I don't think Bernardo Silva was being deliberately racist, and he obviously didn't mean harm by it but it's a lazy and ignorant joke to make. It's not asking much to appreciate someone - even for banter's sake - for more than the colour of their skin.
Most players are idiots who barely made it through school. Education is the answer here, surely Kick It Out has some kind of program? A fine would be pointless and he won't understand why he's being punished anyway.
It’s just an absurd thing to say in this day and age.
He deserves a fine/slap just for being so stupid.
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 7 minutes ago
I don't think Bernardo Silva was being deliberately racist, and he obviously didn't mean harm by it but it's a lazy and ignorant joke to make. It's not asking much to appreciate someone - even for banter's sake - for more than the colour of their skin.
Most players are idiots who barely made it through school. Education is the answer here, surely Kick It Out has some kind of program? A fine would be pointless and he won't understand why he's being punished anyway.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its not lazy or ignorant. Its the PC gone mad brigade.
Its not lazy or ignorant. Its the PC gone mad brigade.
---
Na you're right. It's obviously a well-thought out, witty joke that the snowflakes just don't understand.
Loads of multi ethnic groups have racist/stereotypical "banter" tbh. I'm part of a couple myself.
Is it wrong? Probably. As long as everyone knows it's in jest, can give and take it, then is there really any harm done?
Bullying individuals in a group is very different though, but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
I’d draw the line slightly to the left..
https://www.kickitout.org/equality-and-diversity-awareness-course
Sounds like more of a criticism of the quality level of joke which then determines the level of racism from some of you.
I think this is the kind of thing that should be kept as a private joke between friends. Obviously it can be taken to be offensive and I wouldn’t encourage it but being real here, this is the sort of banter that goes on a lot between people who have an understanding of each other and know what lines to cross and not. I’m not saying it’s right and for people in the public eye, it’s probably best to stay well away from this kind of banter.
comment by 1 Father - 1 Love - 2 Reds (U13312)
posted 58 minutes ago
I think this is the kind of thing that should be kept as a private joke between friends. Obviously it can be taken to be offensive and I wouldn’t encourage it but being real here, this is the sort of banter that goes on a lot between people who have an understanding of each other and know what lines to cross and not. I’m not saying it’s right and for people in the public eye, it’s probably best to stay well away from this kind of banter.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nutshell
comment by 1 Father - 1 Love - 2 Reds (U13312)
posted 1 hour, 7 minutes ago
I think this is the kind of thing that should be kept as a private joke between friends. Obviously it can be taken to be offensive and I wouldn’t encourage it but being real here, this is the sort of banter that goes on a lot between people who have an understanding of each other and know what lines to cross and not. I’m not saying it’s right and for people in the public eye, it’s probably best to stay well away from this kind of banter.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Yup that's it
I don't get it. What is he saying?
I’m black, and agree with the notion that this kind of banter and joke is fine between friends, as long as you’re sure with each other that the other person is fine with it. But I would never post stuff like that on social media. Would anyone ever think of posting stuff like hat on their own Facebook or Twitter? And Bernardo did it with 1000s of followers.
The original tweet with that cereal character falls under a similar thing. Some people mention culture difference - that in Portugal it is more acceptable to make jokes like that publicly. Is that really ok? Or if it’s done to a stranger?
A fine is the wrong way to go about it though. Vilifying him on social media also won’t do much. He’s obviously not racist, just misjudged, a bit of naivety and ignorance. All that will do is just move him to further defiance. Education can go far and the FA should simply sort out a quick session explaining why the tweet shouldn’t have been made and the reasons for that, perhaps with Mendy there too.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
One more point. I get that the original tweet Bernardo posted was of comparing mendy to some cartoon cereal character. That in itself isn’t bad..I’m aware Luiz for instance is compared to Sideshow Bob, and I love to compare Welbeck when he had his high top to the black kid from Recess. However that particular character that Bernardo compared him to, you can’t escape the fact that it just looks very similar to historical caricatures of black people used to make fun of their appearances. And whether Bernardo knew about it or not, this company has released advertisements such as this one with that character that just wouldn’t be kosher today, for obvious reasons:
https://twitter.com/cheapshirt/status/1176751832682643456?s=21
Again, a fine isn’t going to make Bernardo see stuff like this, if he didn’t already. But quick education on the history of hurtful/demeaning caricatures of black people would go a long way to both stop something like this happening again but also for him to actually understand the issue.
