we'd just sign big on a CB as Jose would demand it
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
How many Leeds players do you think get into our team?
Cannot believe some of our fans still defend Mourinho.
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 13 minutes ago
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The tactics last night (more so than the result) were the final straw for me.
After the Brighton performance the minimum requirement last night was to show some attacking ambition from the get go yet Jose set us up to be ultra defensive again.
Its downright weird because it has been proved to him over and over again that this won't work because we always concede but he still puts faith in a failing system.
comment by Islington Spur (U18857)
posted 42 minutes ago
comment by Tottenham Chronic (U3423)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Islington Spur (U18857)
posted 48 seconds ago
Spot on. This is how I see this current situation. There are too many average players. Our midfield is still lightweight and our defence not trustworthy. I really don't want to see another management change. We have to be patient and trust we can turn this around. that's how I feel.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
really? you are a very patient man... what i am seeing is the worst i have EVER seen.. and i am a product of mid 90s spurs when we were a big pile of poo. give me that any day. joke at the back but at least we had a philosophy... attack...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I completely respect what you're saying. We're awful at the moment. The late 90s were painful too. I don't think you can compare the club to where we are now. The club is a completely different profile. Back in November we had a style and it was working. I'm suggesting we back the coach and squad to turn things around. I don't want another upheaval and new project. I'm not convinced that any of the coaches suggested are available or we could get right now. Why not give it until the end of the season?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I admire your patience but to me the failings you mentioned in defence and midfield in your first post are largely to do with fear, indecision and an unsettled starting 11.
All of those things are Jose's responsibility.
He's absolutely obsessed with player responsibility out of possession. If you concede the ball and you're not near your defensive position on the pitch, he'll go mad. That makes players fear coming out, being brave on the ball. It actually makes players prefer to not have it at all which is what we're seeing now. It also explains why Jose says he's not telling them to sit off. I think the players are doing as a consequence of his instructions. He's not doing it directly. There was only one player showing for the ball last night and that was Hojbjerg. They don't want the ball as they don't want to suffer the wrath when it all goes wrong. It's a lack of confidence made entirely by Jose's archaic instructions.
They're not the bad players as you've suggested. They're good players unable to express themselves fully under Jose's tutelage. Keeping him on will not change that. I completely understand waiting until summer. I agree, we can't really get anyone before that but if I were in charge I'd be banging on the front doors of RB Leipzig by the end of May. Or Leicester. Or Brighton. Any progressive manager would do for me.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I'd ignore those player comparisons earlier in the thread. With less depth than we have now Poch got us to the final of the CL and a top 4 finish. We have't sold anyone we didn't want to other than Eriksen since that time so that argument doesn't hold up.
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 57 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 13 minutes ago
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The tactics last night (more so than the result) were the final straw for me.
After the Brighton performance the minimum requirement last night was to show some attacking ambition from the get go yet Jose set us up to be ultra defensive again.
Its downright weird because it has been proved to him over and over again that this won't work because we always concede but he still puts faith in a failing system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The thing is we were doing this more often than not before; showing some attacking intent, taking a lead, and that's when we sat off. Now we're just sitting off even when we don't have a lead. I thought it might have been due to a lack of confidence in the players but in the second half we did at least put more attacking effort in, so you know it has to partly be down to tactics.
When you know it's proven to not work and the defence can't stop avoiding clean sheets it's madness to keep at it.
What's that Einstein quote about trying the same thing twice when it didn't work the first time again?
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 57 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 13 minutes ago
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The tactics last night (more so than the result) were the final straw for me.
After the Brighton performance the minimum requirement last night was to show some attacking ambition from the get go yet Jose set us up to be ultra defensive again.
Its downright weird because it has been proved to him over and over again that this won't work because we always concede but he still puts faith in a failing system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The thing is we were doing this more often than not before; showing some attacking intent, taking a lead, and that's when we sat off. Now we're just sitting off even when we don't have a lead. I thought it might have been due to a lack of confidence in the players but in the second half we did at least put more attacking effort in, so you know it has to partly be down to tactics.
When you know it's proven to not work and the defence can't stop avoiding clean sheets it's madness to keep at it.
What's that Einstein quote about trying the same thing twice when it didn't work the first time again?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yep definition of madness but Mou won't learn he will never change time to move on over to you Levy.
That wasn't actually Einstein. Common misquote. Doesn't change the fact that it's true though.
As for Mourinho, I honestly think he just wants his severance payoff early this time round
Now I know why Poch used the phrase 'brave on the ball' in every post-match interview. Now we're seeing how important it is.
