Ripleys right about Pep too, anyone who thinks their manager conducts transfer negotiations knows nothing about how the system works
---
If that's the case why is he giving interviews to the press talking about negotiations?
you don't get a chance to manage top teams if you're not a top manager. only idiots throw around this checkbook manager bullsh!t. the simple fact is every top team has to spend a lot of money. the perfect storm doesn't come around every year. we saw it with leicester and we'll see it with leeds.
Because directors of football and chief negotiators don’t tend to take press conferences.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 2 minutes ago
Before now I actually thought City were doing things in the right way. Yes, they've spent big money but before Grealish their record transfer fee was around £60m for Dias. Their better performers, with the right scouting set up, could have been acquired by any of the top 6 clubs in a financial sense. Kompany, Silva, Aguero, De Bruyne. All reasonable prices. If he ends up buying Grealish AND Kane then he'll have smashed the British transfer record twice in one window. That's not nurturing and moulding success, it's buying it, and frankly Pep is better than that. No matter what he goes on to achieve at City, he'll be tarnished with the reputation of taking the easy route. Let's face it, if you can spend £250m on just two players, you're cheating the rest of the field. Don't get me wrong, he's clearly still the best manager out there for me. He's revolutionised football. He's a pioneer. In the five years he's been here you can see the difference in the way other clubs operate. That's his legacy and splashing out on the very best does nothing but dilute it. Shame.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He`s a chequebook manager mate. Always has been.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, I don't believe that. That Barca side was nurtured and moulded by him. Their most talented players came from a youth system he had a big hand in developing. For me he's an outstanding manager, I would say the greatest of all time that happens to also now have quite a bit of dosh at his disposal. He's revolutionised the game. To say that he's just a chequebook manager is just the most naive thoughtless statement anyone can make about him. It's absurd as far as I'm concerned. City have had money since 2008 and only since 2016 have we seen them play football that has, at times, taken my breath away. That's not the players, that's Pep. I hate it but it's true. Sometimes you have to hold your hand up and accept it. We should be grateful we have a manager like Pep in our league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Still a chequebook manager who can only work with the best players. Let him try say managing Watfird with little or no money, then we will see how good he is.
Easiest job in the world to manage Barca, Bayern and City where trophies are guaranteed.
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 2 minutes ago
Before now I actually thought City were doing things in the right way. Yes, they've spent big money but before Grealish their record transfer fee was around £60m for Dias. Their better performers, with the right scouting set up, could have been acquired by any of the top 6 clubs in a financial sense. Kompany, Silva, Aguero, De Bruyne. All reasonable prices. If he ends up buying Grealish AND Kane then he'll have smashed the British transfer record twice in one window. That's not nurturing and moulding success, it's buying it, and frankly Pep is better than that. No matter what he goes on to achieve at City, he'll be tarnished with the reputation of taking the easy route. Let's face it, if you can spend £250m on just two players, you're cheating the rest of the field. Don't get me wrong, he's clearly still the best manager out there for me. He's revolutionised football. He's a pioneer. In the five years he's been here you can see the difference in the way other clubs operate. That's his legacy and splashing out on the very best does nothing but dilute it. Shame.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He`s a chequebook manager mate. Always has been.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, I don't believe that. That Barca side was nurtured and moulded by him. Their most talented players came from a youth system he had a big hand in developing. For me he's an outstanding manager, I would say the greatest of all time that happens to also now have quite a bit of dosh at his disposal. He's revolutionised the game. To say that he's just a chequebook manager is just the most naive thoughtless statement anyone can make about him. It's absurd as far as I'm concerned. City have had money since 2008 and only since 2016 have we seen them play football that has, at times, taken my breath away. That's not the players, that's Pep. I hate it but it's true. Sometimes you have to hold your hand up and accept it. We should be grateful we have a manager like Pep in our league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Still a chequebook manager who can only work with the best players. Let him try say managing Watfird with little or no money, then we will see how good he is.
Easiest job in the world to manage Barca, Bayern and City where trophies are guaranteed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Let him try managing Spurs…
comment by TobyJanKaneobi (U15068)
posted 1 hour, 19 minutes ago
comment by Boris 'Inky’ Gibson (U5901)
posted 20 minutes ago
By not buying Kane for a ridiculous amount of money, Pep has proved he’s a chequebook manager.
