I think we need a bit more physical presence in the middle, Santi, Ozil & Coq imo isn't working.
Hope Wilshere can be the answer to the problem, while Rambo is out injured.
We're struggling to find the right balance between attacking and defending especially away from home.
After getting tanked so many times last year we're now sitting back trying to contain rather than taking the game to the opposition. However, we've gone too far the other way and now cannot seem to enforce our attacking play for the fear of getting caught on the break.
Wenger needs to sort it out as we're getting outplayed away from home time and time again and better teams are not going to be as profligate as Palace were today.
Think it is a tactic. Let the opposition have non-threatening possession.
Not sure if it actually works, given our players, so yes, it is a concern.
Yes, I am. If this was one off poor game then I'd be ok with it but it's been a regular theme this season. Can't even keep the ball despite having brilliant ball players. I don't get it. And why are we "parking the bus" against teams like these? I can understand it against City, Chelsea, Liverpool away from home but not Palace ffs.
Think not only us struggling again the "weaker" teams, Tu Meke.
We should be sitting back away from home against the big teams but not against palace
I think the main problem is that the lack of pace/running in-behind that we have in the final third gives the opposition more freedom to push up high and press us.
Giroud's a good link-up striker, but his natural inclination is to drop deep; Sanchez is quick, but he seems to like to drift into pockets of space and run with the ball through the centre; and whilst Welbeck is exceptionally fast, he doesn't seem to make many diagonal runs in-behind (although he did make a good run for the second goal) - again, he seems to prefer the ball to feet when he's playing in the wide positions.
When we come up against a side like this, I think we either have to:
-Play Welbeck up-front and hang him off the shoulders of defenders, or;
-Play either Chamberlain or Walcott - the former drives into the space with the ball, and the latter makes fantastic runs-in-behind.
It was hardly "non-threatening" though DJ. They got in behind plenty of times, it was down to their utterly lame final ball.
HUNTING,
I'm not sure a big brute in midfield will help us against this pressing tactic teams are deploying against us. We need to take the game to the opposition more. It's verging on cowardice at times.
Oh, my bad DJ, didn't read the 2nd part of your comment
No physicality in midfield. Coquelin - Cazorla - Ozil is powderpuff. At least when Ramsey is playing, despite all his criticisms, he gets stuck in and closes down the opposition.
comment by Tu Meke Santi (U3732)
posted 2 minutes ago
HUNTING,
I'm not sure a big brute in midfield will help us against this pressing tactic teams are deploying against us. We need to take the game to the opposition more. It's verging on cowardice at times.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Doesnt have to be a big brute, like Genius said we just need some toughness in the middle.
Spot on Dastudogg.
We also need to push full backs into midfield to out number the press. Or you allow the full backs of the opposition to push into you half which means that their wingers are almost parallel to your penalty area without any effort.
Thats why Bellerin has looked so good when he has played compared to Chambers. Its been a scandal why Monreal has been selected ahead of Gibbs. Kind of shows why Wenger doesn't know what he has or what tactics he is playing.
Yh, but if that physical player is told to sit back and mop up what the opposition take to him, we'll be in the same position. Same goes for the rest of the midfield/team.
I think the defensive qualities of Coquelin and Cazorla are being underrated here. The pair had the most and second most tackles+interceptions of any player on the pitch respectively today.
The presence of Ramsey didn't stop us getting completely overran by teams like Dortmund and Tottenham.
You can even go back to a time when we had Vieira and Gilberto and see examples of when we were completely outbattled when the balance of the team wasn't right - the 2005 FA Cup final, for example, where we were absolutely annihilated for 120 minutes and then scraped it on penalties.
It's always going to be very difficult for a midfield when they're forced to play deep because of the pressing from the opposition (and the lack of out-balls to relieve pressure).
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 5 minutes ago
Spot on Dastudogg.
We also need to push full backs into midfield to out number the press. Or you allow the full backs of the opposition to push into you half which means that their wingers are almost parallel to your penalty area without any effort.
Thats why Bellerin has looked so good when he has played compared to Chambers. Its been a scandal why Monreal has been selected ahead of Gibbs. Kind of shows why Wenger doesn't know what he has or what tactics he is playing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agreed Zaha and Bolasie (when he came on) were so far up the pitch. I can appreciate the qualities than Monreal and Chambers bring, but I'm always a little concerned when they come up against pacey, direct widemen.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
"Press us and we're kinda done."
--------------------
Must be the manager.
It's not only a consequence of a lack of pace up upfront, although it would be helpful.
It's also an indication of how (in)effective our transition play is. The issue of being unable to bring the ball out from our half against pressing teams with quick passing has been there for a while, and it's the manager who should be addressing this.
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posted on 21/2/15
I think we need a bit more physical presence in the middle, Santi, Ozil & Coq imo isn't working.
Hope Wilshere can be the answer to the problem, while Rambo is out injured.
posted on 21/2/15
We're struggling to find the right balance between attacking and defending especially away from home.
