CBB, no question, end of last season was dire, as bad as it gets. Stoke last season, and now West Ham just shows how fragile the confidence of the team and manager is. Having only seen MOTD, Lovren, dear God.
I agree with BRs comments that the very early goal set us back, and that a better team than ours should have been able to overcome the bad start, but ours couldn't. There was no spark, no backbone, nothing.
BUT, BUT, But, it's still only the fourth game of the season. Give them time. I am looking forward to the game against United. Time for the men to step up to the plate.
JimmyTheRed
comment by JimmyTheRed (U1682)
posted 22 minutes ago
Inever, I take your point, but, terrible loss though it was, we get beat once, badly admitted, and pessimism within the Red camp goes into overdrive. It seems we are one extreme or the other, no middle ground.
*****
It's true it's just one loss but even the wins put some dread in me judging from the performances. We have not played well so far apart from one half against Arsenal and yesterday was terrible so there is definitely reason for concern. Sacking Rodgers is neither feasible nor advisable at this time though so calls for his head are misplaced. He knows he has to pull his finger out though just as he said at the start of the season.
"We do believe Brendan is the right man for Liverpool and the right man to take the club forward. When we hired Brendan we wanted to see improvement.
"Hopefully when we have a conversation in a year's time he will have demonstrated and the squad will have demonstrated that we've regained top form again."
He added: "Brendan was very instrumental in the transfer targets that we went after this summer. We expect we’re going to see a strong improvement."
******
Comments from Warner at the start of the season.
I think Brenda will get the whole season unless we are amazingly bad. I also think top 4 could be the minimum target for him to stay past May which would suit me just fine.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Brendan is going to have a big test when Europa kicks in, as will we. Can only see more dropped points coming on the back of that, so would not be surprised if he is struggling by Christmas.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I am not entirely sold on BR, but I'm not panicking yet.
We're struggling to accommodate Benteke a bit, and to learn to mix up our approach, but I don't think we've played all that badly, so far. Was at the game yesterday, and didn't think we were all that bad. I mean we weren't great, and we made some daft defensive mistakes, but I've seen a lot worse. An early goal, and the game ran away from us, a bit….everything that could go wrong, did.
It's very early in the season, and these things happen at this stage, but I'm willing to wait and see if things settle down.
The squad is quite strong, so we'll see. Getting a new manager entails yet another period of 'transition' , when we're not even expected to do anything: I think things have to be worse than this, before we go for yet another change.
BR was our 4th manager in 3 years, and that never did us any good.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Chelsea have a high manager turnover and they've still been picking up trophies over the years - I think clubs can get away with it, if they spend a lot of money - which Liverpool do.
========================================================
It doesn't matter how much money you spend, if other clubs are spending more. Liverpool's spending is not in the same bracket as Chelsea or City (or even United, lately)….there is another echelon above.
You can only get away with it if you are among the clubs within the top echelon of the most expensive squads, which Chelsea were.
But even they are trying to go for a different model now that they are being out-spent by City, and they brought Mourinho back with the intention of keeping him there for a while, and keeping it stable.
Chelsea city and united have ungodly, absurd money.
We only have lots of money
A bit like people who think winning 10mil in euro millions makes you rich when in reality it just makes you middle class
A bit like people who think winning 10mil in euro millions makes you rich when in reality it just makes you middle class
--/////------
Hot damn!
We must also always bear in mind - £125M in for our two best players, when we talk spending.
What makes anyone thinks Rodgers will suddenly turn it around? He is too egotistical to look at himself and his tactics. Hes a goner..id prefer it now than to wait for absolutely inevitable mediocrity. I dont expect us to be top 2 but we should be at least performing at home to West Ham with the money we have spent
3 simple questions.
1. Do you think a new manager would get better results with the same set of players we currently have at Liverpool?
2. Do you think BR could do better with a higher caliber of player (I.e. a player who is certified "world class"
3. Do you believe that a different manager could help bring in a higher caliber of player? If so which manager/s could do this?
------------
1, It's still far too early in the season to make a definitive judgement. We have brought new players in so both they and the manager need time. Certainly more than four games. I think a more informed opinion can be formed in the coming weeks, Our next game (away to Utd) could potentially be a watershed for the manager. Lose badly and I think the supporters at the ground might start to turn. A decent result will mean that the travesty yesterday will be forgotten. Such is the fickleness of football.
2. Any manager would want better players. No offence but it's a bit of a silly question.
3. There are many factors which influence a players choice of destination. Who the manager is certainly one, but imo there are others which will play a more important role. Money is one and imo Liverpool's incentive based contracts with a lower basic wage means that we will struggle to attract the elite player. Other factors such as location and family opinions will outweigh who the manager is. We aren't the type on club who normally invests in the finished article anyway. We have usually looked to develop talent and this is the way I want it to be because it makes financial sense to do so.
He is too egotistical to look at himself and his tactics
==========================================================
He has looked at himself and his tactics several times.
