comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 28 seconds ago
Do you not think that Arsenal and Man Utd are good enough to play in the Champions League?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Undoubtedly.
The premier league clubs have unanimously opposed Uefa’s reforms to the CL so people can stop worrying.
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 2 minutes ago
So you agree with me
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope
Pretty much every group normally has a weak team, right? So why not take 4 places out of those 8 and share those among the 5th and 6th place teams of the top leagues and leave the other 4 as smaller teams so they still have a chance to get into the CL, it's just slightly harder?
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 20 seconds ago
Pretty much every group normally has a weak team, right? So why not take 4 places out of those 8 and share those among the 5th and 6th place teams of the top leagues and leave the other 4 as smaller teams so they still have a chance to get into the CL, it's just slightly harder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the keys, though, is it has to a representative competition and give opportunities to clubs from every UEFA country.
That makes it hard to have a competitive competition though.
Yeah exactly, you'd still have 4 spots for weaker teams and that opportunity would still be there for teams from these countries to qualify.
In the same way that I agree, it is fair to give teams from every country an opportunity to play in the Champions League, because of how much stronger the top leagues are compared to the other leagues, 4 places may not be enough for the best leagues and maybe those teams who are finishing 5th or 6th in the Premier League or even La Liga also deserve a chance to qualify for the Champions League.
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 2 minutes ago
Yeah exactly, you'd still have 4 spots for weaker teams and that opportunity would still be there for teams from these countries to qualify.
In the same way that I agree, it is fair to give teams from every country an opportunity to play in the Champions League, because of how much stronger the top leagues are compared to the other leagues, 4 places may not be enough for the best leagues and maybe those teams who are finishing 5th or 6th in the Premier League or even La Liga also deserve a chance to qualify for the Champions League.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They do, the Europa League.
who are finishing 5th or 6th in the Premier League or even La Liga also deserve a chance to qualify for the Champions League.
-----------
They have a chance - finish top 4.
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why should those slots be taken away?
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 29 minutes ago
Do you not think that Arsenal and Man Utd are good enough to play in the Champions League?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We haven't been gone enough to get past the last 16 in a decade
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why should those slots be taken away?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they'd be better allocated the way I suggested.
So 2nd place in those leagues is:
Basel, Pizen, PSV and Olympiakos
5th, 6th in Spain and England:
Arsenal, Manchester United, Getafe and Sevilla
I wouldn't want to ditch those teams necessarily, because they are good teams some of them, but this way you don't lose the champion of any league whilst still adding quality.
you really are speaking more shiete the longer this thread goes on
comment by Robbing_Hoody - as a rule I don't trust a man who doesn't drink but I do trust James Milner (U6374)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - as a rule I don't trust a man who doesn't drink but I do trust James Milner (U6374)
posted 14 seconds ago
No
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well London clubs have one European Cup between so clearly theyre not good enough are they.
Well Liverpool and Everton have no Premierships between them, does that also mean they are not good enough to compete in the Prem. Silly argument to say London clubs have not won lots of CLs so they should not be allowed to compete.
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why should those slots be taken away?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they'd be better allocated the way I suggested.
So 2nd place in those leagues is:
Basel, Pizen, PSV and Olympiakos
5th, 6th in Spain and England:
Arsenal, Manchester United, Getafe and Sevilla
I wouldn't want to ditch those teams necessarily, because they are good teams some of them, but this way you don't lose the champion of any league whilst still adding quality.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The only acceptable way of implementing your idea is by expanding the competition and having benefits for the smaller nations.
Having top 4 leagues 5th and 6th in the earliest qualifiers is one way, as it would give big games to little teams.
The other is to expand the competition, which obviously has a lot of logistical issues.
Yeah so you could just add more teams into the qualifying rounds and just change that process whilst still having the same amount of teams make it through from the qualifying round into the Champions League.
So 6 teams make it into the CL via the qualifying rounds. What if, for example, 2 of those 6 are from a play off involving 5th and 6th from the top 4 leagues, and the other 4 are obtained through the current way?
I think if we're talking about who deserves a chance, that these teams deserve a chance. You mentioned earlier that the chance they have is finshing top 4, but there's no way you can fit 6 into 4 obviously. Regardless of what happens, 2 (in my opinion) 'worthy' teams miss out.
Wahl - let's face it, nobody agrees with you. The idea that the teams that finish 5th or 6th in the PL have a better claim to a place in the CL than a team that finishes first in a weaker league is not accepted by anyone other than you it seems. English teams play against each other all the time - at least twice per season, and frequently more if they make it through to later rounds of cup competitions. I would much prefer the opportunity to see my club tested against a new challenge - even if it is a team from a lesser league. You'll still get to play against stronger teams in later rounds (if you are still in the competition) but it's a good way to see other developing teams, players, coaches and fans.
