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Will we get another chance?

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posted on 27/7/20

Will you get another chance? Of course you will. All this season showed you is that you're a very good team when everything is going well, both in terms of quality of player and tactics. Really enjoyed the football you were playing in the first half of the season. The stoppage really did damage to you as you then got a load of injuries all at once, whilst other teams got injured players back.

I don't believe you would have finished outside of the top four if you didn't have those injuries all at once, in the end. Even against United yesterday you were missing four first team players, three of which make up your back five. Your most creative player in Maddison. Chilwell, Soyuncu, Perreira and Maddison is a massive loss for you as you simply don't have the players to come in, without a big drop in quality.

Ultimately when you have a weaker squad, you need a bit of luck. This summer should be spent trying to make sure you don't have such a massive drop in quality.

posted on 27/7/20

I think you will struggle for top 6 over the next few years. Midtable team for the next few years i think.

posted on 27/7/20

Anybody who's happy with the dramatic free fall during the second half of the season is not a winner, and that's makes me doubt Rodgers more and fear for the start of next season if the slump problem is not arrested.

Players were out of form even before the injuries, Maddison had 20 hours of football without creating a goal scoring chance or scoring a goal himself and so on. Something is not right at the moment and the earlier it's identified and addressed the better.

posted on 27/7/20

The simple answer is: Not next year. I reckon the top 4 is sewn up next year between the current top 4; Spurs will surely implode at some point under Mourinho and Arsenal simply don't have the standard of players they used to - although both will surely amass more points next season than they have this. Not only will top 4 be far less accessible next season, so will Europa League.

I think the thing to take from next season will likely be for the club to learn another lesson about how to incorporate European competition into their usual league responsibilities. There are some players who need to (and have the room to) improve in certain areas too, so there will be individual challenges as well. In many ways it feels like it's going to be one step forward, one step backward.

posted on 27/7/20

I get where you are coming from, but I think you are underestimating the amount of youngsters that have been involved for us compared to every other team and how this affects momentum, experience, fatigue and belief. We definitely need to invest to ‘work towards’ regularly challenging for the top 4 but let’s get our core 11 back together first and add to and work on our experience within the team. We ran out of steam, possibly this would have happened with a full strength team because of the youngsters that we have. I’m not sure we can really have it both ways, you critique the squad for saying there is only one world class player and accept this will affect us over the course of a season or you have higher expectations of some of the other players and feel disappointed with what has happened. I imagine most of us sit somewhere in between but it seems a little unfair to pick out all of the reasons why and where we are lacking to mean we can’t challenge for top 4, but then have top 4 as an expectation.

If we’d finished 4th we would have had CL for one season guaranteed. Any criticisms would still be there and still be valid - this wouldn’t have changed because of a different result over 90 mins against Man United.

There is an argument by concentrating so much on top 4 and suggesting this was our only chance and this was only because other teams were rubbish would really damage morale. I think we need to concentrate on the improvements needed to make us a better squad rather than thinking about one season where we could have made top 4. If we get going next year, I honestly think the disappointment of this end to the season will pass quickly. And of course, that is what we all want as I’m sure we all have experienced regret, over analysing the past, not looking forward etc. We need to find the positives to help progress particularly the younger players but I’m sure this is exactly what the management and coaching team will try to do and is exactly the reason Rodger’s didn’t show devastation during interviews recently.

If we get our full team back and they still aren’t performing and the youngsters don’t progress, then obviously it’s different predicament. But let’s give them that chance

posted on 27/7/20

comment by NijaFox (U21877)
posted 16 minutes ago
Anybody who's happy with the dramatic free fall during the second half of the season is not a winner, and that's makes me doubt Rodgers more and fear for the start of next season if the slump problem is not arrested.

Players were out of form even before the injuries, Maddison had 20 hours of football without creating a goal scoring chance or scoring a goal himself and so on. Something is not right at the moment and the earlier it's identified and addressed the better.
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I agree. I don't think problem is just injuries or poor form, I think there's something deeper. There's a mental fragility within this team that wasn't in the 15/16 team. We're a bit, dare I say...Spursy? How many of the big, pressure games did we actually win this season? We lost to Liverpool, City and United twice, didn't beat Chelsea, lost a cup semi and a cup QF. That's not the hallmarks of a team that is a serious contender for top 4 finishes and trophers, it's the hallmarks of a team of bottlers.

Rodgers hasn't helped matters IMO. Far too negative, far too content in recent media interviews, far too eager to talk us down rather than talk us up. The 'Little Leicester' act doesn't work as well as he thinks it does when we still have players in the squad who literally won the title 4 years ago.

posted on 27/7/20

There's a mental fragility within this team that wasn't in the 15/16 team.

