Cazorla ?
16 million for a 28 year old, international bit par / bench warmer player from Malaga.
You got Cazorla from a club that had to sell, and therefore you got him at a bargain price. Swansea didn't have to sell, so we had to pay extra.
Cazorla is the better player of the two, but it's easier to attract better players with CL football.
You got Cazorla from a club that had to sell, and therefore you got him at a bargain price.
================================
Bargain price ?
£16,000,000 for a 28 year old, who apart from piggy backing the Spanish teams success, has won nothing in his career, and will have the resale value of a bag of Walkers Cheese and Onion in a year or two.
Get real.
Joe Allen is 22, has a great future ahead of him, and even if it didnt work out at Liverpool, would be a sounder investment than Carzola, in terms of resale value.
how much do you guys think you'll sell Henderson for now? he's young...
Bargain price ?
£16,000,000 for a 28 year old, who apart from piggy backing the Spanish teams success, has won nothing in his career, and will have the resale value of a bag of Walkers Cheese and Onion in a year or two.
Get real.
----------------------------------------------------------
There's nothing wrong with not being able to get into the Spain national team when you look at their midfield. He also doesn't fit into their system as they don't seem to play wingers anymore.
£16mil is not a lot of money in football. If he flops, then it's not a MASSIVE loss. He's 28 so he could soon be hitting his peak.
Also, lines such as "Get real." make you look like a tool.
st.piran78 (U15376)
Ramsey is a year younger and has more caps. He must be worth around 20m at least then?
Also, lines such as "Get real." make you look like a tool.
======================================
Does it now ?
Lines like, '£16,000,000 is not a lot of money' , 'and not a massive loss', make you look like a t!t.
If your still looking to peak at the age of 28, then you might just be beyond hope.
Peaking at 28 in darts, or crown green bowls might be one thing, but in professional football, its a little late.
Tool.
Ramsey is a year younger and has more caps. He must be worth around 20m at least then?
====================================
Ramsey is a perfect example of a young player, who, based on no other reason than he occasionally pulls on a Arsenal jersey, is massively over rated.
So in answer to your request for a valuation, based on his ability, I wouldn't touch him for anymore than 6 million.
Cazorla ?
16 million for a 28 year old, international bit
par / bench warmer player from Malaga.
_____________________________________
That comment shows just how much you know. Very little.
most obvious WUM of the year goes to Donald Vito.
st.piran78
I don't like to be mean but how facking stupid are you? People in Spain regard Cazorla as the best player outside of Barca and Madrid.
Also he's looking to hit his peak? He's at his peak you mongtard.
As for Joe Allen, he's had one decent season in the PL and hardly did anything to make anyone go wow.
Also you're talking about resale value. Do you really think we were bothered about that when we signed this player? Obviously not. He's signed to bring quality to our team, which I'm sure he will.
The whole Spain caps argument is stupid anyway. Have a look at their midfield. Xavi, Iniesta, Silva, Busquets, Alonso and Cesc. I'd think most player would struggle to start in that line up. Also as it is he's getting a lot of caps and the Spain manager clearly rates him. Allen wouldn't even make the Spain reserves.
So, what's your argument?
Lines like, '£16,000,000 is not a lot of money' , 'and not a massive loss', make you look like a t!t.
----------------------
How does it? Arsenal make great profits every year, they can afford these prices.
If your still looking to peak at the age of 28, then you might just be beyond hope.
------------------------
Actually 28 is about right for a midfielder to peak. That's not to say that Cazorla isn't a good player, it just means he wont get much better than he currently is.
The reported fee for Cazorla was in between 11.8m and 15m pounds. The poster above is just inflating the price because he can't debate properly. Cazorla has 45 caps for Spain and was voted the third best player in La Liga, behind Messi and Ronaldo.
The reported fee for Cazorla was in between 11.8m and 15m pounds. The poster above is just inflating the price because he can't debate properly. Cazorla has 45 caps for Spain and was voted the third best player in La Liga, behind Messi and Ronaldo.
