comment by Irishred (U2539)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robb #gotheSwans (U22716)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Irishred (U2539)
posted 3 minutes ago
Robb how are you sir?
Download rocked last night
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m good dude. May have low-key bought Evenescence tickets for August this week 😎
This download was one I particularly wanted to go to with Slipknot and the two Metallica nights. Did they play any rare ones last night? I watched one video of the crowd going crazy but one guy in the middle sat on a deckchair playing sudoku 😅
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leper messiah was one not played too much
Set list
https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/metallica/2023/donington-park-castle-donington-england-1ba689bc.html
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fuel, Leper and King Nothing are not normally played.
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 34 seconds ago
George Best with modern coaching and fitness methods would be Messi. Undoubtedly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
George Best didnt have the mentality required to be messi
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually, he didn’t have the same motivation - the money - or the same access to sports therapists that Messi does. The whole hypothetical in the OP is “what if..?”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree the more you gave George the more he took. He would have ended up the Delli Ali route , got the money and doesnt care no more
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 44 minutes ago
comment by FootyMcfootfoot (U21853)
posted 1 minute ago
They used to smoke st half time and the shirts and shirts alone made things difficult. The ball was concrete and skill on the ball nothing an average 7yr old can't so nowadays.
Totally different game but put haaaland back then and he'd score 20 a game 😂 fitness levels weren't really a thing. Subs didn't exist. They played games in fog etc where you couldn't even see anything 2 ft away it simply wasn't taken very seriously. Wages were a pittance and sportsmanship was important. That's one part of the game that's really suffered though.
Also at least players don't have to have a primary job outside the game anymore. Imagine working a full shift then having to go play 90 minutes on a pitch like the moon kicking a concrete ball about...I'll pass 😂
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The last part sounds like being a GAA player.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think he must be talking about the pre-war days of football for most of this description of an innocent bygone era..
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
----------------------------------------------------------------------
no one did
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
----------------------------------------------------------------------
no one did
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eh, right you are. Enjoy your day
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
----------------------------------------------------------------------
no one did
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eh, right you are. Enjoy your day
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I said he could end up following the same path as Ali, ie not give a $hit after he has made it.
No comparisons were made about the ability.
Sometimes I think you just read what you wanna read.
Teams back then only had 12 players, 11 plus a sub. They could take a kicking also. Think the game is too fast for those players and they'd struggle, but also vice versa, our soft generation of players playing on poorer pitches with heavier balls and contact.
comment by Shaun M - Livin da vi la Roca (U9955)
posted 37 seconds ago
Teams back then only had 12 players, 11 plus a sub. They could take a kicking also. Think the game is too fast for those players and they'd struggle, but also vice versa, our soft generation of players playing on poorer pitches with heavier balls and contact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
the look on their faces as Bremner charges in...... the look on the other 11 players face as they watch the guy writhing in pain after Bremner missed him!
I think the 100m is a good example of how althletes continue to improve. The talent is always there but the advancements of sports science and fitness means we keep seeing tiny improvements, your Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis would obviously have faster times with today's technology. Although Bolt does seem to be an actual freak that none else seems to be able to replicate.
It's literally only the same sport in name and objective. Everything else about it is completely different.
Professionalism
Off-pitch pressures
Off-pitch support
Rules (Laws)
Pitches
Ball
Sportswear
Pace
Fans
If you stuck Lionel Messi in a time machine and swapped him and Nobby Stiles, neither of them would know what the fack they were supposed to do.
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
It was a totally different game. Haaland and Kane wouldn’t score 5 a game in the 60s because in reality if you just dropped them into a game of that era tomorrow they’d be carried off on a stretcher after 5 minutes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Many of you seem to underestimate the massive difference in athleticism between modern footballers and the older generations. What's always stood out to me watching matches from the 60's thereabouts was just how unathletic they looked launching into clumsy tackles. Haaland would look like an absolute beast amidst those spaghetti-legged midgets.
