Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 40 seconds ago
Robb your virtual shower girlfriend called, she said the first 19 nights weren't all that impressive either
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Funny she told me that too !
comment by Robb Constantine (U20351)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 54 seconds ago
Same could have been said of many good players who struggled in their first season with a club.
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You're talking about a hypothetical world where ADM stays and is better in his second season. In reality he's off now and will be considered a flop.
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He's a flop like many players who performed badly in their first season, whether they picked up or not isn't really the issue as we will have nothing to compare them to (assuming ADM moves)
Falcao might have been a worse flop. Probably a draw.
I think it's understandable that he wants to go, was a massive step down in his career going to Utd.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 2 minutes ago
Robb your virtual shower girlfriend called, she said the first 19 nights weren't all that impressive either
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True
Played a lot worse but cost a lot less in fairness.
comment by The Kaiser's Trainers (U5676)
posted 26 seconds ago
Falcao might have been a worse flop. Probably a draw.
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Yeah but it has to be relative to how much you pay and expect for a player too. Falcao was on loan and not been great since his knee injury. There was a large degree of risk in that one and hence the loan.
Di Maria came as a WC player, MOTM in CL final and was expected to tear up the league. Both flops IMO
I believe he would have come good, but his seeming disinterest in being a Utd player wouldn't see that happen. There are tons of PL stars who weren't pulling up tree in their first season. I can think of Henry and Pires in Arsenal as great examples. I can bet you Di Maria would return to a world class level at PSG.
I don't think AdM was ever WC anyway, he always had inconsistency issues and dubious decision making. Very good (on his day) though
comment by The Kaiser's Trainers (U5676)
posted 1 minute ago
I don't think AdM was ever WC anyway, he always had inconsistency issues and dubious decision making. Very good (on his day) though
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Tend to agree with this. Fantastic on his day. At his best when played centrally I believe.
"I don't think AdM was ever WC anyway,"
I would disagree. Wingers are usually the most inconsistent players due to the low percentage/high risk elements of their game dribbling and crossing a lot and Di Maria was no different, but he was one of the very best in the world at it. Di Maria could have gone to any club or international team in the world and been a starter (except perhaps Barca). Not sure how that doesn't make him world class.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 55 minutes ago
So.... Anderson? Valencia? Nani? Shaw? Smith? Berbatov? Kagawa?
All bigger flops than ADM for me and that's just from the last few years (admittedly Smith is going back a while)
I'd say Shaw has only had a season so you can't really judge yet but in that he shares a similarity with the player we are discussing.
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Hold on, hold on.
You can't just list players you don't like an label them as flops! Valencia, really? Since he's joined us he's been in the PFA team of the year, players' and fans' player of the season, played over 150 games, been MOTM in a cup final win, contributed numerous important goals and assists, always been a hardworking professional...
That is not a flop in any sense.
Comment deleted by Article Creator
I loved Berba, got great high hopes for Shaw, just pointing out players who are more of a flop than ADM.
I guess you don't agree with Robb seen as you only questioned a few of them.
Don't know how the hell you can pick out Shaw from that list, at least ADM cared enough to get himself fit!
(this is running on the assumption that effort equals reward which a lot of people seem to be proposing)
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I think that's being considered a floppy rather than a flop.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 5 minutes ago
I loved Berba, got great high hopes for Shaw, just pointing out players who are more of a flop than ADM.
I guess you don't agree with Robb seen as you only questioned a few of them.
Don't know how the hell you can pick out Shaw from that list, at least ADM cared enough to get himself fit!
(this is running on the assumption that effort equals reward which a lot of people seem to be proposing)
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Though on that basis Shaw has knuckled down and looks in great shape. He's beginning to look like he'll be a success story. ADM didn't even make the plane last night.
Floppier than the ears of a drunk rabbit.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 2 minutes ago
I loved Berba, got great high hopes for Shaw, just pointing out players who are more of a flop than ADM.
I guess you don't agree with Robb seen as you only questioned a few of them.