________________________
And he's 27, not 28. A top class in his peak.
Allen - an average player not in his peak.
"Joe Allen is 22, has a great future ahead of him, and even if it didnt work out at Liverpool, would be a sounder investment than Carzola, in terms of resale value..."
**********************************
Like Carroll you mean?? LOL
cazorla is 3 million cheaper
The only reason Liverpool are going after Allen is because their new manager wasn't the one who implemented their pass and move style at Swansea. So its easy to buy a player who plays in an instrumental position for that to function. It won't work. You need the whole team to buy into that philosophy. Liverpool don't have the players so they are willing to over pay for someone who doesn't have the skill of a £15m player but is familiar to the manager.
Cazorla is far superior in every respect. In fact he is more of a creative player than Allen. Arsenal play in a style that will get the most out of him. Frankly I am sure he had plenty of other offers and wouldn't have come to us if we didn't play that style at his age.
Now if you were comparing Ramsey to Allen. Thats another debate.
Forgive me for stating the obvious, but unless Cazorla is going to play a deep CM role for you, or Allen will play on the wing for Liverpool, the comparison is frankly ridiculous.
Allen will play on the wing for Liverpool
---------------------------------
Cazorla is not a winger. He can play left or right wing but his ideal position is a free role behind the striker in a central role or deeper, Allen/Arteta/Wilshere position.
The comparison is possible because Arsene expects all our three central midfield players to rotate. Thats why Sahin is linked as a replacement for Song (if he decides to go). Sahin is far more creative and not a holding player by any stretch of the imagination. In fact Arteta did a better job holding last year than Song!
I know very little about him, but from what I gather he has never played a deep-midfield role for any of the sides he has played for. By the sounds of it he is a 'winger' in the style of Pires or Kranjcar - not an orthodox down-the-line merchant - and if this is the case then I don't see him playing a deep role for you
He could play any position in the spurs team.
I know very little about him, but from what I gather he has never played a deep-midfield role for any of the sides he has played for.
---------------------------
Indeed he has. As this blog points out.
http://thebottomcorner.wordpress.com/2012/08/06/santi-cazorla-solves-a-lot-of-problems-for-arsenal/
He is one of the best players in Liga. And because he can actually play anywhere in the midfield is the type Arsene is trying to build a midfield around.
Arteta was only allowed to play on the wing or behind the striker at Everton. However at Arsenal he has predominantly played in Wilshere's position. Thats the type of pass/move flexible midfield that is the core of Arsenal. Swansea tried to copy that when Martinez was in charge. Rodgers very much built on his style. I doubt very much he can transform Liverpool unless he changes the entire squad beginning with Gerrard (whose passing quality is quite average).
So a comparison between Allen and Cazorla can be made. However to be fair the quality gap is so great that its more sensible to compare Ramsey and Allen. But then Aaron really shouldn't be a starter for us at this point in his career and Arsene has solved that problem with the Carzola acquisition.
comment by Donald Vito (U4098) posted 1 hour, 52 minutes ago
He could play any position in the spurs team.
------------------------------------------------
If our side is that shabby you need to hold the mirror up - it means he'd be able to do the same for you. A few years ago, yes, but if you think you are anything special now you need to splash some water on your face.
Jenius, we'll see if he plays a deeper position for Arsenal - i'm not convinced he will. I don't agree with the Arteta statement by the way, he always played a central role when we played them and they usually had Osman/Coleman and Pienaar as the wide players.
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Santi Cazorla or Joe Allen?
Page 1 of 2
posted on 9/8/12
CAZORLAAAAAAAA!!!!_
posted on 9/8/12
Cazorla ?
16 million for a 28 year old, international bit par / bench warmer player from Malaga.
posted on 9/8/12
You got Cazorla from a club that had to sell, and therefore you got him at a bargain price. Swansea didn't have to sell, so we had to pay extra.