Spurs logic at its finest
—————————
Piish aff inky. He is a chequebook manager.
£918,000,000.00
It’s easy to win at monopoly when you are always the banker!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cannot believe anybody still thinks Pep ain't a chequebook manager, when he has spent that amount.
With all the money Spendiola has spent he ought to have won £ity the CL by now, the fact he hasnt (and is still spending money trying to chase it) suggests he isnt as good as some would believe.
Even if everyone agrees Pep is a chequebook manager, What then?
Would you not want Pep at your club? Or would you only want Pep at your club if your club has money to spend?
And let’s face it, no club is winning anything if they don’t have money to spend…
comment by RipleysCat (U1862)
posted 3 minutes ago
Even if everyone agrees Pep is a chequebook manager, What then?
Would you not want Pep at your club? Or would you only want Pep at your club if your club has money to spend?
And let’s face it, no club is winning anything if they don’t have money to spend…
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesta did a few years back
comment by ● Billy The Yidd ● 2020* 2021* ENIC OUT! (U3924)
posted 7 minutes ago
With all the money Spendiola has spent he ought to have won £ity the CL by now, the fact he hasnt (and is still spending money trying to chase it) suggests he isnt as good as some would believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where Spurs’ fans lack of trophies and experience in the CL shows.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by ● Billy The Yidd ● 2020* 2021* ENIC OUT! (U3924)
posted 7 minutes ago
With all the money Spendiola has spent he ought to have won £ity the CL by now, the fact he hasnt (and is still spending money trying to chase it) suggests he isnt as good as some would believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where Spurs’ fans lack of trophies and experience in the CL shows.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No that's Billy
Fair comment Mighty,
But it’s an anomaly.
An exception that proves the rule.
Pep having money to spend and winning title after title. Clubs back managers like Pep. Pep goes to clubs that will back him.
The bottom line is, if Pep was at Spurs, and Spurs backed him, you’d win trophy after trophy after trophy. And you wouldn’t care that fans of other clubs called him a chequebook manager. You’d just be enjoying the successes that he brought to your club.
comment by RipleysCat (U1862)
posted 11 minutes ago
Fair comment Mighty,
But it’s an anomaly.
An exception that proves the rule.
Pep having money to spend and winning title after title. Clubs back managers like Pep. Pep goes to clubs that will back him.
The bottom line is, if Pep was at Spurs, and Spurs backed him, you’d win trophy after trophy after trophy. And you wouldn’t care that fans of other clubs called him a chequebook manager. You’d just be enjoying the successes that he brought to your club.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
backed him? what scale we talking about here? Do you think Pep would have the same or better success as Klopp under the same circumstances? would you deem Klopp backed? for example.
No escaping Pep is amongst the best theres ever been at what he does, but i still doubt he'd be able to operate like other managers. I doubt he'd have gotten leeds back to the prem for example.
harsh on pep too i doubt the signings have much to do with him, hes more a coach than a hands on involved in everything manager. Im not sure Klopp would do well at City for example. Be interesting to see but hes never really done it that way in his career.
I do believe that if Pep was at Liverpool and backed to the extent that Klopp has been at Liverpool, then he would bring you success.
Klopp would also be a success at City.
The only conclusion we can draw from that, is that both Klopp and Pep would be a success at the club they managed.
The question whether he could get Leeds promoted is moot. No one knows. Just as no one would know if Klopp would get Leeds promoted.
The bottom line in such an argument is that top managers aren’t usually appointed by clubs that are in search of being promoted. They may start off at such a club, but once they’ve proven themselves at the highest level (which Pep and Klopp have done) second tier sides don’t tend to fall on their radar. And they have no reason to try and prove themselves at a club in a lesser position, when the top clubs would be after them. (Well, no reason other than trying to appease fickle fans on irrelevant websites such as this).
Just like top players. They may start at a lower level, but they spend the pinnacle of their careers at the top. The top is the level that they strive to be at. If your able to function successfully at the top, why on earth would you aim to function at a lower level?
It’s a ridiculous argument.
Why is this question never asked about players? Should VVD, Gerrard, Ronaldo, Messi, Salah, be criticised because they never won the title or CL at the likes of Watford, Stoke, etc?
Nobody is saying they should aim to work at lower levels. Klopps been there and done it, although early on his his career, in regards to promotion with a smaller team. Hes also won stuff with big titles the underdog teams where theres always been other clubs as favourites over them in every competition.
