Shut up

Where exactly have i labelled unsettled arsenal fans as whingers?
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these are two quotes from your original post:

'You all sound like a bunch of little whining girls.'

'Sheesh this website is to talk about football related matters not whinge 24/7 about some newspaper stories no?'

So my mistake was not specifying which users i was referring to. I can assure you it wasn't directed at every fan to have raised a complaint or issue about the club. My use of the world "all" was directed at all those that have been whinning non constructively about an issue concerning 2 of our players that has been blown out of proportion. There are plenty of "unsettled" fans it was not aimed at

There are real concerns about the way that the club is drifting at the moment.

1. The club has not won a trophy in 6 years, which by our usual standards is a very long time.

2. We have a Board who appear to be utterly complacent and self
satisfied with what has been going on.

3. A manager whose stubborness has unquestionably contributed to our decline. The so called youth project has proven a failure and whilst the football may be appealing to watch is certainly not going to win us trophies. It is frankly flawed.

4. There is clearly low morale in the squad and team that so many
players want to leave the club. Personally I don't believe that it is
just about money, but as much to do with lack of belief in the manager's project and the club's lack of ambition for its football
success rather than business plans.

5. What appears to be acceptance that the Club is no longer at
the top table of English Football and that we are now lagging far behind Manchester United,Manchester City and Chelsea both in
ambition and spending power.

As someone who has watched and supported Arsenal for over
50 years I find the situation very sad and unless there is a material change in the way that the club is being run I plan not
to renew my 2 season tickets which now cost nearly £4,000 for
season 2012/13. I am sure that I will not be alone.

How can someone who has supported the club for 'over 50 years' call 6 years a 'very long time' to wait for a trophy.Surely you remember the mid-50s and 60s then when we won nothing for over 15 years, and the post 71 time, when we only won a single FA Cup in almost twenty years.

Either you've exaggerated your age, or your memory's going old fella. You're the one who is supposed to be saying, "Bah, youngsters don't know they're born these days."

Coming third/fourth in the league and winning a cup 'every so often', is a vast improvement on my early memories of Arsenal - and I must be at least 10-15 years younger than you. I take your point about the ridiculous prices we're expected to pay - but apart from that I'm not so convinced by most of your post tbh.

Henrys Cat

I started watching in 1954. The first match was watching Stanley Matthews play at Highbury for Blackpool.

Yes I agree I exaggerated on the success rate of Arsenal in the early years.

You are absolutely correct that Arsenal were unsuccessful for the next 15 years and on the odd occasion were even saved by Jack Kelsey from relegation.

However, for all the team's shortcomings during that
period I never watched an Arsenal team capitulate in
the way that we have seen too often in recent years.

Frankly our record from 29th February2011 was abysmal with just 3 wins in 15 matches including replay against Orient. That was relegation form.

How can someone who has supported the club for 'over 50 years' call 6 years a 'very long time' to wait for a trophy.Surely you remember the mid-50s and 60s then when we won nothing for over 15 years, and the post 71 time, when we only won a single FA Cup in almost twenty years.
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to be fair, i would say that it's people of that age group that should be the MOST worried - i'm sure that if i were in U5799's position, having seen those long periods of difficulty, i would be desperate for somebody to notice the pre-warning signs that could see us slip into such a slump again.

wouldn't you?

"wouldn't you?"

In a word, no. I think you've missed my point - the fact is the last 20 years has seen an unusually high point for Arsenal, and people complain about it - it's only the long periods of success enjoyed by Liverpool and ManU that have made people expect this from Arsenal (or other clubs). There was no 'slump', and we're not in a 'slump' now. One purple patch doesn't really define a club. Considering the financial differences at the top of the table, we're doing pretty good - and when the stadium starts paying out, we will compete again.

Yes, I'd love Arsenal to have their period of dominance, but our high point conincided with ManU's dominance - and with the appearance of Cheslea in the top table spoilt possibly our chance to follow on. If people are going to complain and desert in the face of a few years without a trophy then, frankly, I think they were possibly never that ' into it' in the first place. That's said, I'm not judging our 'since '54' fan, if he now feels that £4k is too much to spend on watching footy - then that is more than fair enough, but I am rather tired of Arsenal 'fans' b****ing about not being ManU.

