We are just 6 games away from finding out who will be continental champions in Europe and the Americas. On Tuesday Spain play France (8pm), with Argentina versus Canada at 1am Wednesday. That evening Netherlands and England meet in Europe at 8pm and Uruguay face Colombia at 1am Thursday morning.
Euro Semi Finalists
SPAIN
The standout team in the Euros thus far. Won 3 out of 3 in a group of death, hitting top gear straight away by leading Croatia 3-0 by half time. 1-0 wins over Italy and Albania followed. They faced big underdogs Georgia in the last 16 and were shocked by an early concession. A Rodri goal just before half time was followed by 3 second half goals and a 4-1 win. The quarter against hosts Germany was always going to be a big test, and an early injury disrupted their plans. However, it was Pedri's replacement Olmo who put them in the lead just after the break. A very late Wirtz equaliser put the game into extra time. As penalties looked likely another sub, Mikel Merino, found himself free in the box to head Spain into the semi.
Spain have been solid in defence, with Unai Simon looking good in goal. They will miss Carvajal, who got sent off against Germany but was already suspended for 2 yellows as well as Robin Le Normand - so a rejigged defence will be necessary. It is the midfield that really has stood out though, with Fabian Ruiz arguably being their star player but going under the radar a fair bit. Youngsters Lamine Yamal and Nico Williams have been dangerous throughout, while Dani Olmo has largely been reduced to a sub role but has 2 goals and will likely start. Alvaro Morata scored their first goal of the tournament but hasn't netted since.
FRANCE
Their group was never going to be easy, but France have not been able to build on an opening game win thanks to an Austrian own goal. A goalless draw with Netherlands was a bit fortunate, before a draw with already out Poland put them into the stronger side of the draw.
Another hard fought game for the French in the last 16 needed a Randal Kolo Muani late deflected effort to decide their tie with Belgium. It didn't get any better for France in their quarter final with Portugal that went goalless. 5 perfect penalties and a Joao Felix miss gives France a semi final spot.
Defensively France have been near perfect - only a late Lewandowski penalty breaching Maignans goal. However, it is a record that can be attributed to their hard-running, defensive midfield set up. Rabiot will be back after suspension and likely will join Tchouameni and Kante in the middle.
Conversely, the attack has not clicked at all. 2 own goals and a penalty is all they have managed and a first game Mbappe broken nose is a contributory factor. Greizmann hasn't been at his best, while Dembele, Thuram, Kolo Muani, Barcola and Giroud have all failed to establish themselves. Who plays with Mbappe will be the key call from Deschamps, with Dembele picking up the MotM from the bench on Friday putting him at the front of the queue.
NETHERLANDS
One of the quirks of the 24 team tournament is that the Dutch probably benefitted from finishing 3rd rather than 2nd in the group. A comeback win over Poland in game one and a 0-0 with France where they felt aggrieved not to win meant they were all but through before meeting Austria. A great game saw Austria win 3-2 and top the group, while France's draw with Poland meant Netherlands were 3rd and into the bottom half of the draw.
The last 16 against Romania was largely an even game, but two late Malen goals to add to Gakpo's opener gave them a 3-0 win. They had to come from behind in the quarter against Türkiye, with De Vrij and an own goal getting them through against a spirited Turkish side that took them to the wire.
The Netherlands are the only team yet to need extra time, and are the third highest scorers in the competition with 9 goals. Cody Gakpo has a third of them, leading the scoring charts (tied with 3 others who are all out). Memphis Depay and Xavi Simons have been the usual companions, with the likes of Bergwijn, Malen, Weghorst, Frimpong and Zirkzee all being used in support.
Virgil van Dijk and Stefan de Vrij have been quite solid ahead of rookie 'keeper Bart Verbruggen, with Denzil Dumfries and Nathan Ake completing the back 4. Arguably their best player this tournament has been Tijjani Reijnders in midfield, with Jerdy Schouten partnering him.
The Dutch didn't pick up any suspensions, so the main call in the XI selection will be if Bergwijn starts or they use one of the other options.
ENGLAND
It took 13 minutes for Jude Bellingham to open the scoring in Englands first game - that remains the only winning goal in 90 minutes England have. A 1-1 draw with Denmark and a 0-0 with Slovenia was enough to win Group C and keep them in the easier looking bottom half.
Slovakia really shook England in the last 16, taking a 25th minute lead deep into injury time. Bellingham saved England in injury time and a Harry Kane header won the tie in the first minute of extra time. England were again behind in the quarter, far later this time - a 75th minute Embolo goal put England on the brink again. Bukayo Saka, though, almost instantly hit back with the equaliser. No extra time winner this time, but 5 perfect penalties put England through.
