For me I'd argue that he's best strengths are his composure and dribbling both which we see more wide which isn't surprising seeing as he was a winger his entire (short) career up until last season
---------------------------------------------------
This just isn't true.
He played more as a support striker/10 and main striker than he did as a wide man for the youth sides.
but to say that we're not hard to beat because of the amount of draws we have had is pure garbage.
..........
A draw is like a defeat for a club like Man Utd. You can draw 38 games and say we went unbeaten and still get relegated. You can say we are hard to beat but you can go undefeated and finish with 38 points or you can lose 25 league matches but win 13 and finish with 39 points.
comment by Posh Mufc Great Hafi Not Arrogant Just Better (U6578)
posted 1 minute ago
but to say that we're not hard to beat because of the amount of draws we have had is pure garbage.
..........
A draw is like a defeat for a club like Man Utd. You can draw 38 games and say we went unbeaten and still get relegated. You can say we are hard to beat but you can go undefeated and finish with 38 points or you can lose 25 league matches but win 13 and finish with 39 points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
we know what a draw is
we know what a defeat is
we know you get 1 point for a draw and 3 for a win
but thanks for the clarification
comment by Robb.Lannister (U21234)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Republik of Mancunia (U6779)
posted 37 seconds ago
comment by Robb.Lannister (U21234)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 10 minutes ago
Some excellent posts on this thread. I'm quite disappointed with the season to be honest.
I had high hopes for it with the acquisitions, the manager and our start to the season.
It has all petered out unfortunately and what has annoyed me immensely is the stupid points dropped from winning positions and negative tactics deployed on occasion.
We should be in the title picture and looking at the team more recently, I honestly cannot see a way forward if the manager continues the current approach.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He's got us closer than ever to SAFs level but he needs better finishers
The future is bright. Just need more luck in season 2
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Missing loads of chances isn't bad luck though Robb, we argued this with the scousers when they first got Suarez. It all comes down to bad play ultimately. If we can turn it around and challenge next season like they did then he will have done a better job, but taking this season in isolation it's been hit and miss.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How is it to do with bad play whatever that means?
If the team creates 6/7 good chances a game and the players miss them there's nothing wrong with the 'play'
Just the finishing is off. It looked better yesterday so let's hope it improves As the season ends
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thing is, we may miss one or two very good chances in a game, never 7.
TRS
Is that true? I'm going purely on what Butt said in an interview in The Times a few months ago. He specifically said Rashford is far more natural as a winger as he played there up until the beginning of the 2015/16 season. He said he would have no issue seeing him back wide because that is where he has played the vast majority of his football.
In the 3 seasons after SAF we had 10 home draws out of 57. This season we have drawn 9 out of 16 at home lol.
SAF never drew a home game in the league in his last season.
And then Jose starts making nonsense soundbites about Javier hernandez
A nice vote of confidence for the 2 boys
................
Jose's comments saying he would not have sold Welbeck and Hernandez were comical at best.
Lukaku and De Bryne?
omment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 13 minutes ago
VC
Really? I think he's really good, keeps his head up, comfortable with both feet, has great skill, doesn't panic and smash balls in, instead is happy to make the right pass.
....................
But not good at actually taking on and beating a player.
His pace is what he uses to get past players.
Martial has much quicker feet and knows what he wants to do well before he tries it. It doesn't always come off, but it does more so than Rashford.
Is that true? I'm going purely on what Butt said in an interview in The Times a few months ago. He specifically said Rashford is far more natural as a winger as he played there up until the beginning of the 2015/16 season. He said he would have no issue seeing him back wide because that is where he has played the vast majority of his football.
-------------------------------------------------
Strange because I seen him play quite a lot for the U18s behind the striker and then as the main striker and I think most considered him more of an attacking midfielder/2nd striker if anything back then.
I'm not saying he didn't play wide but not as much as he has in those other positions. Not for the U18s/21s anyway.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 3 minutes ago
And then Jose starts making nonsense soundbites about Javier hernandez
A nice vote of confidence for the 2 boys
................
Jose's comments saying he would not have sold Welbeck and Hernandez were comical at best.
Lukaku and De Bryne?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
to be fair those two are often lumped in together as obvious blunders, but it took roughly 18 months for the consensus on lukaku to shift from "blimey everton were ripped off" to "he's some player".
not obviously a worse blunder at the time than keane/king/drinkwater/shawcross etc.
KDB I will give you.
TRS
https://imgur.com/a/ggXmz
"He wasn't a centre forward as a youngster; he probably developed into that more out of necessity last season than design. He actually was on the left. I believe his best position is off the side."