Darren guy also said you can just win the Europa, but Chelsea won the Europa this year having already qualified for the Champions League via the domestic league. So Arsenal lost out on Champions league qualification not to another team in their position who gained Champions League qualification through winning the Europa, but to a team who already had qualified for the Champions League. So it's not that simple that the team who wins the Europa is always winning Champions League qualification in the process.
he idea that the teams that finish 5th or 6th in the PL have a better claim to a place in the CL than a team that finishes first in a weaker league is not accepted by anyone other than you it seems.
---------------
Why not toss them all in the qualifiers? Surely whoever wins has the best claim?
English teams play against each other all the time - at least twice per season, and frequently more if they make it through to later rounds of cup competitions
-----------------------
Don't see what relevance this has
I would much prefer the opportunity to see my club tested against a new challenge - even if it is a team from a lesser league.
-----------------------------------
Less competitive game though.
but it's a good way to see other developing teams, players, coaches and fans.
-----------------------
I don't get why this a reason. You like seeing new teams. Why not just watch other leagues then?
The thing is I'm sure people back when they first changed the champions league to accommodate 3rd and 4th place teams would have said the same thing some people have said on this thread. Yet it happened and the CL is stronger for it.
So it's not that simple that the team who wins the Europa is always winning Champions League qualification in the process.
———
Of course it is. It supercedes any league qualification process because you automatically join in the group stages and join pot one.
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 12 minutes ago
The thing is I'm sure people back when they first changed the champions league to accommodate 3rd and 4th place teams would have said the same thing some people have said on this thread. Yet it happened and the CL is stronger for it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’d argue it isn’t. It’s just done exactly what we would deserve with the next step. Driven all the other clubs further away and hence losing real competition. The financial gap is ridiculous now. Where does it end?
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Does the Premier League deserve 6 CL places
Page 6 of 8
6 | 7 | 8
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 28 seconds ago
Do you not think that Arsenal and Man Utd are good enough to play in the Champions League?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Undoubtedly.
posted on 5/6/19
So you agree with me
posted on 5/6/19
The premier league clubs have unanimously opposed Uefa’s reforms to the CL so people can stop worrying.
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 2 minutes ago
So you agree with me
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope
posted on 5/6/19
Pretty much every group normally has a weak team, right? So why not take 4 places out of those 8 and share those among the 5th and 6th place teams of the top leagues and leave the other 4 as smaller teams so they still have a chance to get into the CL, it's just slightly harder?
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 20 seconds ago
Pretty much every group normally has a weak team, right? So why not take 4 places out of those 8 and share those among the 5th and 6th place teams of the top leagues and leave the other 4 as smaller teams so they still have a chance to get into the CL, it's just slightly harder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the keys, though, is it has to a representative competition and give opportunities to clubs from every UEFA country.
That makes it hard to have a competitive competition though.
posted on 5/6/19
Yeah exactly, you'd still have 4 spots for weaker teams and that opportunity would still be there for teams from these countries to qualify.
In the same way that I agree, it is fair to give teams from every country an opportunity to play in the Champions League, because of how much stronger the top leagues are compared to the other leagues, 4 places may not be enough for the best leagues and maybe those teams who are finishing 5th or 6th in the Premier League or even La Liga also deserve a chance to qualify for the Champions League.
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 2 minutes ago
Yeah exactly, you'd still have 4 spots for weaker teams and that opportunity would still be there for teams from these countries to qualify.
In the same way that I agree, it is fair to give teams from every country an opportunity to play in the Champions League, because of how much stronger the top leagues are compared to the other leagues, 4 places may not be enough for the best leagues and maybe those teams who are finishing 5th or 6th in the Premier League or even La Liga also deserve a chance to qualify for the Champions League.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They do, the Europa League.
posted on 5/6/19
who are finishing 5th or 6th in the Premier League or even La Liga also deserve a chance to qualify for the Champions League.
-----------
They have a chance - finish top 4.
posted on 5/6/19
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why should those slots be taken away?
posted on 5/6/19
this is just stupid
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 29 minutes ago
Do you not think that Arsenal and Man Utd are good enough to play in the Champions League?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We haven't been gone enough to get past the last 16 in a decade
posted on 5/6/19
*good
posted on 5/6/19
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why should those slots be taken away?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they'd be better allocated the way I suggested.