Last season, we were struggling to score goals, so around Xmas he switched to a more defensive style, and we went on a good run, on the back of a series of clean sheets.
I'm not BR's biggest fan either, but flexibility is perceived by the media as one of his strengths, not his weakness.
2. Any manager would want better players. No offence but it's a bit of a silly question.
---/
Yep all managers want better players...
I was sort of getting at the fact we have potentially one world class player in Cout, and then there's Sturridge. Point being - is it the 'level above player' our squad needs to fully work in the way BR envisions, is he hoping Coot and Danny push us to that point?
comment by Wessie Road (U10652)
posted 1 minute ago
He is too egotistical to look at himself and his tactics
==========================================================
He has looked at himself and his tactics several times.
Last season, we were struggling to score goals, so around Xmas he switched to a more defensive style, and we went on a good run, on the back of a series of clean sheets.
I'm not BR's biggest fan either, but flexibility is perceived by the media as one of his strengths, not his weakness.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I have no issue if people would like to replace Rodgers, I can understand it, they don't feel safe in the knowledge he's only potential and hasn't proved anything yet. However when they say he has no plan b or is too stubborn to change his approach, it absolutely baffles me. I've never seen a manager try so many new things, new systems, players in other positions etc.
I'm really confused by that type of comment. I understand it from rival fans who don't actually see the games so just splurt out crap but from Liverpool fans? I don't buy it.
My biggest Crespo,iridium (criticism, wow what a spell check) of Rodgers is persisting with bad tactics such as his beloved 433 for too long.
But he does come this senses eventually with some new system and we have a run of great form
He's very flexible and tactically astute. Just a bit stubborn regarding sticking with what hed like to work long term for too long when it's not working
1) Possibly, it's hard to tell as we have a fair few players whom we don't really know what their peak level is. Another manager may be able to set them up better and motivate them better, but ultimately any manager wants some of their own players too.
2) It's not really relevant is it? We can't afford or attract ready made world class players as we not playing at the top level and don't pay top wages.
3) Possibly to an extent. They can't solve the above problem but a manager with a bigger reputation in Europe could help give us the edge of we are trying to sign players against clubs of a similar current stature to us. No manager is going to help us sign a player ahead of Chelsea or City etc.
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Three Questions
Page 2 of 2
posted on 30/8/15
CBB, no question, end of last season was dire, as bad as it gets. Stoke last season, and now West Ham just shows how fragile the confidence of the team and manager is. Having only seen MOTD, Lovren, dear God.
I agree with BRs comments that the very early goal set us back, and that a better team than ours should have been able to overcome the bad start, but ours couldn't. There was no spark, no backbone, nothing.
BUT, BUT, But, it's still only the fourth game of the season. Give them time. I am looking forward to the game against United. Time for the men to step up to the plate.
JimmyTheRed
posted on 30/8/15
comment by JimmyTheRed (U1682)
posted 22 minutes ago
Inever, I take your point, but, terrible loss though it was, we get beat once, badly admitted, and pessimism within the Red camp goes into overdrive. It seems we are one extreme or the other, no middle ground.
*****
It's true it's just one loss but even the wins put some dread in me judging from the performances. We have not played well so far apart from one half against Arsenal and yesterday was terrible so there is definitely reason for concern. Sacking Rodgers is neither feasible nor advisable at this time though so calls for his head are misplaced. He knows he has to pull his finger out though just as he said at the start of the season.
posted on 30/8/15
"We do believe Brendan is the right man for Liverpool and the right man to take the club forward. When we hired Brendan we wanted to see improvement.
"Hopefully when we have a conversation in a year's time he will have demonstrated and the squad will have demonstrated that we've regained top form again."
He added: "Brendan was very instrumental in the transfer targets that we went after this summer. We expect we’re going to see a strong improvement."
******
Comments from Warner at the start of the season.
I think Brenda will get the whole season unless we are amazingly bad. I also think top 4 could be the minimum target for him to stay past May which would suit me just fine.
posted on 30/8/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/8/15
Brendan is going to have a big test when Europa kicks in, as will we. Can only see more dropped points coming on the back of that, so would not be surprised if he is struggling by Christmas.
posted on 30/8/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/8/15
I am not entirely sold on BR, but I'm not panicking yet.
We're struggling to accommodate Benteke a bit, and to learn to mix up our approach, but I don't think we've played all that badly, so far. Was at the game yesterday, and didn't think we were all that bad. I mean we weren't great, and we made some daft defensive mistakes, but I've seen a lot worse. An early goal, and the game ran away from us, a bit….everything that could go wrong, did.
It's very early in the season, and these things happen at this stage, but I'm willing to wait and see if things settle down.
The squad is quite strong, so we'll see. Getting a new manager entails yet another period of 'transition' , when we're not even expected to do anything: I think things have to be worse than this, before we go for yet another change.