Teams back then also used to complete entire league seasons with a roster of like 14 players. Except their bones were made different at the time, if they weren't getting stretchered off after 5 minutes, Haaland wouldn't either.
put modern day players on the cabbage patch pitches of yesteryear, with 2 inch thick leather boots, footballs that were as hard as medicine balls and see what happens
honestly Leeds 1970 would batter Man City 2023 in those conditions
Same as tennis, which has changed drastically in the last 50 years in terms of racquet technology and playing surfaces
put Djokovic up against Mcenroe or Laver with an old wooden racquet with animal gut strings on the sort of crazy fast low bouncing grass courts of that era, Djoko would get battered
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 1 hour, 21 minutes ago
George Best with modern coaching and fitness methods would be Messi. Undoubtedly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Or more like Ronaldinho. The freakish consistency of Messi and Ronaldo through their careers can't be replicated by everyone - definitely not George Best - in any hypothetical situation.
comment by peks - Aliens are here 👽 (U6618)
posted 1 minute ago
put modern day players on the cabbage patch pitches of yesteryear, with 2 inch thick leather boots, footballs that were as hard as medicine balls and see what happens
honestly Leeds 1970 would batter Man City 2023 in those conditions
Same as tennis, which has changed drastically in the last 50 years in terms of racquet technology and playing surfaces
put Djokovic up against Mcenroe or Laver with an old wooden racquet with animal gut strings on the sort of crazy fast low bouncing grass courts of that era, Djoko would get battered
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leeds honestly wouldn't though. They'd probably lose like 9-0 or something if you took Man City in a time machine to play in those exact conditions. Technically, tactically, physically, it'd just be pros against amateurs.
A good separate debate would be about pure talent vs longevity. Like I’d debate all night to say that Ronaldinho was a better footballer than Cristiano Ronaldo. But the latter had a longer career but imo at no point was he as good a player as Ronaldinho. So should longevity always be the barometer?
comment by Robb #gotheSwans (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
A good separate debate would be about pure talent vs longevity. Like I’d debate all night to say that Ronaldinho was a better footballer than Cristiano Ronaldo. But the latter had a longer career but imo at no point was he as good a player as Ronaldinho. So should longevity always be the barometer?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ronaldo scored 450 goals in 438 matches for Real Madrid. And scored 105 goals in 101 CL matches for Real Madrid. I don't know how you define "better footballer", but yes, Ronaldo at his peak was definitely a better footballer than Ronaldinho.
comment by Robb #gotheSwans (U22716)
posted 6 minutes ago
A good separate debate would be about pure talent vs longevity. Like I’d debate all night to say that Ronaldinho was a better footballer than Cristiano Ronaldo. But the latter had a longer career but imo at no point was he as good a player as Ronaldinho. So should longevity always be the barometer?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
another interesting debate is effectiveness over ability.
There have been many more talanted players than Ronaldo and Haaland but fewer are or were as effective as them imo.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 hour, 10 minutes ago
I think the 100m is a good example of how althletes continue to improve. The talent is always there but the advancements of sports science and fitness means we keep seeing tiny improvements, your Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis would obviously have faster times with today's technology. Although Bolt does seem to be an actual freak that none else seems to be able to replicate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
^^
Spot on.
From beginning to end.
comment by IAmMe (U18491)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 hour, 10 minutes ago
I think the 100m is a good example of how althletes continue to improve. The talent is always there but the advancements of sports science and fitness means we keep seeing tiny improvements, your Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis would obviously have faster times with today's technology. Although Bolt does seem to be an actual freak that none else seems to be able to replicate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
^^
Spot on.
From beginning to end.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
also genetics can change.... so when you get years and years of better genetics mixing then you improve the chances of genes getting better through the decades
The issue about being the best is not about being the best in an era, it is about being the best full stop.
We know how good players of the current day are in the most advanced era of football (due to coaching developments, equipment, sports science) but we could only speculate about how good the players from bygone days would be today. In other words, we have evidence about the performance of current players in this highly developed footballing era.
