I think it has something to do with the Ronaldo and Messi effect. You could possibly throw Iniesta in there too.
But them 3 have taken the game to such a level that players like Aguero, Hazard, Silva, Suarez, Modric etc have all become best supporting acts whereas 10-15 years ago, would’ve been considered the greats of their era.
In reality, there are many great players about today. They just happen to be plying their trade in an era where 2-3 individuals took the game to another level.
I know there will be a lot of disagreement, but I just think that even “average” or “mediocre” players are so physically and technically good nowadays that they know how to nullify the most gifted. So the flair and quality is still there - perhaps more than ever - but tactical and individual improvements elsewhere mean it doesn’t have the same obvious effect on games.
In the same way that track and field athletes demonstrably improve over the years, so, I imagine, do footballers. This is no slight on the “natural” ability of the greats of yesteryear; it’s just the way it is.
comment by CurrentlyInChina (U11181)
posted 41 minutes ago
What pub was it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The Nags Head
comment by CurrentlyInChina (U11181)
posted 56 minutes ago
What pub was it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The Devil’s double
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 30 minutes ago
I think it has something to do with the Ronaldo and Messi effect. You could possibly throw Iniesta in there too.
But them 3 have taken the game to such a level that players like Aguero, Hazard, Silva, Suarez, Modric etc have all become best supporting acts whereas 10-15 years ago, would’ve been considered the greats of their era.
In reality, there are many great players about today. They just happen to be plying their trade in an era where 2-3 individuals took the game to another level.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree. How many times have we seen “there aren’t many top X or Y’s” about when discussing potential signings. Ronaldo or Messis achievements shouldn’t mean we can’t name 5 top CB’s or CM’s
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 24 minutes ago
I know there will be a lot of disagreement, but I just think that even “average” or “mediocre” players are so physically and technically good nowadays that they know how to nullify the most gifted. So the flair and quality is still there - perhaps more than ever - but tactical and individual improvements elsewhere mean it doesn’t have the same obvious effect on games.
In the same way that track and field athletes demonstrably improve over the years, so, I imagine, do footballers. This is no slight on the “natural” ability of the greats of yesteryear; it’s just the way it is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you mean by tactical and individual improvements ?
Probably because the central premise "... there seem (sic) to be fewer world class players now than there have been in previous generations .... " is:
a) weak
b) false
if anybody in our social circle at the pub ever raised that premise .......... well, in short, they would no longer be in our social circle.
What IAmMe is saying is he has no friends.
comment by IAmMe (U18491)
posted 3 hours, 7 minutes ago
Probably because the central premise "... there seem (sic) to be fewer world class players now than there have been in previous generations .... " is:
a) weak
b) false
if anybody in our social circle at the pub ever raised that premise .......... well, in short, they would no longer be in our social circle.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
State of this guy
Gotta say guys, some great observations that i agree with when it comes to the Players of today.
good topic.
and that's why i'll wait til 2030 to give Women's footie a watch.
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Got there first. In pretty much every walk of life people pine after the old times.
Was talking to an old friend the other day and he wished we can go back to the "good old days", but when we were actually living those days he was constantly moaning about how bored he was.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Doesn’t change the fact Van Basten was a great player and there are now fewer great players than there were generations ago.
comment by DL11 (U21614)
posted 1 hour, 9 minutes ago
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Got there first. In pretty much every walk of life people pine after the old times.
Was talking to an old friend the other day and he wished we can go back to the "good old days", but when we were actually living those days he was constantly moaning about how bored he was.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Perfect quote from the ending of the Office;
“I wish there was a way to know you're in the good old days before you've actually left them”
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 7 hours, 27 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 24 minutes ago
I know there will be a lot of disagreement, but I just think that even “average” or “mediocre” players are so physically and technically good nowadays that they know how to nullify the most gifted. So the flair and quality is still there - perhaps more than ever - but tactical and individual improvements elsewhere mean it doesn’t have the same obvious effect on games.
