Ship out Elanga to raise some funds
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
Nah. Rather see Hannibal given a chance next season
A few seasons back, maybe (like when he went to Leicester). Not now.
Not for now unless we do get him in which case I trust Erik's judgement with a useful squad addition.
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 9 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I literally only just read about Newcastle/McTominay. I’m surprised really - I thought they would be looking for a level above that. But if they want him, it’s because they think he’ll strengthen them, and to be fair he’s still a useful squad player in our current phase. So keep him for me.
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 10 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eddie must see something we don't
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 10 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eddie must see something we don't
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To be fair, the likes of Willock and Joelinton look like world-beaters now so perhaps he thinks he could do something with McTominay as well.
Why would they loan him out when he is out of contract in the summer?
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 11 hours, 3 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
People want shot of all of McT, Elanga, AWB, Williams, Jones and Maguire, and them replaced with the likes of Tielemans, Kudus, Dest and Torres.
United are relatively fairly well stocked with homegrown players, but need to hang on to some squad players meeting the criteria for depth. They’ll have to promote from within or shell out on some homegrown players from elsewhere in the PL.
Tielemans’ application has been questioned by Leicester fans, particularly when he’s been dropped, and replacing a squad player on £50k p/w who is always fit and guaranteed to give you 100% off the bench with a squad player apparently demanding £200k p/w (which is reportedly why Arsenal walked away in the summer) and who chucks one when he isn’t playing every week doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.
Fwiw, as much as he adores United, I think McT will want to move on in the summer if he doesn’t believe he has a chance of playing minimum 25-30 games per season; but as others have suggested, I expect that several of the squad players who do leave will be replaced with promoted Academy players.
Tielemans, to me at least, seems to have regressed this last year or so but the stats here could be of interest to EtH if he thinks he can work with him - https://twitter.com/markrstats/status/1615043201886453760?s=20&t=r0rILeshRis6uwjggNbvDA
Ball progression and ball regains pretty high compared to quite a few midfielders.
Rosso, we can sign English players as well. I’d imagine Rice and Kane will be two players high up on our wishlist this summer.
There’s a good crop of young English players at u20 level as well, particularly in midfield. Alex Scott and Tim Iroegbunham in particular have been impressing in the Championship this season. The latter might be difficult to get off Villa, but both would be cheaper alternatives to Rice and could be top midfielders in the future.
comment by Lisandro The King Martinez (U10026)
posted 40 minutes ago
Rosso, we can sign English players as well. I’d imagine Rice and Kane will be two players high up on our wishlist this summer.
There’s a good crop of young English players at u20 level as well, particularly in midfield. Alex Scott and Tim Iroegbunham in particular have been impressing in the Championship this season. The latter might be difficult to get off Villa, but both would be cheaper alternatives to Rice and could be top midfielders in the future.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it’s something the club should always be considering, obviously.
I think the more sensible *focus* (although not the be-all-and-end-all) should be on developing the academy and identifying and bringing in young talent like Mejbri, Jurado and Garnacho.
Best case scenario is you sign the odd gem early enough that they become a homegrown player as they’re brought on and brought through. (Hopefully Garnacho will turn out to be one of these.)
Otherwise, you might have a few fairly talented players who you can add value to by helping them become homegrown, loaning them out, then selling them on.
(I should clarify that I don’t want to see United adopt the Chelsea model of hoovering up as many youngsters as is legally or otherwise possible just to loan them out perpetually to the players’ and no doubt in some cases families’ detriment.)
On Kane and Rice, as an aside, I’d be delighted if United signed either in the summer, but equally surprised. I think ETH will go younger up top and for a little more finesse in midfield (although Rice’s technical ability is still widely underrated).
I will look up Scott and Iroegbunham, btw thanks
My knowledge of the Championship is shameful; but keeping up with the Primeira Liga and PL is already more than I have time for nowadays!
