Yes, dragging it on is hurting us. The EFL know that.
We probably do have a strong case, unless there's more to it, and what we did wasn't exactly what the EFL approved.
There's no recourse for the harm being done to the club by the EFL's actions though. It would be unprecedented for a club to sue the league in order to be reinstated at a higher level, after the fact, even if it could be proven that the league's actions contributed directly to the downfall of the club.
Accepting relegation would give us the best chance of bouncing back. We might not have many Championship quality players, but if we just write off next season in the Championship where we can't compete, we'll have even fewer of them by the time we are in League 1, therefore be even less likely to bounce back.
All that will be in Mel’s mind will be sale value of the club which would be considerably less as league one outfit. I would take any lumps including relegation if need be, to get the club on a settled and upward trajectory as soon as possible. This like the 80s again
If the stories about the debt etc. are true I don't think the club has a sale value anyway.
There's Pride Park, ooh wait, perhaps not.
I've borrowed some of HMG's smoke and mirrors ........
Think we should resign and join the European Super League they seem to be stuck for numbers and we lose every week anyway, at least the away games would be warm
Times like these I look at what Burton Albion are up to. They've made SIX signings to add to their *twenty plus signings during the January transfer window when JFH took over.
*Slight exaggeration but it was a ridiculous number
and Wycombe now confirm their intent to sue us for £15m in lost revenue if they're not reinstated.
Keogh case all over again.
Wycombe chairman needs to remember the only reason they succeeded in promotion was due to Covid and the controversial points scheme used in League One and Two.
Oxford, Portsmouth and Fleetwood all had more points than Wycombe Wanderers, so if the club wants to open up a legal campaign on lost revenue, I'm pretty sure there's going to a minimum of eight clubs that could argue Wycombe shouldn't have been there and the loss revenue belongs to them.
Some good news, depending on your views, if we are relegated Wayne Rooney will not be sticking around to manage in L1.
There's a grey cloud of doom hovering over us.
Not that two wrongs make a right, but whatever happened to the "serious sanctions" threatened for the ESL clubs?
comment by Scouse (U9675)
posted 19 minutes ago
Not that two wrongs make a right, but whatever happened to the "serious sanctions" threatened for the ESL clubs?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're right but this is the line trotted out from Luton, Wednesday and others about us.
There is no consistency and methinks that to poke the corrupt wasps' nest known as the EFL will only make the incompetent, weak willed arbitrators more angry.
According to their owner, Wycombe will only sue if the decision to ‘relegate’ Derby comes into effect after they start the season in League 1 and will then sue for lost earnings from if they had been in the Championship instead. If the final decision does not relegate us they won’t sue as nothing is lost (no matter how peeved they are).
This then begs the question of how can you retrospectively be relegated if a season has started? Obviously a points deduction a la Sheff W might end up relegating us this season but that’s not the same. So I can’t quite see how they will sue on that basis.
Any road up it’s a frikkin mess. The EFL should be bound by their own independent tribunal (a second one) and not keep objecting until they get what they want out of spite.
I believe it'll be a case of submit accounts before deadline, EFL determine the books have been cooked for past three years and Wycombe take our place.
Submit after deadline, we remain in embargo so unable to sign anyone other than freebies, ( I'm assuming this will prevent us from re-signing Waghorn and Wisdom in a similar scenario to Marriott) so we'll be depleted further.
Quote Desi
( I'm assuming this will prevent us from re-signing Waghorn and Wisdom in a similar scenario to Marriott) so we'll be depleted further.
I could live with that. There will be a surfeit of freebies next season.
We're approaching a point where the type of freebies to sign would be what Clough had to deal with:
Kevin Poole
Dean Holdsworth
etc....
If we can retain Waghorn for another season or season and half ( same with Wisdom) I'd much rather that considering the outlay on these two - then bring someone in of a similar quality or less.
