Ali ducked. Not the greatest boxer of all time and not the greatest champion. Has an unrivalled hype surrounding him though which none knowlegable people get sucked into.
From your list, it truly has to be Bolt. Carries his sport, is the true greatest of all time in it, has Ali's charisma and constantly defeats known steroid cheaters in the most raw and pure form of individual sport there is.
Doesn't make Bolt any worse, but to point out that he's doing it against juiced athletes as if he wasn't is pretty naive tbh.
comment by itsonlyagame (U6426)
posted 14 minutes ago
Doesn't make Bolt any worse, but to point out that he's doing it against juiced athletes as if he wasn't is pretty naive tbh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bolt passes ALL the tests every single time. Catch him doing it, and fair enough he's no better.
But innocent until proven guilty. And until then, he is the undouted and undisputable greatest of all time in his sport, which is one of the most pure forms of individual sporting competition. He's competing against other incredibly naturally gifted people who are then resorting to cheating to beat him. And they can't get close.
To cap it off, he is the symbol of sporting excellence in the world today, fantastically charismatic while extremely respectful and respectable at all times. Something Ali wasn't in all his charismatic media performances.
Bolt has never avoided a race like Ali avoided Foreman 2.
To me it's cear cut that if it's a choice between Ali and Bolt, it's Bolt no contest. And I say this as a fam of boxing and former amature myself.
Usain is the greatest individual sportsman of all time.
Fame, ability, level of interest and participation in his sport the world over, charisma, as a role model, obsticles put in his way and more make Bolt the no.1.
From what I've seen about Ali he was just a loudmouth.
How him having "charisma outside the sport" propels him to number one in anyone's mind is pretty ridiculous.
So he was on the tele a lot, shouting himself up. Boxers have to do that to sell fights.
I know he was an excellent boxer, but in between cutting gloves and ducking fights, he's nowhere higher than Lance Armstrong for me.
Redgrave is a good shout for longevity and titles won. Ryan Giggs; Phil Taylor also.
But in keeping with the comp, where fame and notoriety seem to win the day, my pick goes to Oscar Pistorius. He won some stuff yeah, but everybody knows who he is, and he put the Paralympics on the map. And got away with murder.
Not finished yet either.
lance Armstrong the self confessed cheat you mean.......!!!!!
valentine rossi.......just for multiple world champs.
The Doctor is awesome but motorsport is so difficult to judge as often the machine is worth more than the pilot
Lewis totally destroyed Nico - who was still so far clear of anyone else
A.P.McCoy - over 4k wins, 19 times Champion Jockey
comment by Tino's mutant ninja eye-ties (U2087)
posted 22 minutes ago
The Doctor is awesomebut motorsport is so difficult to judge as often the machine is worth more than the pilot
Lewis totally destroyed Nico - who was still so far clear of anyone else
A.P.McCoy - over 4k wins, 19 times Champion Jockey
----------------------------------------------------------------------
you start your post with the machine is worth more that the driver, then offer up a jockey as an alternative.
Agree that motorsports shouldn't really come into it.
Iron, yeah, innocent until proven guilty...similar to the years it took them to nab Armstrong ... would it have meant he was 'clean' if they hadn't? Course not, it would have meant that he'd gotten away with it and would still have 7 Tours to his name.
Seen too much doping in sport to believe anyone at the very top of a sport that is mainly about phsyical attributes is capable of outrunning, outswimming or outpedalling his main opponents by such margins. His best times just blow everyone else's out of the water, people who have been doping to improve their times. It just doesn't wash..
We have also learnt from history the amount of cover-ups there've been for a variety of commercial or nationalist reasons. Firstly, could you imagine the shockwaves it would send through the sport if after all these years it were revealed that he had failed tests at some point or other? Secondly, countries have been known to have engaged in systematic doping that has foiled controls, with WADA-sanctioned labs manipulating samples or returning false negatives. I don't know much about the Jamaican AF, but as recently as this month the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) stated that within IAAF, “the acceptance of cheating at all levels is widespread and of long standing."