Don't know how the hell you can pick out Shaw from that list, at least ADM cared enough to get himself fit!
(this is running on the assumption that effort equals reward which a lot of people seem to be proposing)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Success is never guaranteed, but talent, application, and a suitable environment can all contribute to pushing up the probability of a decent outcome in equal measure.
Di Maria has the talent. Most of the time he seems to have the application. But I'm just not sure he perfectly suits us or Van Gaal, and his head is definitely not in the right place.
I think it is - to a degree - fair to measure the scale of a flop against net spend, so if we recoup a large proportion of what we shelled out, he's probably no worse a flop than Falcao given he was one expensive loan and that Di Maria gave us more in his one short season.
Given the promise an expectations, it's hard to argue that both didn't seriously underachieve with us.
So now making plane journeys is one of the conditions of being a flop or not....?!
Best not discuss Bergkamp then...
He has some fairly good excuses in fairness, plenty of players have struggled in their first season when coming to a new league. There's many players who would be considered flops if they were judged on their first season in England alone.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 1 minute ago
So now making plane journeys is one of the conditions of being a flop or not....?!
Best not discuss Bergkamp then...
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You mean Flopkamp
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 1 minute ago
So now making plane journeys is one of the conditions of being a flop or not....?!
Best not discuss Bergkamp then...
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I think ADM did actually get on a flight. But to New Jersey where psg are.
That scoundrel.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 27 seconds ago
He has some fairly good excuses in fairness, plenty of players have struggled in their first season when coming to a new league. There's many players who would be considered flops if they were judged on their first season in England alone.
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Yeah, that's a fair point. And I'd love him to be staying, knuckling down, and fighting for a place in the side to prove everybody wrong.
Sign in if you want to comment
Was ADM our biggest flop ever?
Page 3 of 5
posted on 26/7/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 40 seconds ago
Robb your virtual shower girlfriend called, she said the first 19 nights weren't all that impressive either
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Funny she told me that too !
posted on 26/7/15
comment by Robb Constantine (U20351)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 54 seconds ago
Same could have been said of many good players who struggled in their first season with a club.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're talking about a hypothetical world where ADM stays and is better in his second season. In reality he's off now and will be considered a flop.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He's a flop like many players who performed badly in their first season, whether they picked up or not isn't really the issue as we will have nothing to compare them to (assuming ADM moves)
posted on 26/7/15
Falcao might have been a worse flop. Probably a draw.
posted on 26/7/15
I think it's understandable that he wants to go, was a massive step down in his career going to Utd.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 2 minutes ago
Robb your virtual shower girlfriend called, she said the first 19 nights weren't all that impressive either
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True
posted on 26/7/15
Played a lot worse but cost a lot less in fairness.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by The Kaiser's Trainers (U5676)
posted 26 seconds ago
Falcao might have been a worse flop. Probably a draw.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah but it has to be relative to how much you pay and expect for a player too. Falcao was on loan and not been great since his knee injury. There was a large degree of risk in that one and hence the loan.
Di Maria came as a WC player, MOTM in CL final and was expected to tear up the league. Both flops IMO
posted on 26/7/15
I believe he would have come good, but his seeming disinterest in being a Utd player wouldn't see that happen. There are tons of PL stars who weren't pulling up tree in their first season. I can think of Henry and Pires in Arsenal as great examples. I can bet you Di Maria would return to a world class level at PSG.
posted on 26/7/15
I don't think AdM was ever WC anyway, he always had inconsistency issues and dubious decision making. Very good (on his day) though
posted on 26/7/15
comment by The Kaiser's Trainers (U5676)
posted 1 minute ago
I don't think AdM was ever WC anyway, he always had inconsistency issues and dubious decision making. Very good (on his day) though
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tend to agree with this. Fantastic on his day. At his best when played centrally I believe.
posted on 26/7/15
"I don't think AdM was ever WC anyway,"
I would disagree. Wingers are usually the most inconsistent players due to the low percentage/high risk elements of their game dribbling and crossing a lot and Di Maria was no different, but he was one of the very best in the world at it. Di Maria could have gone to any club or international team in the world and been a starter (except perhaps Barca). Not sure how that doesn't make him world class.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 55 minutes ago
So.... Anderson? Valencia? Nani? Shaw? Smith? Berbatov? Kagawa?