In the same way that track and field athletes demonstrably improve over the years, so, I imagine, do footballers. This is no slight on the “natural” ability of the greats of yesteryear; it’s just the way it is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you mean by tactical and individual improvements ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tactical - I’d imagine now there is a more studied, sophisticated approach to games, inculcated by managers into players. More emphasis on shape and knowing how to restrict opponents as well as playing yourself. I’m not saying coaches of the past were naive, not at all, but the game has undergone revolutions just in the last twenty years or so. Wenger and Guardiola spring to mind.
Individual - as I said, even mediocre, run-of-the-mill players are very fit now and with only modest flair can hold their own against more gifted players.
1) More detailed tactics and scouting these days make it easier for a world class player to be kept quiet
2) We an watch any player we want, when we want.
3) the average player is better than previously
4) Messi and Ronaldo make it difficult for others look world class
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
It's just looking at players best moments and remembering them, rather than any poor games.
People remember players like Figo, Davids, Nedved, Raul etc and rightly regard them highly but i'd say like for like players like Hazard, KDB, Silva, Aguero, Suarez are every bit as good. Without going up a level to Ronaldo and Messi.
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Great shout Scruttocks. That would set to play a part.
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 0 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Great shout Scruttocks. That would set to play a part.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Deffo
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 0 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Great shout Scruttocks. That would set to play a part.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Deffo
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Every school now has a 4g football pitch where you can actually play football. We played in a river at best when we were at school. No excuses.
Sign in if you want to comment
Lack of great players
Page 1 of 2
posted on 7/3/19
What pub was it?
posted on 7/3/19
Red Lion
posted on 8/3/19
I think it has something to do with the Ronaldo and Messi effect. You could possibly throw Iniesta in there too.
But them 3 have taken the game to such a level that players like Aguero, Hazard, Silva, Suarez, Modric etc have all become best supporting acts whereas 10-15 years ago, would’ve been considered the greats of their era.
In reality, there are many great players about today. They just happen to be plying their trade in an era where 2-3 individuals took the game to another level.
posted on 8/3/19
I know there will be a lot of disagreement, but I just think that even “average” or “mediocre” players are so physically and technically good nowadays that they know how to nullify the most gifted. So the flair and quality is still there - perhaps more than ever - but tactical and individual improvements elsewhere mean it doesn’t have the same obvious effect on games.
In the same way that track and field athletes demonstrably improve over the years, so, I imagine, do footballers. This is no slight on the “natural” ability of the greats of yesteryear; it’s just the way it is.
posted on 8/3/19
comment by CurrentlyInChina (U11181)
posted 41 minutes ago
What pub was it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The Nags Head
posted on 8/3/19
comment by CurrentlyInChina (U11181)
posted 56 minutes ago
What pub was it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The Devil’s double
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 30 minutes ago
I think it has something to do with the Ronaldo and Messi effect. You could possibly throw Iniesta in there too.
But them 3 have taken the game to such a level that players like Aguero, Hazard, Silva, Suarez, Modric etc have all become best supporting acts whereas 10-15 years ago, would’ve been considered the greats of their era.
In reality, there are many great players about today. They just happen to be plying their trade in an era where 2-3 individuals took the game to another level.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree. How many times have we seen “there aren’t many top X or Y’s” about when discussing potential signings. Ronaldo or Messis achievements shouldn’t mean we can’t name 5 top CB’s or CM’s
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 24 minutes ago
I know there will be a lot of disagreement, but I just think that even “average” or “mediocre” players are so physically and technically good nowadays that they know how to nullify the most gifted. So the flair and quality is still there - perhaps more than ever - but tactical and individual improvements elsewhere mean it doesn’t have the same obvious effect on games.
