Not moaning, Forest have gambled by splashing the cash and have to take the consequences.

DM, I wholeheartedly agree with what you are saying and think it would be a great idea.

Bolton pay 5% interest on the loan to Edwin Davies's company. They also had to pay a £3.6M arrangement fee. Soon they will not be able to cover the interest payments. I think the arrangement at Bolton is similar to the one Doughty had at Forest.

Fulham had a £200M interest free loan from Al Fayhed. Both clubs lived way beyond their means for several seasons but it shows that it is still unsustainable without significant income.

"Maybe the owner of Bolton gave the league reassurances about what happens to the debt in the event of his death."
Yeh, that's likely

This is why Fawaz is appreciated by fans.

Weirdly, the FFP embargo may really help Forest.

It's a god send, strett.

I wonder how long he will want to keep trying - he's on his fifth, maybe soon to be sixth manager and it looks as though Forest are further away than ever from promotion. If he does keep going, fair play to him for persistence - I am sure he expected it to be far easier than this!

If he isn't going to be allowed to bankroll the club to promotion as anticipated then it may be that a few sterner questions will be asked of him by fans who up until now have simply appreciated his financial input. He likes being popular, that's apparent, and so far such criticism as has come from Forest supporters has been directed to the various inept managers that have been in charge rather than the person who appointed them, but surely that won't go on indefinitely.

Without opening old wounds even the best of owners get criticised on occasions, and on those instances when Fawaz has had a few negative comments on Twitter he has not handled it well. If Pearce goes he is likely to get a reasonable amount of stick from those faithful of a questioning disposition, not just for this season but for the whole sorry shambolic nature of his tenure. He has reacted previously to pressure with knee-jerk appointments like Davies and Pearce which he thought would appease the fans but it would be harder to convince anyone this time with yet another throw of the dice. If he were to go back to his former life but without leaving the club in crippling debt to him, wouldn't that be the best option all round? If he loves Forest, shouldn't he let Forest go?

a bit dramatic vidals

Vidal, are you suggesting that no Forest fans have questioned him? Because that is just not true.

His next manager will be the first recruited since Faulkner, when that happens (whenever it is), you would think he would have some influence

This is just laughable! you sheep for year upon year were all Calling GSE blind for not investing in the club.

As with many football fans they to have those that look for excuses when things aren't going well and target certain people to point the finger at. They just seem to have forgotten that there was a split in the opinion whether the stagnation under NLN was the manager or their owners for not investing. They even had a bit of a protest about it but as they're doing well now, and FFP is there everything is rosy.

Fawaz loves the club. I've met him and his knowledge of old players is very good. He will probably leave it to his offspring who actually attend games from time to time. He just needs to get more business like with it. I wouldn't swap him.

As for Pearce, he loves the club too. But he has no financial clout. He won't be manager forever either. On saying that I'd like him to see his contract through at least. Hopefully we can get a result on Saturday and even if we don't win the week after he won't go the way of that last prat we had. Davies almost ruined our club with his unfinished business. I couldn't stand the man when he was he and still don't.

I don't see us going up this season but I blame vital injuries and players who don't always play for the shirt. Not Pearce.

Also.... Reidy could play a part Saturday.

What is your point RFB

Iwas he's trying to take the limelight of them on to us. Like always

I'll help here. Wassa is attempting to say that RFB is trying to take the limelight OFF Forest and onto Derby.

It was a valid point to be fair in response to valid, a bit complicated for Iwas and WAGBO but for most people fairly straight forward

Valid indeed.

Go Somewhere Else was oft used.

It's almost like those that questioned them were wrong now FFP has come in and they've progressed on the pitch. WAGBO himself got over excited when they joined, then later had doubted them from the beginning apparently and now seems happy to live with them again.

I wouldn't call it fickle but in a vice versa situation that's what we'd be being called

It's certainly a valid point to talk about the changing attitude of some Derby supporters towards the ownership. While nothing appeared to be progressing on the pitch some of us were very critical. I said at the time that the plan seemed to be to let other clubs over-reach themselves and fall past us which seemed an improbable way to achieve success, but I think they were a bit smarter than we gave them credit for behind the scenes. Opinion still differs of course: there are some who think they simply got lucky with Clough, a crop of good young players and now McClaren. There are still some of us who think that if Derby had been funded better three or four years ago that we would have been out of the division by now.

But back to the OP! I wasn't trying to be overly-dramatic but in the case of managers, if they are useless - signing rubbish players who don't win and the like - then they get sacked as opposed to just hoping that they will eventually get better. Fawaz has had plenty of time in his current position and has surely shown himself to be pretty useless at running a football club. You would have thought the sensible thing would be to let someone do it who is better suited. Loving the club is no substitute for competence, whether it is the owner or manager.

"You would have thought the sensible thing would be to let someone do it who is better suited."

Which is what a CEO does and we've covered that over the last few days a number of times now

Do you have faith in anyone Fawaz appoints? Didn't he appoint Jim Price FFS? I think Faulkner was responsible for appointing McLeish to Villa so maybe the wheel will turn full circle!

He's Forest related of course you immediately think he's going to be crap.

You suggest FAH needs to hire someone to run things on a couple of occasions now and when I point out he has (again) you write him off totally as FAH has appointed him. Save you waffle in the future it doesn't seem to have any constructive conclusion

Well, my instincts are to examine the available evidence and to draw conclusions Ray. Under the circumstances it would indeed be astonishing if he were anything other than crap, but I enjoy surprises so I hope I am wrong. In Fawaz we trust as they say.

Do you think that the rumours that Pearce may be about to be sacked have any basis Ray? If so, do you think that Faulkner is the one who will make the decision?

You are hardly objective and have a VERY unhealthy level of interest