Think you will find there will be far more choice than has beens and never will bes. Clubs are shedding players like leaves in autumn. It's whether we have the ability to pick the wheat from the chaff which will determine our season.
'It's whether we have the ability to pick the wheat from the chaff which will determine our season. '
I think we both know the answer to that.
Going on past evidence maybe but let's look on the bright side.
comment by Desicafu (U8481)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
I believe it'll be a case of submit accounts before deadline, EFL determine the books have been cooked for past three years and Wycombe take our place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Can’t see all that happening before August 7th. So presumably we won’t be retrospectively relegated. In for a bad season, yes.
Just to say I'm not gloating.
It seems very strange to publish to different fixture lists.
I think Mel has personnally upset some one at the EFL and this is the result.
This also messes up League One as well.
Well, don't know how true these figures are....but if correct indicate why we're (and other clubs of course) are in the proverbial. I bet even the lowliest on this list many of us would be envious of :
https://salarysport.com/football/sky-bet-championship/Derby-county/
https://salarysport.com/football/player/jack-marriott/
So much about the EFL's war against us does not make sense. Why? Maybe it's just too convenient to say that Gibson is all behind it and it's all without substance. Perhaps there is stuff about Morris's behaviour or his management of the club that might, if not vindicate the EFL's approach, at least make it a bit more understandable than at present. Can it be as simple as saying "The EFL hate us"?
But if their vendetta is against Morris, why are they effectively making it impossible for him to sell the club by spinning out the uncertainty and confusion for as long as they can? Why do they not want to draw a line under it after all this time and simply move on? And if we are actualy guilty of bad pracftice, why did the original tribunal side so strongly with DCFC, and are still doing so now with this miniscule "punishment"? It simply does not add up..
Mel's story in the history books will be an interesting one.
When he was appointed I had friends, who were big gamers saying to me "Oh no, not the Candy Crush man" such was the amorality they felt that brand carried, and how it had transformed their jobs from making fun and enjoyable puzzle games into ones where they had to maximize after-sales profit by exploiting players while skirting around gambling laws.
That might not have been Mel's doing, but it was a company he heavily invested in.
He comes across, at Derby, as thinking he's smarter than everybody else, the EFL may feel they were lured into a trap by agreeing to these policies, which along with a number of other decisions we've seen over the years are of questionable morality and appear like attempts to get away with exploiting loopholes.
That kind of behavior rubs others the wrong way, and that might be what we are seeing.
comment by lastapostleofvidal (U1491)
posted 6 hours, 18 minutes ago
So much about the EFL's war against us does not make sense. Why? Maybe it's just too convenient to say that Gibson is all behind it and it's all without substance. Perhaps there is stuff about Morris's behaviour or his management of the club that might, if not vindicate the EFL's approach, at least make it a bit more understandable than at present. Can it be as simple as saying "The EFL hate us"?
But if their vendetta is against Morris, why are they effectively making it impossible for him to sell the club by spinning out the uncertainty and confusion for as long as they can? Why do they not want to draw a line under it after all this time and simply move on? And if we are actualy guilty of bad pracftice, why did the original tribunal side so strongly with DCFC, and are still doing so now with this miniscule "punishment"? It simply does not add up..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Had we finished last season on 60 odd points this wouldn't be a discussion, which says it all.
That's Marriott gone then.
I'm surprised the media aren't making a bigger deal of this, as it means that contract extension options are not worth the paper they're written on.
I suppose this is the EFL flexing their muscles with regards player valuations, making it clear that our players have no residual worth unless they allow them it.
I think if Mel has any option to sue the EFL it will be over this.
Sign in if you want to comment
Fine! and oh yes, the fixture list
Page 2 of 3
posted on 24/6/21
Yes, dragging it on is hurting us. The EFL know that.
We probably do have a strong case, unless there's more to it, and what we did wasn't exactly what the EFL approved.