So 2nd place in those leagues is:
Basel, Pizen, PSV and Olympiakos
5th, 6th in Spain and England:
Arsenal, Manchester United, Getafe and Sevilla
I wouldn't want to ditch those teams necessarily, because they are good teams some of them, but this way you don't lose the champion of any league whilst still adding quality.
posted on 5/6/19
you really are speaking more shiete the longer this thread goes on
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Robbing_Hoody - as a rule I don't trust a man who doesn't drink but I do trust James Milner (U6374)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - as a rule I don't trust a man who doesn't drink but I do trust James Milner (U6374)
posted 14 seconds ago
No
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well London clubs have one European Cup between so clearly theyre not good enough are they.
Well Liverpool and Everton have no Premierships between them, does that also mean they are not good enough to compete in the Prem. Silly argument to say London clubs have not won lots of CLs so they should not be allowed to compete.
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 1 minute ago
So I've just looked at the rules for qualification. In the qualifying rounds there are 4 places in those qualifying rounds allocated to the 2nd places teams in Switzerland, Czech Republic, Netherlands and Greece. What if you took those 4 slots away and allocated them instead to 5th and 6th from the top two leagues (which is Spain and England currently). So they'd be in the qualifying rounds with no guaranteed place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why should those slots be taken away?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they'd be better allocated the way I suggested.
So 2nd place in those leagues is:
Basel, Pizen, PSV and Olympiakos
5th, 6th in Spain and England:
Arsenal, Manchester United, Getafe and Sevilla
I wouldn't want to ditch those teams necessarily, because they are good teams some of them, but this way you don't lose the champion of any league whilst still adding quality.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The only acceptable way of implementing your idea is by expanding the competition and having benefits for the smaller nations.
Having top 4 leagues 5th and 6th in the earliest qualifiers is one way, as it would give big games to little teams.
The other is to expand the competition, which obviously has a lot of logistical issues.
posted on 5/6/19
Yeah so you could just add more teams into the qualifying rounds and just change that process whilst still having the same amount of teams make it through from the qualifying round into the Champions League.
So 6 teams make it into the CL via the qualifying rounds. What if, for example, 2 of those 6 are from a play off involving 5th and 6th from the top 4 leagues, and the other 4 are obtained through the current way?
I think if we're talking about who deserves a chance, that these teams deserve a chance. You mentioned earlier that the chance they have is finshing top 4, but there's no way you can fit 6 into 4 obviously. Regardless of what happens, 2 (in my opinion) 'worthy' teams miss out.
posted on 5/6/19
Wahl - let's face it, nobody agrees with you. The idea that the teams that finish 5th or 6th in the PL have a better claim to a place in the CL than a team that finishes first in a weaker league is not accepted by anyone other than you it seems. English teams play against each other all the time - at least twice per season, and frequently more if they make it through to later rounds of cup competitions. I would much prefer the opportunity to see my club tested against a new challenge - even if it is a team from a lesser league. You'll still get to play against stronger teams in later rounds (if you are still in the competition) but it's a good way to see other developing teams, players, coaches and fans.
posted on 5/6/19
Darren guy also said you can just win the Europa, but Chelsea won the Europa this year having already qualified for the Champions League via the domestic league. So Arsenal lost out on Champions league qualification not to another team in their position who gained Champions League qualification through winning the Europa, but to a team who already had qualified for the Champions League. So it's not that simple that the team who wins the Europa is always winning Champions League qualification in the process.
posted on 5/6/19
he idea that the teams that finish 5th or 6th in the PL have a better claim to a place in the CL than a team that finishes first in a weaker league is not accepted by anyone other than you it seems.
---------------
Why not toss them all in the qualifiers? Surely whoever wins has the best claim?
English teams play against each other all the time - at least twice per season, and frequently more if they make it through to later rounds of cup competitions
-----------------------
Don't see what relevance this has
I would much prefer the opportunity to see my club tested against a new challenge - even if it is a team from a lesser league.
-----------------------------------
Less competitive game though.
but it's a good way to see other developing teams, players, coaches and fans.
-----------------------
I don't get why this a reason. You like seeing new teams. Why not just watch other leagues then?
posted on 5/6/19
The thing is I'm sure people back when they first changed the champions league to accommodate 3rd and 4th place teams would have said the same thing some people have said on this thread. Yet it happened and the CL is stronger for it.
posted on 5/6/19
So it's not that simple that the team who wins the Europa is always winning Champions League qualification in the process.
———
Of course it is. It supercedes any league qualification process because you automatically join in the group stages and join pot one.
posted on 5/6/19
comment by Wahl Might (U22137)
posted 12 minutes ago
The thing is I'm sure people back when they first changed the champions league to accommodate 3rd and 4th place teams would have said the same thing some people have said on this thread. Yet it happened and the CL is stronger for it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’d argue it isn’t. It’s just done exactly what we would deserve with the next step. Driven all the other clubs further away and hence losing real competition. The financial gap is ridiculous now. Where does it end?
Page 6 of 8
6 | 7 | 8