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
comment by (U22540)
posted 34 seconds ago
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope Levy was watching Premier League Tonight on BT Sport last night. Steve Sidwell is a youth team coach and he explained their current approach in terms of, not just manager, but club philosophy. They decided early on through Dan Ashworth to develop an attacking brand of football after the Chris Hughton sacking. They decided their approach and then chose a manger to fit in Graham Potter. That meant a change of process from youth to first team. If Potter were to get sacked or find a better job, the process would be the same. It means every player whether they're 13 or 30 has a clear idea of how Brighton play. It's not new. Ajax do it, Barcelona do it and other clubs are now following suit.
We should be doing the same.
We had it right with Poch but obviously that did probably come to a natural conclusion after 5 years. Where we went wrong was to shift the club philosophy entirely. You can't jump from a club based on progressive, ball-playing expansive football to suddenly ultra defensive win at any cost ruthlessness. We should have replaced progressive with progressive as that's what the club stands for. The problem right now is Mourinho but the real issue is deeper than that. We need to commit to a philosophy first and then determine who we get in to fit that philosophy.
Our squad hasn’t deteriorated - it’s better than it was in 16/17 while the starting XI is worse.
The op is a bit ridiculous: Dembele is now Sissoko - Eriksen is now Lamela.
Would be like me saying: Ndombele now is Stambouli then and Bergwijn now is Njie then
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 42 minutes ago
comment by (U22540)
posted 34 seconds ago
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope Levy was watching Premier League Tonight on BT Sport last night. Steve Sidwell is a youth team coach and he explained their current approach in terms of, not just manager, but club philosophy. They decided early on through Dan Ashworth to develop an attacking brand of football after the Chris Hughton sacking. They decided their approach and then chose a manger to fit in Graham Potter. That meant a change of process from youth to first team. If Potter were to get sacked or find a better job, the process would be the same. It means every player whether they're 13 or 30 has a clear idea of how Brighton play. It's not new. Ajax do it, Barcelona do it and other clubs are now following suit.
We should be doing the same.
We had it right with Poch but obviously that did probably come to a natural conclusion after 5 years. Where we went wrong was to shift the club philosophy entirely. You can't jump from a club based on progressive, ball-playing expansive football to suddenly ultra defensive win at any cost ruthlessness. We should have replaced progressive with progressive as that's what the club stands for. The problem right now is Mourinho but the real issue is deeper than that. We need to commit to a philosophy first and then determine who we get in to fit that philosophy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Good post. Common sense really. The issue is Levy being a Mourinho fan boy.
... Is Wahl Levy?
ENIC have left us with a squad consisting of Aurier, Doherty, Sanchez, Dier, Davies, Sissoko, Winks and Lucas, none of them are good enough to play in a Mourinho team.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by ● Billy The Yidd ● 2020* 2021* (U3924)
posted 28 minutes ago
ENIC have left us with a squad consisting of Aurier, Doherty, Sanchez, Dier, Davies, Sissoko, Winks and Lucas, none of them are good enough to play in a Mourinho team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Loads of the played in pochettino teams that got top 4 and played nice football
All the current top 4 sides have squads full of average players
This one's on Jose
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 3 hours, 30 minutes ago
comment by (U22540)
posted 34 seconds ago
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope Levy was watching Premier League Tonight on BT Sport last night. Steve Sidwell is a youth team coach and he explained their current approach in terms of, not just manager, but club philosophy. They decided early on through Dan Ashworth to develop an attacking brand of football after the Chris Hughton sacking. They decided their approach and then chose a manger to fit in Graham Potter. That meant a change of process from youth to first team. If Potter were to get sacked or find a better job, the process would be the same. It means every player whether they're 13 or 30 has a clear idea of how Brighton play. It's not new. Ajax do it, Barcelona do it and other clubs are now following suit.
We should be doing the same.
We had it right with Poch but obviously that did probably come to a natural conclusion after 5 years. Where we went wrong was to shift the club philosophy entirely. You can't jump from a club based on progressive, ball-playing expansive football to suddenly ultra defensive win at any cost ruthlessness. We should have replaced progressive with progressive as that's what the club stands for. The problem right now is Mourinho but the real issue is deeper than that. We need to commit to a philosophy first and then determine who we get in to fit that philosophy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Spot on mate
Sign in if you want to comment
Let's have a go!!!
Page 2 of 2
posted on 5/2/21
we'd just sign big on a CB as Jose would demand it
posted on 5/2/21
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
posted on 5/2/21
1
posted on 5/2/21
How many Leeds players do you think get into our team?
posted on 5/2/21
Cannot believe some of our fans still defend Mourinho.
posted on 5/2/21
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 13 minutes ago
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The tactics last night (more so than the result) were the final straw for me.
After the Brighton performance the minimum requirement last night was to show some attacking ambition from the get go yet Jose set us up to be ultra defensive again.