In the same way that track and field athletes demonstrably improve over the years, so, I imagine, do footballers. This is no slight on the “natural” ability of the greats of yesteryear; it’s just the way it is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you mean by tactical and individual improvements ?
posted on 8/3/19
Probably because the central premise "... there seem (sic) to be fewer world class players now than there have been in previous generations .... " is:
a) weak
b) false
if anybody in our social circle at the pub ever raised that premise .......... well, in short, they would no longer be in our social circle.
posted on 8/3/19
So is it weak or false ?
posted on 8/3/19
What IAmMe is saying is he has no friends.
posted on 8/3/19
comment by IAmMe (U18491)
posted 3 hours, 7 minutes ago
Probably because the central premise "... there seem (sic) to be fewer world class players now than there have been in previous generations .... " is:
a) weak
b) false
if anybody in our social circle at the pub ever raised that premise .......... well, in short, they would no longer be in our social circle.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
State of this guy
posted on 8/3/19
Gotta say guys, some great observations that i agree with when it comes to the Players of today.
good topic.
and that's why i'll wait til 2030 to give Women's footie a watch.
posted on 8/3/19
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Got there first. In pretty much every walk of life people pine after the old times.
Was talking to an old friend the other day and he wished we can go back to the "good old days", but when we were actually living those days he was constantly moaning about how bored he was.
posted on 8/3/19
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Doesn’t change the fact Van Basten was a great player and there are now fewer great players than there were generations ago.
posted on 8/3/19
comment by DL11 (U21614)
posted 1 hour, 9 minutes ago
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
Historical hindsight.
We remember the great players of the past because of their good games and forget about their bad games.
Marco van Basten was incredible, scored amazing goals but he was also on occasion an empty jersey that went missing, that would be subbed because he was ineffective.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Got there first. In pretty much every walk of life people pine after the old times.
Was talking to an old friend the other day and he wished we can go back to the "good old days", but when we were actually living those days he was constantly moaning about how bored he was.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Perfect quote from the ending of the Office;
“I wish there was a way to know you're in the good old days before you've actually left them”
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 7 hours, 27 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 24 minutes ago
I know there will be a lot of disagreement, but I just think that even “average” or “mediocre” players are so physically and technically good nowadays that they know how to nullify the most gifted. So the flair and quality is still there - perhaps more than ever - but tactical and individual improvements elsewhere mean it doesn’t have the same obvious effect on games.
In the same way that track and field athletes demonstrably improve over the years, so, I imagine, do footballers. This is no slight on the “natural” ability of the greats of yesteryear; it’s just the way it is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you mean by tactical and individual improvements ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tactical - I’d imagine now there is a more studied, sophisticated approach to games, inculcated by managers into players. More emphasis on shape and knowing how to restrict opponents as well as playing yourself. I’m not saying coaches of the past were naive, not at all, but the game has undergone revolutions just in the last twenty years or so. Wenger and Guardiola spring to mind.
Individual - as I said, even mediocre, run-of-the-mill players are very fit now and with only modest flair can hold their own against more gifted players.
posted on 8/3/19
1) More detailed tactics and scouting these days make it easier for a world class player to be kept quiet
2) We an watch any player we want, when we want.
3) the average player is better than previously
4) Messi and Ronaldo make it difficult for others look world class
posted on 8/3/19
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
posted on 8/3/19
It's just looking at players best moments and remembering them, rather than any poor games.
People remember players like Figo, Davids, Nedved, Raul etc and rightly regard them highly but i'd say like for like players like Hazard, KDB, Silva, Aguero, Suarez are every bit as good. Without going up a level to Ronaldo and Messi.
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Great shout Scruttocks. That would set to play a part.
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 0 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Great shout Scruttocks. That would set to play a part.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Deffo
posted on 8/3/19
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Trigger (U22078)
posted 0 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
Surely there's now less kids playing football all day every day?
We're in a digital age, I can't say this is definitely having an effect but logically a smaller pool of talent should mean we don't see as many elite players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Great shout Scruttocks. That would set to play a part.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Deffo
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Every school now has a 4g football pitch where you can actually play football. We played in a river at best when we were at school. No excuses.
Page 1 of 2