So credit to Bolt for being the best sprinter ever, but as I said, I wouldn't buy his being clean for a second.
Sorry.
comment by junction8 (U1074)
posted 53 minutes ago
lance Armstrong the self confessed cheat you mean.......!!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so Ali didn't admit it. Maybe he's lower than Armstrong then
I can't edit the OP, but for interest, here are the previous rounds:
Round one http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/326069
Round two http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/326437
Round three http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/326861
Round four http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/327643
comment by itsonlyagame (U6426)
posted 2 hours, 51 minutes ago
Agree that motorsports shouldn't really come into it.
Iron, yeah, innocent until proven guilty...similar to the years it took them to nab Armstrong ... would it have meant he was 'clean' if they hadn't? Course not, it would have meant that he'd gotten away with it and would still have 7 Tours to his name.
Seen too much doping in sport to believe anyone at the very top of a sport that is mainly about phsyical attributes is capable of outrunning, outswimming or outpedalling his main opponents by such margins. His best times just blow everyone else's out of the water, people who have been doping to improve their times. It just doesn't wash..
We have also learnt from history the amount of cover-ups there've been for a variety of commercial or nationalist reasons. Firstly, could you imagine the shockwaves it would send through the sport if after all these years it were revealed that he had failed tests at some point or other? Secondly, countries have been known to have engaged in systematic doping that has foiled controls, with WADA-sanctioned labs manipulating samples or returning false negatives. I don't know much about the Jamaican AF, but as recently as this month the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) stated that within IAAF, “the acceptance of cheating at all levels is widespread and of long standing."
So credit to Bolt for being the best sprinter ever, but as I said, I wouldn't buy his being clean for a second.
Sorry.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't say "it's likely this person cheated, therefore they obviously cheated!"
Whether you buy it or not, Bolt has an entirely clean record and has utterly dominated tremendous athletes who have been caught cheating. You cannot argue that.
Fact is he's 100% fair and never touched a performance enhancer in the eyes of the governing bodies.
Assuming he IS entirely clean, I don't think his position atop the mountain can be questioned. Again, assuming he IS clean, where do you think he stands?
One final point on the notion of Ali being the greatest of all time;
He was allowed to use steroids in his day. Have a look and see for yourselves
comment by The Iron Giant (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
One final point on the notion of Ali being the greatest of all time;
He was allowed to use steroids in his day. Have a look and see for yourselves
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No fecking way!!
I can't help but feel that people say Ali, because his PR called him 'The Greatest'. It's become a cliche to just jump to him, I mean what did he actually achieve? He was good at having an organised punch up. I don't get it personally, but then I'm not much a fan of boxing either, so....
...also, as a sportsman, I have no idea how you begin to compare Ali to Federer. You might as well compare a bricky to a surgeon.
Henrys that does sound a little biased tbf.
But I generally agree with what you say.
It's shame that Pele hasn't made it to the final round, but Maradona has.
Pele has some brilliant videos on YouTube that meltonblue pointed me to.
Definitely has a shout at being one of the best. If he got as much coverage as Messi I think the train of thought would stop at a few more stations.
How did Maradona enter the final round and not Jesse Owens?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by couscous (U20421)
posted 52 minutes ago
How did Maradona enter the final round and not Jesse Owens?
===============================
Agree. Maradona should be nowhere near this list.
To have him in & Jesse Owens overlooked is criminal.
At the time i put this thread up maradona was significantly ahead of owens but it has changed. I can't do anything now sorry
Wait, where is TOM BRADY?
everybody knows NFL is the greatest sport on earth and Tom Brady has 4 rings
Sign in if you want to comment
Greatest of all time - FINAL
Page 2 of 4
posted on 1/12/15
Ali ducked. Not the greatest boxer of all time and not the greatest champion. Has an unrivalled hype surrounding him though which none knowlegable people get sucked into.