Completely agree with this and I don't think it's a coincidence that we have so many younger players in at a time that this has become apparent.

posted on 27/7/20

I'm not sure Rodgers quite knows how to define us. One moment he's talking us up as competing with Liverpool for the title, then when that crashes after heavy defeats to them and Man City he goes completely the other way and starting rattling out Puel-esque comments about how we can't compete against the giants. At least he didn't go as far as claiming we can't compete against the might of Wolverhampton Wanderers, which pretty much condemned Puel.

I think he needs to see us as a growing club and a work in progress, and indeed a team lacking leadership at times. It seemed to come as a genuine surprise to him when we capitulated against Bournemouth when I've felt that mental weakness had been evident for months.

posted on 27/7/20

"I think you are underestimating the amount of youngsters that have been involved for us compared to every other team and how this affects momentum, experience, fatigue and belief"

You see, this is the problem; both Chelsea and Man Utd used this season to blood youngsters this year.

Chelsea: Mount, James, Tomori, Hudson-Odoi, Gilmour.

Man Utd: Greenwood, Williams, James, Wan-Bissaka

All of these players were playing either their first or second season in the Premier League. Many were playing in the Championship last year.

Of course we also have youngsters, but we also have vastly experienced players like Schmeichel, Vardy, Evans, etc.

They also had players like Pulisic and Fernandes who were playing their first season in the Premier League. Soyuncu, Tielemans and others had already had games last season.

There really wasn't that much difference between us and Chelsea/Man Utd in terms of experience within their squad. They also had virtually novice managers compared to ours.

posted on 27/7/20

Agree with that also Dm. I have a feeling Rodger's has either merged or misunderstood the team spirit and unity we have after recent positive and tragic events with leadership and mental strength when the pressure is on.

posted on 27/7/20

"One moment he's talking us up as competing with Liverpool for the title, then when that crashes after heavy defeats to them and Man City he goes completely the other way and starting rattling out Puel-esque comments about how we can't compete against the giants."

Yep, this is spot on Dunge. It's this kind of inconsistency that drives fans (and presumably players too) mad. You can't big us up and then knock us back down when it suits. Feels more like Rodgers trying to protect his own back and deflect criticism.

posted on 27/7/20

Liverpool utilised 2 players 24 or under on a regular basis.

Man City utilised 2 players 24 or under on a regular basis.

Chelsea utilised 3 or 4 players 24 or under on a regular basis.

Man U utilised 6 24 or under and several of these were already experienced at Pl level.

Leicester, out of necessity on occasions, have used between 8 and 10, in fact there has been occasions where 80% of our outfielder players have been 24 or under and inexperienced.

There is no club that has come close and this (look at all of the squads, its between 1 and 4 and often as subs or in supporting roles out of the limelight) was raved about by pundits in the first half of the season, more than once I read that we have one of the most exciting group of young prospects in the league. But this comes at a cost.

This hasn't been a season of blooding youngsters as the injuries started to hit, it has been sink or swim at times for them. It's immense pressure. And as we've said, we haven't had the experienced quality or leadership to support this.

posted on 27/7/20

Ok, so to be controversial, I don’t think our club can compete regularly for the top 4. I think our ambition ‘should’ be Europe and domestic cup competitions.

Unless we rip up the blue print, and start spending more heavily on experienced and proven pros, it’s not possible to compete with the heavyweights and their big budgets. I don’t want us to rip up this blue print - it’s seen us win the league and challenge for the top 4. What more can we genuinely want from our club?

The risks are too high of it goes wrong. So for me I’m happy for us to build sustainabily, steadly and in line with a long term plan. If that results in top 10 finishes, Europe and good progression in the cup (my god imagine if we actually won the FA Cup) then that is success for us.

So, does that make it even more fitting we didn’t take our chance for top 4. That was our once in a lifetime chance for a club of our size*. That’s why it hurts today, because that was “our chance” and we blew it.



* except for the other once in a lifetime chance where we went and won the league, but I still don’t believe that happened.

posted on 27/7/20

* even more gutting. Not fitting. It was befitting our form no doubt!

comment by IfUNo (U4755)

posted on 27/7/20

Delighted that the Snake Rodgers failled. Karma is a b!tch

posted on 27/7/20

I think you are right Mersey. It is gutting. But we just need to make sure we don't combine the idea of getting 'top 4' in a particular season with the expectation of being a 'top 4 club'. One is a one off chance in a given season and the other is a very long term goal.

posted on 27/7/20

"I'm not sure Rodgers quite knows how to define us. One moment he's talking us up as competing with Liverpool for the title"

Which is understandable as nobody had you up there competing and then when you were, expectations needed to be adjusted. After the poor run of form this then needed adjusted again. It would have been pretty stupid to talk you up competing for the title when you're nowhere near and in poor form.

posted on 27/7/20

Mersey; I don't disagree with a lot of what you say. There's certainly advantages of tasking a sustainable, slow and steady approach rather than spending tons of money ala Man City.