Its downright weird because it has been proved to him over and over again that this won't work because we always concede but he still puts faith in a failing system.
posted on 5/2/21
comment by Islington Spur (U18857)
posted 42 minutes ago
comment by Tottenham Chronic (U3423)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Islington Spur (U18857)
posted 48 seconds ago
Spot on. This is how I see this current situation. There are too many average players. Our midfield is still lightweight and our defence not trustworthy. I really don't want to see another management change. We have to be patient and trust we can turn this around. that's how I feel.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
really? you are a very patient man... what i am seeing is the worst i have EVER seen.. and i am a product of mid 90s spurs when we were a big pile of poo. give me that any day. joke at the back but at least we had a philosophy... attack...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I completely respect what you're saying. We're awful at the moment. The late 90s were painful too. I don't think you can compare the club to where we are now. The club is a completely different profile. Back in November we had a style and it was working. I'm suggesting we back the coach and squad to turn things around. I don't want another upheaval and new project. I'm not convinced that any of the coaches suggested are available or we could get right now. Why not give it until the end of the season?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I admire your patience but to me the failings you mentioned in defence and midfield in your first post are largely to do with fear, indecision and an unsettled starting 11.
All of those things are Jose's responsibility.
He's absolutely obsessed with player responsibility out of possession. If you concede the ball and you're not near your defensive position on the pitch, he'll go mad. That makes players fear coming out, being brave on the ball. It actually makes players prefer to not have it at all which is what we're seeing now. It also explains why Jose says he's not telling them to sit off. I think the players are doing as a consequence of his instructions. He's not doing it directly. There was only one player showing for the ball last night and that was Hojbjerg. They don't want the ball as they don't want to suffer the wrath when it all goes wrong. It's a lack of confidence made entirely by Jose's archaic instructions.
They're not the bad players as you've suggested. They're good players unable to express themselves fully under Jose's tutelage. Keeping him on will not change that. I completely understand waiting until summer. I agree, we can't really get anyone before that but if I were in charge I'd be banging on the front doors of RB Leipzig by the end of May. Or Leicester. Or Brighton. Any progressive manager would do for me.
posted on 5/2/21
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 5/2/21
I'd ignore those player comparisons earlier in the thread. With less depth than we have now Poch got us to the final of the CL and a top 4 finish. We have't sold anyone we didn't want to other than Eriksen since that time so that argument doesn't hold up.
posted on 5/2/21
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 57 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 13 minutes ago
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The tactics last night (more so than the result) were the final straw for me.
After the Brighton performance the minimum requirement last night was to show some attacking ambition from the get go yet Jose set us up to be ultra defensive again.
Its downright weird because it has been proved to him over and over again that this won't work because we always concede but he still puts faith in a failing system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The thing is we were doing this more often than not before; showing some attacking intent, taking a lead, and that's when we sat off. Now we're just sitting off even when we don't have a lead. I thought it might have been due to a lack of confidence in the players but in the second half we did at least put more attacking effort in, so you know it has to partly be down to tactics.
When you know it's proven to not work and the defence can't stop avoiding clean sheets it's madness to keep at it.
What's that Einstein quote about trying the same thing twice when it didn't work the first time again?
posted on 5/2/21
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 57 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 13 minutes ago
Going to be hard for Jose to turn anything around when he is so stubborn with his negative tactics and is starting to lose the faith and trust of the players. He will put what's going wrong down to not having the quality of player or something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The tactics last night (more so than the result) were the final straw for me.
After the Brighton performance the minimum requirement last night was to show some attacking ambition from the get go yet Jose set us up to be ultra defensive again.
Its downright weird because it has been proved to him over and over again that this won't work because we always concede but he still puts faith in a failing system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The thing is we were doing this more often than not before; showing some attacking intent, taking a lead, and that's when we sat off. Now we're just sitting off even when we don't have a lead. I thought it might have been due to a lack of confidence in the players but in the second half we did at least put more attacking effort in, so you know it has to partly be down to tactics.
When you know it's proven to not work and the defence can't stop avoiding clean sheets it's madness to keep at it.
What's that Einstein quote about trying the same thing twice when it didn't work the first time again?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yep definition of madness but Mou won't learn he will never change time to move on over to you Levy.
posted on 5/2/21
That wasn't actually Einstein. Common misquote. Doesn't change the fact that it's true though.