All bigger flops than ADM for me and that's just from the last few years (admittedly Smith is going back a while)
I'd say Shaw has only had a season so you can't really judge yet but in that he shares a similarity with the player we are discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hold on, hold on.
You can't just list players you don't like an label them as flops! Valencia, really? Since he's joined us he's been in the PFA team of the year, players' and fans' player of the season, played over 150 games, been MOTM in a cup final win, contributed numerous important goals and assists, always been a hardworking professional...
That is not a flop in any sense.
posted on 26/7/15
Exactly Rosso
posted on 26/7/15
Comment deleted by Article Creator
posted on 26/7/15
I loved Berba, got great high hopes for Shaw, just pointing out players who are more of a flop than ADM.
I guess you don't agree with Robb seen as you only questioned a few of them.
Don't know how the hell you can pick out Shaw from that list, at least ADM cared enough to get himself fit!
(this is running on the assumption that effort equals reward which a lot of people seem to be proposing)
posted on 26/7/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 26/7/15
I think that's being considered a floppy rather than a flop.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 5 minutes ago
I loved Berba, got great high hopes for Shaw, just pointing out players who are more of a flop than ADM.
I guess you don't agree with Robb seen as you only questioned a few of them.
Don't know how the hell you can pick out Shaw from that list, at least ADM cared enough to get himself fit!
(this is running on the assumption that effort equals reward which a lot of people seem to be proposing)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Though on that basis Shaw has knuckled down and looks in great shape. He's beginning to look like he'll be a success story. ADM didn't even make the plane last night.
Floppier than the ears of a drunk rabbit.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 2 minutes ago
I loved Berba, got great high hopes for Shaw, just pointing out players who are more of a flop than ADM.
I guess you don't agree with Robb seen as you only questioned a few of them.
Don't know how the hell you can pick out Shaw from that list, at least ADM cared enough to get himself fit!
(this is running on the assumption that effort equals reward which a lot of people seem to be proposing)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Success is never guaranteed, but talent, application, and a suitable environment can all contribute to pushing up the probability of a decent outcome in equal measure.
Di Maria has the talent. Most of the time he seems to have the application. But I'm just not sure he perfectly suits us or Van Gaal, and his head is definitely not in the right place.
I think it is - to a degree - fair to measure the scale of a flop against net spend, so if we recoup a large proportion of what we shelled out, he's probably no worse a flop than Falcao given he was one expensive loan and that Di Maria gave us more in his one short season.
Given the promise an expectations, it's hard to argue that both didn't seriously underachieve with us.
posted on 26/7/15
So now making plane journeys is one of the conditions of being a flop or not....?!
Best not discuss Bergkamp then...
posted on 26/7/15
He has some fairly good excuses in fairness, plenty of players have struggled in their first season when coming to a new league. There's many players who would be considered flops if they were judged on their first season in England alone.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 1 minute ago
So now making plane journeys is one of the conditions of being a flop or not....?!
Best not discuss Bergkamp then...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You mean Flopkamp
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 1 minute ago
So now making plane journeys is one of the conditions of being a flop or not....?!
Best not discuss Bergkamp then...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think ADM did actually get on a flight. But to New Jersey where psg are.
That scoundrel.
posted on 26/7/15
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine(7) (U5768)
posted 27 seconds ago
He has some fairly good excuses in fairness, plenty of players have struggled in their first season when coming to a new league. There's many players who would be considered flops if they were judged on their first season in England alone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, that's a fair point. And I'd love him to be staying, knuckling down, and fighting for a place in the side to prove everybody wrong.
Page 3 of 5