VC
I disagree, he can wriggle past players very well, the West Ham game where he came on as a sub he changed the game with his wing play.
I think Lukaku needed to go to be honest.But KDB should have been utilized more by Jose,who also got rid of Mata and kept that average at best Oscar.
TBF to Jose he won the title after selling both KDB and Lukaku. Rightly or wrongly Jose wanted more developed players and in Costa and Cesc he got that and they were key to Chelsea winning the league.
5stars from me. Talking sense as usual.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 minute ago
TBF to Jose he won the title after selling both KDB and Lukaku. Rightly or wrongly Jose wanted more developed players and in Costa and Cesc he got that and they were key to Chelsea winning the league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yep, it's probably only this season that you would have swapped costa for lukaku, and there is no guarantee that chelsea would have won the title either 2 years ago or this year with lukaku.
and pedro has been involved in as many PL goals this year as KDB.
Don
I'd personally still rate Costa higher, he seems to score more important goals. Lukaku scores in bunches where as Costa seems to often get's the winner in games.
A draw is like a defeat for a club like Man Utd.
So if you draw next week end with Chelsea (the best team in the league), it will feel like a defeat.
Good old Hafi
mu82
I think even Rashford considered his preferred position to be as a 10 at one point.
--------------------------------------------------
"I don't regret playing in the number 10 role because it means now I can still play there if I need to," Rashford told Inside United.
"Number 10, on both wings and up front as well. It means I have more in my armoury when it comes to the matches.
"I used to look up to players who would dribble at people, creating chances, scoring too.
"But the type of the player I want to be now is different to the type of player I wanted to be then."
TRS
That's interesting, not watching the youth teams I've never seen him in the #10 role and I can't really see it myself. Did it not nullify his pace and directness, I've also not seen much of his vision or creativity to see what he could do there.
My initial point was that I think some have forgotten that his scoring form after the first 2 games wasn't that great and that his future as a centre forward is far from clear. I personally feel from what I have seen of him that he is more dangerous out wide cutting inside where his pace, trickery and composure can be utilised well.
VC
I disagree, he can wriggle past players very well, the West Ham game where he came on as a sub he changed the game with his wing play.
................
Your own clip from Nicky Butt tells you what he is. direct and uses his pace.
Butt is also describing him as playing off the side as opposed to being out wide.
I have no problem with him playing on the right, but on the left it should always be Martial over Rashford.
VC
Yes he's direct and has the skill to dribble round players and does that by playing wide and cutting inside, as Martial does but in a different way that relies more on power. If we are going by Martial's form last season then yes I'd pick him over Rashford but that doesn't change my view that Rashord seems more comfortable out wide cutting in than he does centrally where his finishing still needs a lot of improving.
es he's direct and has the skill to dribble round players
............
No he doesn't he mostly over runs it or gets tackled.
.............
If we are going by Martial's form last season then yes I'd pick him over Rashford
................
I would pick him on the left from this seasons form as well.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 22 minutes ago
And then Jose starts making nonsense soundbites about Javier hernandez
A nice vote of confidence for the 2 boys
................
Jose's comments saying he would not have sold Welbeck and Hernandez were comical at best.
Lukaku and De Bryne?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Comical at best vc and also for the two names you mention
I wonder however does Jose think about the possible impact his public utterings have on his players
It beggars belief to talk in April about a player that's been gone the guts of 2 years from the club, a player who hadn't been mentioned at all during the previous 2 windows.
He has two of the most exciting young talents on his hands and all of a sudden chiqarittto if he was here would have been the answer to our goal scoring problems.
😕
Did it not nullify his pace and directness, I've also not seen much of his vision or creativity to see what he could do there.
-----------------------------------------------
Watching him for the youth sides, it would maybe surprise you what he's actually capable of or was at least back then. Long shots, wicked set pieces, slide rule passes etc.
I think he liked that he got a better view of things ahead of him from that role and also enjoyed the freedom that came with it. He could drop deep, run off the main striker or pull out wide.
TRS
Interesting, he definitely impresses me with his skill and some of his touches, the free kick he took the other day was really well taken too.
Sign in if you want to comment
State of Affairs
Page 3 of 4
posted on 10/4/17
For me I'd argue that he's best strengths are his composure and dribbling both which we see more wide which isn't surprising seeing as he was a winger his entire (short) career up until last season
---------------------------------------------------
This just isn't true.
