Because the alternatives are even worse
comment by renoog (U4449)
posted 5 minutes ago
Because the alternatives are even worse
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wilshire is ready
Wilshire is ready
-----------------
Maybe. But the idea of Ramsey and Wilshere in the same 2-man midfield fills me with nightmares.
Could be to do with his recent contribution.
comment by renoog (U4449)
posted 6 minutes ago
Wilshire is ready
-----------------
Maybe. But the idea of Ramsey and Wilshere in the same 2-man midfield fills me with nightmares.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We are no longer playing with a DM. Wilshere cannot play every game, but is better than Xhaka and should get a start in league.
comment by renoog (U4449)
posted 1 hour, 9 minutes ago
Wilshire is ready
-----------------
Maybe. But the idea of Ramsey and Wilshere in the same 2-man midfield fills me with nightmares.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wilshire to Ramsay!! 😁 vs 10 men of course
Wenger doesn’t trust Jack in CM
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
Xhaka actually had a good game. Just think he needs the right players around him on their game also.
They all played well today and can see Wilshere as a great added bonus to strengthen the midfield.
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 3 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what? Doesn’t change that we are wasteful in front of goal and Xhaka gifts our opponents 1 goal a game on average.
Mertesacker was just as responsible for Rooney's goal as Xhaka. However Xhaka has not done enough so far and maybe the fact he was partly responsible for the first goal got a positive reaction from him. Whatever Bould/Wenger taught Xhaka last season abt standing off because he was getting sent off was rotten. Xhaka has a dirtyness to his game. He is naturally aggressive and that is so important to his game.
You can see physically that Xhaka is not fast but what is more worrying is that he seems slow upstairs if he doesnt know after 18 months in this league you dont get time on the ball then you have to wonder about his suitability for the league.
comment by 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 (U18355)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 3 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what? Doesn’t change that we are wasteful in front of goal and Xhaka gifts our opponents 1 goal a game on average.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Xhaka raised his game 100% after his mistake. Why slate players off but when they do something good after no mention at all. Same with Giroud for so long. Sick of it.
This 3 at the back is not good for Xhaka because his not quick. He can pick out a pass and can shoot but his greatly more effective IMO with a midfield of 3-4.
comment by Gunnerthru (U6675)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 (U18355)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 3 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what? Doesn’t change that we are wasteful in front of goal and Xhaka gifts our opponents 1 goal a game on average.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Xhaka raised his game 100% after his mistake. Why slate players off but when they do something good after no mention at all. Same with Giroud for so long. Sick of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
absolutely spot on.
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 9 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No idiot. My opinion is based on numerous games and realizing he is NOT the answer for our midfield. He gave away the ball numerous times. Let me guess...you think we will win the league again under wenger.
As for Lacazette and Ramsay...yes they scored. But that does not erase the fact that they had golden opportunities to score early in the game.
So not sure what point you were trying to make.
The OP is right, but of course it's ultimately down to Wenger, if you want to play Xhaka at all you have to play him next to a quality DM who rules the midfield and keeps everybody in line and communicating (clearly Xhaka has no nous and nobody gave him a shout for Everton's first goal) - Wenger doesn't even seem to be aware of the problem...
comment by ItsAboutTheBackFour (U9916)
posted 56 seconds ago
The OP is right, but of course it's ultimately down to Wenger, if you want to play Xhaka at all you have to play him next to a quality DM who rules the midfield and keeps everybody in line and communicating (clearly Xhaka has no nous and nobody gave him a shout for Everton's first goal) - Wenger doesn't even seem to be aware of the problem...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
that's what im saying, when your playing him along side 1 other traditional midfielder it aint going to work, you need that additional midfielder or a more traditional 4-4-2 formation.