Cazorla is the better player of the two, but it's easier to attract better players with CL football.
posted on 9/8/12
You got Cazorla from a club that had to sell, and therefore you got him at a bargain price.
================================
Bargain price ?
£16,000,000 for a 28 year old, who apart from piggy backing the Spanish teams success, has won nothing in his career, and will have the resale value of a bag of Walkers Cheese and Onion in a year or two.
Get real.
posted on 9/8/12
Joe Allen is 22, has a great future ahead of him, and even if it didnt work out at Liverpool, would be a sounder investment than Carzola, in terms of resale value.
posted on 9/8/12
how much do you guys think you'll sell Henderson for now? he's young...
posted on 9/8/12
Bargain price ?
£16,000,000 for a 28 year old, who apart from piggy backing the Spanish teams success, has won nothing in his career, and will have the resale value of a bag of Walkers Cheese and Onion in a year or two.
Get real.
----------------------------------------------------------
There's nothing wrong with not being able to get into the Spain national team when you look at their midfield. He also doesn't fit into their system as they don't seem to play wingers anymore.
£16mil is not a lot of money in football. If he flops, then it's not a MASSIVE loss. He's 28 so he could soon be hitting his peak.
Also, lines such as "Get real." make you look like a tool.
posted on 9/8/12
st.piran78 (U15376)
Ramsey is a year younger and has more caps. He must be worth around 20m at least then?
posted on 9/8/12
Also, lines such as "Get real." make you look like a tool.
======================================
Does it now ?
Lines like, '£16,000,000 is not a lot of money' , 'and not a massive loss', make you look like a t!t.
If your still looking to peak at the age of 28, then you might just be beyond hope.
Peaking at 28 in darts, or crown green bowls might be one thing, but in professional football, its a little late.
Tool.
posted on 9/8/12
Ramsey is a year younger and has more caps. He must be worth around 20m at least then?
====================================
Ramsey is a perfect example of a young player, who, based on no other reason than he occasionally pulls on a Arsenal jersey, is massively over rated.
So in answer to your request for a valuation, based on his ability, I wouldn't touch him for anymore than 6 million.
posted on 9/8/12
Cazorla ?
16 million for a 28 year old, international bit
par / bench warmer player from Malaga.
_____________________________________
That comment shows just how much you know. Very little.
posted on 9/8/12
most obvious WUM of the year goes to Donald Vito.
posted on 9/8/12
st.piran78
I don't like to be mean but how facking stupid are you? People in Spain regard Cazorla as the best player outside of Barca and Madrid.
Also he's looking to hit his peak? He's at his peak you mongtard.
As for Joe Allen, he's had one decent season in the PL and hardly did anything to make anyone go wow.
Also you're talking about resale value. Do you really think we were bothered about that when we signed this player? Obviously not. He's signed to bring quality to our team, which I'm sure he will.
The whole Spain caps argument is stupid anyway. Have a look at their midfield. Xavi, Iniesta, Silva, Busquets, Alonso and Cesc. I'd think most player would struggle to start in that line up. Also as it is he's getting a lot of caps and the Spain manager clearly rates him. Allen wouldn't even make the Spain reserves.
So, what's your argument?
posted on 9/8/12
Lines like, '£16,000,000 is not a lot of money' , 'and not a massive loss', make you look like a t!t.
----------------------
How does it? Arsenal make great profits every year, they can afford these prices.
If your still looking to peak at the age of 28, then you might just be beyond hope.
------------------------
Actually 28 is about right for a midfielder to peak. That's not to say that Cazorla isn't a good player, it just means he wont get much better than he currently is.
posted on 9/8/12
The reported fee for Cazorla was in between 11.8m and 15m pounds. The poster above is just inflating the price because he can't debate properly. Cazorla has 45 caps for Spain and was voted the third best player in La Liga, behind Messi and Ronaldo.
posted on 9/8/12
The reported fee for Cazorla was in between 11.8m and 15m pounds. The poster above is just inflating the price because he can't debate properly. Cazorla has 45 caps for Spain and was voted the third best player in La Liga, behind Messi and Ronaldo.
