I see you are all too scared to debate my whims!!

So "The Emperor Has No Clothes". Some of us knew that from the outset.

I don't go for the “Brake by wire” excuse. Isn't it supposed to be a driver aid? Doesn't it take the sensitivity of the drivers foot action and translate it immediately to braking demand?

I think his move to Ferrari is his last ditch attempt to make some money before his excuses finally run out.

I agree with you. Ferrari will not suddenly become a better team than RedBull or design a better car. We have seen that without his magic exhaust he is no better than the Ericsson's of this world

I think thats going a bit overboard

You don't get to this part of your career without being at least a little bit good (or richly backed). The praise of him got a little overboard at times I agree but now the criticism is getting overboard.

I think he's a very good driver who struggled this season. If I was to split the grid into 4 bands of talent I think I'd put Vettel into the second best band.

One season does not make for a bad driver

i agree with Nsix.

Up to 2008 I was never impressed by Fernando Alonso and now I think he is one of the best out there. So I am willing to change my view of Vettel if he puts in performances that impress me to the same extent that others have (impressed me).

Up to now he has done nothing to impress me at all. I am not just judging him on 2014.

I have never been convinced by Vettel and the praise he was getting was ridiculous.

I'm not trying to be a counter to the hype machine but a lot of people did not think RIcciardo was even as good as Vergne and he has destroyed Seb with ease.

We have seen a driver not able to adapt his style as a result of losing a significant aero advantage. I always questioned his racing ability and race craft, did so for years. Seen nothing yet to change my mind.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

I frequently invite members of this forum to post a comment to justify their positive opinion of Vettel.

Nobody has ever taken up my offer.

I have a positive opinion of vettel

I think he is a good driver, not great, but good. He also did put some very consistent performances in, in the red bulls. Granted the cars where Exceptional, but they still had to be driven.

Hes a good driver, not great, but good, and in the second tier, with the buttons and massas of this world

Massa and Button are better drivers in my humble opinion. They have won races in uncompetitive machinery. I reckon Seb is at the level of Di Rests or lower

I think u do him a little dis service tbh. Time will tell

Sebastian Vettel is not Michael Schumacher.

Ferrari are dysfunctional.

Ferrari refuse to accept internal criticism. They have fired good people (drivers included) for trying to give them feed back as to how bad their car is.

Ferrari believe that their name alone guarantees world dominance.

Ferrari rely on their cosy deal with FOM to ensure that they get paid more than any other team irrespective of their results.

Michael Schumacher went to Ferrari and sacrificed 2 years to help build them. He fired off all the Italian slackers and recruited British engineers. Then he left and Ferrari are skilfully undoing all his good work and going back to what they do best = losing.

The success of Sebastian Vettel was entirely due to Adrian Newey.

Adrian Newey actually races cars as well as designing them. Newey told Sebastian Vettel how to take advantage of the exhaust to rotate the car through corners. Newey engineered Vettel.

When Sebastian Vettel won his 4th WDC certain people suddenly praised him. Glory hunters I think they are called. Where was this praise in junior formula or in previous years?

“Don't judge him by one year” they command. Well Sebastian Vettel's supporters waited 4 years before they clung to him. Looking pretty sick now though.

I'm still waiting for the Vettel fans to explain to me why he is great.

Vettel is a much better driver than Massa I think, as is Button.I expect that he will see off Kimi quite comfortably too next year. I don't have him in the same league as Hamilton and Alonso though. Rosberg, Button, Vettel, Bottas, Hulkenberg, Perez and Danny Ricc are all similar imo. I have my opinion (I think the Hulk is the best of these) but I acknowledge it is very subjective.
It does beg the question though, after at least matching DR and beating Kvyat fairly easily, how good is JEV? At 24 his F1 career is apparently over and for me I could name alot of drivers who have not earned the right to be in F1 anywhere near as much. He also has a junior record that is as good as any, including Lewis.

Jev has been badly treated in my humble opinion. Redbull have this thing about young drivers now. So hos career is unfortunately over as paydrivers have taken other available seats.

Ferrari have hired former Toro Rosso driver Jean-Eric Vergne to work on car development in their simulator.
The Frenchman was dropped by the Red Bull junior team last month and had been looking for a new role in F1.
He replaces Spaniard Pedro De La Rosa, who has left Ferrari after two years with the Italian team.
Vergne, 24, said joining Ferrari was an "honour" and a "dream" and that he was committed to "helping the Scuderia get back to the top step of the podium".
His employment is the latest move in a fundamental restructuring of Ferrari in the last few weeks, including the sacking of several senior personnel.
This week, Ferrari have announced the departures of their former engineering director Pat Fry, chief designer Nikolas Tombazis and tyre analyst Hirohide Hamashima.

They lost their lead driver Fernando Alonso, who negotiated an exit from his contract to join McLaren, and replaced him with four-time champion Sebastian Vettel.
And immediately after the end of the season team principal Marco Mattiacci was sacked after only seven months in the job.
The hiring of Vergne and departure of De La Rosa by new team principal Maurizio Arrivabene is a shift away from the Alonso era - De La Rosa is close to his countryman.
However, fellow Spaniard Marc Gene remains as a test driver, alongside Italian Davide Rigon.
Last week Ferrari signed Mexican former Sauber driver Esteban Gutierrez as their reserve driver, and the next day announced a major sponsorship package from the 23-year-old's home country.

I originally thought wow when Vettel came on the scene. But then when we started to find out more about the car he was driving, the EBD and the flexing front wings, my doubts set in.
I actually think he is a very good driver, but as pointed out by many not in the top tier, and possibly not at the top of the second tier.
IMO Alonso Hamilton are in the top tier with Ricciardo and Bottas knocking on the door.

Feel for jev - hes going to be a trst driver for 1 or maybe 2 drivers he is better than

Seb had 3 seasons of total domination, he may have had the car but he used it to the maximum. I was annoyed that seasons were ruined by there being no battle at the top but I can't begrudge what Vettel did, simply put what more could he have done.

He struggled last season and got a lot of mocking for it, but still managed 4 podiums and 5th overall. Considering the Red bull was often the third best car thats not horrific, he achieved an average result at worst.

I think he's been way over hyped in the past but he is clearly a very good driver. The fact that he's been so mocked for 2014 shows how high we are used to him being

“Considering the Red bull was often the third best”

Then what was the second best?

Williams?

Williams was not second best consistently. The redbull in Ricciardos hands was the next best after the mercs

didn't say always third best

I could probably fill one hands worth of fingers when thinking of drivers I rate higher than Vettel at the moment, but no where near as many as others!

Drivers I rate higher than Vettel

Alonso
Hamilton
Ricciardo
Button
Bottas
Hulkenberg
Rosberg
Bianchi