A change to 3 at the back was implemented yesterday, and will be expected to be retained for the semi final. Marc Guehi, arguably Englands best player in the first 4 games, will be available. With the only unforced change in the XI being Declan Rices partner, it seems as if the XI that played in the last 16 will be what we see in the semi. Like the Dutch, England managed to avoid any suspensions and Mainoo seems to have solidified his role in the team ahead of TAA and Gallagher.
Predictions
Spain 1-1 France (France on penalties)
Netherlands 0-1 England
Copa America Semi finalists
ARGENTINA
No surprise to see the World Champions get here. A group stage stroll, winning all 3 without conceding, didn't really test them. The quarters did - facing an in form Ecuador. Argentina took the lead thanks to Lisandro Martinez, and Argentina survived a penalty as Enner Valencia missed. However, a 92nd minute equaliser shocked the favourites. Lionel Messi then missed the opening penalty - but Emi Martinez was at his best saving the first 2 Ecuadorian penalties.
Lautaro Martinez is the top scorer in Copa America with 4 of Argentina's 6 goals.
CANADA
The 2026 World Cup hosts started their Copa America adventure with a defeat to Argentina, and now they face them again in the semi finals. A late Jonathan David goal was enough to beat Peru, and a 0-0 draw with Chile was enough to progress. They were underdogs against an in-form Venezuela in the quarters, but snatched an early lead through Jacob Shaffelburg. They couldn't hold it, as Rondon equalised midway through the second half, and the game reached penalties. Despite missing twice, Canada managed to win 4-3, with Ismael Kone netting and Angel missing the sudden death penalties.
Canada will be massive underdogs, and need David and Alphonso Davies to be on top form.
COLOMBIA
Colombia came into the tournament on a long unbeaten run and have maintained that form brilliantly. A 2-1 opening win over Paraguay and a 3-0 over Costa Rica meant their 1-1 draw with Brazil was enough to win the group. Panama were no match for them in the quarter final. Jhon Cordoba, James Rodriguez, Luis Diaz, Richard Rios and Miguel Borja all finding the net in a 5-0 thrashing.
James Rodriguez has been at his best, with Daniel Munoz, Cordoba and Diaz all netting twice.
URUGUAY
The Bielsa led side stormed a group containing Bolivia, Panama and hosts United States. 3-1 over Panama was followed by a 5-0 romp over Bolivia. The group was concluded with a 1-0 over the US, knocking the hosts out.
Early this morning they met Brazil, who had a lot to prove. Nunez missed a good headed chance before Nandez got sent off giving Brazil a one man advantage they couldn't take. Militao and Douglas Luiz missed in the shoot-out giving Jose Gimenez a chance to win it, which he failed. But Manuel Ugarte sealed the win.
They have shared the goals around, but top scorer Ronald Araujo was forced off early in the quarter. He has 2 goals, as has Darwin Nunez. Federico Valverde has been their main man so far, with Ugarte, Facundo Pellistri and Mathias Olivera also shining.
Predictons
Argentina 3-0 Canada
Colombia 1-2 Uruguay
The Semi Finalists...
posted on 9/7/24
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 hours, 44 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 47 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 42 minutes ago
Think Spain beat England 1 nil in the final. Spain deserve to win it, England should have been out weeks ago.
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Don’t get this “deserve” thing at all. They beat a very poor Croatia side and an Italy side that lost to Switzerland - those games looked hard on paper but never lived up to it. Georgia in the last 16 as well.
Their best performance and result was against Germany, they were great, but they have to do it against France as well.
People are knocking France, but they are in a semi despite only scoring 3 goals - how? Because they have only conceded once and that was a penalty - I’m backing France to win that game, they won’t blink if it’s 0-0 on 119 mins whereas the Spanish were desperate to avoid pens with Germany.
Spain have played great, but we can’t say they deserve it - let’s see what they do in the next 1/2 games.
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Basically Spain have beaten more big teams in this one tournament than Southgate has in 4 tournaments.
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Good, I’m glad we’ve gone down this route as I have wanted to ask this for days now.
Why does Spain beating Italy in 24 count more than England beating Germany in 21? Is anyone really going to arguably were a top side.
Croatia are abysmal at Euros - that’s what I was told when people make claims about Southgate’s draws - checks notes, yep Croatia was one of the sides Spain beat.
Maybe we’re talking about Albania or Georgia ? Nope thought not.
So by popular Southgate knocking standards, Spain have only beaten 1 decent side so far.
Next they play a France side that people are criticising left right and centre - if it was England playing France all we would hear about is how we are playing the worst French side in years - how jammmy
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Italy are rubbish and are really suffering at the moment, just like Germany were when we beat them. But Spain also beat the hosts Germany, who were in good form and had momentum, so that already puts the number of big teams they've beaten ahead of the ones Southgate has, in his whole tenure as England manager.