As for Mourinho, I honestly think he just wants his severance payoff early this time round
posted on 5/2/21
Now I know why Poch used the phrase 'brave on the ball' in every post-match interview. Now we're seeing how important it is.
posted on 5/2/21
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
posted on 5/2/21
comment by (U22540)
posted 34 seconds ago
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope Levy was watching Premier League Tonight on BT Sport last night. Steve Sidwell is a youth team coach and he explained their current approach in terms of, not just manager, but club philosophy. They decided early on through Dan Ashworth to develop an attacking brand of football after the Chris Hughton sacking. They decided their approach and then chose a manger to fit in Graham Potter. That meant a change of process from youth to first team. If Potter were to get sacked or find a better job, the process would be the same. It means every player whether they're 13 or 30 has a clear idea of how Brighton play. It's not new. Ajax do it, Barcelona do it and other clubs are now following suit.
We should be doing the same.
We had it right with Poch but obviously that did probably come to a natural conclusion after 5 years. Where we went wrong was to shift the club philosophy entirely. You can't jump from a club based on progressive, ball-playing expansive football to suddenly ultra defensive win at any cost ruthlessness. We should have replaced progressive with progressive as that's what the club stands for. The problem right now is Mourinho but the real issue is deeper than that. We need to commit to a philosophy first and then determine who we get in to fit that philosophy.
posted on 5/2/21
Our squad hasn’t deteriorated - it’s better than it was in 16/17 while the starting XI is worse.
The op is a bit ridiculous: Dembele is now Sissoko - Eriksen is now Lamela.
Would be like me saying: Ndombele now is Stambouli then and Bergwijn now is Njie then
posted on 5/2/21
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 42 minutes ago
comment by (U22540)
posted 34 seconds ago
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope Levy was watching Premier League Tonight on BT Sport last night. Steve Sidwell is a youth team coach and he explained their current approach in terms of, not just manager, but club philosophy. They decided early on through Dan Ashworth to develop an attacking brand of football after the Chris Hughton sacking. They decided their approach and then chose a manger to fit in Graham Potter. That meant a change of process from youth to first team. If Potter were to get sacked or find a better job, the process would be the same. It means every player whether they're 13 or 30 has a clear idea of how Brighton play. It's not new. Ajax do it, Barcelona do it and other clubs are now following suit.
We should be doing the same.
We had it right with Poch but obviously that did probably come to a natural conclusion after 5 years. Where we went wrong was to shift the club philosophy entirely. You can't jump from a club based on progressive, ball-playing expansive football to suddenly ultra defensive win at any cost ruthlessness. We should have replaced progressive with progressive as that's what the club stands for. The problem right now is Mourinho but the real issue is deeper than that. We need to commit to a philosophy first and then determine who we get in to fit that philosophy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Good post. Common sense really. The issue is Levy being a Mourinho fan boy.
... Is Wahl Levy?
posted on 5/2/21
ENIC have left us with a squad consisting of Aurier, Doherty, Sanchez, Dier, Davies, Sissoko, Winks and Lucas, none of them are good enough to play in a Mourinho team.
posted on 5/2/21
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 5/2/21
comment by ● Billy The Yidd ● 2020* 2021* (U3924)
posted 28 minutes ago
ENIC have left us with a squad consisting of Aurier, Doherty, Sanchez, Dier, Davies, Sissoko, Winks and Lucas, none of them are good enough to play in a Mourinho team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Loads of the played in pochettino teams that got top 4 and played nice football
All the current top 4 sides have squads full of average players
This one's on Jose
posted on 5/2/21
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 3 hours, 30 minutes ago
comment by (U22540)
posted 34 seconds ago
A reminder of what the Supporters Trust said when Mou was appointed
"The club must ensure it does not find itself in the same position in two or three years' time, and we need to hear from the executive board what the long-term thinking behind this appointment is."
Very wise indeed although didnt take a genius to work out what would happen. As for long term thinking oh dear.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hope Levy was watching Premier League Tonight on BT Sport last night. Steve Sidwell is a youth team coach and he explained their current approach in terms of, not just manager, but club philosophy. They decided early on through Dan Ashworth to develop an attacking brand of football after the Chris Hughton sacking. They decided their approach and then chose a manger to fit in Graham Potter. That meant a change of process from youth to first team. If Potter were to get sacked or find a better job, the process would be the same. It means every player whether they're 13 or 30 has a clear idea of how Brighton play. It's not new. Ajax do it, Barcelona do it and other clubs are now following suit.
We should be doing the same.
We had it right with Poch but obviously that did probably come to a natural conclusion after 5 years. Where we went wrong was to shift the club philosophy entirely. You can't jump from a club based on progressive, ball-playing expansive football to suddenly ultra defensive win at any cost ruthlessness. We should have replaced progressive with progressive as that's what the club stands for. The problem right now is Mourinho but the real issue is deeper than that. We need to commit to a philosophy first and then determine who we get in to fit that philosophy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Spot on mate
Page 2 of 2