From your list, it truly has to be Bolt. Carries his sport, is the true greatest of all time in it, has Ali's charisma and constantly defeats known steroid cheaters in the most raw and pure form of individual sport there is.
posted on 1/12/15
Doesn't make Bolt any worse, but to point out that he's doing it against juiced athletes as if he wasn't is pretty naive tbh.
posted on 1/12/15
comment by itsonlyagame (U6426)
posted 14 minutes ago
Doesn't make Bolt any worse, but to point out that he's doing it against juiced athletes as if he wasn't is pretty naive tbh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bolt passes ALL the tests every single time. Catch him doing it, and fair enough he's no better.
But innocent until proven guilty. And until then, he is the undouted and undisputable greatest of all time in his sport, which is one of the most pure forms of individual sporting competition. He's competing against other incredibly naturally gifted people who are then resorting to cheating to beat him. And they can't get close.
To cap it off, he is the symbol of sporting excellence in the world today, fantastically charismatic while extremely respectful and respectable at all times. Something Ali wasn't in all his charismatic media performances.
Bolt has never avoided a race like Ali avoided Foreman 2.
To me it's cear cut that if it's a choice between Ali and Bolt, it's Bolt no contest. And I say this as a fam of boxing and former amature myself.
Usain is the greatest individual sportsman of all time.
posted on 1/12/15
Fame, ability, level of interest and participation in his sport the world over, charisma, as a role model, obsticles put in his way and more make Bolt the no.1.
posted on 1/12/15
From what I've seen about Ali he was just a loudmouth.
How him having "charisma outside the sport" propels him to number one in anyone's mind is pretty ridiculous.
So he was on the tele a lot, shouting himself up. Boxers have to do that to sell fights.
I know he was an excellent boxer, but in between cutting gloves and ducking fights, he's nowhere higher than Lance Armstrong for me.
Redgrave is a good shout for longevity and titles won. Ryan Giggs; Phil Taylor also.
But in keeping with the comp, where fame and notoriety seem to win the day, my pick goes to Oscar Pistorius. He won some stuff yeah, but everybody knows who he is, and he put the Paralympics on the map. And got away with murder.
Not finished yet either.
posted on 1/12/15
lance Armstrong the self confessed cheat you mean.......!!!!!
posted on 1/12/15
valentine rossi.......just for multiple world champs.
posted on 1/12/15
The Doctor is awesome but motorsport is so difficult to judge as often the machine is worth more than the pilot
Lewis totally destroyed Nico - who was still so far clear of anyone else
A.P.McCoy - over 4k wins, 19 times Champion Jockey
posted on 1/12/15
comment by Tino's mutant ninja eye-ties (U2087)
posted 22 minutes ago
The Doctor is awesomebut motorsport is so difficult to judge as often the machine is worth more than the pilot
Lewis totally destroyed Nico - who was still so far clear of anyone else
A.P.McCoy - over 4k wins, 19 times Champion Jockey
----------------------------------------------------------------------
you start your post with the machine is worth more that the driver, then offer up a jockey as an alternative.
posted on 1/12/15
Agree that motorsports shouldn't really come into it.
Iron, yeah, innocent until proven guilty...similar to the years it took them to nab Armstrong ... would it have meant he was 'clean' if they hadn't? Course not, it would have meant that he'd gotten away with it and would still have 7 Tours to his name.
Seen too much doping in sport to believe anyone at the very top of a sport that is mainly about phsyical attributes is capable of outrunning, outswimming or outpedalling his main opponents by such margins. His best times just blow everyone else's out of the water, people who have been doping to improve their times. It just doesn't wash..
We have also learnt from history the amount of cover-ups there've been for a variety of commercial or nationalist reasons. Firstly, could you imagine the shockwaves it would send through the sport if after all these years it were revealed that he had failed tests at some point or other? Secondly, countries have been known to have engaged in systematic doping that has foiled controls, with WADA-sanctioned labs manipulating samples or returning false negatives. I don't know much about the Jamaican AF, but as recently as this month the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) stated that within IAAF, “the acceptance of cheating at all levels is widespread and of long standing."