It's not really untrue what I've just said, is it? They've beaten more big teams than Southgate has in one tournament.
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What you’ve said is bollox but I won’t stop you, I will just disagree.
I’m sure if we beat the Netherlands on Wednesday then people will tie themselves up in knots about how the Netherlands aren’t a top side. God knows what some will do if we win the tournament - probably claim it’s all a fix like Cinci has already alluded to
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I've already said on here, maybe even on this thread, that I will give Southgate some credit if we can beat the Netherlands, cause they are a high ranked big team in decent form. Obviously if we do it playing absolutely dire football I won't be happy but I'll have to respect the fact he finally did what he wasn't able to before.
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We beat the African champions in the last World Cup, we beat Croatia and Germany in 2021. We’ve beaten Denmark and Sweden in his tenure as well.
We seem to be limiting top sides to Italy, France, Portugal and Spain ?
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I wouldn't class African countries as big teams, the same as Asian countries who have won the Asian Cup. I mean Qatar are the current champions of that, you wouldn't count them as a big team, would you?
France, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Germany, Netherlands should be considered the big teams and I guess you could let in Belgium and Croatia, although that is questionable now. I mean the FIFA rankings at the time of playing them give a pretty good indication and our record against any of these higher ranking opponents is poor.
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Southgate has beaten Croatia and Germany
He has only lost to 2 top sides inside 120 mins
If you look through the last few world cups and Euros - you will find the winner has usually beaten 2 of the above sides - no more bar the odd exception. So if England beat the Netherlands and one of Spain/France then we will be par with other winners.
If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 then that would have been 3 of those sides.
So much for the lucky draw theory
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No the lucky draw thing still stands. He's beaten as many good teams as Sven did in 3 tournaments only Sven had tougher draws when it came to the KO stage. Sven beat Croatia and Argentina and both were without the home advantage that Southgate had, and he had injury issues and other unfavourable moments go against him. Southgate's England do not get over the line against Brazil or Portugal back then either.
posted on 9/7/24
I don't think Portugal were all that back in the mid 2000's. I'd back this team to beat them. Rooney getting injured in 04 was a massive reason why we didn't back then.
posted on 9/7/24
comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 15 minutes ago
I don't think Portugal were all that back in the mid 2000's. I'd back this team to beat them. Rooney getting injured in 04 was a massive reason why we didn't back then.
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They were a flair team with some top players. We have usually always struggled against those sorts of teams. This team may beat them having good penalty takers and a better keeper. Whether that's with Southgate though I'm not sure.
The Rooney injury is the sort of thing I'm talking about as far as luck goes. Southgate hasn't suffered that sort of set back.
posted on 9/7/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 15 minutes ago
I don't think Portugal were all that back in the mid 2000's. I'd back this team to beat them. Rooney getting injured in 04 was a massive reason why we didn't back then.
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They were a flair team with some top players. We have usually always struggled against those sorts of teams. This team may beat them having good penalty takers and a better keeper. Whether that's with Southgate though I'm not sure.
The Rooney injury is the sort of thing I'm talking about as far as luck goes. Southgate hasn't suffered that sort of set back.
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Kane is kid of injured but I agree.
posted on 9/7/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 53 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 hours, 44 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 47 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 42 minutes ago
Think Spain beat England 1 nil in the final. Spain deserve to win it, England should have been out weeks ago.
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Don’t get this “deserve” thing at all. They beat a very poor Croatia side and an Italy side that lost to Switzerland - those games looked hard on paper but never lived up to it. Georgia in the last 16 as well.
Their best performance and result was against Germany, they were great, but they have to do it against France as well.
People are knocking France, but they are in a semi despite only scoring 3 goals - how? Because they have only conceded once and that was a penalty - I’m backing France to win that game, they won’t blink if it’s 0-0 on 119 mins whereas the Spanish were desperate to avoid pens with Germany.
Spain have played great, but we can’t say they deserve it - let’s see what they do in the next 1/2 games.
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Basically Spain have beaten more big teams in this one tournament than Southgate has in 4 tournaments.
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Good, I’m glad we’ve gone down this route as I have wanted to ask this for days now.
Why does Spain beating Italy in 24 count more than England beating Germany in 21? Is anyone really going to arguably were a top side.
Croatia are abysmal at Euros - that’s what I was told when people make claims about Southgate’s draws - checks notes, yep Croatia was one of the sides Spain beat.
Maybe we’re talking about Albania or Georgia ? Nope thought not.
So by popular Southgate knocking standards, Spain have only beaten 1 decent side so far.