As always it’s about balancing the academy with homegrown signings. We’ve generally done this well, so it’s not something I’m too concerned about if we do sell off many of our homegrown players. They can be replaced via the academy and the transfer market, I think Amad will qualify as homegrown soon. I think Kane will be our main focus because he’s the best on the market, I don’t think age will be of much concern for ETH because he’ll want a balance on youth and experience, as we’ve seen with Casemiro and Eriksen, and I think he will want to assemble a squad that can compete for the biggest trophies as soon as possible.
Could be right regarding Rice, and there’s rumours that Arsenal want him now, and he’s been on record saying he wants to stay in London, so we could well just lose out on him anyway.
Those two, along with Patino and Chukwemeka, are very highly rated young midfielders. The former on loan from Arsenal at Blackpool and obviously the latter getting some game time at Chelsea now. They were all part of the England u19’s that won the Euros, apart from Patino, but all of them are currently in the u20’s now and should be playing at the u20 world cup this summer - unless their performances get them a call up to the u21’s ahead of this summer’s Euros.
Ones to look out for in the coming years, all should be playing premier league football soon. The Championship has become a grate development league over the last few years, many have made their name there and then stepped up to prem level and then even going on to become England internationals.
Ten Hag is very hot on building from the back in a bold way, which relies a lot on technically secure and press resistant players in defence and deep midfield. Obviously FDJ was a player he saw as a short cut to enabling United to play in this manner (as was Lisandro). I'd suggest that Rice (though technically underrated, as Rosso says) isn't the right profile for this role, and surely you only want to pay the kind of fee he would command if the profile is a very close match to what you want.
Chelsea will probably end up shelling out a combined £250m on Kane and Rice come June
I think something to consider is also how ETH may feel he could improve Rice in possession. He’s steadily improved that season on season, and that’s playing in a West Ham team, managed by Moyes, that aren’t big on keeping possession. Casemiro is an obvious player where we’re seeing more from him on the ball than at his previous club because he’s got more responsibility and is playing for a coach that is emboldening all his players with the ball.
But with Chelsea and Arsenal interested I think we could miss out anyway. I’d prefer we look at De Jong or Enzo Fernandez because they’ve already shown a superior ability on the ball.
We may go for Bellingham as well.
Dazza, I'm sure ETH could improve Rice, but why gamble on developing a skill set that isn't among his primary characteristics as a player? There must be a bunch of cheaper players who already match that profile where you're asking the coach to enable him to manage the transition to doing it at a higher level, which seems like a smaller ask / risk to me.
Bellingham isn't exactly that player either but I think he looks closer to it.
Because he may value his primary characteristics, and see upside in developing other parts of his game. I suspect this is why Arsenal and Chelsea want him as well.
It’s also worth considering what it is that ETH wants from a new midfielder and how they can compliment what is already in the squad and other signings.
Take you earlier point about building from the back. That can offset weaknesses in build up play in the midfield. Then there’s the issue we have with pushing up high and defending counters. This is a problem with the keeper we have and the midfield having issues defending counters when Eriksen is in the team. It’s why we our defensive line is one of the lowest in the league. We haven’t got the players to play in the opposition half for sustained periods.
As we’ve discussed before, ETH is a more adaptable coach than it was believed based on Dutch stereotypes. And whilst he’s obviously got principles he’ll want to have embedded, it doesn’t appear that he’s going to turn United into Ajax 2.
Availability is going to shape our transfer policy as much as anything. Bellingham doesn’t fit the model of a FDJ player. But then if we want to reference his Ajax sides, Gravenberch had a similar profile and played a completely different role from what FDJ did when both played under ETH.
I don’t think we’ll get Rice anyway, as I think he’ll stay in London. But everything I’ve read suggests Rice is high on our transfer list for midfield, and I don’t think ETH would turn his nose up at him because of him not fitting a profile we aren’t even certain that we’ll be targeting.
