish into the team somehow upsetting the balance. Or catered to the attackers more in general, maybe by picking one holding midfielder rather than two, and we found the balance upset again.
Southgate's England feel a little bit more like a club team than previous one's, in camaraderie but also tactically, and I love that.
posted on 13/7/21
comment by Devil (U6522)
posted 8 hours, 50 minutes ago
comment by Kante's Dad-Heavy Jumbo (U20563)
posted 18 hours, 2 minutes ago
comment by Devil (U6522)
posted 26 minutes ago
English football can learn from Italy, imo. Don’t get bogged down with style of football or building for the “next competition", be competitive, defend well and have the belief you can win it.
--------------------------------------------------------
Southgate's England have kind of been that tbh, and I think it's great. He's had a plan/stuck to it, the emphasis has been on defence, and the mental block is getting chipped at (slowly but never the less).
Honestly, just my opinion, but the only thing Southgate's missing is a CV that instils belief in fans so his decisions don't get cross analysed from every angle. We've had FARRRRRRRRRR better managers in his chair overcomplicate the hell out of this job, he keeps it simple and that's exactly what's required
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But we have a good crop of attacking players and virtually no defenders
------------------------------------------------
True, but building on a foundation set by the last tournament where the likes of Foden, Mount & Sancho weren't ready yet, I appreciate the fact Southgate kept consistency in the camp (so undervalued in International football) by incorporating different players but not totally changing up the defensive style. For the Qatar WC, I'd expect that to be evolved once again & we'll keep the majority of the players, but the style will be a bit more aggressive as the squad gel more.
Previous England managers have had a habit of trying to force things either into their own ideology or shove square pegs in round holes. I guarantee a different England manager this tournament would've played the same way, but still attempted to shoehorn Grealish into the team somehow upsetting the balance. Or catered to the attackers more in general, maybe by picking one holding midfielder rather than two, and we found the balance upset again.
Southgate's England feel a little bit more like a club team than previous one's, in camaraderie but also tactically, and I love that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your point is well made and I would agree that most england managers played flavour of the month type and yes england played a set way and looked able to change it up enough yet.maintain that style.
The pity it was the most negative dearly rubbish going that Tony pulis could have served up though.