After getting tanked so many times last year we're now sitting back trying to contain rather than taking the game to the opposition. However, we've gone too far the other way and now cannot seem to enforce our attacking play for the fear of getting caught on the break.
Wenger needs to sort it out as we're getting outplayed away from home time and time again and better teams are not going to be as profligate as Palace were today.
posted on 21/2/15
Think it is a tactic. Let the opposition have non-threatening possession.
Not sure if it actually works, given our players, so yes, it is a concern.
posted on 21/2/15
Yes, I am. If this was one off poor game then I'd be ok with it but it's been a regular theme this season. Can't even keep the ball despite having brilliant ball players. I don't get it. And why are we "parking the bus" against teams like these? I can understand it against City, Chelsea, Liverpool away from home but not Palace ffs.
posted on 21/2/15
Think not only us struggling again the "weaker" teams, Tu Meke.
posted on 21/2/15
We should be sitting back away from home against the big teams but not against palace
posted on 21/2/15
I think the main problem is that the lack of pace/running in-behind that we have in the final third gives the opposition more freedom to push up high and press us.
Giroud's a good link-up striker, but his natural inclination is to drop deep; Sanchez is quick, but he seems to like to drift into pockets of space and run with the ball through the centre; and whilst Welbeck is exceptionally fast, he doesn't seem to make many diagonal runs in-behind (although he did make a good run for the second goal) - again, he seems to prefer the ball to feet when he's playing in the wide positions.
When we come up against a side like this, I think we either have to:
-Play Welbeck up-front and hang him off the shoulders of defenders, or;
-Play either Chamberlain or Walcott - the former drives into the space with the ball, and the latter makes fantastic runs-in-behind.
posted on 21/2/15
It was hardly "non-threatening" though DJ. They got in behind plenty of times, it was down to their utterly lame final ball.
posted on 21/2/15
HUNTING,
I'm not sure a big brute in midfield will help us against this pressing tactic teams are deploying against us. We need to take the game to the opposition more. It's verging on cowardice at times.
posted on 21/2/15
Oh, my bad DJ, didn't read the 2nd part of your comment
posted on 21/2/15
No physicality in midfield. Coquelin - Cazorla - Ozil is powderpuff. At least when Ramsey is playing, despite all his criticisms, he gets stuck in and closes down the opposition.
posted on 21/2/15
comment by Tu Meke Santi (U3732)
posted 2 minutes ago
HUNTING,
I'm not sure a big brute in midfield will help us against this pressing tactic teams are deploying against us. We need to take the game to the opposition more. It's verging on cowardice at times.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Doesnt have to be a big brute, like Genius said we just need some toughness in the middle.
posted on 21/2/15
Spot on Dastudogg.
We also need to push full backs into midfield to out number the press. Or you allow the full backs of the opposition to push into you half which means that their wingers are almost parallel to your penalty area without any effort.
Thats why Bellerin has looked so good when he has played compared to Chambers. Its been a scandal why Monreal has been selected ahead of Gibbs. Kind of shows why Wenger doesn't know what he has or what tactics he is playing.
posted on 21/2/15
Yh, but if that physical player is told to sit back and mop up what the opposition take to him, we'll be in the same position. Same goes for the rest of the midfield/team.
posted on 21/2/15
I think the defensive qualities of Coquelin and Cazorla are being underrated here. The pair had the most and second most tackles+interceptions of any player on the pitch respectively today.
The presence of Ramsey didn't stop us getting completely overran by teams like Dortmund and Tottenham.
You can even go back to a time when we had Vieira and Gilberto and see examples of when we were completely outbattled when the balance of the team wasn't right - the 2005 FA Cup final, for example, where we were absolutely annihilated for 120 minutes and then scraped it on penalties.
It's always going to be very difficult for a midfield when they're forced to play deep because of the pressing from the opposition (and the lack of out-balls to relieve pressure).
posted on 21/2/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 21/2/15
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 5 minutes ago
Spot on Dastudogg.
We also need to push full backs into midfield to out number the press. Or you allow the full backs of the opposition to push into you half which means that their wingers are almost parallel to your penalty area without any effort.
Thats why Bellerin has looked so good when he has played compared to Chambers. Its been a scandal why Monreal has been selected ahead of Gibbs. Kind of shows why Wenger doesn't know what he has or what tactics he is playing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agreed Zaha and Bolasie (when he came on) were so far up the pitch. I can appreciate the qualities than Monreal and Chambers bring, but I'm always a little concerned when they come up against pacey, direct widemen.
posted on 21/2/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 23/2/15
"Press us and we're kinda done."
--------------------
Must be the manager.
It's not only a consequence of a lack of pace up upfront, although it would be helpful.
It's also an indication of how (in)effective our transition play is. The issue of being unable to bring the ball out from our half against pressing teams with quick passing has been there for a while, and it's the manager who should be addressing this.
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