There's no recourse for the harm being done to the club by the EFL's actions though. It would be unprecedented for a club to sue the league in order to be reinstated at a higher level, after the fact, even if it could be proven that the league's actions contributed directly to the downfall of the club.
Accepting relegation would give us the best chance of bouncing back. We might not have many Championship quality players, but if we just write off next season in the Championship where we can't compete, we'll have even fewer of them by the time we are in League 1, therefore be even less likely to bounce back.
posted on 24/6/21
All that will be in Mel’s mind will be sale value of the club which would be considerably less as league one outfit. I would take any lumps including relegation if need be, to get the club on a settled and upward trajectory as soon as possible. This like the 80s again
posted on 24/6/21
If the stories about the debt etc. are true I don't think the club has a sale value anyway.
posted on 24/6/21
There's Pride Park, ooh wait, perhaps not.
posted on 24/6/21
I've borrowed some of HMG's smoke and mirrors ........
posted on 24/6/21
Think we should resign and join the European Super League they seem to be stuck for numbers and we lose every week anyway, at least the away games would be warm
posted on 24/6/21
Times like these I look at what Burton Albion are up to. They've made SIX signings to add to their *twenty plus signings during the January transfer window when JFH took over.
*Slight exaggeration but it was a ridiculous number
posted on 25/6/21
and Wycombe now confirm their intent to sue us for £15m in lost revenue if they're not reinstated.
Keogh case all over again.
posted on 25/6/21
Wycombe chairman needs to remember the only reason they succeeded in promotion was due to Covid and the controversial points scheme used in League One and Two.
Oxford, Portsmouth and Fleetwood all had more points than Wycombe Wanderers, so if the club wants to open up a legal campaign on lost revenue, I'm pretty sure there's going to a minimum of eight clubs that could argue Wycombe shouldn't have been there and the loss revenue belongs to them.
Some good news, depending on your views, if we are relegated Wayne Rooney will not be sticking around to manage in L1.
There's a grey cloud of doom hovering over us.
posted on 25/6/21
Not that two wrongs make a right, but whatever happened to the "serious sanctions" threatened for the ESL clubs?
posted on 25/6/21
comment by Scouse (U9675)
posted 19 minutes ago
Not that two wrongs make a right, but whatever happened to the "serious sanctions" threatened for the ESL clubs?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're right but this is the line trotted out from Luton, Wednesday and others about us.
There is no consistency and methinks that to poke the corrupt wasps' nest known as the EFL will only make the incompetent, weak willed arbitrators more angry.
posted on 25/6/21
According to their owner, Wycombe will only sue if the decision to ‘relegate’ Derby comes into effect after they start the season in League 1 and will then sue for lost earnings from if they had been in the Championship instead. If the final decision does not relegate us they won’t sue as nothing is lost (no matter how peeved they are).
This then begs the question of how can you retrospectively be relegated if a season has started? Obviously a points deduction a la Sheff W might end up relegating us this season but that’s not the same. So I can’t quite see how they will sue on that basis.
Any road up it’s a frikkin mess. The EFL should be bound by their own independent tribunal (a second one) and not keep objecting until they get what they want out of spite.
posted on 25/6/21
I believe it'll be a case of submit accounts before deadline, EFL determine the books have been cooked for past three years and Wycombe take our place.
Submit after deadline, we remain in embargo so unable to sign anyone other than freebies, ( I'm assuming this will prevent us from re-signing Waghorn and Wisdom in a similar scenario to Marriott) so we'll be depleted further.
posted on 25/6/21
Quote Desi
( I'm assuming this will prevent us from re-signing Waghorn and Wisdom in a similar scenario to Marriott) so we'll be depleted further.
I could live with that. There will be a surfeit of freebies next season.
posted on 25/6/21
We're approaching a point where the type of freebies to sign would be what Clough had to deal with:
Kevin Poole
Dean Holdsworth
etc....