Gerrards cups he won with us are worth more than anything he could have won with Chelsea imo. The difference again being favourites and expectation?
Peps teams always been favourites. Still a lot to do and deserves credit, the city team under him imo for example is the best we've seen in the prem era. But yeah we have to look at it subjectively, its a team sport firstly and theres lots of details and stuff like this all counts or atleast should be included when forming your opinions. And thats what they are, nothing wrong with having them. And i disagree im not convinced Pep would have had success with us under the same circumstances Klopps had. And equally im not sure Klopp would at Real or City or PSG, and one of the main valid arguments/reasons for that is because neither have even attempted to operate in that way before in their careers not so much that i dont believe they both great and the best around atm.
Lots of people are saying exactly that! That is exactly the criticism they are aiming towards Pep, and thus by extension they are saying that they would only regard him as a top manager if he succeeds as a lesser club.
It’s a nonsense argument.
People also underestimate what he achieved at Barca B , which gave the power people at Barcelona a reason to appoint him manager of their club to begin with.
I’m sorry, but you’re really not bringing anything new to the table here. You can say you don’t think that Pep would have success at Liverpool under the same circumstances that Klopp has. The reason for you saying that boils down the exactly the same argument that others are making - that he can’t succeed unless all the odds are stacked in his favour.
Irrespective of what you think about City and their status as a club, Barcelona and Bayern’s status is not up for discussion. And he achieved at those clubs.
Prior to Pep, Barcelona had won the CL twice in their entire history. Pep won it twice during his three/four year spell with them.
(Oh but that’s because of Messi. Like Barca have never had top top players before then.)
To be honest, it’s a lazy argument, a boring argument, and it’s so full of holes it is ridiculous.
comment by montleeds (U18330)
posted 1 hour, 57 minutes ago
you don't get a chance to manage top teams if you're not a top manager.
______
Good point
only idiots throw around this checkbook manager bullsh!t. the simple fact is every top team has to spend a lot of money.
_________
Mostly agree yeah
the perfect storm doesn't come around every year.
____________
Totally agree
we saw it with leicester and we'll see it with leeds.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lost me there bud
I don’t think Pep would have had success under the same circumstances Klopp had, it’s really incredible what he managed to achieve with the players he had.
But I’m not sure Klopp would have had the same success that Pep has if he managed the same clubs.
I think their styles of managed are best suited to the clubs they’ve been at. And they’ve picked those clubs for that reason.
This is a man that has revolutionised football. His legacy is beyond management really. He's inherited the Cruyff philosophy and taken it to a new level. Tika-taka is him, playing out from the back is him, changing the face of what it is to be a goalkeeper now is him, playing with a false nine is him. Sure, you can go really far back and attribute some of the tika-taka to the Brazil team of 1970 or the Dutch team with Cruyff but no one has managed to take that game and make it work in different territories like Pep has. For that reason alone, he sits above Ferguson. Ferguson was a great manager but the Aberdeen era was a different time in football. You're talking about an era where Forest can win the European Cup, Derby the first division straight from promotion. An era where the entire country was so far behind when it came to fitness and professionalism that the gains from taking things seriously aren't marginal. They're huge. Pep is a great manager too but he's beyond that. He's a visionary. It's always opposition fans that label him a chequebook manager. It's bitterness, pure and simple.
Jose? Now he's a chequebook manager but for some reason Sandy, you didn't seem to have an issue with him.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 13 minutes ago
This is a man that has revolutionised football. His legacy is beyond management really. He's inherited the Cruyff philosophy and taken it to a new level. Tika-taka is him, playing out from the back is him, changing the face of what it is to be a goalkeeper now is him, playing with a false nine is him. Sure, you can go really far back and attribute some of the tika-taka to the Brazil team of 1970 or the Dutch team with Cruyff but no one has managed to take that game and make it work in different territories like Pep has. For that reason alone, he sits above Ferguson. Ferguson was a great manager but the Aberdeen era was a different time in football. You're talking about an era where Forest can win the European Cup, Derby the first division straight from promotion. An era where the entire country was so far behind when it came to fitness and professionalism that the gains from taking things seriously aren't marginal. They're huge. Pep is a great manager too but he's beyond that. He's a visionary. It's always opposition fans that label him a chequebook manager. It's bitterness, pure and simple.