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's an appearance thing. It's not for me to say if a person with black skin finds that offensive but surely not?
I mean my wife wears naked tights. Surely there is a version of naked tights for a person with black skin. Probably a crap example but I'm sure you get the point.
Would a black person find it offensive is the question. Not for me to say but I don't see it.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's an appearance thing. It's not for me to say if a person with black skin finds that offensive but surely not?
I mean my wife wears naked tights. Surely there is a version of naked tights for a person with black skin. Probably a crap example but I'm sure you get the point.
Would a black person find it offensive is the question. Not for me to say but I don't see it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As I’ve said, “offensive” or not, if you make a public joke about a black man that is literally about his blackness, don’t expect the joke to end there. It’s as simple as that.
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's an appearance thing. It's not for me to say if a person with black skin finds that offensive but surely not?
I mean my wife wears naked tights. Surely there is a version of naked tights for a person with black skin. Probably a crap example but I'm sure you get the point.
Would a black person find it offensive is the question. Not for me to say but I don't see it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As I’ve said, “offensive” or not, if you make a public joke about a black man that is literally about his blackness, don’t expect the joke to end there. It’s as simple as that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah have to agree with that. Stupidity to make a public joke like that that in person I don't believe somebody would find offensive.
I do believe that we have to get to a point where that isn't offensive where we can see different appearances, not find it taboo to talk and joke about it. But yeah, we aren't at that point yet.
All this crap I don't see colour when I talk to somebody is nonsense. You see appearance, it's about accepting it as normal and of course equal.
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Where do you draw a line on racism
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posted on 27/9/19
I don't think Bernardo Silva was being deliberately racist, and he obviously didn't mean harm by it but it's a lazy and ignorant joke to make. It's not asking much to appreciate someone - even for banter's sake - for more than the colour of their skin.
Most players are idiots who barely made it through school. Education is the answer here, surely Kick It Out has some kind of program? A fine would be pointless and he won't understand why he's being punished anyway.
posted on 27/9/19
It’s just an absurd thing to say in this day and age.
He deserves a fine/slap just for being so stupid.
posted on 27/9/19
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 7 minutes ago
I don't think Bernardo Silva was being deliberately racist, and he obviously didn't mean harm by it but it's a lazy and ignorant joke to make. It's not asking much to appreciate someone - even for banter's sake - for more than the colour of their skin.
Most players are idiots who barely made it through school. Education is the answer here, surely Kick It Out has some kind of program? A fine would be pointless and he won't understand why he's being punished anyway.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its not lazy or ignorant. Its the PC gone mad brigade.
posted on 27/9/19
Its not lazy or ignorant. Its the PC gone mad brigade.
---
Na you're right. It's obviously a well-thought out, witty joke that the snowflakes just don't understand.
posted on 27/9/19
Loads of multi ethnic groups have racist/stereotypical "banter" tbh. I'm part of a couple myself.
Is it wrong? Probably. As long as everyone knows it's in jest, can give and take it, then is there really any harm done?
Bullying individuals in a group is very different though, but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
posted on 27/9/19
I’d draw the line slightly to the left..
posted on 27/9/19
https://www.kickitout.org/equality-and-diversity-awareness-course
posted on 27/9/19
Sounds like more of a criticism of the quality level of joke which then determines the level of racism from some of you.
posted on 27/9/19
I think this is the kind of thing that should be kept as a private joke between friends. Obviously it can be taken to be offensive and I wouldn’t encourage it but being real here, this is the sort of banter that goes on a lot between people who have an understanding of each other and know what lines to cross and not. I’m not saying it’s right and for people in the public eye, it’s probably best to stay well away from this kind of banter.