Next they play a France side that people are criticising left right and centre - if it was England playing France all we would hear about is how we are playing the worst French side in years - how jammmy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Italy are rubbish and are really suffering at the moment, just like Germany were when we beat them. But Spain also beat the hosts Germany, who were in good form and had momentum, so that already puts the number of big teams they've beaten ahead of the ones Southgate has, in his whole tenure as England manager.
It's not really untrue what I've just said, is it? They've beaten more big teams than Southgate has in one tournament.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What you’ve said is bollox but I won’t stop you, I will just disagree.
I’m sure if we beat the Netherlands on Wednesday then people will tie themselves up in knots about how the Netherlands aren’t a top side. God knows what some will do if we win the tournament - probably claim it’s all a fix like Cinci has already alluded to
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I've already said on here, maybe even on this thread, that I will give Southgate some credit if we can beat the Netherlands, cause they are a high ranked big team in decent form. Obviously if we do it playing absolutely dire football I won't be happy but I'll have to respect the fact he finally did what he wasn't able to before.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We beat the African champions in the last World Cup, we beat Croatia and Germany in 2021. We’ve beaten Denmark and Sweden in his tenure as well.
We seem to be limiting top sides to Italy, France, Portugal and Spain ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I wouldn't class African countries as big teams, the same as Asian countries who have won the Asian Cup. I mean Qatar are the current champions of that, you wouldn't count them as a big team, would you?
France, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Germany, Netherlands should be considered the big teams and I guess you could let in Belgium and Croatia, although that is questionable now. I mean the FIFA rankings at the time of playing them give a pretty good indication and our record against any of these higher ranking opponents is poor.
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Southgate has beaten Croatia and Germany
He has only lost to 2 top sides inside 120 mins
If you look through the last few world cups and Euros - you will find the winner has usually beaten 2 of the above sides - no more bar the odd exception. So if England beat the Netherlands and one of Spain/France then we will be par with other winners.
If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 then that would have been 3 of those sides.
So much for the lucky draw theory
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No the lucky draw thing still stands. He's beaten as many good teams as Sven did in 3 tournaments only Sven had tougher draws when it came to the KO stage. Sven beat Croatia and Argentina and both were without the home advantage that Southgate had, and he had injury issues and other unfavourable moments go against him. Southgate's England do not get over the line against Brazil or Portugal back then either.
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This is a shocking take Spurtle - Croatia 2004 were faaaacking dump yet you are belittling Croatia 2021 - weird take.
In 2021 we played 3 top sides, Croatia, Germany and Italy. We beat 2
2018 we played 2 top sides - Belgium and Croatia, we lost both
2022 we played France and lost
My point though was that very few tournament winning sides play more than 2 top teams - go through the list from 2000 onwards and you will see on average it’s 2 sides. If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 it would have been 3. If win the next 2 games then we have our 2 and maintain that average. If Spain win it then it massively skews the average.
Finally, as has been pointed out many a time, England did not get lucky in the draw. Pre tournament we had France and Belgium as the other pot 1 teams and we were going to get the Runner up of B which was almost certainly going to be Italy or Croatia - so 3 top sides. The other side of the Draw had Germany, Spain and Portugal, plus the runner up of D which everyone assumed would be the Netherlands - so it was balanced.
What played out is that England and Southgate did their job, France, Netherlands, Belgium all failed to finish where most expected - Netherlands switched to our side of the draw and France and Belgium to the other. Southgate/England made their own luck by winning the group.
France are in the semi final despite scoring 3 goals all tournament, 2 own goals and a penalty. Netherlands have lost a game this tournament. Only Spain have been great
posted on 9/7/24
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 3 hours, 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 53 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 hours, 44 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 47 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 42 minutes ago
Think Spain beat England 1 nil in the final. Spain deserve to win it, England should have been out weeks ago.
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Don’t get this “deserve” thing at all. They beat a very poor Croatia side and an Italy side that lost to Switzerland - those games looked hard on paper but never lived up to it. Georgia in the last 16 as well.
Their best performance and result was against Germany, they were great, but they have to do it against France as well.
People are knocking France, but they are in a semi despite only scoring 3 goals - how? Because they have only conceded once and that was a penalty - I’m backing France to win that game, they won’t blink if it’s 0-0 on 119 mins whereas the Spanish were desperate to avoid pens with Germany.
Spain have played great, but we can’t say they deserve it - let’s see what they do in the next 1/2 games.
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Basically Spain have beaten more big teams in this one tournament than Southgate has in 4 tournaments.
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Good, I’m glad we’ve gone down this route as I have wanted to ask this for days now.
Why does Spain beating Italy in 24 count more than England beating Germany in 21? Is anyone really going to arguably were a top side.
Croatia are abysmal at Euros - that’s what I was told when people make claims about Southgate’s draws - checks notes, yep Croatia was one of the sides Spain beat.
Maybe we’re talking about Albania or Georgia ? Nope thought not.
