comment by Ji Sung Park's Cousin - hustla service (U2958)
posted 48 minutes ago
Bebe looked world class in the Portuguese league.
------------------------
He simply didn't.
I will never know why people have to play the billy big balls on here and can;t just admit they don;t know a certain league.
I don't comment on lesser known players from Italy or Germany as I watch next to nothing of those leagues. It is not something embarrassing to admit. I just have better things to do with my life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is totally true. Bebe scored a couple of nifty goals but a Falcao, James or even Hulk (yes, they did play in Portugal!) he was not.
You obviously know your stuff about our league, mate, kudos for that.
The amount of lazy people who use the "average/poor league" when not commenting the fashionable flavour of the month is just sad, really.
Carrick's forward passing is a joy to watch. He releases it as quick as anyone if there is a pass on and is as accurate as anyone
One poor season last season won't change that for me
The majority of our players were garbage last season
Carrick's a passer. If there's an option, he'll find it, if there isn't, he's ineffective.
I ideally want a midfielder who can press for large periods of the game, is comfortable on the ball and able to distribute it well with a good variety of passes. From what I've read that is exactly what Carvalho offers. That would then enable a player like Herrera to work further up the field and work in areas where he can have a greater threat.
He would work in both a 2 and 3 man midfield. He would also work better with better quality out wide and the se can be said the other way round which is why a winger is just as important as a CM right now. If we can get both then both will benefit massively.
All reports suggest we aren't even in for Carvalho anyway, so it doesn't matter.
It's a bit lazy but Khadira seems the obvious option, as does Di Maria for the wing.
You are missing my point
..............
Not really.
I get your point.
But your wing men need to be getting the ball in the opponents half, not where Young was getting it in his own half.
It is this obsession with passing sideways with no thought of moving through the middle with pace.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 6 seconds ago
You are missing my point
..............
Not really.
I get your point.
But your wing men need to be getting the ball in the opponents half, not where Young was getting it in his own half.
It is this obsession with passing sideways with no thought of moving through the middle with pace.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I understand the point on the midfielder, and I agree we need a new midfielder alongside Herrera.
I still don't think, regardless of you midfield, that Valencia or Young will provide the required quality for us to finish top 4.
Carrick's forward passing is a joy to watch. He releases it as quick as anyone if there is a pass on and is as accurate as anyone
...................
But Carrick is far too deep when he plays for us. He should have been played much further up the field.
A DM he is not. We have got away with it far to long and last season we got found out.
Hey VC
Want a laugh?
Go on Viva ronaldo's thread about Di Maria going to PSG
I am skeptical of how much we can offer on the wings if we continue to operate with wingbacks.
What works so well using fullbacks and wingers is the ability to use wingers to pull opponents out of position to give the fullback the space to attacks.
Currently we are expecting too much from players that have never really played the wingback roles.
But your wing men need to be getting the ball in the opponents half, not where Young was getting it in his own half.
--------------------------------
Even if it were a good foward ball... The difference between that and an inch perfect ball from someone like Scholes will make all the difference.
The winger will be under less pressure, as the defence try to get back into position, can get his head up and pick the pass.
I think a fit 30 year old Scholes in this squad and we would be challenging for the league again. SAF gets the plaudits (of course) for dragging us over the line in these later years, but Scholes was who made average to good players come alive, as he gave them valuable seconds to think.
But one of Carricks strengths is his positional sense which would be far less effective further forward. His lack of mobility is covered slightly playing deeper because of this. You can still play deep and effect play with your passes, that's the role of a Regista.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 minute ago
I am skeptical of how much we can offer on the wings if we continue to operate with wingbacks.
What works so well using fullbacks and wingers is the ability to use wingers to pull opponents out of position to give the fullback the space to attacks.
Currently we are expecting too much from players that have never really played the wingback roles.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm working on the basis that LVG has said we do not have good enough wingers to play a 4-3-3.
If we signed a winger, we would then have good enough wingers to revert to his favoured system.
Come Christmas, I'd be surprised if we are playing 5-3-2 / 3-5-2.
And in terms of the 3-5-2 system we are currently playing, we definitely do (imo) need more pace in the middle to make it work.
We look so bad out of possession, we just don't have the players to make the pressing game work.
