5th is about right for us...

And thats about decisions, right? Appointing the right people, like Liverpool did with Klopp and Chelsea have done Tuchel? And then spending wisely?

J99, I don't understand what you're arguing with me about. Are you trying to argue for the sake of it?

Yes, it is about those decisions. Hence why I am saying if we continue running the club like we have been, it makes things harder for us. So we need to DO BETTER in every facet of improving the club, not just money.

Samir

"I'm sorry J99 but you're talking absolute nonsense. I've had this conversation with you before and I've told you to stop parroting that line because it is inherently flawed.

Of course it matters what the rest are doing. What a ridiculous comment. They ALL have the intention to improve their squad every season too. Do you think our rivals are going to sit still and just let us improve?"

I have tried to explain to you how much its not what others do.

Its what we do internally. How we appoint and how we buy because we spend money. In fact more than Liverpool and Chelsea.

So after spending more money than every other club last summer why shouldn't we be expecting Arteta to finish 4th? Why are some in our fanbase already making excuses for us to NOT be in the top 4?

I have tried to explain to you how much its not what others do.
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It was nonsense.

Everything you have said has contradicted the above quote. You have even said we need to benchmark against the more successful teams and aim to do better. This doesn't mean we shouldn't continue to improve, but it does mean that, unless the likes of Liverpool, Chelsea and United begin to stutter, and all Arsenal's signings/team click, that is the best way we can get back challenging. By capitalising on the misfortunes of other clubs.

So you haven't disproved anything I've said. If teams that are already better than us continue to improve further, that makes the task harder for us. Because it makes the gap bigger. So there is more for us to do.

How you're trying to disagree with that is beyond me.

"By capitalising on the misfortunes of other clubs."

Right so we can only finish higher than other clubs if they have misfortune and not because we have improved more than they have by spending money and taking better decisions?

All clubs spend money. I've shown you we spend more than others. But you still cannot accept that its about how we spend money and hire good managers and not what others do.

Right so we can only finish higher than other clubs if they have misfortune and not because we have improved more than they have by spending money and taking better decisions?
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They are not mutually exclusive things.

But in my personal opinion, for us to get back in, I believe we will need to hope for the downfall of the others. To then cement ourselves as a top-4 side again, that's when we need to have a coherent strategy and approach to ensure we don't suffer this BS again.



But you still cannot accept that its about how we spend money and hire good managers and not what others do.
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Are you joking?

What did I literally just say a few posts ago?

And you wonder why I don't believe you read what other people tell you.

The only real thing I disagree with you on is that it doesn't matter what others do. I personally think it does. Especially when there's new players into the game which there will be soon with Newcastle becoming another oil club.

As Wenger used to say. Each team can only field 11 players at a time on the pitch. Klopp has already shown you can not only compete with the 'oil clubs' but beat them without out spending them. And Man Utd have shown you can waste a lot of money on what 'pundits' think are top players. We are also the 3rd highest spenders so why should not expect to finish 3rd every season as a fanbase?

You cannot affect what others do. You can take responsibility for your decisions. And when you spending like a top 4 club why are you making excuses and fearing the competition?

Klopp is an elite manager. He's one of the best managers in the world. Arteta isn't.

Also, let's see how long Liverpool can keep doing this for because my gut feeling is, once Klopp goes, their level will diminish. I don't think any other manager can get them performing to this standard.

"We are also the 3rd highest spenders so why should not expect to finish 3rd every season as a fanbase?"

Because the transfer fees alone aren't what need to be factored in and we didn't have saleable assets to offset the outlay. There are more contextual factors at play.

The £150m we spent was also on 6 players, which isn't that much when you break it down. Chelsea and City spent two-thirds of that fee on one player each (Grealish & Lukaku). Although Chelsea have better saleable assets than us which is why their net spend was next to nothing.

There will be another Klopp. Just like there will be another Pep. And Tuchel was fired from his previous job.

a) If KSE think Arteta is the next Klopp then they needed to back him with money, which they did, and then also expect to set certain goals. Which was top 4, I suspect by the end of his contract. I expected a top 6 finish last season whilst challenging for the top 4. Our run has materialised this season and thats the limbo situation. Do you offer Arteta a new contract because you think he is getting there albeit a year late or is it a failure based on your original assumption that Arteta should be able to qualify for the top 4 within his 3.5 year contract.

b) And what have Lukaku and Grealish been this season apart from massive disappointments? What do you think their values are now?

In my opinion football in contrast to any other industry deflates and inflates values of assets (players) within months. So you cannot say any club has a monumental head start. Keep in mind everyone thought Man City will be no where this season because they did not have a striker when they failed to sign Kane.