prob wouldnt be the worst time to take ur points deduction would it?
Yeah im not against that, if the outstanding FFP issue under Roman was dealt with, that might be a touch, as long as we dont get a transfer ban.
Another season without a decent striker to support Nkunku & Jackson would be a nightmare
comment by InBefore (U20589)
posted 14 minutes ago
prob wouldnt be the worst time to take ur points deduction would it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They would be in the mire if they had a 10 point deduction this season.
HB, chatting blx, as usual
CFC 31 points , - 12 points =19 points
Luton> 19th -16 points
A max point deduction 12 , would put us in 15th place,as our G/D is + 5 over Brentfords - 5.
if we did get taken back to 19 points , im confident we will continue to build points at a better rate than Sheffield Utd, Burnley, Luton, Brentford Everton & forrest
? or have I got it wrong HB?
I think Chelsea's pain comes next season.
Your current 3 year rolling figures (4 allowing for Covid) are probably helped by a profit in 19/20, and record revenues since driven by UCL participation. Zero Europe with associated prize money, matchday and sponsor revenues will impact a lot. If you fail to make Europe again for next season it, the pain will continue unless you can plug that financial gap.
I don't think your owners will see you break the rules, but they will have to act to ensure you don't.
I think Chelsea's pain comes next season.
I knew you were going to say that
Chelsea should be stripped of titles just like City will be next year. They fudged the books for years. Lets not forget the transfer bans in the past too. Just another City when under Roman.
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 17 minutes ago
I think Chelsea's pain comes next season.
I knew you were going to say that
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ive given my reasons. Do you disagree?
I don't think your owners will see you break the rules, but they will have to act to ensure you don't.
Agreed
Yes, and this where we come to what levers can they pull.
Im not certain European football would benefit for that reporting period, as it will require the 8 year amortized contracts to be reduced to 5 years, That could increase the 5 year amortization bill by 30m +.
Will a European run bring that much in ?
C/L would be a different issue, but 6th. 7th 8th European football, I don't believe it would.
The only levers are increased sponsorship / advertising revenue and player sales.
The Bohley- Clearlake business model is centered around player trading.
So on the basis of that , i would expect the club to attempt to trade it's way to FFP compliance.
It is not an assured route , as the sales market is fraught with variables which may or may not work at the specific time.
But the club does have the assets, which has been the key to the huge risky spend.
How Cfc come out of this ?
I reckon the club maywell prevent an FFP breach, but i think it will come at the cost of players will have been sold that should have stayed, they probably will have had to weaken the squad to stabilise the clubs finances, due to their poor decision making in the transfer market.
The one thing that the new owners should be very good at is finance, they are on the learning curve as EPL club owners, i think once we get through all of this , they will be wiser and hopefully can continue build on the foundations/ legacy that Bates, Harding & Roman built
Kash,
Chelsea should be stripped of titles just like City will be next year. They fudged the books for years. Lets not forget the transfer bans in the past too. Just another City when under Roman.
Lots of big talk, without any substance.
You cannot compare the in- complete reporting under Roman for agents fees and commissions, to the charges City face.
Their 2017 PL title should be stripped and awarded to Spurs, clearly it was acquired by breaking financial fair play rules… 🤔
The crusty old SPu Nker has spoken
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 36 minutes ago
I don't think your owners will see you break the rules, but they will have to act to ensure you don't.
Agreed
Yes, and this where we come to what levers can they pull.
Im not certain European football would benefit for that reporting period, as it will require the 8 year amortized contracts to be reduced to 5 years, That could increase the 5 year amortization bill by 30m +.
Will a European run bring that much in ?
C/L would be a different issue, but 6th. 7th 8th European football, I don't believe it would.
The only levers are increased sponsorship / advertising revenue and player sales.
The Bohley- Clearlake business model is centered around player trading.
So on the basis of that , i would expect the club to attempt to trade it's way to FFP compliance.
It is not an assured route , as the sales market is fraught with variables which may or may not work at the specific time.
But the club does have the assets, which has been the key to the huge risky spend.
How Cfc come out of this ?
I reckon the club maywell prevent an FFP breach, but i think it will come at the cost of players will have been sold that should have stayed, they probably will have had to weaken the squad to stabilise the clubs finances, due to their poor decision making in the transfer market.
The one thing that the new owners should be very good at is finance, they are on the learning curve as EPL club owners, i think once we get through all of this , they will be wiser and hopefully can continue build on the foundations/ legacy that Bates, Harding & Roman built
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think this is about right. You'll need a reset to get you to a long term compliant position from where you can build.
The danger and difficulty is though that others are already on that path - Spurs, Villa, NUFC. Adding to Arsenal, Liverpool, City and United are also getting their house in order.
in a couple seasons time when CFC have reset and are in a building phase, there is no certainty you can get yourself back into Europe, let alone hit the heights you hit before.