BR was our 4th manager in 3 years, and that never did us any good.
posted on 30/8/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/8/15
Chelsea have an oil well
posted on 30/8/15
Chelsea have a high manager turnover and they've still been picking up trophies over the years - I think clubs can get away with it, if they spend a lot of money - which Liverpool do.
========================================================
It doesn't matter how much money you spend, if other clubs are spending more. Liverpool's spending is not in the same bracket as Chelsea or City (or even United, lately)….there is another echelon above.
You can only get away with it if you are among the clubs within the top echelon of the most expensive squads, which Chelsea were.
But even they are trying to go for a different model now that they are being out-spent by City, and they brought Mourinho back with the intention of keeping him there for a while, and keeping it stable.
posted on 30/8/15
Chelsea city and united have ungodly, absurd money.
We only have lots of money
A bit like people who think winning 10mil in euro millions makes you rich when in reality it just makes you middle class
posted on 30/8/15
A bit like people who think winning 10mil in euro millions makes you rich when in reality it just makes you middle class
--/////------
Hot damn!
We must also always bear in mind - £125M in for our two best players, when we talk spending.
posted on 30/8/15
What makes anyone thinks Rodgers will suddenly turn it around? He is too egotistical to look at himself and his tactics. Hes a goner..id prefer it now than to wait for absolutely inevitable mediocrity. I dont expect us to be top 2 but we should be at least performing at home to West Ham with the money we have spent
posted on 30/8/15
3 simple questions.
1. Do you think a new manager would get better results with the same set of players we currently have at Liverpool?
2. Do you think BR could do better with a higher caliber of player (I.e. a player who is certified "world class"
3. Do you believe that a different manager could help bring in a higher caliber of player? If so which manager/s could do this?
------------
1, It's still far too early in the season to make a definitive judgement. We have brought new players in so both they and the manager need time. Certainly more than four games. I think a more informed opinion can be formed in the coming weeks, Our next game (away to Utd) could potentially be a watershed for the manager. Lose badly and I think the supporters at the ground might start to turn. A decent result will mean that the travesty yesterday will be forgotten. Such is the fickleness of football.
2. Any manager would want better players. No offence but it's a bit of a silly question.
3. There are many factors which influence a players choice of destination. Who the manager is certainly one, but imo there are others which will play a more important role. Money is one and imo Liverpool's incentive based contracts with a lower basic wage means that we will struggle to attract the elite player. Other factors such as location and family opinions will outweigh who the manager is. We aren't the type on club who normally invests in the finished article anyway. We have usually looked to develop talent and this is the way I want it to be because it makes financial sense to do so.
posted on 30/8/15
He is too egotistical to look at himself and his tactics
==========================================================
He has looked at himself and his tactics several times.
Last season, we were struggling to score goals, so around Xmas he switched to a more defensive style, and we went on a good run, on the back of a series of clean sheets.
I'm not BR's biggest fan either, but flexibility is perceived by the media as one of his strengths, not his weakness.
posted on 30/8/15
2. Any manager would want better players. No offence but it's a bit of a silly question.
---/
Yep all managers want better players...
I was sort of getting at the fact we have potentially one world class player in Cout, and then there's Sturridge. Point being - is it the 'level above player' our squad needs to fully work in the way BR envisions, is he hoping Coot and Danny push us to that point?
posted on 30/8/15
comment by Wessie Road (U10652)
posted 1 minute ago
He is too egotistical to look at himself and his tactics
==========================================================
He has looked at himself and his tactics several times.
Last season, we were struggling to score goals, so around Xmas he switched to a more defensive style, and we went on a good run, on the back of a series of clean sheets.
I'm not BR's biggest fan either, but flexibility is perceived by the media as one of his strengths, not his weakness.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I have no issue if people would like to replace Rodgers, I can understand it, they don't feel safe in the knowledge he's only potential and hasn't proved anything yet. However when they say he has no plan b or is too stubborn to change his approach, it absolutely baffles me. I've never seen a manager try so many new things, new systems, players in other positions etc.
I'm really confused by that type of comment. I understand it from rival fans who don't actually see the games so just splurt out crap but from Liverpool fans? I don't buy it.
posted on 30/8/15
My biggest Crespo,iridium (criticism, wow what a spell check) of Rodgers is persisting with bad tactics such as his beloved 433 for too long.
But he does come this senses eventually with some new system and we have a run of great form
He's very flexible and tactically astute. Just a bit stubborn regarding sticking with what hed like to work long term for too long when it's not working
posted on 30/8/15
1) Possibly, it's hard to tell as we have a fair few players whom we don't really know what their peak level is. Another manager may be able to set them up better and motivate them better, but ultimately any manager wants some of their own players too.
2) It's not really relevant is it? We can't afford or attract ready made world class players as we not playing at the top level and don't pay top wages.
3) Possibly to an extent. They can't solve the above problem but a manager with a bigger reputation in Europe could help give us the edge of we are trying to sign players against clubs of a similar current stature to us. No manager is going to help us sign a player ahead of Chelsea or City etc.
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