It is not the fault of players from eras gone by that they were not as well coached or nourished and that they had to play with worse equipment, but nonetheless they would not be as fit as today's players.
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 2 hours, 13 minutes ago
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 34 seconds ago
George Best with modern coaching and fitness methods would be Messi. Undoubtedly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
George Best didnt have the mentality required to be messi
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We will never know whether Messi would have had the mentality to be George Best either. Messi has had the benefit of being protected by the ever changing laws of the game that the likes of Best and Cruyff never had.
"....but I just wonder if you put Harry Kane or Lewandowski into a team in the 1960’s would they score 4/5 goals a game?"
No. For the same reason that George Best would be seen as a level above Ronaldo and Messi if you could transport him 60 years forward in time. Apart from the bowling green smooth grassy pitches of today, better boots, and the advances in diet, health, training etc, the biggest difference is the tackles the players back then had to endure. Parts of some games then look like a WWE match.
Imagine Ronny getting a drop kick in the back from Ron "Chopper" Harris and still finishing the game. I saw Bestie get one on an old Match Of The Day. The same two players were in the opening credits for years, Harris scything into Best from behind, George ridning it with his "running on rails" balance, where Ronny would have rolled across the box and into the net.
Likewise look at the protection a Best would get in 2023.
Could you imagine that nancy boy Jack Grealish coming up against Chopper Harris or Norman bites your legs Hunter. Let alone the cynical South American defenders of that generation.
"nancy boy"
Obviously someone hasn't been able to move on from 1970s homophobic slurs unlike the rest of the World.
Sign in if you want to comment
Football now vs Football of years gone by
Page 2 of 4
posted on 9/6/23
comment by Irishred (U2539)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robb #gotheSwans (U22716)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Irishred (U2539)
posted 3 minutes ago
Robb how are you sir?
Download rocked last night
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m good dude. May have low-key bought Evenescence tickets for August this week 😎
This download was one I particularly wanted to go to with Slipknot and the two Metallica nights. Did they play any rare ones last night? I watched one video of the crowd going crazy but one guy in the middle sat on a deckchair playing sudoku 😅
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leper messiah was one not played too much
Set list
https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/metallica/2023/donington-park-castle-donington-england-1ba689bc.html
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fuel, Leper and King Nothing are not normally played.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 34 seconds ago
George Best with modern coaching and fitness methods would be Messi. Undoubtedly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
George Best didnt have the mentality required to be messi
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually, he didn’t have the same motivation - the money - or the same access to sports therapists that Messi does. The whole hypothetical in the OP is “what if..?”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree the more you gave George the more he took. He would have ended up the Delli Ali route , got the money and doesnt care no more
posted on 9/6/23
comment by The Process (U20671)
posted 44 minutes ago
comment by FootyMcfootfoot (U21853)
posted 1 minute ago
They used to smoke st half time and the shirts and shirts alone made things difficult. The ball was concrete and skill on the ball nothing an average 7yr old can't so nowadays.
Totally different game but put haaaland back then and he'd score 20 a game 😂 fitness levels weren't really a thing. Subs didn't exist. They played games in fog etc where you couldn't even see anything 2 ft away it simply wasn't taken very seriously. Wages were a pittance and sportsmanship was important. That's one part of the game that's really suffered though.
Also at least players don't have to have a primary job outside the game anymore. Imagine working a full shift then having to go play 90 minutes on a pitch like the moon kicking a concrete ball about...I'll pass 😂
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The last part sounds like being a GAA player.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think he must be talking about the pre-war days of football for most of this description of an innocent bygone era..
posted on 9/6/23
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
posted on 9/6/23
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
----------------------------------------------------------------------
no one did
posted on 9/6/23
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
----------------------------------------------------------------------
no one did
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eh, right you are. Enjoy your day
posted on 9/6/23
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Heard it all now - comparing Best and Ali
----------------------------------------------------------------------
no one did
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eh, right you are. Enjoy your day
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I said he could end up following the same path as Ali, ie not give a $hit after he has made it.