He played more as a support striker/10 and main striker than he did as a wide man for the youth sides.
posted on 10/4/17
but to say that we're not hard to beat because of the amount of draws we have had is pure garbage.
..........
A draw is like a defeat for a club like Man Utd. You can draw 38 games and say we went unbeaten and still get relegated. You can say we are hard to beat but you can go undefeated and finish with 38 points or you can lose 25 league matches but win 13 and finish with 39 points.
posted on 10/4/17
comment by Posh Mufc Great Hafi Not Arrogant Just Better (U6578)
posted 1 minute ago
but to say that we're not hard to beat because of the amount of draws we have had is pure garbage.
..........
A draw is like a defeat for a club like Man Utd. You can draw 38 games and say we went unbeaten and still get relegated. You can say we are hard to beat but you can go undefeated and finish with 38 points or you can lose 25 league matches but win 13 and finish with 39 points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
we know what a draw is
we know what a defeat is
we know you get 1 point for a draw and 3 for a win
but thanks for the clarification
posted on 10/4/17
comment by Robb.Lannister (U21234)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Republik of Mancunia (U6779)
posted 37 seconds ago
comment by Robb.Lannister (U21234)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 10 minutes ago
Some excellent posts on this thread. I'm quite disappointed with the season to be honest.
I had high hopes for it with the acquisitions, the manager and our start to the season.
It has all petered out unfortunately and what has annoyed me immensely is the stupid points dropped from winning positions and negative tactics deployed on occasion.
We should be in the title picture and looking at the team more recently, I honestly cannot see a way forward if the manager continues the current approach.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He's got us closer than ever to SAFs level but he needs better finishers
The future is bright. Just need more luck in season 2
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Missing loads of chances isn't bad luck though Robb, we argued this with the scousers when they first got Suarez. It all comes down to bad play ultimately. If we can turn it around and challenge next season like they did then he will have done a better job, but taking this season in isolation it's been hit and miss.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How is it to do with bad play whatever that means?
If the team creates 6/7 good chances a game and the players miss them there's nothing wrong with the 'play'
Just the finishing is off. It looked better yesterday so let's hope it improves As the season ends
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thing is, we may miss one or two very good chances in a game, never 7.
posted on 10/4/17
TRS
Is that true? I'm going purely on what Butt said in an interview in The Times a few months ago. He specifically said Rashford is far more natural as a winger as he played there up until the beginning of the 2015/16 season. He said he would have no issue seeing him back wide because that is where he has played the vast majority of his football.
posted on 10/4/17
In the 3 seasons after SAF we had 10 home draws out of 57. This season we have drawn 9 out of 16 at home lol.
SAF never drew a home game in the league in his last season.
posted on 10/4/17
And then Jose starts making nonsense soundbites about Javier hernandez
A nice vote of confidence for the 2 boys
................
Jose's comments saying he would not have sold Welbeck and Hernandez were comical at best.
Lukaku and De Bryne?
posted on 10/4/17
omment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 13 minutes ago
VC
Really? I think he's really good, keeps his head up, comfortable with both feet, has great skill, doesn't panic and smash balls in, instead is happy to make the right pass.
....................
But not good at actually taking on and beating a player.
His pace is what he uses to get past players.
Martial has much quicker feet and knows what he wants to do well before he tries it. It doesn't always come off, but it does more so than Rashford.
posted on 10/4/17
Is that true? I'm going purely on what Butt said in an interview in The Times a few months ago. He specifically said Rashford is far more natural as a winger as he played there up until the beginning of the 2015/16 season. He said he would have no issue seeing him back wide because that is where he has played the vast majority of his football.
-------------------------------------------------
Strange because I seen him play quite a lot for the U18s behind the striker and then as the main striker and I think most considered him more of an attacking midfielder/2nd striker if anything back then.
I'm not saying he didn't play wide but not as much as he has in those other positions. Not for the U18s/21s anyway.
posted on 10/4/17
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 3 minutes ago
And then Jose starts making nonsense soundbites about Javier hernandez
A nice vote of confidence for the 2 boys
................
Jose's comments saying he would not have sold Welbeck and Hernandez were comical at best.
Lukaku and De Bryne?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
to be fair those two are often lumped in together as obvious blunders, but it took roughly 18 months for the consensus on lukaku to shift from "blimey everton were ripped off" to "he's some player".
not obviously a worse blunder at the time than keane/king/drinkwater/shawcross etc.
KDB I will give you.
posted on 10/4/17
TRS
https://imgur.com/a/ggXmz
"He wasn't a centre forward as a youngster; he probably developed into that more out of necessity last season than design. He actually was on the left. I believe his best position is off the side."