So by popular Southgate knocking standards, Spain have only beaten 1 decent side so far.
Next they play a France side that people are criticising left right and centre - if it was England playing France all we would hear about is how we are playing the worst French side in years - how jammmy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Italy are rubbish and are really suffering at the moment, just like Germany were when we beat them. But Spain also beat the hosts Germany, who were in good form and had momentum, so that already puts the number of big teams they've beaten ahead of the ones Southgate has, in his whole tenure as England manager.
It's not really untrue what I've just said, is it? They've beaten more big teams than Southgate has in one tournament.
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What you’ve said is bollox but I won’t stop you, I will just disagree.
I’m sure if we beat the Netherlands on Wednesday then people will tie themselves up in knots about how the Netherlands aren’t a top side. God knows what some will do if we win the tournament - probably claim it’s all a fix like Cinci has already alluded to
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I've already said on here, maybe even on this thread, that I will give Southgate some credit if we can beat the Netherlands, cause they are a high ranked big team in decent form. Obviously if we do it playing absolutely dire football I won't be happy but I'll have to respect the fact he finally did what he wasn't able to before.
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We beat the African champions in the last World Cup, we beat Croatia and Germany in 2021. We’ve beaten Denmark and Sweden in his tenure as well.
We seem to be limiting top sides to Italy, France, Portugal and Spain ?
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I wouldn't class African countries as big teams, the same as Asian countries who have won the Asian Cup. I mean Qatar are the current champions of that, you wouldn't count them as a big team, would you?
France, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Germany, Netherlands should be considered the big teams and I guess you could let in Belgium and Croatia, although that is questionable now. I mean the FIFA rankings at the time of playing them give a pretty good indication and our record against any of these higher ranking opponents is poor.
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Southgate has beaten Croatia and Germany
He has only lost to 2 top sides inside 120 mins
If you look through the last few world cups and Euros - you will find the winner has usually beaten 2 of the above sides - no more bar the odd exception. So if England beat the Netherlands and one of Spain/France then we will be par with other winners.
If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 then that would have been 3 of those sides.
So much for the lucky draw theory
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No the lucky draw thing still stands. He's beaten as many good teams as Sven did in 3 tournaments only Sven had tougher draws when it came to the KO stage. Sven beat Croatia and Argentina and both were without the home advantage that Southgate had, and he had injury issues and other unfavourable moments go against him. Southgate's England do not get over the line against Brazil or Portugal back then either.
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This is a shocking take Spurtle - Croatia 2004 were faaaacking dump yet you are belittling Croatia 2021 - weird take.
In 2021 we played 3 top sides, Croatia, Germany and Italy. We beat 2
2018 we played 2 top sides - Belgium and Croatia, we lost both
2022 we played France and lost
My point though was that very few tournament winning sides play more than 2 top teams - go through the list from 2000 onwards and you will see on average it’s 2 sides. If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 it would have been 3. If win the next 2 games then we have our 2 and maintain that average. If Spain win it then it massively skews the average.
Finally, as has been pointed out many a time, England did not get lucky in the draw. Pre tournament we had France and Belgium as the other pot 1 teams and we were going to get the Runner up of B which was almost certainly going to be Italy or Croatia - so 3 top sides. The other side of the Draw had Germany, Spain and Portugal, plus the runner up of D which everyone assumed would be the Netherlands - so it was balanced.
What played out is that England and Southgate did their job, France, Netherlands, Belgium all failed to finish where most expected - Netherlands switched to our side of the draw and France and Belgium to the other. Southgate/England made their own luck by winning the group.
France are in the semi final despite scoring 3 goals all tournament, 2 own goals and a penalty. Netherlands have lost a game this tournament. Only Spain have been great
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You forget that we played all 3 of those sides at home and Germany were every bit the dump you make Croatia in 2004 out to be in that case.
We were lucky to top a very average group in this tournament. We were the only quarter finalist to have won just the one match in 90 mins, the rest won 2 or more. Based on performance levels we're probably the worst team left and it makes me wonder why people are so confident we're going to coast our way past the Netherlands.
posted on 9/7/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 33 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 3 hours, 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 53 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 hours, 44 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 47 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 42 minutes ago
Think Spain beat England 1 nil in the final. Spain deserve to win it, England should have been out weeks ago.
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Don’t get this “deserve” thing at all. They beat a very poor Croatia side and an Italy side that lost to Switzerland - those games looked hard on paper but never lived up to it. Georgia in the last 16 as well.
Their best performance and result was against Germany, they were great, but they have to do it against France as well.
People are knocking France, but they are in a semi despite only scoring 3 goals - how? Because they have only conceded once and that was a penalty - I’m backing France to win that game, they won’t blink if it’s 0-0 on 119 mins whereas the Spanish were desperate to avoid pens with Germany.