Xhaka just not good enough to be our DMF, plain and simple. The guy is slow physically and mentally. Never going to be our long-term solution. Coquelin not good enough either. We need to scour the world for a ball playing DMF, someone who can tackle and pass. Can't be that hard
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
Mertesacker was just as responsible for Rooney's goal as Xhaka. However Xhaka has not done enough so far and maybe the fact he was partly responsible for the first goal got a positive reaction from him. Whatever Bould/Wenger taught Xhaka last season abt standing off because he was getting sent off was rotten. Xhaka has a dirtyness to his game. He is naturally aggressive and that is so important to his game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jenius, it is not Mertesacker's fault (except perhaps like others in not warning the hapless Xhaka of the impeding tackle) - when Rooney gets the ball Mertesacker holds off because if he commits to Rooney then Rooney can put Vlasic clean through - by the time the cover gets back it's too late.
comment by ItsAboutTheBackFour (U9916)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
Mertesacker was just as responsible for Rooney's goal as Xhaka. However Xhaka has not done enough so far and maybe the fact he was partly responsible for the first goal got a positive reaction from him. Whatever Bould/Wenger taught Xhaka last season abt standing off because he was getting sent off was rotten. Xhaka has a dirtyness to his game. He is naturally aggressive and that is so important to his game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jenius, it is not Mertesacker's fault (except perhaps like others in not warning the hapless Xhaka of the impeding tackle) - when Rooney gets the ball Mertesacker holds off because if he commits to Rooney then Rooney can put Vlasic clean through - by the time the cover gets back it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah. Thats the issue with 3 at the back. You can assume danger when none exists. Mertesacker had Kos on his right and Monreal on his left behind him. This is what I meant earlier in the season by not having the players to play 3 CBs. Your third middle Cb has to be astute to read the game and know when to come into the midfield, and when to drop back. Chelsea depend so much on Luiz. Mertesacker lacks and pace and so his first instinct is to drop deeper. Henry did a wonderful analysis on the Watford game where he showed how Mertesacker kept on dropping deeper allowing Watford wide players to get in behind the wing backs constantly. Mertesacker did the same today against Rooney. The issue is made worse by the fact that Rooney is probably the only forward in the premier league who wouldn't be able to out run Mertesacker. Henry showed at HT with slow motion of what happened to confirm my first instinct on the match thread. Mertseacker should have closed down Rooney and its no hindsight.
When you play 2 CBs, your Cbs are very sure of who to cover, when to drop back and when to step up to play offside. 3 CBs confuses issues for your defenders unless they are drilled to destruction like Conte does. And even then you need very clever defenders with pace and ability cover each other. Its why Conte got rid of Terry straight away.
Mertesacker could also see the whole pitch in front of him. There was no need to pass to Xhaka who was being pressed by Everton. It was a hospital ball. So he was at fault twice. Which is my point of the need of a ball playing CB for the Chelsea formation to work well. Honest just watching Liverpool getting taken apart by Spurs playing 4-3-3. I don't think I will be ever convinced of 3-4-3 because we just don't have the right players for it, nor are we drilled enough to make it work well.
"Nah. Thats the issue with 3 at the back. You can assume danger when none exists. Mertesacker had Kos on his right and Monreal on his left behind him."
-----
Ummm... nope - the only reason Monreal has time to get back is because Mertesacker delays and stops the pass to Vlasic - it's quite clear on the video.
comment by ItsAboutTheBackFour (U9916)
posted 12 minutes ago
"Nah. Thats the issue with 3 at the back. You can assume danger when none exists. Mertesacker had Kos on his right and Monreal on his left behind him."
-----
Ummm... nope - the only reason Monreal has time to get back is because Mertesacker delays and stops the pass to Vlasic - it's quite clear on the video.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
(even if I accept your scenario and I don't)
So you tell me where the danger was? Was it abt worrying about a through ball to a player attacking from wide who may have been offside anyway. or was it center of the goal against a player who has some of the highest statistics in premier league history for goals from shooting at the edge of the box?
Mertesacker covered one side of the goal and Vlasic at the same time, that's as good as he could do in the circumstances, The position for Mertesacker was impossible, we had too many players in advanced positions, ridiculously it was four against three in their favour in our last 25 yards and specifically two against one regarding Mertesacker.
It's not really just the lack of defensive awareness by Xhaka (which is really low), it's the whole team.