So credit to Bolt for being the best sprinter ever, but as I said, I wouldn't buy his being clean for a second.
Sorry.
posted on 1/12/15
comment by junction8 (U1074)
posted 53 minutes ago
lance Armstrong the self confessed cheat you mean.......!!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so Ali didn't admit it. Maybe he's lower than Armstrong then
posted on 1/12/15
I can't edit the OP, but for interest, here are the previous rounds:
Round one http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/326069
Round two http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/326437
Round three http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/326861
Round four http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/327643
posted on 1/12/15
comment by itsonlyagame (U6426)
posted 2 hours, 51 minutes ago
Agree that motorsports shouldn't really come into it.
Iron, yeah, innocent until proven guilty...similar to the years it took them to nab Armstrong ... would it have meant he was 'clean' if they hadn't? Course not, it would have meant that he'd gotten away with it and would still have 7 Tours to his name.
Seen too much doping in sport to believe anyone at the very top of a sport that is mainly about phsyical attributes is capable of outrunning, outswimming or outpedalling his main opponents by such margins. His best times just blow everyone else's out of the water, people who have been doping to improve their times. It just doesn't wash..
We have also learnt from history the amount of cover-ups there've been for a variety of commercial or nationalist reasons. Firstly, could you imagine the shockwaves it would send through the sport if after all these years it were revealed that he had failed tests at some point or other? Secondly, countries have been known to have engaged in systematic doping that has foiled controls, with WADA-sanctioned labs manipulating samples or returning false negatives. I don't know much about the Jamaican AF, but as recently as this month the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) stated that within IAAF, “the acceptance of cheating at all levels is widespread and of long standing."
So credit to Bolt for being the best sprinter ever, but as I said, I wouldn't buy his being clean for a second.
Sorry.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't say "it's likely this person cheated, therefore they obviously cheated!"
Whether you buy it or not, Bolt has an entirely clean record and has utterly dominated tremendous athletes who have been caught cheating. You cannot argue that.
Fact is he's 100% fair and never touched a performance enhancer in the eyes of the governing bodies.
Assuming he IS entirely clean, I don't think his position atop the mountain can be questioned. Again, assuming he IS clean, where do you think he stands?
posted on 1/12/15
One final point on the notion of Ali being the greatest of all time;
He was allowed to use steroids in his day. Have a look and see for yourselves
posted on 1/12/15
comment by The Iron Giant (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
One final point on the notion of Ali being the greatest of all time;
He was allowed to use steroids in his day. Have a look and see for yourselves
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No fecking way!!
posted on 1/12/15
I can't help but feel that people say Ali, because his PR called him 'The Greatest'. It's become a cliche to just jump to him, I mean what did he actually achieve? He was good at having an organised punch up. I don't get it personally, but then I'm not much a fan of boxing either, so....
...also, as a sportsman, I have no idea how you begin to compare Ali to Federer. You might as well compare a bricky to a surgeon.
posted on 1/12/15
Henrys that does sound a little biased tbf.
But I generally agree with what you say.
posted on 1/12/15
It's shame that Pele hasn't made it to the final round, but Maradona has.
posted on 1/12/15
Pele has some brilliant videos on YouTube that meltonblue pointed me to.
Definitely has a shout at being one of the best. If he got as much coverage as Messi I think the train of thought would stop at a few more stations.
posted on 1/12/15
How did Maradona enter the final round and not Jesse Owens?
posted on 1/12/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 1/12/15
comment by couscous (U20421)
posted 52 minutes ago
How did Maradona enter the final round and not Jesse Owens?
===============================
Agree. Maradona should be nowhere near this list.
To have him in & Jesse Owens overlooked is criminal.
posted on 1/12/15
At the time i put this thread up maradona was significantly ahead of owens but it has changed. I can't do anything now sorry
posted on 1/12/15
Maradona's the GOAT.
posted on 5/12/15
Wait, where is TOM BRADY?
everybody knows NFL is the greatest sport on earth and Tom Brady has 4 rings
Page 2 of 4