Madrid would win. They have a much stronger squad than Barca, and have more consistent goalscorers ready to fill the void in their team.

not sure, barca's style of play is instilled in them and they would still be able to keep the ball for most of the game, whether they'd have someone to finish the chances is another thing altogether, i suppose we'll never know because ronaldo and messi never get injured

Madrid are better than Barca with or without Ronaldo.

Ronaldo > Messi

Its a hard one. But Barca would struggle I think. The whole team is built around Messi. You take him out, and that magic spark goes.

Although you could aruge that it'd be almsot like watching Spain play. But Madrid have better strikers in reserve, so Madrid would be better off.

Stop wumming Batmanu

Casillas
Arbeloa Ramos Pepe Marcelo
Khedira Alonso
Di Maria Ozil Modric
Benzema

vs

Villa
Iniesta Cesc Pedro
Xavi Busquets
Alba Mascherano Puyol Montoya/Alves
Valdes

Modric on the wing? Would rather put Marcelo there, and Coentrao at LB.

Madrid are better with and without the star player IMO

Barca would still have more of the ball, but most of their possession would be ineffective and without penetration. Madrid are the more ruthless team, they need less chances to score.

Barca minus Messi, & Madrid minus Ronaldo = Sevilla minus Gary Medel. There is your answer.

More of an advanced playmaker than a proper winger really. He would swap with Ozil I guess

At least that's the team I'd expect to see if that does actually happen

barca have become overdependent on messi not just for goals but penetration too

i think madrid would still score plenty of goals without ronnie...
and ronnie is no messi like playmaker imo

Dont know if anyones said it but Sanchez plays for Barca?

lawrie?

Something about Messi in that Barca team just takes a little out of the rest of those players. I always see everyone play within himself when Messi is playing. Don't believe me? Watch the Barca team of 2009 and the current one and you will see what I am talking about.

^They don't play within themselves, Messi is the creative hub of the team and the biggest goal threat by a landslide so everything goes through him. In 2009 Barca had Henry and Eto'o, now they have 2 of Cesc/Pedro/Sanchez/Villa who don't score anywhere near Henry and Eto'o did.

That is not the issue. In 2009 Messi played primarily as a forward and left the bulk of the creative duties to Xavi and Iniesta. That Barca team was simply unstoppable, incredibly difficult to keep out and also a joy to watch. Come 2010 and Pep decided to give Messi an almost central role and he crowded the midfield as a result making them easier to stop. Remember Messi coming inside against Inter dragging with him Motta, Cambiasso and Zanneti in the center of the field leaving almost no space for Xavi to weave his magic? In 2009 Barca's biggest weapon when attacking was completely spreading the pitch. They were simply irresistible. Bringing Messi central and putting him at the center of everything Barca do ruined all that.

Dont know if anyones said it but Sanchez plays for Barca?
===
Who said he didn't?

That only adds weight to rumors of Messi being a cry baby when he felt that he wasn't that important to the team. Pep gave in to those cries and weakened the greatest team to ever step onto a football pitch.

Batmanu
What happened to the Xavi-Iniesta combo which was mental in 2009? Is it still as prominent now or should I ask, does it even exist anymore. The thing is nowadays Xavi and Iniesta will always try to find Messi with every ball.

Madrid

Pep did not weaken the team by playing Messi central, Messi plays as a false number 9 so when he isn't running past defenders and scoring for fun, he is dropping back and creating chances for others.

In 2011 Barca were in their peak, the performance vs United at Wembley was the best I have ever seen from them, even better than the 5-0 destruction of Real Madrid earlier that season. The problem is since then Xavi has declined, Pedo and Villa have had injuries and lost their goal scoring touch, Sanchez and Cesc have not settled the way Pep hoped them too, basically Messi is dropping deep and creating chances for guys who have become static and can't finish. That isn't to mention that Barca have had terrible injury problems at the back defensively for over a year now and look vulnerable against any team that decides to attack them.

The Barca players don't play within themselves because of Messi, they all look to him for inspiration, without him they are facked. Real on the other hand don't look to Ronaldo at all.

The real reason Barca have declined is because Xavi is not the player he used to be, Xavi was the king 2 years ago. They've tried the likes of Thiago, Cesc and Iniesta playing his role a few times and it has never worked.

Well Eto'o left in 2009, didn't he? And Henry was declining also, he had to put Messi there, really.

Speaking of Eto'o, he must have been one of the mist underrated strikers in history.

I think it's more to do with fatigue than actual decline, plus opponents becoming increasingly familiar with the system and how to counter it.

Anyhow, this is a non-int'l tournament year. If you look, there's been a alternating pattern in Barça's CL and Spain's int'l tournament success, will be interesting to see if they can pull it off again this year.