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Tielemans
Page 1 of 2
posted on 16/1/23
Ship out Elanga to raise some funds
posted on 16/1/23
Welcome to Chelsea
posted on 16/1/23
No he isn’t.
posted on 16/1/23
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
posted on 16/1/23
Nah. Rather see Hannibal given a chance next season
posted on 16/1/23
A few seasons back, maybe (like when he went to Leicester). Not now.
posted on 16/1/23
Not for now unless we do get him in which case I trust Erik's judgement with a useful squad addition.
posted on 16/1/23
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 9 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I literally only just read about Newcastle/McTominay. I’m surprised really - I thought they would be looking for a level above that. But if they want him, it’s because they think he’ll strengthen them, and to be fair he’s still a useful squad player in our current phase. So keep him for me.
posted on 16/1/23
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 10 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eddie must see something we don't
posted on 16/1/23
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 10 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eddie must see something we don't
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To be fair, the likes of Willock and Joelinton look like world-beaters now so perhaps he thinks he could do something with McTominay as well.
posted on 16/1/23
Why would they loan him out when he is out of contract in the summer?
posted on 16/1/23
No
posted on 17/1/23
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 11 hours, 3 minutes ago
Not needed currently. We could do worse than get him for free in the summer and sell McTominay. Newcastle are said to be interested.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
People want shot of all of McT, Elanga, AWB, Williams, Jones and Maguire, and them replaced with the likes of Tielemans, Kudus, Dest and Torres.
United are relatively fairly well stocked with homegrown players, but need to hang on to some squad players meeting the criteria for depth. They’ll have to promote from within or shell out on some homegrown players from elsewhere in the PL.
Tielemans’ application has been questioned by Leicester fans, particularly when he’s been dropped, and replacing a squad player on £50k p/w who is always fit and guaranteed to give you 100% off the bench with a squad player apparently demanding £200k p/w (which is reportedly why Arsenal walked away in the summer) and who chucks one when he isn’t playing every week doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.
Fwiw, as much as he adores United, I think McT will want to move on in the summer if he doesn’t believe he has a chance of playing minimum 25-30 games per season; but as others have suggested, I expect that several of the squad players who do leave will be replaced with promoted Academy players.
posted on 17/1/23
Tielemans, to me at least, seems to have regressed this last year or so but the stats here could be of interest to EtH if he thinks he can work with him - https://twitter.com/markrstats/status/1615043201886453760?s=20&t=r0rILeshRis6uwjggNbvDA
Ball progression and ball regains pretty high compared to quite a few midfielders.
posted on 17/1/23
No, no, no
posted on 17/1/23
Rosso, we can sign English players as well. I’d imagine Rice and Kane will be two players high up on our wishlist this summer.
There’s a good crop of young English players at u20 level as well, particularly in midfield. Alex Scott and Tim Iroegbunham in particular have been impressing in the Championship this season. The latter might be difficult to get off Villa, but both would be cheaper alternatives to Rice and could be top midfielders in the future.
posted on 17/1/23
comment by Lisandro The King Martinez (U10026)
posted 40 minutes ago
Rosso, we can sign English players as well. I’d imagine Rice and Kane will be two players high up on our wishlist this summer.
There’s a good crop of young English players at u20 level as well, particularly in midfield. Alex Scott and Tim Iroegbunham in particular have been impressing in the Championship this season. The latter might be difficult to get off Villa, but both would be cheaper alternatives to Rice and could be top midfielders in the future.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it’s something the club should always be considering, obviously.
I think the more sensible *focus* (although not the be-all-and-end-all) should be on developing the academy and identifying and bringing in young talent like Mejbri, Jurado and Garnacho.
Best case scenario is you sign the odd gem early enough that they become a homegrown player as they’re brought on and brought through. (Hopefully Garnacho will turn out to be one of these.)
Otherwise, you might have a few fairly talented players who you can add value to by helping them become homegrown, loaning them out, then selling them on.
(I should clarify that I don’t want to see United adopt the Chelsea model of hoovering up as many youngsters as is legally or otherwise possible just to loan them out perpetually to the players’ and no doubt in some cases families’ detriment.)