Jose? Now he's a chequebook manager but for some reason Sandy, you didn't seem to have an issue with him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I have an issue with most of the so called modern top managers, that they all go to clubs where trophies are guaranteed.
BIlly Nicholson took over Spurs when they were 18th in the 1st division.
Bill Shankly took over Liverpool when they were in the 2nd division.
Don Revie took over Leeds when they were in the 2nd division.
Brian Clough took over Nottm Forest when they were in the 2nd division.
Alf Ramsey took over Ipswich when they were in the 3rd division.
See where I'm coming from, all those great managers built their teams from absolutely nothing. Every team Pep has managed he was guaranteed silverware before he walked through the door.
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 24 minutes ago
This is a man that has revolutionised football. His legacy is beyond management really. He's inherited the Cruyff philosophy and taken it to a new level. Tika-taka is him, playing out from the back is him, changing the face of what it is to be a goalkeeper now is him, playing with a false nine is him. Sure, you can go really far back and attribute some of the tika-taka to the Brazil team of 1970 or the Dutch team with Cruyff but no one has managed to take that game and make it work in different territories like Pep has. For that reason alone, he sits above Ferguson. Ferguson was a great manager but the Aberdeen era was a different time in football. You're talking about an era where Forest can win the European Cup, Derby the first division straight from promotion. An era where the entire country was so far behind when it came to fitness and professionalism that the gains from taking things seriously aren't marginal. They're huge. Pep is a great manager too but he's beyond that. He's a visionary. It's always opposition fans that label him a chequebook manager. It's bitterness, pure and simple.
Jose? Now he's a chequebook manager but for some reason Sandy, you didn't seem to have an issue with him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jose is a chequebook manager, not disputing that. But any manager would have won trophies at the three clubs Pep has managed at, it is that easy.
Sign in if you want to comment
Poor old Pep
Page 3 of 4
posted on 6/8/21
Ripleys right about Pep too, anyone who thinks their manager conducts transfer negotiations knows nothing about how the system works
---
If that's the case why is he giving interviews to the press talking about negotiations?
posted on 6/8/21
you don't get a chance to manage top teams if you're not a top manager. only idiots throw around this checkbook manager bullsh!t. the simple fact is every top team has to spend a lot of money. the perfect storm doesn't come around every year. we saw it with leicester and we'll see it with leeds.
posted on 6/8/21
Because directors of football and chief negotiators don’t tend to take press conferences.
posted on 6/8/21
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 6/8/21
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 2 minutes ago
Before now I actually thought City were doing things in the right way. Yes, they've spent big money but before Grealish their record transfer fee was around £60m for Dias. Their better performers, with the right scouting set up, could have been acquired by any of the top 6 clubs in a financial sense. Kompany, Silva, Aguero, De Bruyne. All reasonable prices. If he ends up buying Grealish AND Kane then he'll have smashed the British transfer record twice in one window. That's not nurturing and moulding success, it's buying it, and frankly Pep is better than that. No matter what he goes on to achieve at City, he'll be tarnished with the reputation of taking the easy route. Let's face it, if you can spend £250m on just two players, you're cheating the rest of the field. Don't get me wrong, he's clearly still the best manager out there for me. He's revolutionised football. He's a pioneer. In the five years he's been here you can see the difference in the way other clubs operate. That's his legacy and splashing out on the very best does nothing but dilute it. Shame.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He`s a chequebook manager mate. Always has been.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, I don't believe that. That Barca side was nurtured and moulded by him. Their most talented players came from a youth system he had a big hand in developing. For me he's an outstanding manager, I would say the greatest of all time that happens to also now have quite a bit of dosh at his disposal. He's revolutionised the game. To say that he's just a chequebook manager is just the most naive thoughtless statement anyone can make about him. It's absurd as far as I'm concerned. City have had money since 2008 and only since 2016 have we seen them play football that has, at times, taken my breath away. That's not the players, that's Pep. I hate it but it's true. Sometimes you have to hold your hand up and accept it. We should be grateful we have a manager like Pep in our league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Still a chequebook manager who can only work with the best players. Let him try say managing Watfird with little or no money, then we will see how good he is.