Spain have played great, but we can’t say they deserve it - let’s see what they do in the next 1/2 games.
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Basically Spain have beaten more big teams in this one tournament than Southgate has in 4 tournaments.
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Good, I’m glad we’ve gone down this route as I have wanted to ask this for days now.
Why does Spain beating Italy in 24 count more than England beating Germany in 21? Is anyone really going to arguably were a top side.
Croatia are abysmal at Euros - that’s what I was told when people make claims about Southgate’s draws - checks notes, yep Croatia was one of the sides Spain beat.
Maybe we’re talking about Albania or Georgia ? Nope thought not.
So by popular Southgate knocking standards, Spain have only beaten 1 decent side so far.
Next they play a France side that people are criticising left right and centre - if it was England playing France all we would hear about is how we are playing the worst French side in years - how jammmy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Italy are rubbish and are really suffering at the moment, just like Germany were when we beat them. But Spain also beat the hosts Germany, who were in good form and had momentum, so that already puts the number of big teams they've beaten ahead of the ones Southgate has, in his whole tenure as England manager.
It's not really untrue what I've just said, is it? They've beaten more big teams than Southgate has in one tournament.
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What you’ve said is bollox but I won’t stop you, I will just disagree.
I’m sure if we beat the Netherlands on Wednesday then people will tie themselves up in knots about how the Netherlands aren’t a top side. God knows what some will do if we win the tournament - probably claim it’s all a fix like Cinci has already alluded to
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I've already said on here, maybe even on this thread, that I will give Southgate some credit if we can beat the Netherlands, cause they are a high ranked big team in decent form. Obviously if we do it playing absolutely dire football I won't be happy but I'll have to respect the fact he finally did what he wasn't able to before.
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We beat the African champions in the last World Cup, we beat Croatia and Germany in 2021. We’ve beaten Denmark and Sweden in his tenure as well.
We seem to be limiting top sides to Italy, France, Portugal and Spain ?
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I wouldn't class African countries as big teams, the same as Asian countries who have won the Asian Cup. I mean Qatar are the current champions of that, you wouldn't count them as a big team, would you?
France, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Germany, Netherlands should be considered the big teams and I guess you could let in Belgium and Croatia, although that is questionable now. I mean the FIFA rankings at the time of playing them give a pretty good indication and our record against any of these higher ranking opponents is poor.
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Southgate has beaten Croatia and Germany
He has only lost to 2 top sides inside 120 mins
If you look through the last few world cups and Euros - you will find the winner has usually beaten 2 of the above sides - no more bar the odd exception. So if England beat the Netherlands and one of Spain/France then we will be par with other winners.
If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 then that would have been 3 of those sides.
So much for the lucky draw theory
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No the lucky draw thing still stands. He's beaten as many good teams as Sven did in 3 tournaments only Sven had tougher draws when it came to the KO stage. Sven beat Croatia and Argentina and both were without the home advantage that Southgate had, and he had injury issues and other unfavourable moments go against him. Southgate's England do not get over the line against Brazil or Portugal back then either.
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This is a shocking take Spurtle - Croatia 2004 were faaaacking dump yet you are belittling Croatia 2021 - weird take.
In 2021 we played 3 top sides, Croatia, Germany and Italy. We beat 2
2018 we played 2 top sides - Belgium and Croatia, we lost both
2022 we played France and lost
My point though was that very few tournament winning sides play more than 2 top teams - go through the list from 2000 onwards and you will see on average it’s 2 sides. If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 it would have been 3. If win the next 2 games then we have our 2 and maintain that average. If Spain win it then it massively skews the average.
Finally, as has been pointed out many a time, England did not get lucky in the draw. Pre tournament we had France and Belgium as the other pot 1 teams and we were going to get the Runner up of B which was almost certainly going to be Italy or Croatia - so 3 top sides. The other side of the Draw had Germany, Spain and Portugal, plus the runner up of D which everyone assumed would be the Netherlands - so it was balanced.
What played out is that England and Southgate did their job, France, Netherlands, Belgium all failed to finish where most expected - Netherlands switched to our side of the draw and France and Belgium to the other. Southgate/England made their own luck by winning the group.
France are in the semi final despite scoring 3 goals all tournament, 2 own goals and a penalty. Netherlands have lost a game this tournament. Only Spain have been great
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You forget that we played all 3 of those sides at home and Germany were every bit the dump you make Croatia in 2004 out to be in that case.
We were lucky to top a very average group in this tournament. We were the only quarter finalist to have won just the one match in 90 mins, the rest won 2 or more. Based on performance levels we're probably the worst team left and it makes me wonder why people are so confident we're going to coast our way past the Netherlands.
