It's been a strange 2 and a bit years under ETH. Been following Utd for pretty much 40 years now, seen a lot of managers, but when I view ETH's reign, it just seems full of contradiction.
The good - 2 trophies, a first season 3rd place finish, followed by a disappointing 8th, but overall, if you looked at that alone, you might think, pretty good overall, although it's in the context of how our standards have dropped over the years that what has happened would be considered pretty good. But of course there are other things to consider.....
The bad - just never felt that ETH had the players' belief in him. Tactically questionable at times, but sometimes you can overcome that if the players are truly with you. I genuinely think that for most of the time, the players didn't give up or down tools ( I accept the odd game, the toys went out of the pram etc), more that ETH just struggled to communicate with them and get across what he really wanted. Sometimes that just happens at a club, and especially at Utd, you need it all - tactical nous, communication skills, that bit of charisma / 'X' factor. ETH just came up short in those departments.
The ugly - the inevitable style of play. Did we ever really find out how ETH wanted us to play - not on the pitch anyway. Also so many records broken for the wrong reasons - so many defeats at home, pretty much looking vulnerable to any team we played, so many losses by 3 goals or more, so many insipid performances.
I don't think anyone feels that ETH wasn't give a fair run, indeed, given so many poor performances, many would argue he got more than a fair run - there will always be disagreement of when he should have gone, but that's been done to death.
I have seen so many poor performances, and I really do think, how the hell did we manage to win 2 trophies - to me it shows that there is potential in this squad of players and surely the right manager can get them playing well, scoring goals, being able to dominate some games at least, and looking more like a team rather than a bunch of individuals.
ETH gave great effort, the highlight is the FA Cup win, the low is probably the 7-0 defeat to Liverpool. Sadly the lows far outweigh the highs for me.
I hope he does well in the future, wherever that may be.
But we move on, it seems to Amorim, and hope he has the magic touch we have been looking for.
Reflection - the good, the bad and the ugly
posted 6 hours, 58 minutes ago
Entirely irrelevant.
The club's direction wasn't set by ANY of the coaches/managers.
'Guided on' in an advisory manner perhaps, but that's all.
None of this has been dealt with for well over 10 seasons now, and it doesn't look like the real issues are going to be dealt with in the immediate or near future.
It's been pointed out for most of that 10+ seasons - by those, like myself, that know - that even if the club STARTED to deal with those REAL issues immediately it would still take about 4 seasons to sort out. And by "sort out", what is really meant is "catch up".
Dark times are going to remain regardless of any trendy coaches/manager changes. It's pure symbolism.
posted 6 hours, 51 minutes ago
I'm pretty sure it'll ALL be fixed a week next Thursday.
posted 6 hours, 8 minutes ago
His biggest failing was his man management.
This saw his adopt a policy of signing almost a whole team of former players/Dutch players as he would have a better connection with them.
So we've ended up signing a number of players to help him rather than the team.
posted 5 hours, 47 minutes ago
For me, the FA Cup final was a one off performance where everything went right for us on day. Don't get me wrong, ETH had a plan, the players implemented it perfectly and we got the result required, and deserve the plaudits for it.
But it was a one off game, and we don't play City every week. In other games, we would expect to see more of the ball, try to dominate the game and impose our will on other teams. We couldn't play the way against we did against City week in week out, and honestly, I wouldn't want us to.
You would have expected us to dominate at least a handful of matches against lower placed teams last season, regardless of injuries etc, but we have none of that. The entertainment factor from a purely footballing point of view was zero.
posted 4 hours, 50 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 🏴 JA606 Class Act (U2462)
posted 5 hours, 12 minutes ago
The City final is probably my favourite single United game in a long while. Yes, what happened before or after wasn't great but that day it was a defiant United.
I'll remember that much more than finishing fourth.
That doesn't mean to say that it's acceptable long term of course but football is all about grabbing moments when we can IMO.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't understand the need to demean the 2 cup wins
Two brilliant occasions and triumphs at Wembley that hadnt been experienced for a number of years
posted 4 hours, 39 minutes ago
comment by Roy's Keane (U11635)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 🏴 JA606 Class Act (U2462)
posted 5 hours, 12 minutes ago
The City final is probably my favourite single United game in a long while. Yes, what happened before or after wasn't great but that day it was a defiant United.
I'll remember that much more than finishing fourth.
That doesn't mean to say that it's acceptable long term of course but football is all about grabbing moments when we can IMO.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't understand the need to demean the 2 cup wins
Two brilliant occasions and triumphs at Wembley that hadnt been experienced for a number of years
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My best ever memories of following United were at Wembley in FA Cup finals.
The semi vs Coventry however.....
posted 4 hours, 35 minutes ago
comment by Roy's Keane (U11635)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 🏴 JA606 Class Act (U2462)
posted 5 hours, 12 minutes ago
The City final is probably my favourite single United game in a long while. Yes, what happened before or after wasn't great but that day it was a defiant United.
I'll remember that much more than finishing fourth.
That doesn't mean to say that it's acceptable long term of course but football is all about grabbing moments when we can IMO.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't understand the need to demean the 2 cup wins
Two brilliant occasions and triumphs at Wembley that hadnt been experienced for a number of years
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I would like to think no-one is demeaning cup wins, but at the same time, it's no measure of how good a team is and if they are progressing, and that's the real issue for us.
I would still say my fav Utd moment is Whiteside's goal in the 85 cup final
posted 4 hours, 35 minutes ago
comment by kinsang (U3346)
posted 19 minutes ago
For me, the FA Cup final was a one off performance where everything went right for us on day. Don't get me wrong, ETH had a plan, the players implemented it perfectly and we got the result required, and deserve the plaudits for it.
But it was a one off game, and we don't play City every week. In other games, we would expect to see more of the ball, try to dominate the game and impose our will on other teams. We couldn't play the way against we did against City week in week out, and honestly, I wouldn't want us to.
You would have expected us to dominate at least a handful of matches against lower placed teams last season, regardless of injuries etc, but we have none of that. The entertainment factor from a purely footballing point of view was zero.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The FA Cup final was a great performance, but based on a game plan which was a retreat from what he had set out to build that season. In a way it represented the failure of his footballing project. Losing to City while putting in a good showing that demonstrated some nice phases of controlled possession and glimpses of 'the best transition side in the world' might have been more of a success in terms of showing how far he had developed the team. Especially if we'd also finished 4th rather than 8th.
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
The win against City was the most enjoyable moment since SAF left imo.
However Cup comps are often a lottery and that's why I never judge a manager purely based on those. Possibly why I don't rate the likes of Tuchel & Ancelotti as highly as others do.
Anyway back to my point, 8 times out of 10 Liverpool would have put as away in that 2nd half in the quarter finals and we were inches away from one of the most humiliating moments in our history against Coventry.
Even in the final, as well as the game plan was executed, if City don't make that error leading to Garnacho's goal, I'm not sure we win it.
It was as much down to luck or destiny as managerial success.
posted 3 hours, 43 minutes ago
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 25 minutes ago
The win against City was the most enjoyable moment since SAF left imo.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ehh... For a brief period of time, United under Ole was ht epeak for me. Good attacking football, good record against the big teams, lots of goals from players we knew where sheit. Going far in competitions, albeit never winning. It was the most successful system even if it was "simple"
Us winning City reminded me of Wigan winning it all those years ago. Did not cover the manager being average then too.