If we can retain Waghorn for another season or season and half ( same with Wisdom) I'd much rather that considering the outlay on these two - then bring someone in of a similar quality or less.
posted on 25/6/21
Think you will find there will be far more choice than has beens and never will bes. Clubs are shedding players like leaves in autumn. It's whether we have the ability to pick the wheat from the chaff which will determine our season.
posted on 25/6/21
'It's whether we have the ability to pick the wheat from the chaff which will determine our season. '
I think we both know the answer to that.
posted on 25/6/21
Going on past evidence maybe but let's look on the bright side.
posted on 25/6/21
comment by Desicafu (U8481)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
I believe it'll be a case of submit accounts before deadline, EFL determine the books have been cooked for past three years and Wycombe take our place.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Can’t see all that happening before August 7th. So presumably we won’t be retrospectively relegated. In for a bad season, yes.
posted on 25/6/21
Just to say I'm not gloating.
It seems very strange to publish to different fixture lists.
I think Mel has personnally upset some one at the EFL and this is the result.
This also messes up League One as well.
posted on 26/6/21
Well, don't know how true these figures are....but if correct indicate why we're (and other clubs of course) are in the proverbial. I bet even the lowliest on this list many of us would be envious of :
https://salarysport.com/football/sky-bet-championship/Derby-county/
https://salarysport.com/football/player/jack-marriott/
posted on 26/6/21
So much about the EFL's war against us does not make sense. Why? Maybe it's just too convenient to say that Gibson is all behind it and it's all without substance. Perhaps there is stuff about Morris's behaviour or his management of the club that might, if not vindicate the EFL's approach, at least make it a bit more understandable than at present. Can it be as simple as saying "The EFL hate us"?
But if their vendetta is against Morris, why are they effectively making it impossible for him to sell the club by spinning out the uncertainty and confusion for as long as they can? Why do they not want to draw a line under it after all this time and simply move on? And if we are actualy guilty of bad pracftice, why did the original tribunal side so strongly with DCFC, and are still doing so now with this miniscule "punishment"? It simply does not add up..
posted on 26/6/21
Mel's story in the history books will be an interesting one.
When he was appointed I had friends, who were big gamers saying to me "Oh no, not the Candy Crush man" such was the amorality they felt that brand carried, and how it had transformed their jobs from making fun and enjoyable puzzle games into ones where they had to maximize after-sales profit by exploiting players while skirting around gambling laws.
That might not have been Mel's doing, but it was a company he heavily invested in.
He comes across, at Derby, as thinking he's smarter than everybody else, the EFL may feel they were lured into a trap by agreeing to these policies, which along with a number of other decisions we've seen over the years are of questionable morality and appear like attempts to get away with exploiting loopholes.
That kind of behavior rubs others the wrong way, and that might be what we are seeing.
posted on 26/6/21
comment by lastapostleofvidal (U1491)
posted 6 hours, 18 minutes ago
So much about the EFL's war against us does not make sense. Why? Maybe it's just too convenient to say that Gibson is all behind it and it's all without substance. Perhaps there is stuff about Morris's behaviour or his management of the club that might, if not vindicate the EFL's approach, at least make it a bit more understandable than at present. Can it be as simple as saying "The EFL hate us"?
But if their vendetta is against Morris, why are they effectively making it impossible for him to sell the club by spinning out the uncertainty and confusion for as long as they can? Why do they not want to draw a line under it after all this time and simply move on? And if we are actualy guilty of bad pracftice, why did the original tribunal side so strongly with DCFC, and are still doing so now with this miniscule "punishment"? It simply does not add up..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Had we finished last season on 60 odd points this wouldn't be a discussion, which says it all.
posted on 1/7/21
That's Marriott gone then.
I'm surprised the media aren't making a bigger deal of this, as it means that contract extension options are not worth the paper they're written on.
I suppose this is the EFL flexing their muscles with regards player valuations, making it clear that our players have no residual worth unless they allow them it.
I think if Mel has any option to sue the EFL it will be over this.
Page 2 of 3