________________________
And he's 27, not 28. A top class in his peak.
Allen - an average player not in his peak.
posted on 9/8/12
"Joe Allen is 22, has a great future ahead of him, and even if it didnt work out at Liverpool, would be a sounder investment than Carzola, in terms of resale value..."
**********************************
Like Carroll you mean?? LOL
posted on 9/8/12
cazorla is 3 million cheaper
posted on 9/8/12
The only reason Liverpool are going after Allen is because their new manager wasn't the one who implemented their pass and move style at Swansea. So its easy to buy a player who plays in an instrumental position for that to function. It won't work. You need the whole team to buy into that philosophy. Liverpool don't have the players so they are willing to over pay for someone who doesn't have the skill of a £15m player but is familiar to the manager.
Cazorla is far superior in every respect. In fact he is more of a creative player than Allen. Arsenal play in a style that will get the most out of him. Frankly I am sure he had plenty of other offers and wouldn't have come to us if we didn't play that style at his age.
Now if you were comparing Ramsey to Allen. Thats another debate.
posted on 9/8/12
Forgive me for stating the obvious, but unless Cazorla is going to play a deep CM role for you, or Allen will play on the wing for Liverpool, the comparison is frankly ridiculous.
posted on 9/8/12
Allen will play on the wing for Liverpool
---------------------------------
Cazorla is not a winger. He can play left or right wing but his ideal position is a free role behind the striker in a central role or deeper, Allen/Arteta/Wilshere position.
The comparison is possible because Arsene expects all our three central midfield players to rotate. Thats why Sahin is linked as a replacement for Song (if he decides to go). Sahin is far more creative and not a holding player by any stretch of the imagination. In fact Arteta did a better job holding last year than Song!
posted on 9/8/12
I know very little about him, but from what I gather he has never played a deep-midfield role for any of the sides he has played for. By the sounds of it he is a 'winger' in the style of Pires or Kranjcar - not an orthodox down-the-line merchant - and if this is the case then I don't see him playing a deep role for you
posted on 9/8/12
He could play any position in the spurs team.
posted on 9/8/12
I know very little about him, but from what I gather he has never played a deep-midfield role for any of the sides he has played for.
---------------------------
Indeed he has. As this blog points out.
http://thebottomcorner.wordpress.com/2012/08/06/santi-cazorla-solves-a-lot-of-problems-for-arsenal/
He is one of the best players in Liga. And because he can actually play anywhere in the midfield is the type Arsene is trying to build a midfield around.
Arteta was only allowed to play on the wing or behind the striker at Everton. However at Arsenal he has predominantly played in Wilshere's position. Thats the type of pass/move flexible midfield that is the core of Arsenal. Swansea tried to copy that when Martinez was in charge. Rodgers very much built on his style. I doubt very much he can transform Liverpool unless he changes the entire squad beginning with Gerrard (whose passing quality is quite average).
So a comparison between Allen and Cazorla can be made. However to be fair the quality gap is so great that its more sensible to compare Ramsey and Allen. But then Aaron really shouldn't be a starter for us at this point in his career and Arsene has solved that problem with the Carzola acquisition.
posted on 9/8/12
comment by Donald Vito (U4098) posted 1 hour, 52 minutes ago
He could play any position in the spurs team.
------------------------------------------------
If our side is that shabby you need to hold the mirror up - it means he'd be able to do the same for you. A few years ago, yes, but if you think you are anything special now you need to splash some water on your face.
Jenius, we'll see if he plays a deeper position for Arsenal - i'm not convinced he will. I don't agree with the Arteta statement by the way, he always played a central role when we played them and they usually had Osman/Coleman and Pienaar as the wide players.
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