But one person who I think may disagree with you is Top. I think he is fiercely ambitions and wants us to be top 4 regulars. He's spoken about wanting us to be 'perfect' and to build on his father's legacy. You don't get perfection with 10th place finishes or spending half a season in relegation form.

It's why I think Rodgers' comments about us not being able to compete might be potentially dangerous territory for him. It undermines what Top is trying to achieve. You don't build an £80m training ground which will be one of the best in Europe and then write off your own chances of competing. And you can't on one hand say to perspective signings and sponsors "please come to us, we want to be a successful club" and on the other say "but don't expect us to finish above Man Utd, that's unrealistic".

At some point the aspiration of the owner and the realism of the manager are going to have to move in sync with each other, or there will be a parting of the ways.

posted on 27/7/20

comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 10 minutes ago
"I'm not sure Rodgers quite knows how to define us. One moment he's talking us up as competing with Liverpool for the title"

Which is understandable as nobody had you up there competing and then when you were, expectations needed to be adjusted. After the poor run of form this then needed adjusted again. It would have been pretty stupid to talk you up competing for the title when you're nowhere near and in poor form.
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I think the issue is that we went from saying that we could compete with Liverpool (I don't think he genuinely meant it but it's on record), to then saying we can't possibly compete with Manchester United, who are considerably weaker than Liverpool are. It's inconsistent and makes him look both silly and also that he is protecting himself against criticism for our second half collapse.

posted on 27/7/20

comment by Foxello (U6985)
posted 12 minutes ago
Mersey; I don't disagree with a lot of what you say. There's certainly advantages of tasking a sustainable, slow and steady approach rather than spending tons of money ala Man City.

But one person who I think may disagree with you is Top. I think he is fiercely ambitions and wants us to be top 4 regulars. He's spoken about wanting us to be 'perfect' and to build on his father's legacy. You don't get perfection with 10th place finishes or spending half a season in relegation form.

It's why I think Rodgers' comments about us not being able to compete might be potentially dangerous territory for him. It undermines what Top is trying to achieve. You don't build an £80m training ground which will be one of the best in Europe and then write off your own chances of competing. And you can't on one hand say to perspective signings and sponsors "please come to us, we want to be a successful club" and on the other say "but don't expect us to finish above Man Utd, that's unrealistic".

At some point the aspiration of the owner and the realism of the manager are going to have to move in sync with each other, or there will be a parting of the ways.
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I think you can just about get away with it if you're trying to foster a sense of underdog/team spirit, kind of like Sean Dyche has at Burnley. But you shouldn't go about saying it in a "woe is us", excuse sort of way. It just drags down confidence.

posted on 27/7/20

There’s a balance of putting too much pressure and expectation on a young squad, and giving belief and confidence to a young squad.

I think this is where a lot of us feel Rodgers May have not quite got it right.

posted on 27/7/20

comment by Foxello (U6985)
posted 3 hours, 12 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 10 minutes ago
"I'm not sure Rodgers quite knows how to define us. One moment he's talking us up as competing with Liverpool for the title"

Which is understandable as nobody had you up there competing and then when you were, expectations needed to be adjusted. After the poor run of form this then needed adjusted again. It would have been pretty stupid to talk you up competing for the title when you're nowhere near and in poor form.
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I think the issue is that we went from saying that we could compete with Liverpool (I don't think he genuinely meant it but it's on record), to then saying we can't possibly compete with Manchester United, who are considerably weaker than Liverpool are. It's inconsistent and makes him look both silly and also that he is protecting himself against criticism for our second half collapse.
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I'd like to see those quotes.

I could only find this.

"We sit outside the so-called bigger clubs but where we sit in the table will make people sit up and take notice," Rodgers said.

"There's also the style in which we play and hopefully that's a marker for players to want to be a part of it.

"Our mission has always been clear, we want to play European football and of course the best players want to play in those competitions.

"I think people can look at ourselves and see how we work and how we play, they will know about the recent history of Leicester. It can be a fantastic club to come and work for. We're playing a style of football where players will improve.

"With the training facility and progress we're making, it's a really exciting prospect."

posted on 27/7/20

The quote I am referring to is from a post match television interview yesterday where he says "we don't have the resources to compete with Manchester United".

comment by angelx (U11102)

posted on 27/7/20

SIX wins in last 20 games.Bye Bye Brendan

posted on 27/7/20

comment by angelx (U11102)
posted 2 hours, 48 minutes ago
SIX wins in last 20 games.Bye Bye Brendan
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Eddie Howe? Who would come here?

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