Easiest job in the world to manage Barca, Bayern and City where trophies are guaranteed.
posted on 6/8/21
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 2 minutes ago
Before now I actually thought City were doing things in the right way. Yes, they've spent big money but before Grealish their record transfer fee was around £60m for Dias. Their better performers, with the right scouting set up, could have been acquired by any of the top 6 clubs in a financial sense. Kompany, Silva, Aguero, De Bruyne. All reasonable prices. If he ends up buying Grealish AND Kane then he'll have smashed the British transfer record twice in one window. That's not nurturing and moulding success, it's buying it, and frankly Pep is better than that. No matter what he goes on to achieve at City, he'll be tarnished with the reputation of taking the easy route. Let's face it, if you can spend £250m on just two players, you're cheating the rest of the field. Don't get me wrong, he's clearly still the best manager out there for me. He's revolutionised football. He's a pioneer. In the five years he's been here you can see the difference in the way other clubs operate. That's his legacy and splashing out on the very best does nothing but dilute it. Shame.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He`s a chequebook manager mate. Always has been.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, I don't believe that. That Barca side was nurtured and moulded by him. Their most talented players came from a youth system he had a big hand in developing. For me he's an outstanding manager, I would say the greatest of all time that happens to also now have quite a bit of dosh at his disposal. He's revolutionised the game. To say that he's just a chequebook manager is just the most naive thoughtless statement anyone can make about him. It's absurd as far as I'm concerned. City have had money since 2008 and only since 2016 have we seen them play football that has, at times, taken my breath away. That's not the players, that's Pep. I hate it but it's true. Sometimes you have to hold your hand up and accept it. We should be grateful we have a manager like Pep in our league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Still a chequebook manager who can only work with the best players. Let him try say managing Watfird with little or no money, then we will see how good he is.
Easiest job in the world to manage Barca, Bayern and City where trophies are guaranteed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Let him try managing Spurs…
posted on 6/8/21
comment by TobyJanKaneobi (U15068)
posted 1 hour, 19 minutes ago
comment by Boris 'Inky’ Gibson (U5901)
posted 20 minutes ago
By not buying Kane for a ridiculous amount of money, Pep has proved he’s a chequebook manager.
Spurs logic at its finest
—————————
Piish aff inky. He is a chequebook manager.
£918,000,000.00
It’s easy to win at monopoly when you are always the banker!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cannot believe anybody still thinks Pep ain't a chequebook manager, when he has spent that amount.
posted on 6/8/21
With all the money Spendiola has spent he ought to have won £ity the CL by now, the fact he hasnt (and is still spending money trying to chase it) suggests he isnt as good as some would believe.
posted on 6/8/21
Even if everyone agrees Pep is a chequebook manager, What then?
Would you not want Pep at your club? Or would you only want Pep at your club if your club has money to spend?
And let’s face it, no club is winning anything if they don’t have money to spend…
posted on 6/8/21
comment by RipleysCat (U1862)
posted 3 minutes ago
Even if everyone agrees Pep is a chequebook manager, What then?
Would you not want Pep at your club? Or would you only want Pep at your club if your club has money to spend?
And let’s face it, no club is winning anything if they don’t have money to spend…
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesta did a few years back
posted on 6/8/21
comment by ● Billy The Yidd ● 2020* 2021* ENIC OUT! (U3924)
posted 7 minutes ago
With all the money Spendiola has spent he ought to have won £ity the CL by now, the fact he hasnt (and is still spending money trying to chase it) suggests he isnt as good as some would believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where Spurs’ fans lack of trophies and experience in the CL shows.
posted on 6/8/21
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by ● Billy The Yidd ● 2020* 2021* ENIC OUT! (U3924)
posted 7 minutes ago
With all the money Spendiola has spent he ought to have won £ity the CL by now, the fact he hasnt (and is still spending money trying to chase it) suggests he isnt as good as some would believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where Spurs’ fans lack of trophies and experience in the CL shows.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No that's Billy
posted on 6/8/21
Fair comment Mighty,
But it’s an anomaly.
An exception that proves the rule.
Pep having money to spend and winning title after title. Clubs back managers like Pep. Pep goes to clubs that will back him.
The bottom line is, if Pep was at Spurs, and Spurs backed him, you’d win trophy after trophy after trophy. And you wouldn’t care that fans of other clubs called him a chequebook manager. You’d just be enjoying the successes that he brought to your club.
posted on 6/8/21
comment by RipleysCat (U1862)
posted 11 minutes ago
Fair comment Mighty,
But it’s an anomaly.