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Croatia were out in the group stage in 2004, Germany finished second in the group and thumped Portugal 4-2 - they were miles better than Croatia 2004. You’re talking nonsense. No one ever disputed home advantage - so how exactly have I forgotten?
Only winning one match in 90 mins is your issue? Okay - Portugal won the whole tournament in 2016 with one win inside 90 mins. Croatia haven’t won a knockout game inside 90 mins since 2014 - I will say that again: Croatia haven’t won a tournament knockout game inside 90 mins since 2014 - yet the last 2 world cups they have been in the final and semi final. You are picking holes in schitt that just doesn’t matter.
France haven’t scored a goal in open play, the Dutch have lost to Austria already in this tournament and were incredibly fortunate to beat Turkey. Only Spain have been near flawless.
No one thinks we will coast past the Dutch, but there is confidence we will beat them. This confidence comes from the fact that virtually every footballing expert out there will tell you that England are better than the Netherlands. The Dutch lost 5 midfielders pre Euros, they are very weak in that position and have suffered by not being able to control games, resulting in them overloading the attack and being wide open at the back.
Let’s talk about Southgate’s supposed luck and let’s compare to Koeman and the Netherlands. You love flapping your gums about us getting an easy draw, well we won our group and played Slovakia (who beat Belgium) and Switzerland (who drew with Germany and beat Italy. The Netherlands by contrast finished 3rd in their group and played Romania (who beat Ukraine) and Turkey who beat ( Georgia, Czechs and Austria).
Let’s talk about riding our luck with goals - England have converted 5 of their 13 chances in this tournament - which is a high conversion rate, however the Dutch have converted a barely believable 8 from 20
posted on 9/7/24
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Think Spain beat England 1 nil in the final. Spain deserve to win it, England should have been out weeks ago.
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Don’t get this “deserve” thing at all. They beat a very poor Croatia side and an Italy side that lost to Switzerland - those games looked hard on paper but never lived up to it. Georgia in the last 16 as well.
Their best performance and result was against Germany, they were great, but they have to do it against France as well.
People are knocking France, but they are in a semi despite only scoring 3 goals - how? Because they have only conceded once and that was a penalty - I’m backing France to win that game, they won’t blink if it’s 0-0 on 119 mins whereas the Spanish were desperate to avoid pens with Germany.
Spain have played great, but we can’t say they deserve it - let’s see what they do in the next 1/2 games.
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Basically Spain have beaten more big teams in this one tournament than Southgate has in 4 tournaments.
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Good, I’m glad we’ve gone down this route as I have wanted to ask this for days now.
Why does Spain beating Italy in 24 count more than England beating Germany in 21? Is anyone really going to arguably were a top side.
Croatia are abysmal at Euros - that’s what I was told when people make claims about Southgate’s draws - checks notes, yep Croatia was one of the sides Spain beat.
Maybe we’re talking about Albania or Georgia ? Nope thought not.
So by popular Southgate knocking standards, Spain have only beaten 1 decent side so far.
Next they play a France side that people are criticising left right and centre - if it was England playing France all we would hear about is how we are playing the worst French side in years - how jammmy
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Italy are rubbish and are really suffering at the moment, just like Germany were when we beat them. But Spain also beat the hosts Germany, who were in good form and had momentum, so that already puts the number of big teams they've beaten ahead of the ones Southgate has, in his whole tenure as England manager.
It's not really untrue what I've just said, is it? They've beaten more big teams than Southgate has in one tournament.
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What you’ve said is bollox but I won’t stop you, I will just disagree.
I’m sure if we beat the Netherlands on Wednesday then people will tie themselves up in knots about how the Netherlands aren’t a top side. God knows what some will do if we win the tournament - probably claim it’s all a fix like Cinci has already alluded to
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I've already said on here, maybe even on this thread, that I will give Southgate some credit if we can beat the Netherlands, cause they are a high ranked big team in decent form. Obviously if we do it playing absolutely dire football I won't be happy but I'll have to respect the fact he finally did what he wasn't able to before.
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We beat the African champions in the last World Cup, we beat Croatia and Germany in 2021. We’ve beaten Denmark and Sweden in his tenure as well.
We seem to be limiting top sides to Italy, France, Portugal and Spain ?
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I wouldn't class African countries as big teams, the same as Asian countries who have won the Asian Cup. I mean Qatar are the current champions of that, you wouldn't count them as a big team, would you?
France, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Germany, Netherlands should be considered the big teams and I guess you could let in Belgium and Croatia, although that is questionable now. I mean the FIFA rankings at the time of playing them give a pretty good indication and our record against any of these higher ranking opponents is poor.