No comparisons were made about the ability.
Sometimes I think you just read what you wanna read.
posted on 9/6/23
Teams back then only had 12 players, 11 plus a sub. They could take a kicking also. Think the game is too fast for those players and they'd struggle, but also vice versa, our soft generation of players playing on poorer pitches with heavier balls and contact.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by Shaun M - Livin da vi la Roca (U9955)
posted 37 seconds ago
Teams back then only had 12 players, 11 plus a sub. They could take a kicking also. Think the game is too fast for those players and they'd struggle, but also vice versa, our soft generation of players playing on poorer pitches with heavier balls and contact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
the look on their faces as Bremner charges in...... the look on the other 11 players face as they watch the guy writhing in pain after Bremner missed him!
posted on 9/6/23
I think the 100m is a good example of how althletes continue to improve. The talent is always there but the advancements of sports science and fitness means we keep seeing tiny improvements, your Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis would obviously have faster times with today's technology. Although Bolt does seem to be an actual freak that none else seems to be able to replicate.
posted on 9/6/23
It's literally only the same sport in name and objective. Everything else about it is completely different.
Professionalism
Off-pitch pressures
Off-pitch support
Rules (Laws)
Pitches
Ball
Sportswear
Pace
Fans
If you stuck Lionel Messi in a time machine and swapped him and Nobby Stiles, neither of them would know what the fack they were supposed to do.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
It was a totally different game. Haaland and Kane wouldn’t score 5 a game in the 60s because in reality if you just dropped them into a game of that era tomorrow they’d be carried off on a stretcher after 5 minutes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Many of you seem to underestimate the massive difference in athleticism between modern footballers and the older generations. What's always stood out to me watching matches from the 60's thereabouts was just how unathletic they looked launching into clumsy tackles. Haaland would look like an absolute beast amidst those spaghetti-legged midgets.
Teams back then also used to complete entire league seasons with a roster of like 14 players. Except their bones were made different at the time, if they weren't getting stretchered off after 5 minutes, Haaland wouldn't either.
posted on 9/6/23
put modern day players on the cabbage patch pitches of yesteryear, with 2 inch thick leather boots, footballs that were as hard as medicine balls and see what happens
honestly Leeds 1970 would batter Man City 2023 in those conditions
Same as tennis, which has changed drastically in the last 50 years in terms of racquet technology and playing surfaces
put Djokovic up against Mcenroe or Laver with an old wooden racquet with animal gut strings on the sort of crazy fast low bouncing grass courts of that era, Djoko would get battered
posted on 9/6/23
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 1 hour, 21 minutes ago
George Best with modern coaching and fitness methods would be Messi. Undoubtedly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Or more like Ronaldinho. The freakish consistency of Messi and Ronaldo through their careers can't be replicated by everyone - definitely not George Best - in any hypothetical situation.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by peks - Aliens are here 👽 (U6618)
posted 1 minute ago
put modern day players on the cabbage patch pitches of yesteryear, with 2 inch thick leather boots, footballs that were as hard as medicine balls and see what happens
honestly Leeds 1970 would batter Man City 2023 in those conditions
Same as tennis, which has changed drastically in the last 50 years in terms of racquet technology and playing surfaces
put Djokovic up against Mcenroe or Laver with an old wooden racquet with animal gut strings on the sort of crazy fast low bouncing grass courts of that era, Djoko would get battered
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leeds honestly wouldn't though. They'd probably lose like 9-0 or something if you took Man City in a time machine to play in those exact conditions. Technically, tactically, physically, it'd just be pros against amateurs.
posted on 9/6/23
A good separate debate would be about pure talent vs longevity. Like I’d debate all night to say that Ronaldinho was a better footballer than Cristiano Ronaldo. But the latter had a longer career but imo at no point was he as good a player as Ronaldinho. So should longevity always be the barometer?