Problem with it is it expects too much defensively from Mata.
That's the big reason why I would love di Maria, it would instantly allow us to operate 433.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 3 minutes ago
Problem with it is it expects too much defensively from Mata.
That's the big reason why I would love di Maria, it would instantly allow us to operate 433.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Anybody else already missing 442
It was the last formation we played only 6 days ago.
comment by Busbybabes (U9083)
posted 29 minutes ago
We look so bad out of possession, we just don't have the players to make the pressing game work.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's more to do with organisation, stamina and aggression than pace though.
I'd have sold him long ago anyway.... even
when he was at his best, I never really
enjoyed watching him play.
This is probably the only time when I have agreed with you on this site hipster.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 36 minutes ago
It was the last formation we played only 6 days ago.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Looked like a 433 to me but I haven't seen the game on TV tbf
It depends on your style of play and what other players you have in the side.
I'm of the opinion that weaknesses in certain players should be catered for by others in the side. Now looking at that spine through the middle of attack in the 352, it certainly lacks pace.
A midfielder that has pace to get up and down to contribute in both defence and attack can help us going forward because Mata, Rooney and RVP will need support from the midfield.
Carvalho may be a good player to have as a dm, I don't know much about him, but I don't see the need for an out an out dm when we are playing with three cb's. The whole point of a dm is to protect the defence, if a back three/five needs a specialist dm to protect it then we are facked.
Also on Valencia, BB is bang on. Valencia was crap when Scholes was still in the team in his last season, and Carrick had his best season and was releasing the ball quicker than he ever has when passing forward.
Yet our wingers were still crap. Young had always been crap in a United shirt. And Nani hasn't been good since 2011. So the midfield isn't to blame for their lack of quality and effectiveness - though it obviously doesn't help.
Sign in if you want to comment
Pace in midfield, overrated
Page 3 of 3
posted on 22/8/14
comment by Ji Sung Park's Cousin - hustla service (U2958)
posted 48 minutes ago
Bebe looked world class in the Portuguese league.
------------------------
He simply didn't.
I will never know why people have to play the billy big balls on here and can;t just admit they don;t know a certain league.
I don't comment on lesser known players from Italy or Germany as I watch next to nothing of those leagues. It is not something embarrassing to admit. I just have better things to do with my life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is totally true. Bebe scored a couple of nifty goals but a Falcao, James or even Hulk (yes, they did play in Portugal!) he was not.
You obviously know your stuff about our league, mate, kudos for that.
The amount of lazy people who use the "average/poor league" when not commenting the fashionable flavour of the month is just sad, really.
posted on 22/8/14
Carrick's forward passing is a joy to watch. He releases it as quick as anyone if there is a pass on and is as accurate as anyone
One poor season last season won't change that for me
The majority of our players were garbage last season
Carrick's a passer. If there's an option, he'll find it, if there isn't, he's ineffective.
posted on 22/8/14
I ideally want a midfielder who can press for large periods of the game, is comfortable on the ball and able to distribute it well with a good variety of passes. From what I've read that is exactly what Carvalho offers. That would then enable a player like Herrera to work further up the field and work in areas where he can have a greater threat.
He would work in both a 2 and 3 man midfield. He would also work better with better quality out wide and the se can be said the other way round which is why a winger is just as important as a CM right now. If we can get both then both will benefit massively.
posted on 22/8/14
All reports suggest we aren't even in for Carvalho anyway, so it doesn't matter.
It's a bit lazy but Khadira seems the obvious option, as does Di Maria for the wing.
posted on 22/8/14
You are missing my point
..............
Not really.
I get your point.
But your wing men need to be getting the ball in the opponents half, not where Young was getting it in his own half.
It is this obsession with passing sideways with no thought of moving through the middle with pace.
posted on 22/8/14
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 6 seconds ago
You are missing my point
..............
Not really.
I get your point.
But your wing men need to be getting the ball in the opponents half, not where Young was getting it in his own half.
It is this obsession with passing sideways with no thought of moving through the middle with pace.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I understand the point on the midfielder, and I agree we need a new midfielder alongside Herrera.
