VC you are starting to worry me all you think about is children
VC he was one of our best players at the time.
.............
No doubt. And if I remember rightly Stevie played up top with him during that year and a half prolific spell.
Quite how he has 'lost it' is beyond me.
Quite how he has 'lost it' is beyond me
------------
He lost his heart and soul by joining Chelsea. A massive mistake. It's quite blatant that he is a very unhappy man.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 1 hour, 31 minutes ago
kneerash
You might find that comment a little strange if you think about it.
Roy?
----
That's a fair response vidic but IMO Roy never warranted the job in the first place, he was never good enough to manage a team with our squad, revenue etc yet hicks and gillette listened to purslow and employed him as none of the 3 wanted to listen to rafas legitimate claims about how the club needed more investment then they were willing or able to provide.
Roy started to pull the coffin lid down with some questionable signings and the very poor brand of football, coupled with very poor results nailed it shut as far as his tenure at lfc was concerned.
I think it's naieve to blame it all on h and g as it was a series of poor decisions that led to the demise but they'd a significant part to play
I think it's naieve to blame it all on h and g as it was a series of poor decisions that led to the demise but they'd a significant part to play
.............
Don't get me wrong bud, H&G were a right pair of t wats, but it is just to easy to blame them on everything. like some of your fans do.
One of the big plusses I here for Rafa was that he built up your academy. Well he done that with the backing of H&G.
Another one that always made me laugh was all the praise Rafa got when he made a good signing, yet when he made a bad one it was someone else’s fault.
academy. Well he done that with the backing of H&G.
---
Already started doing that before H and G appeared on the scene.
Already started doing that before H and G appeared on the scene.
................
And carried on doing it while they were there.
Redinthehead
In H&G fist two years Rrafa signed 41 players.
and how much was the networth of them players.
comment by Suso The Magician - (U11770)
posted 2 minutes ago
and how much was the networth of them players.
.......................................
How is that relevant?
When you buy players, you have to sell some to make room for them in your squad. This happens with every football club, not just Liverpool Suso.
Including youth signed by Rafa to support your point Vidic. Rafa signed alot of players but when he wanted Silva he had to settle for Riera in the end. When he wanted David Villa he got Keane. When he wanted Alves he eventually got Arbeloa who turned out to be great and left with Alonso to Madrid. You cant blame H & G for everything but the buck stopped with them and they controlled everything anyway.
H&G were largely to blame but let's not forget Rafa had the same issues over player purchases at Valencia.
If Rafa had got all the players he wanted we would have had an amazing side, we also would have had a pretty high probability of doing a Leeds.
Our wage bill was already massive and Rafa showed no sign of wanting to control it.
Rafa is from the school of manager who leaves finance to other people but who is happy to blame other people when they can't afford what he wants.
I prefer my managers to have a bit of fiscal responsibility themselves, which is why I am happier with BR because he recognises we can't afford A-list all the time and that each player has a value.
Rafa is a very good manager of expensive players as he has shown throughout his career, but I wouldn't touch him if I was a chairman working on a budget.
Excellent post righteous.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 3 hours, 15 minutes ago
Redinthehead
In H&G fist two years Rrafa signed 41 players.
----
He didnt keep all those 41 players on the clubs books though. When finances were squeezed by H & G, Rafa had to look at bringing in players that could have been bargains rather than the near finished product.
Both Torres and Mascherano were bought with additional loans rather than from H and G's pocket. It's only then, when they became so highly leveraged that they could not get other loans that acquisitions of top players stopped.
Take Aquilani, Alonso sold for £30m.. Aquilani bought in for an initial £5m and a payment plan for the rest.
Tells its own story.
Rafa is a top manager, but had Purslow, H and G above him (all with 0 years, literally, experience in football) telling him how to do his job.
The bloke had no chance, had the rug pulled from under him.
If Rafa had our current owners it would have been a brilliant combination.
I disagree with you righteous. Liverpool raked in tons of money when Rafa was in charge. We were always in the last four or thereabouts in the Champions League and always in the top 4 in England.
I definitely don't think Rafa didn't care about finances. Honestly I think to think so is outrageous. IMO Rafa knew exactly what the club could afford and what it couldn't and made demands based on this and therefore his frustration at not getting it. If the Yanks didn't have us paying 40m pounds a year in interest payments alone and we turned in a profit inspite of the yanks at the time!!!!
We had an opportrunity to establish a dynasty with what Rafa was doing I feel if he was given the support he had built quite a formidable force but the wheels will come off if you are getting half baked support consistently.
Our wage bill at the time was consistent with a CL club so I don't really look at it the same way. We had to reduce it when we dropped out of the CL due to income going down IMO.
Remember also that Dubai came in and offered G&H a 500m offer for the club they bought for 250m.
They said they wanted 750m (1bn dollars)
What a pair of
You can't credit all of United's success to Fergie as he had help but without him United would probably still be floundering.
In the same way you can't blame H & G for everything but they were still entirely responsible for our downfall in that same respect if you get what I mean.
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Page 2 of 2
posted on 2/7/13
VC you are starting to worry me all you think about is children
posted on 2/7/13
VC he was one of our best players at the time.
.............
No doubt. And if I remember rightly Stevie played up top with him during that year and a half prolific spell.