posted on 9/6/23
comment by Robb #gotheSwans (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
A good separate debate would be about pure talent vs longevity. Like I’d debate all night to say that Ronaldinho was a better footballer than Cristiano Ronaldo. But the latter had a longer career but imo at no point was he as good a player as Ronaldinho. So should longevity always be the barometer?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ronaldo scored 450 goals in 438 matches for Real Madrid. And scored 105 goals in 101 CL matches for Real Madrid. I don't know how you define "better footballer", but yes, Ronaldo at his peak was definitely a better footballer than Ronaldinho.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by Robb #gotheSwans (U22716)
posted 6 minutes ago
A good separate debate would be about pure talent vs longevity. Like I’d debate all night to say that Ronaldinho was a better footballer than Cristiano Ronaldo. But the latter had a longer career but imo at no point was he as good a player as Ronaldinho. So should longevity always be the barometer?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
another interesting debate is effectiveness over ability.
There have been many more talanted players than Ronaldo and Haaland but fewer are or were as effective as them imo.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 hour, 10 minutes ago
I think the 100m is a good example of how althletes continue to improve. The talent is always there but the advancements of sports science and fitness means we keep seeing tiny improvements, your Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis would obviously have faster times with today's technology. Although Bolt does seem to be an actual freak that none else seems to be able to replicate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
^^
Spot on.
From beginning to end.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by IAmMe (U18491)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 hour, 10 minutes ago
I think the 100m is a good example of how althletes continue to improve. The talent is always there but the advancements of sports science and fitness means we keep seeing tiny improvements, your Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis would obviously have faster times with today's technology. Although Bolt does seem to be an actual freak that none else seems to be able to replicate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
^^
Spot on.
From beginning to end.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
also genetics can change.... so when you get years and years of better genetics mixing then you improve the chances of genes getting better through the decades
posted on 9/6/23
The issue about being the best is not about being the best in an era, it is about being the best full stop.
We know how good players of the current day are in the most advanced era of football (due to coaching developments, equipment, sports science) but we could only speculate about how good the players from bygone days would be today. In other words, we have evidence about the performance of current players in this highly developed footballing era.
It is not the fault of players from eras gone by that they were not as well coached or nourished and that they had to play with worse equipment, but nonetheless they would not be as fit as today's players.
posted on 9/6/23
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 2 hours, 13 minutes ago
comment by A Treble Without Cheating (U9335)
posted 34 seconds ago
George Best with modern coaching and fitness methods would be Messi. Undoubtedly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
George Best didnt have the mentality required to be messi
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We will never know whether Messi would have had the mentality to be George Best either. Messi has had the benefit of being protected by the ever changing laws of the game that the likes of Best and Cruyff never had.
posted on 9/6/23
"....but I just wonder if you put Harry Kane or Lewandowski into a team in the 1960’s would they score 4/5 goals a game?"
No. For the same reason that George Best would be seen as a level above Ronaldo and Messi if you could transport him 60 years forward in time. Apart from the bowling green smooth grassy pitches of today, better boots, and the advances in diet, health, training etc, the biggest difference is the tackles the players back then had to endure. Parts of some games then look like a WWE match.
Imagine Ronny getting a drop kick in the back from Ron "Chopper" Harris and still finishing the game. I saw Bestie get one on an old Match Of The Day. The same two players were in the opening credits for years, Harris scything into Best from behind, George ridning it with his "running on rails" balance, where Ronny would have rolled across the box and into the net.
Likewise look at the protection a Best would get in 2023.
posted on 9/6/23
Could you imagine that nancy boy Jack Grealish coming up against Chopper Harris or Norman bites your legs Hunter. Let alone the cynical South American defenders of that generation.
posted on 9/6/23
"nancy boy"
Obviously someone hasn't been able to move on from 1970s homophobic slurs unlike the rest of the World.
Page 2 of 4