An exception that proves the rule.
Pep having money to spend and winning title after title. Clubs back managers like Pep. Pep goes to clubs that will back him.
The bottom line is, if Pep was at Spurs, and Spurs backed him, you’d win trophy after trophy after trophy. And you wouldn’t care that fans of other clubs called him a chequebook manager. You’d just be enjoying the successes that he brought to your club.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
backed him? what scale we talking about here? Do you think Pep would have the same or better success as Klopp under the same circumstances? would you deem Klopp backed? for example.
No escaping Pep is amongst the best theres ever been at what he does, but i still doubt he'd be able to operate like other managers. I doubt he'd have gotten leeds back to the prem for example.
posted on 6/8/21
harsh on pep too i doubt the signings have much to do with him, hes more a coach than a hands on involved in everything manager. Im not sure Klopp would do well at City for example. Be interesting to see but hes never really done it that way in his career.
posted on 6/8/21
I do believe that if Pep was at Liverpool and backed to the extent that Klopp has been at Liverpool, then he would bring you success.
Klopp would also be a success at City.
The only conclusion we can draw from that, is that both Klopp and Pep would be a success at the club they managed.
The question whether he could get Leeds promoted is moot. No one knows. Just as no one would know if Klopp would get Leeds promoted.
The bottom line in such an argument is that top managers aren’t usually appointed by clubs that are in search of being promoted. They may start off at such a club, but once they’ve proven themselves at the highest level (which Pep and Klopp have done) second tier sides don’t tend to fall on their radar. And they have no reason to try and prove themselves at a club in a lesser position, when the top clubs would be after them. (Well, no reason other than trying to appease fickle fans on irrelevant websites such as this).
Just like top players. They may start at a lower level, but they spend the pinnacle of their careers at the top. The top is the level that they strive to be at. If your able to function successfully at the top, why on earth would you aim to function at a lower level?
It’s a ridiculous argument.
Why is this question never asked about players? Should VVD, Gerrard, Ronaldo, Messi, Salah, be criticised because they never won the title or CL at the likes of Watford, Stoke, etc?
posted on 6/8/21
Nobody is saying they should aim to work at lower levels. Klopps been there and done it, although early on his his career, in regards to promotion with a smaller team. Hes also won stuff with big titles the underdog teams where theres always been other clubs as favourites over them in every competition.
Gerrards cups he won with us are worth more than anything he could have won with Chelsea imo. The difference again being favourites and expectation?
Peps teams always been favourites. Still a lot to do and deserves credit, the city team under him imo for example is the best we've seen in the prem era. But yeah we have to look at it subjectively, its a team sport firstly and theres lots of details and stuff like this all counts or atleast should be included when forming your opinions. And thats what they are, nothing wrong with having them. And i disagree im not convinced Pep would have had success with us under the same circumstances Klopps had. And equally im not sure Klopp would at Real or City or PSG, and one of the main valid arguments/reasons for that is because neither have even attempted to operate in that way before in their careers not so much that i dont believe they both great and the best around atm.
posted on 6/8/21
Lots of people are saying exactly that! That is exactly the criticism they are aiming towards Pep, and thus by extension they are saying that they would only regard him as a top manager if he succeeds as a lesser club.
It’s a nonsense argument.
People also underestimate what he achieved at Barca B , which gave the power people at Barcelona a reason to appoint him manager of their club to begin with.
I’m sorry, but you’re really not bringing anything new to the table here. You can say you don’t think that Pep would have success at Liverpool under the same circumstances that Klopp has. The reason for you saying that boils down the exactly the same argument that others are making - that he can’t succeed unless all the odds are stacked in his favour.
Irrespective of what you think about City and their status as a club, Barcelona and Bayern’s status is not up for discussion. And he achieved at those clubs.
Prior to Pep, Barcelona had won the CL twice in their entire history. Pep won it twice during his three/four year spell with them.
(Oh but that’s because of Messi. Like Barca have never had top top players before then.)
To be honest, it’s a lazy argument, a boring argument, and it’s so full of holes it is ridiculous.
posted on 6/8/21
comment by montleeds (U18330)
posted 1 hour, 57 minutes ago
you don't get a chance to manage top teams if you're not a top manager.
______
Good point
only idiots throw around this checkbook manager bullsh!t. the simple fact is every top team has to spend a lot of money.