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Xhaka
Page 1 of 2
posted on 22/10/17
Because the alternatives are even worse
posted on 22/10/17
comment by renoog (U4449)
posted 5 minutes ago
Because the alternatives are even worse
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wilshire is ready
posted on 22/10/17
Wilshire is ready
-----------------
Maybe. But the idea of Ramsey and Wilshere in the same 2-man midfield fills me with nightmares.
posted on 22/10/17
Could be to do with his recent contribution.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by renoog (U4449)
posted 6 minutes ago
Wilshire is ready
-----------------
Maybe. But the idea of Ramsey and Wilshere in the same 2-man midfield fills me with nightmares.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We are no longer playing with a DM. Wilshere cannot play every game, but is better than Xhaka and should get a start in league.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by renoog (U4449)
posted 1 hour, 9 minutes ago
Wilshire is ready
-----------------
Maybe. But the idea of Ramsey and Wilshere in the same 2-man midfield fills me with nightmares.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wilshire to Ramsay!! 😁 vs 10 men of course
posted on 22/10/17
Wenger doesn’t trust Jack in CM
posted on 22/10/17
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
posted on 22/10/17
Xhaka actually had a good game. Just think he needs the right players around him on their game also.
They all played well today and can see Wilshere as a great added bonus to strengthen the midfield.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 3 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what? Doesn’t change that we are wasteful in front of goal and Xhaka gifts our opponents 1 goal a game on average.
posted on 22/10/17
Mertesacker was just as responsible for Rooney's goal as Xhaka. However Xhaka has not done enough so far and maybe the fact he was partly responsible for the first goal got a positive reaction from him. Whatever Bould/Wenger taught Xhaka last season abt standing off because he was getting sent off was rotten. Xhaka has a dirtyness to his game. He is naturally aggressive and that is so important to his game.
posted on 22/10/17
You can see physically that Xhaka is not fast but what is more worrying is that he seems slow upstairs if he doesnt know after 18 months in this league you dont get time on the ball then you have to wonder about his suitability for the league.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 (U18355)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 3 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what? Doesn’t change that we are wasteful in front of goal and Xhaka gifts our opponents 1 goal a game on average.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Xhaka raised his game 100% after his mistake. Why slate players off but when they do something good after no mention at all. Same with Giroud for so long. Sick of it.
posted on 22/10/17
This 3 at the back is not good for Xhaka because his not quick. He can pick out a pass and can shoot but his greatly more effective IMO with a midfield of 3-4.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by Gunnerthru (U6675)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 (U18355)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 3 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what? Doesn’t change that we are wasteful in front of goal and Xhaka gifts our opponents 1 goal a game on average.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Xhaka raised his game 100% after his mistake. Why slate players off but when they do something good after no mention at all. Same with Giroud for so long. Sick of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
absolutely spot on.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by citrenoogeht (U13932)
posted 9 minutes ago
OP is easily triggered. He posted this article 15 minutes into the game slagging off Xhaka and stating that Lacazette and Ramsey should have scored. Well if he had waited until the end of the game he would have noted that Lacazette and Ramsey scored and Xhaka got and assist! SMH
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No idiot. My opinion is based on numerous games and realizing he is NOT the answer for our midfield. He gave away the ball numerous times. Let me guess...you think we will win the league again under wenger.
As for Lacazette and Ramsay...yes they scored. But that does not erase the fact that they had golden opportunities to score early in the game.
So not sure what point you were trying to make.
posted on 22/10/17
The OP is right, but of course it's ultimately down to Wenger, if you want to play Xhaka at all you have to play him next to a quality DM who rules the midfield and keeps everybody in line and communicating (clearly Xhaka has no nous and nobody gave him a shout for Everton's first goal) - Wenger doesn't even seem to be aware of the problem...
posted on 22/10/17
comment by ItsAboutTheBackFour (U9916)
posted 56 seconds ago
The OP is right, but of course it's ultimately down to Wenger, if you want to play Xhaka at all you have to play him next to a quality DM who rules the midfield and keeps everybody in line and communicating (clearly Xhaka has no nous and nobody gave him a shout for Everton's first goal) - Wenger doesn't even seem to be aware of the problem...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
that's what im saying, when your playing him along side 1 other traditional midfielder it aint going to work, you need that additional midfielder or a more traditional 4-4-2 formation.