Quite how he has 'lost it' is beyond me.
posted on 2/7/13
Quite how he has 'lost it' is beyond me
------------
He lost his heart and soul by joining Chelsea. A massive mistake. It's quite blatant that he is a very unhappy man.
posted on 2/7/13
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 1 hour, 31 minutes ago
kneerash
You might find that comment a little strange if you think about it.
Roy?
----
That's a fair response vidic but IMO Roy never warranted the job in the first place, he was never good enough to manage a team with our squad, revenue etc yet hicks and gillette listened to purslow and employed him as none of the 3 wanted to listen to rafas legitimate claims about how the club needed more investment then they were willing or able to provide.
Roy started to pull the coffin lid down with some questionable signings and the very poor brand of football, coupled with very poor results nailed it shut as far as his tenure at lfc was concerned.
I think it's naieve to blame it all on h and g as it was a series of poor decisions that led to the demise but they'd a significant part to play
posted on 2/7/13
I think it's naieve to blame it all on h and g as it was a series of poor decisions that led to the demise but they'd a significant part to play
.............
Don't get me wrong bud, H&G were a right pair of t wats, but it is just to easy to blame them on everything. like some of your fans do.
One of the big plusses I here for Rafa was that he built up your academy. Well he done that with the backing of H&G.
Another one that always made me laugh was all the praise Rafa got when he made a good signing, yet when he made a bad one it was someone else’s fault.
posted on 2/7/13
academy. Well he done that with the backing of H&G.
---
Already started doing that before H and G appeared on the scene.
posted on 2/7/13
Already started doing that before H and G appeared on the scene.
................
And carried on doing it while they were there.
posted on 2/7/13
Redinthehead
In H&G fist two years Rrafa signed 41 players.
posted on 2/7/13
and how much was the networth of them players.
posted on 2/7/13
comment by Suso The Magician - (U11770)
posted 2 minutes ago
and how much was the networth of them players.
.......................................
How is that relevant?
When you buy players, you have to sell some to make room for them in your squad. This happens with every football club, not just Liverpool Suso.
posted on 2/7/13
Including youth signed by Rafa to support your point Vidic. Rafa signed alot of players but when he wanted Silva he had to settle for Riera in the end. When he wanted David Villa he got Keane. When he wanted Alves he eventually got Arbeloa who turned out to be great and left with Alonso to Madrid. You cant blame H & G for everything but the buck stopped with them and they controlled everything anyway.
posted on 2/7/13
H&G were largely to blame but let's not forget Rafa had the same issues over player purchases at Valencia.
If Rafa had got all the players he wanted we would have had an amazing side, we also would have had a pretty high probability of doing a Leeds.
Our wage bill was already massive and Rafa showed no sign of wanting to control it.
Rafa is from the school of manager who leaves finance to other people but who is happy to blame other people when they can't afford what he wants.
I prefer my managers to have a bit of fiscal responsibility themselves, which is why I am happier with BR because he recognises we can't afford A-list all the time and that each player has a value.
Rafa is a very good manager of expensive players as he has shown throughout his career, but I wouldn't touch him if I was a chairman working on a budget.
posted on 2/7/13
Excellent post righteous.
posted on 2/7/13
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 3 hours, 15 minutes ago
Redinthehead
In H&G fist two years Rrafa signed 41 players.
----
He didnt keep all those 41 players on the clubs books though. When finances were squeezed by H & G, Rafa had to look at bringing in players that could have been bargains rather than the near finished product.
Both Torres and Mascherano were bought with additional loans rather than from H and G's pocket. It's only then, when they became so highly leveraged that they could not get other loans that acquisitions of top players stopped.
Take Aquilani, Alonso sold for £30m.. Aquilani bought in for an initial £5m and a payment plan for the rest.
Tells its own story.
Rafa is a top manager, but had Purslow, H and G above him (all with 0 years, literally, experience in football) telling him how to do his job.
The bloke had no chance, had the rug pulled from under him.
posted on 2/7/13
If Rafa had our current owners it would have been a brilliant combination.
posted on 4/7/13
I disagree with you righteous. Liverpool raked in tons of money when Rafa was in charge. We were always in the last four or thereabouts in the Champions League and always in the top 4 in England.
I definitely don't think Rafa didn't care about finances. Honestly I think to think so is outrageous. IMO Rafa knew exactly what the club could afford and what it couldn't and made demands based on this and therefore his frustration at not getting it. If the Yanks didn't have us paying 40m pounds a year in interest payments alone and we turned in a profit inspite of the yanks at the time!!!!
We had an opportrunity to establish a dynasty with what Rafa was doing I feel if he was given the support he had built quite a formidable force but the wheels will come off if you are getting half baked support consistently.
Our wage bill at the time was consistent with a CL club so I don't really look at it the same way. We had to reduce it when we dropped out of the CL due to income going down IMO.
posted on 4/7/13
what Red Mamba said
posted on 4/7/13
Remember also that Dubai came in and offered G&H a 500m offer for the club they bought for 250m.
They said they wanted 750m (1bn dollars)
What a pair of
posted on 4/7/13
You can't credit all of United's success to Fergie as he had help but without him United would probably still be floundering.
In the same way you can't blame H & G for everything but they were still entirely responsible for our downfall in that same respect if you get what I mean.
Page 2 of 2