VC
I disagree, he can wriggle past players very well, the West Ham game where he came on as a sub he changed the game with his wing play.
posted on 10/4/17
I think Lukaku needed to go to be honest.But KDB should have been utilized more by Jose,who also got rid of Mata and kept that average at best Oscar.
posted on 10/4/17
TBF to Jose he won the title after selling both KDB and Lukaku. Rightly or wrongly Jose wanted more developed players and in Costa and Cesc he got that and they were key to Chelsea winning the league.
posted on 10/4/17
5stars from me. Talking sense as usual.
posted on 10/4/17
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 minute ago
TBF to Jose he won the title after selling both KDB and Lukaku. Rightly or wrongly Jose wanted more developed players and in Costa and Cesc he got that and they were key to Chelsea winning the league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yep, it's probably only this season that you would have swapped costa for lukaku, and there is no guarantee that chelsea would have won the title either 2 years ago or this year with lukaku.
and pedro has been involved in as many PL goals this year as KDB.
posted on 10/4/17
Don
I'd personally still rate Costa higher, he seems to score more important goals. Lukaku scores in bunches where as Costa seems to often get's the winner in games.
posted on 10/4/17
A draw is like a defeat for a club like Man Utd.
So if you draw next week end with Chelsea (the best team in the league), it will feel like a defeat.
Good old Hafi
posted on 10/4/17
mu82
I think even Rashford considered his preferred position to be as a 10 at one point.
--------------------------------------------------
"I don't regret playing in the number 10 role because it means now I can still play there if I need to," Rashford told Inside United.
"Number 10, on both wings and up front as well. It means I have more in my armoury when it comes to the matches.
"I used to look up to players who would dribble at people, creating chances, scoring too.
"But the type of the player I want to be now is different to the type of player I wanted to be then."
posted on 10/4/17
TRS
That's interesting, not watching the youth teams I've never seen him in the #10 role and I can't really see it myself. Did it not nullify his pace and directness, I've also not seen much of his vision or creativity to see what he could do there.
My initial point was that I think some have forgotten that his scoring form after the first 2 games wasn't that great and that his future as a centre forward is far from clear. I personally feel from what I have seen of him that he is more dangerous out wide cutting inside where his pace, trickery and composure can be utilised well.
posted on 10/4/17
VC
I disagree, he can wriggle past players very well, the West Ham game where he came on as a sub he changed the game with his wing play.
................
Your own clip from Nicky Butt tells you what he is. direct and uses his pace.
Butt is also describing him as playing off the side as opposed to being out wide.
I have no problem with him playing on the right, but on the left it should always be Martial over Rashford.
posted on 10/4/17
VC
Yes he's direct and has the skill to dribble round players and does that by playing wide and cutting inside, as Martial does but in a different way that relies more on power. If we are going by Martial's form last season then yes I'd pick him over Rashford but that doesn't change my view that Rashord seems more comfortable out wide cutting in than he does centrally where his finishing still needs a lot of improving.
posted on 10/4/17
es he's direct and has the skill to dribble round players
............
No he doesn't he mostly over runs it or gets tackled.
.............
If we are going by Martial's form last season then yes I'd pick him over Rashford
................
I would pick him on the left from this seasons form as well.
posted on 10/4/17
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 22 minutes ago
And then Jose starts making nonsense soundbites about Javier hernandez
A nice vote of confidence for the 2 boys
................
Jose's comments saying he would not have sold Welbeck and Hernandez were comical at best.
Lukaku and De Bryne?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Comical at best vc and also for the two names you mention
I wonder however does Jose think about the possible impact his public utterings have on his players
It beggars belief to talk in April about a player that's been gone the guts of 2 years from the club, a player who hadn't been mentioned at all during the previous 2 windows.
He has two of the most exciting young talents on his hands and all of a sudden chiqarittto if he was here would have been the answer to our goal scoring problems.
😕
posted on 10/4/17
Did it not nullify his pace and directness, I've also not seen much of his vision or creativity to see what he could do there.
-----------------------------------------------
Watching him for the youth sides, it would maybe surprise you what he's actually capable of or was at least back then. Long shots, wicked set pieces, slide rule passes etc.
I think he liked that he got a better view of things ahead of him from that role and also enjoyed the freedom that came with it. He could drop deep, run off the main striker or pull out wide.
posted on 10/4/17
TRS
Interesting, he definitely impresses me with his skill and some of his touches, the free kick he took the other day was really well taken too.
Page 3 of 4