On Kane and Rice, as an aside, I’d be delighted if United signed either in the summer, but equally surprised. I think ETH will go younger up top and for a little more finesse in midfield (although Rice’s technical ability is still widely underrated).
posted on 17/1/23
I will look up Scott and Iroegbunham, btw thanks
My knowledge of the Championship is shameful; but keeping up with the Primeira Liga and PL is already more than I have time for nowadays!
posted on 17/1/23
As always it’s about balancing the academy with homegrown signings. We’ve generally done this well, so it’s not something I’m too concerned about if we do sell off many of our homegrown players. They can be replaced via the academy and the transfer market, I think Amad will qualify as homegrown soon. I think Kane will be our main focus because he’s the best on the market, I don’t think age will be of much concern for ETH because he’ll want a balance on youth and experience, as we’ve seen with Casemiro and Eriksen, and I think he will want to assemble a squad that can compete for the biggest trophies as soon as possible.
Could be right regarding Rice, and there’s rumours that Arsenal want him now, and he’s been on record saying he wants to stay in London, so we could well just lose out on him anyway.
Those two, along with Patino and Chukwemeka, are very highly rated young midfielders. The former on loan from Arsenal at Blackpool and obviously the latter getting some game time at Chelsea now. They were all part of the England u19’s that won the Euros, apart from Patino, but all of them are currently in the u20’s now and should be playing at the u20 world cup this summer - unless their performances get them a call up to the u21’s ahead of this summer’s Euros.
Ones to look out for in the coming years, all should be playing premier league football soon. The Championship has become a grate development league over the last few years, many have made their name there and then stepped up to prem level and then even going on to become England internationals.
posted on 17/1/23
Ten Hag is very hot on building from the back in a bold way, which relies a lot on technically secure and press resistant players in defence and deep midfield. Obviously FDJ was a player he saw as a short cut to enabling United to play in this manner (as was Lisandro). I'd suggest that Rice (though technically underrated, as Rosso says) isn't the right profile for this role, and surely you only want to pay the kind of fee he would command if the profile is a very close match to what you want.
posted on 17/1/23
Chelsea will probably end up shelling out a combined £250m on Kane and Rice come June
posted on 17/1/23
I think something to consider is also how ETH may feel he could improve Rice in possession. He’s steadily improved that season on season, and that’s playing in a West Ham team, managed by Moyes, that aren’t big on keeping possession. Casemiro is an obvious player where we’re seeing more from him on the ball than at his previous club because he’s got more responsibility and is playing for a coach that is emboldening all his players with the ball.
But with Chelsea and Arsenal interested I think we could miss out anyway. I’d prefer we look at De Jong or Enzo Fernandez because they’ve already shown a superior ability on the ball.
posted on 17/1/23
We may go for Bellingham as well.
posted on 17/1/23
Dazza, I'm sure ETH could improve Rice, but why gamble on developing a skill set that isn't among his primary characteristics as a player? There must be a bunch of cheaper players who already match that profile where you're asking the coach to enable him to manage the transition to doing it at a higher level, which seems like a smaller ask / risk to me.
Bellingham isn't exactly that player either but I think he looks closer to it.
posted on 17/1/23
Because he may value his primary characteristics, and see upside in developing other parts of his game. I suspect this is why Arsenal and Chelsea want him as well.
It’s also worth considering what it is that ETH wants from a new midfielder and how they can compliment what is already in the squad and other signings.
Take you earlier point about building from the back. That can offset weaknesses in build up play in the midfield. Then there’s the issue we have with pushing up high and defending counters. This is a problem with the keeper we have and the midfield having issues defending counters when Eriksen is in the team. It’s why we our defensive line is one of the lowest in the league. We haven’t got the players to play in the opposition half for sustained periods.
As we’ve discussed before, ETH is a more adaptable coach than it was believed based on Dutch stereotypes. And whilst he’s obviously got principles he’ll want to have embedded, it doesn’t appear that he’s going to turn United into Ajax 2.
Availability is going to shape our transfer policy as much as anything. Bellingham doesn’t fit the model of a FDJ player. But then if we want to reference his Ajax sides, Gravenberch had a similar profile and played a completely different role from what FDJ did when both played under ETH.
I don’t think we’ll get Rice anyway, as I think he’ll stay in London. But everything I’ve read suggests Rice is high on our transfer list for midfield, and I don’t think ETH would turn his nose up at him because of him not fitting a profile we aren’t even certain that we’ll be targeting.
Page 1 of 2