I still don't think, regardless of you midfield, that Valencia or Young will provide the required quality for us to finish top 4.
posted on 22/8/14
Carrick's forward passing is a joy to watch. He releases it as quick as anyone if there is a pass on and is as accurate as anyone
...................
But Carrick is far too deep when he plays for us. He should have been played much further up the field.
A DM he is not. We have got away with it far to long and last season we got found out.
posted on 22/8/14
Hey VC
Want a laugh?
Go on Viva ronaldo's thread about Di Maria going to PSG
posted on 22/8/14
Agree he plays too deep
posted on 22/8/14
I am skeptical of how much we can offer on the wings if we continue to operate with wingbacks.
What works so well using fullbacks and wingers is the ability to use wingers to pull opponents out of position to give the fullback the space to attacks.
Currently we are expecting too much from players that have never really played the wingback roles.
posted on 22/8/14
But your wing men need to be getting the ball in the opponents half, not where Young was getting it in his own half.
--------------------------------
Even if it were a good foward ball... The difference between that and an inch perfect ball from someone like Scholes will make all the difference.
The winger will be under less pressure, as the defence try to get back into position, can get his head up and pick the pass.
I think a fit 30 year old Scholes in this squad and we would be challenging for the league again. SAF gets the plaudits (of course) for dragging us over the line in these later years, but Scholes was who made average to good players come alive, as he gave them valuable seconds to think.
posted on 22/8/14
But one of Carricks strengths is his positional sense which would be far less effective further forward. His lack of mobility is covered slightly playing deeper because of this. You can still play deep and effect play with your passes, that's the role of a Regista.
posted on 22/8/14
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 minute ago
I am skeptical of how much we can offer on the wings if we continue to operate with wingbacks.
What works so well using fullbacks and wingers is the ability to use wingers to pull opponents out of position to give the fullback the space to attacks.
Currently we are expecting too much from players that have never really played the wingback roles.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm working on the basis that LVG has said we do not have good enough wingers to play a 4-3-3.
If we signed a winger, we would then have good enough wingers to revert to his favoured system.
Come Christmas, I'd be surprised if we are playing 5-3-2 / 3-5-2.
posted on 22/8/14
And in terms of the 3-5-2 system we are currently playing, we definitely do (imo) need more pace in the middle to make it work.
We look so bad out of possession, we just don't have the players to make the pressing game work.
posted on 22/8/14
Problem with it is it expects too much defensively from Mata.
That's the big reason why I would love di Maria, it would instantly allow us to operate 433.
posted on 22/8/14
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 3 minutes ago
Problem with it is it expects too much defensively from Mata.
That's the big reason why I would love di Maria, it would instantly allow us to operate 433.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 22/8/14
Anybody else already missing 442
posted on 22/8/14
It was the last formation we played only 6 days ago.
posted on 22/8/14
comment by Busbybabes (U9083)
posted 29 minutes ago
We look so bad out of possession, we just don't have the players to make the pressing game work.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's more to do with organisation, stamina and aggression than pace though.
posted on 22/8/14
I'd have sold him long ago anyway.... even
when he was at his best, I never really
enjoyed watching him play.
This is probably the only time when I have agreed with you on this site hipster.
posted on 22/8/14
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 36 minutes ago
It was the last formation we played only 6 days ago.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Looked like a 433 to me but I haven't seen the game on TV tbf
posted on 22/8/14
It depends on your style of play and what other players you have in the side.
I'm of the opinion that weaknesses in certain players should be catered for by others in the side. Now looking at that spine through the middle of attack in the 352, it certainly lacks pace.
A midfielder that has pace to get up and down to contribute in both defence and attack can help us going forward because Mata, Rooney and RVP will need support from the midfield.
Carvalho may be a good player to have as a dm, I don't know much about him, but I don't see the need for an out an out dm when we are playing with three cb's. The whole point of a dm is to protect the defence, if a back three/five needs a specialist dm to protect it then we are facked.
Also on Valencia, BB is bang on. Valencia was crap when Scholes was still in the team in his last season, and Carrick had his best season and was releasing the ball quicker than he ever has when passing forward.
Yet our wingers were still crap. Young had always been crap in a United shirt. And Nani hasn't been good since 2011. So the midfield isn't to blame for their lack of quality and effectiveness - though it obviously doesn't help.
Page 3 of 3