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Mostly agree yeah
the perfect storm doesn't come around every year.
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Totally agree
we saw it with leicester and we'll see it with leeds.
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Lost me there bud
posted on 6/8/21
I don’t think Pep would have had success under the same circumstances Klopp had, it’s really incredible what he managed to achieve with the players he had.
But I’m not sure Klopp would have had the same success that Pep has if he managed the same clubs.
I think their styles of managed are best suited to the clubs they’ve been at. And they’ve picked those clubs for that reason.
posted on 6/8/21
*management
posted on 6/8/21
This is a man that has revolutionised football. His legacy is beyond management really. He's inherited the Cruyff philosophy and taken it to a new level. Tika-taka is him, playing out from the back is him, changing the face of what it is to be a goalkeeper now is him, playing with a false nine is him. Sure, you can go really far back and attribute some of the tika-taka to the Brazil team of 1970 or the Dutch team with Cruyff but no one has managed to take that game and make it work in different territories like Pep has. For that reason alone, he sits above Ferguson. Ferguson was a great manager but the Aberdeen era was a different time in football. You're talking about an era where Forest can win the European Cup, Derby the first division straight from promotion. An era where the entire country was so far behind when it came to fitness and professionalism that the gains from taking things seriously aren't marginal. They're huge. Pep is a great manager too but he's beyond that. He's a visionary. It's always opposition fans that label him a chequebook manager. It's bitterness, pure and simple.
Jose? Now he's a chequebook manager but for some reason Sandy, you didn't seem to have an issue with him.
posted on 6/8/21
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 6/8/21
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 13 minutes ago
This is a man that has revolutionised football. His legacy is beyond management really. He's inherited the Cruyff philosophy and taken it to a new level. Tika-taka is him, playing out from the back is him, changing the face of what it is to be a goalkeeper now is him, playing with a false nine is him. Sure, you can go really far back and attribute some of the tika-taka to the Brazil team of 1970 or the Dutch team with Cruyff but no one has managed to take that game and make it work in different territories like Pep has. For that reason alone, he sits above Ferguson. Ferguson was a great manager but the Aberdeen era was a different time in football. You're talking about an era where Forest can win the European Cup, Derby the first division straight from promotion. An era where the entire country was so far behind when it came to fitness and professionalism that the gains from taking things seriously aren't marginal. They're huge. Pep is a great manager too but he's beyond that. He's a visionary. It's always opposition fans that label him a chequebook manager. It's bitterness, pure and simple.
Jose? Now he's a chequebook manager but for some reason Sandy, you didn't seem to have an issue with him.
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I have an issue with most of the so called modern top managers, that they all go to clubs where trophies are guaranteed.
BIlly Nicholson took over Spurs when they were 18th in the 1st division.
Bill Shankly took over Liverpool when they were in the 2nd division.
Don Revie took over Leeds when they were in the 2nd division.
Brian Clough took over Nottm Forest when they were in the 2nd division.
Alf Ramsey took over Ipswich when they were in the 3rd division.
See where I'm coming from, all those great managers built their teams from absolutely nothing. Every team Pep has managed he was guaranteed silverware before he walked through the door.
posted on 6/8/21
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 24 minutes ago
This is a man that has revolutionised football. His legacy is beyond management really. He's inherited the Cruyff philosophy and taken it to a new level. Tika-taka is him, playing out from the back is him, changing the face of what it is to be a goalkeeper now is him, playing with a false nine is him. Sure, you can go really far back and attribute some of the tika-taka to the Brazil team of 1970 or the Dutch team with Cruyff but no one has managed to take that game and make it work in different territories like Pep has. For that reason alone, he sits above Ferguson. Ferguson was a great manager but the Aberdeen era was a different time in football. You're talking about an era where Forest can win the European Cup, Derby the first division straight from promotion. An era where the entire country was so far behind when it came to fitness and professionalism that the gains from taking things seriously aren't marginal. They're huge. Pep is a great manager too but he's beyond that. He's a visionary. It's always opposition fans that label him a chequebook manager. It's bitterness, pure and simple.
Jose? Now he's a chequebook manager but for some reason Sandy, you didn't seem to have an issue with him.
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Jose is a chequebook manager, not disputing that. But any manager would have won trophies at the three clubs Pep has managed at, it is that easy.
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