posted on 22/10/17
Xhaka just not good enough to be our DMF, plain and simple. The guy is slow physically and mentally. Never going to be our long-term solution. Coquelin not good enough either. We need to scour the world for a ball playing DMF, someone who can tackle and pass. Can't be that hard
posted on 22/10/17
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
Mertesacker was just as responsible for Rooney's goal as Xhaka. However Xhaka has not done enough so far and maybe the fact he was partly responsible for the first goal got a positive reaction from him. Whatever Bould/Wenger taught Xhaka last season abt standing off because he was getting sent off was rotten. Xhaka has a dirtyness to his game. He is naturally aggressive and that is so important to his game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jenius, it is not Mertesacker's fault (except perhaps like others in not warning the hapless Xhaka of the impeding tackle) - when Rooney gets the ball Mertesacker holds off because if he commits to Rooney then Rooney can put Vlasic clean through - by the time the cover gets back it's too late.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by ItsAboutTheBackFour (U9916)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
Mertesacker was just as responsible for Rooney's goal as Xhaka. However Xhaka has not done enough so far and maybe the fact he was partly responsible for the first goal got a positive reaction from him. Whatever Bould/Wenger taught Xhaka last season abt standing off because he was getting sent off was rotten. Xhaka has a dirtyness to his game. He is naturally aggressive and that is so important to his game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jenius, it is not Mertesacker's fault (except perhaps like others in not warning the hapless Xhaka of the impeding tackle) - when Rooney gets the ball Mertesacker holds off because if he commits to Rooney then Rooney can put Vlasic clean through - by the time the cover gets back it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah. Thats the issue with 3 at the back. You can assume danger when none exists. Mertesacker had Kos on his right and Monreal on his left behind him. This is what I meant earlier in the season by not having the players to play 3 CBs. Your third middle Cb has to be astute to read the game and know when to come into the midfield, and when to drop back. Chelsea depend so much on Luiz. Mertesacker lacks and pace and so his first instinct is to drop deeper. Henry did a wonderful analysis on the Watford game where he showed how Mertesacker kept on dropping deeper allowing Watford wide players to get in behind the wing backs constantly. Mertesacker did the same today against Rooney. The issue is made worse by the fact that Rooney is probably the only forward in the premier league who wouldn't be able to out run Mertesacker. Henry showed at HT with slow motion of what happened to confirm my first instinct on the match thread. Mertseacker should have closed down Rooney and its no hindsight.
When you play 2 CBs, your Cbs are very sure of who to cover, when to drop back and when to step up to play offside. 3 CBs confuses issues for your defenders unless they are drilled to destruction like Conte does. And even then you need very clever defenders with pace and ability cover each other. Its why Conte got rid of Terry straight away.
Mertesacker could also see the whole pitch in front of him. There was no need to pass to Xhaka who was being pressed by Everton. It was a hospital ball. So he was at fault twice. Which is my point of the need of a ball playing CB for the Chelsea formation to work well. Honest just watching Liverpool getting taken apart by Spurs playing 4-3-3. I don't think I will be ever convinced of 3-4-3 because we just don't have the right players for it, nor are we drilled enough to make it work well.
posted on 22/10/17
"Nah. Thats the issue with 3 at the back. You can assume danger when none exists. Mertesacker had Kos on his right and Monreal on his left behind him."
-----
Ummm... nope - the only reason Monreal has time to get back is because Mertesacker delays and stops the pass to Vlasic - it's quite clear on the video.
posted on 22/10/17
comment by ItsAboutTheBackFour (U9916)
posted 12 minutes ago
"Nah. Thats the issue with 3 at the back. You can assume danger when none exists. Mertesacker had Kos on his right and Monreal on his left behind him."
-----
Ummm... nope - the only reason Monreal has time to get back is because Mertesacker delays and stops the pass to Vlasic - it's quite clear on the video.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
(even if I accept your scenario and I don't)
So you tell me where the danger was? Was it abt worrying about a through ball to a player attacking from wide who may have been offside anyway. or was it center of the goal against a player who has some of the highest statistics in premier league history for goals from shooting at the edge of the box?
posted on 22/10/17
(will be back l8r)
posted on 22/10/17
Mertesacker covered one side of the goal and Vlasic at the same time, that's as good as he could do in the circumstances, The position for Mertesacker was impossible, we had too many players in advanced positions, ridiculously it was four against three in their favour in our last 25 yards and specifically two against one regarding Mertesacker.
It's not really just the lack of defensive awareness by Xhaka (which is really low), it's the whole team.
Page 1 of 2