So leave now if you're not happy, but come back when we've got a bit of cash and are financially 'competing' with the Chelseas and ManCs of this world. I'll keep your seat warm.

the fact is the last 20 years has seen an unusually high point for Arsenal, and people complain about it - it's only the long periods of success enjoyed by Liverpool and ManU that have made people expect this from Arsenal (or other clubs). There was no 'slump', and we're not in a 'slump' now. One purple patch doesn't really define a club.
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exactly. what it IS defined by is that we have won trophies consistently since the 30s - the 60s was the only decade in which we saw no silverware, and the 40s only saw one trophy, but overall, we've been seen as an english football giant since before ww2. this 'purple patch' you speak of is seven trophies across a decade, despite the fact that the same was achieved in the 30s and to some extent in the 70s and 80s. so we're hardly latecomers, are we? do you think, if those fans from the 50s had known they would see no silverware for a decade, that would be saying 'oh, it's all ok. we've won plenty to tide us by.' no. they would be saying what plenty of us are saying now - STOP THE ROT BEFORE IT HAPPENS. because a club isn't defined by a 'purple patch' as you say - but is it defined by the mediocrity BETWEEN the purple patches?

Yes, I'd love Arsenal to have their period of dominance, but our high point conincided with ManU's dominance - and with the appearance of Cheslea in the top table spoilt possibly our chance to follow on. If people are going to complain and desert in the face of a few years without a trophy then, frankly, I think they were possibly never that ' into it' in the first place.
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there's a difference between deserting and being pushed out. we see now a club that is a shell of its former self - everything has changed. the stadium is built to accomodate the 'fashionable' football fan. the logo is a bland, corporate cartoon. this goes beyond success and failure - we're talking about a big, faceless corporation. large numbers of people are becoming disillusioned with a club that bleeds them dry yet tries so hard to ignore them - while sitting symbolically above us, looking out at the big cash cow that is our new, flashy stadium.

That's said, I'm not judging our 'since '54' fan, if he now feels that £4k is too much to spend on watching footy - then that is more than fair enough, but I am rather tired of Arsenal 'fans' b****ing about not being ManU.
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and now you're making stuff up. who exactly said they wanted arsenal to be man united?

So leave now if you're not happy, but come back when we've got a bit of cash and are financially 'competing' with the Chelseas and ManCs of this world. I'll keep your seat warm.
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here's a better idea. how about YOU go and read up on the history of our club? it could help you. lord only knows that we could do with bringing back the REAL fans to the club, in place of people who prefer to lap up the club's lies and soundbites.

Re Henry's Cat

No the cost is not the issue for me nor for that matter
purely a lack of success.

What is of concern is the club's lack of ambition. We
are being overtaken by other clubs not just Man Utd
and that has to be of real concern whatever the reason
for this.

The market is unfortunately not short of sugar daddies
however unpalatable that situation might be.

Anyone visiting the Emirates last season will have seen that quite a large number of seats were empty with increasing frequency, which suggests that perhaps a lot of season ticket holders were increasingly dissatisfied with what was happening.

In the current economic climate the club may well find
that a lot of fair weather fans may not be disposed to renew.

I made the point that I had been a season ticket holder
for a very long time. Indeed my family have held been
season ticket holders since 1947. When people like me express concern the club should take note.

Moreover Arsenal are over dependent on its seats
revenue when compared with Man Utd or even Chelsea both of whom are outscoring us when it comes to marketing revenue.

"who exactly said they wanted arsenal to be man united?"

I think maybe that was a little subtle, I didn't mean people want the club to move to Salford and rebadge as ManU - but people *expect* the level of success that they see from ManU, but right now that's asking rather a lot of the club when faced with the increasing resources of the 'monied' clubs.

"here's a better idea. how about YOU go and read up on the history of our club? it could help you."

I know plenty thanks, like I know that we won a single FA Cup from that outstanding double in 1971 and *that* league win in 1989 - that's a single trophy in almost 20 years - yet you say the 70s and 80s are comparble 'to some extent' to our 'purple patch'.

I don't appreciate being told to 'read your history', this is the sort of drivel that idiot Chelsea/ManU WUMs come out with and not really helpful.

Btw, I agreed with most of your post and , as with Mr 5799, appreciate a different perspective. The fact that I see progress where others see only failure does not make me some kind of corporate kiss-a**, it's just a different view - and I try to remain positive. And I stand by the statement that Arsenal has seen far more success in my second 20 years than they did in my first - and I've loved it. I fully expect to see the same level of success at some point - but I certainly don't slaughter the club/team/manager because we *only* come 4th (disappointing as it was after our 'half-way' form).

But, I do also *hate* the new badge, if that helps.