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Southgate has beaten Croatia and Germany
He has only lost to 2 top sides inside 120 mins
If you look through the last few world cups and Euros - you will find the winner has usually beaten 2 of the above sides - no more bar the odd exception. So if England beat the Netherlands and one of Spain/France then we will be par with other winners.
If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 then that would have been 3 of those sides.
So much for the lucky draw theory
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No the lucky draw thing still stands. He's beaten as many good teams as Sven did in 3 tournaments only Sven had tougher draws when it came to the KO stage. Sven beat Croatia and Argentina and both were without the home advantage that Southgate had, and he had injury issues and other unfavourable moments go against him. Southgate's England do not get over the line against Brazil or Portugal back then either.
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This is a shocking take Spurtle - Croatia 2004 were faaaacking dump yet you are belittling Croatia 2021 - weird take.
In 2021 we played 3 top sides, Croatia, Germany and Italy. We beat 2
2018 we played 2 top sides - Belgium and Croatia, we lost both
2022 we played France and lost
My point though was that very few tournament winning sides play more than 2 top teams - go through the list from 2000 onwards and you will see on average it’s 2 sides. If we’d beaten Italy in 2021 it would have been 3. If win the next 2 games then we have our 2 and maintain that average. If Spain win it then it massively skews the average.
Finally, as has been pointed out many a time, England did not get lucky in the draw. Pre tournament we had France and Belgium as the other pot 1 teams and we were going to get the Runner up of B which was almost certainly going to be Italy or Croatia - so 3 top sides. The other side of the Draw had Germany, Spain and Portugal, plus the runner up of D which everyone assumed would be the Netherlands - so it was balanced.
What played out is that England and Southgate did their job, France, Netherlands, Belgium all failed to finish where most expected - Netherlands switched to our side of the draw and France and Belgium to the other. Southgate/England made their own luck by winning the group.
France are in the semi final despite scoring 3 goals all tournament, 2 own goals and a penalty. Netherlands have lost a game this tournament. Only Spain have been great
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You forget that we played all 3 of those sides at home and Germany were every bit the dump you make Croatia in 2004 out to be in that case.
We were lucky to top a very average group in this tournament. We were the only quarter finalist to have won just the one match in 90 mins, the rest won 2 or more. Based on performance levels we're probably the worst team left and it makes me wonder why people are so confident we're going to coast our way past the Netherlands.
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Croatia were out in the group stage in 2004, Germany finished second in the group and thumped Portugal 4-2 - they were miles better than Croatia 2004. You’re talking nonsense. No one ever disputed home advantage - so how exactly have I forgotten?
Only winning one match in 90 mins is your issue? Okay - Portugal won the whole tournament in 2016 with one win inside 90 mins. Croatia haven’t won a knockout game inside 90 mins since 2014 - I will say that again: Croatia haven’t won a tournament knockout game inside 90 mins since 2014 - yet the last 2 world cups they have been in the final and semi final. You are picking holes in schitt that just doesn’t matter.
France haven’t scored a goal in open play, the Dutch have lost to Austria already in this tournament and were incredibly fortunate to beat Turkey. Only Spain have been near flawless.
No one thinks we will coast past the Dutch, but there is confidence we will beat them. This confidence comes from the fact that virtually every footballing expert out there will tell you that England are better than the Netherlands. The Dutch lost 5 midfielders pre Euros, they are very weak in that position and have suffered by not being able to control games, resulting in them overloading the attack and being wide open at the back.
Let’s talk about Southgate’s supposed luck and let’s compare to Koeman and the Netherlands. You love flapping your gums about us getting an easy draw, well we won our group and played Slovakia (who beat Belgium) and Switzerland (who drew with Germany and beat Italy. The Netherlands by contrast finished 3rd in their group and played Romania (who beat Ukraine) and Turkey who beat ( Georgia, Czechs and Austria).
Let’s talk about riding our luck with goals - England have converted 5 of their 13 chances in this tournament - which is a high conversion rate, however the Dutch have converted a barely believable 8 from 20
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Germany had 3 games at home and won once to Portugal. It's hardly a vintage team is it? I wouldn't say miles better and their performance levels in and around this time back this up.
You have a point with how poor Portugal were in 2016 but right now we look back at them as winners. If Southgate can get through and win and they'll have to do it beating the best team in the tournament, then kudos to him. He'll have proved me wrong. So far he's had 3 goes at tournaments without meeting too many of the big teams and some very good squads and hasn't won anything yet.
Your 2 examples of Germany and Croatia were both played with home advantage and if you take that away then it's incredibly thin, with us losing to all the best opponents we came across - Belgium x 2, France and Croatia. Netherlands will be among these teams so let's see if he can finally buck the trend.
posted on 9/7/24
God, you 2 love the reply feature.
posted on 9/7/24
Always a pleasure to see Strike getting ANOTHER 50/50 prediction so wrong 😂