posted on 27/9/19
comment by 1 Father - 1 Love - 2 Reds (U13312)
posted 58 minutes ago
I think this is the kind of thing that should be kept as a private joke between friends. Obviously it can be taken to be offensive and I wouldn’t encourage it but being real here, this is the sort of banter that goes on a lot between people who have an understanding of each other and know what lines to cross and not. I’m not saying it’s right and for people in the public eye, it’s probably best to stay well away from this kind of banter.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nutshell
posted on 27/9/19
comment by 1 Father - 1 Love - 2 Reds (U13312)
posted 1 hour, 7 minutes ago
I think this is the kind of thing that should be kept as a private joke between friends. Obviously it can be taken to be offensive and I wouldn’t encourage it but being real here, this is the sort of banter that goes on a lot between people who have an understanding of each other and know what lines to cross and not. I’m not saying it’s right and for people in the public eye, it’s probably best to stay well away from this kind of banter.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Yup that's it
posted on 28/9/19
I don't get it. What is he saying?
posted on 28/9/19
I’m black, and agree with the notion that this kind of banter and joke is fine between friends, as long as you’re sure with each other that the other person is fine with it. But I would never post stuff like that on social media. Would anyone ever think of posting stuff like hat on their own Facebook or Twitter? And Bernardo did it with 1000s of followers.
The original tweet with that cereal character falls under a similar thing. Some people mention culture difference - that in Portugal it is more acceptable to make jokes like that publicly. Is that really ok? Or if it’s done to a stranger?
A fine is the wrong way to go about it though. Vilifying him on social media also won’t do much. He’s obviously not racist, just misjudged, a bit of naivety and ignorance. All that will do is just move him to further defiance. Education can go far and the FA should simply sort out a quick session explaining why the tweet shouldn’t have been made and the reasons for that, perhaps with Mendy there too.
posted on 28/9/19
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
posted on 28/9/19
One more point. I get that the original tweet Bernardo posted was of comparing mendy to some cartoon cereal character. That in itself isn’t bad..I’m aware Luiz for instance is compared to Sideshow Bob, and I love to compare Welbeck when he had his high top to the black kid from Recess. However that particular character that Bernardo compared him to, you can’t escape the fact that it just looks very similar to historical caricatures of black people used to make fun of their appearances. And whether Bernardo knew about it or not, this company has released advertisements such as this one with that character that just wouldn’t be kosher today, for obvious reasons:
https://twitter.com/cheapshirt/status/1176751832682643456?s=21
Again, a fine isn’t going to make Bernardo see stuff like this, if he didn’t already. But quick education on the history of hurtful/demeaning caricatures of black people would go a long way to both stop something like this happening again but also for him to actually understand the issue.
posted on 28/9/19
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's an appearance thing. It's not for me to say if a person with black skin finds that offensive but surely not?
I mean my wife wears naked tights. Surely there is a version of naked tights for a person with black skin. Probably a crap example but I'm sure you get the point.
Would a black person find it offensive is the question. Not for me to say but I don't see it.
posted on 28/9/19
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's an appearance thing. It's not for me to say if a person with black skin finds that offensive but surely not?
I mean my wife wears naked tights. Surely there is a version of naked tights for a person with black skin. Probably a crap example but I'm sure you get the point.
Would a black person find it offensive is the question. Not for me to say but I don't see it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As I’ve said, “offensive” or not, if you make a public joke about a black man that is literally about his blackness, don’t expect the joke to end there. It’s as simple as that.
posted on 28/9/19
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 3 hours, 32 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 41 minutes ago
I don't get it. What is he saying?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In this one (which I have to admit I haven’t seen), he’s apparently saying that a black man in black clothes is “naked” as the colour of the clothes is indistinguishable from that of his skin.
Not the worst thing in the world, of course, but how he thought making twitter jokes about a black man’s blackness would be uncontroversial is beyond me. Where’s he been?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's an appearance thing. It's not for me to say if a person with black skin finds that offensive but surely not?
I mean my wife wears naked tights. Surely there is a version of naked tights for a person with black skin. Probably a crap example but I'm sure you get the point.
Would a black person find it offensive is the question. Not for me to say but I don't see it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As I’ve said, “offensive” or not, if you make a public joke about a black man that is literally about his blackness, don’t expect the joke to end there. It’s as simple as that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah have to agree with that. Stupidity to make a public joke like that that in person I don't believe somebody would find offensive.
I do believe that we have to get to a point where that isn't offensive where we can see different appearances, not find it taboo to talk and joke about it. But yeah, we aren't at that point yet.
All this crap I don't see colour when I talk to somebody is nonsense. You see appearance, it's about accepting it as normal and of course equal.
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