A bit like United now, you are going to need the right people in the right positions at the club to get yourself moving forward with the sort of organised and effective strategy that City & Liverpool have, that NUFC, Spurs, Villa and Arsenal are progressing. So far, not seen too much of that from Chelsea.
I actually think it will take 3+ seasons for the club to get over the disastrous start that Bohely - Clearlake have made.The current round of 5 year amortizations will be on the wane, it will be easier to sell players.
What that will look like, I really would not know, going on the first two seasons decision making it is hard to be confident in the ownerships decision making.
The club may need to first totally restructure the footballing operation, new sporting directors, back room staff and so on. Getting the right people in is critical to how well the club will fare.
What we do know , is that the ownership has a track record of investing in the USA sporting franchises that they own.
They see CFC as an elite club, they want to rebuild the stadium, they have huge EGOs and want own a club that reflects their largess.
Importantly they have the means to do these things, but it will be dependent upon the club operating with FFP compliance & the quality and ability of the next Sporting directors , who hopefully will direct footballing operation , whilst they conjure up bright ways to turn the club into a cash cow.
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 3 hours, 22 minutes ago
HB, chatting blx, as usual
CFC 31 points , - 12 points =19 points
Luton> 19th -16 points
A max point deduction 12 , would put us in 15th place,as our G/D is + 5 over Brentfords - 5.
if we did get taken back to 19 points , im confident we will continue to build points at a better rate than Sheffield Utd, Burnley, Luton, Brentford Everton & forrest
? or have I got it wrong HB?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean 3 points above the relegation zone surely qualifies for being in the mire no?
yeah, putting like that you right
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 21 minutes ago
I actually think it will take 3+ seasons for the club to get over the disastrous start that Bohely - Clearlake have made.The current round of 5 year amortizations will be on the wane, it will be easier to sell players.
What that will look like, I really would not know, going on the first two seasons decision making it is hard to be confident in the ownerships decision making.
The club may need to first totally restructure the footballing operation, new sporting directors, back room staff and so on. Getting the right people in is critical to how well the club will fare.
What we do know , is that the ownership has a track record of investing in the USA sporting franchises that they own.
They see CFC as an elite club, they want to rebuild the stadium, they have huge EGOs and want own a club that reflects their largess.
Importantly they have the means to do these things, but it will be dependent upon the club operating with FFP compliance & the quality and ability of the next Sporting directors , who hopefully will direct footballing operation , whilst they conjure up bright ways to turn the club into a cash cow.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
By the time that CFC get their shiiiit in order they may well not be an elite club any more.
The current rules make it very hard to close the gap to the top. You have invested young so may be in 2 years this group will be purring but its a big if.
For me CFC need to really take a long term view to getting back up there, but you get the sense the owners lack patience. They clearly thought that doing what they did over the last 18 months would be quickly successful. It really had to work, but hasn't, so where they go from now, where their egos let them go is a difficult one. The longer CFC become irrelevant in the PL and Europe, the bigger the struggle will be to get back up there.
By elite club, they have the aspiration to return the club to such a level.
But will they get it right , ?
Currently i wouldn't bet on it, see how i feel at the end of the season
They are prepared to back the club, it really depends on how they build revenue streams.
Like i said , I believe that they are good with finance, it is what they do .
Its the footballing aspect they need to stay away from and bring in the best brains they can afford, as City have done.
Irrelevant ? look at the trophy cabinet, it carries weight.
A lot will depend on what % of the current squad works out and how many players it will take to get the club back to a top status.
I think we will finish 8th or 9th,and get to the final of the Carabao cup this season, if we finish strong, as in, starting to control games over 90ms , I won't be too disappointed tbh.
On getting it right ?
If we clear FFP, the Roman in- complete reporting issues in one piece and still have a squad valued at 1 bln along with a club that is operating on a healthy financial footing, then they wouldn't have totally failed in this initial phase of their tenure.
Unquestionably they have taken the club back years in terms of its ability to compete at an elite level, but if the club is running on a sound financial footing and progresses steadily then that will do.
To be fair Ifraka, its what I was expecting.
There has been a lot of noise over the last couple of years, if not on and off since Roman. Problem is people focus on specific areas, sometimes even confusing them with FFP activities or focusing on spend only whilst ignoring sales. There will always be the next year arguments, there nearly always have been.
Hi Jf,
Really positive news for the club for sure.
I think the next reporting window will be the crunch point. If the club can comply it should be an indicator that the club is able to operate & comply within a smaller economy.
I think compliance will be dependent upon the club raising enough funds through player sales.
We do have several players who are excess to the 25man squad.
Lets hope the club can keep hold of Gallagher
UTC!
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posted on 16/1/24
prob wouldnt be the worst time to take ur points deduction would it?
posted on 16/1/24
Yeah im not against that, if the outstanding FFP issue under Roman was dealt with, that might be a touch, as long as we dont get a transfer ban.
Another season without a decent striker to support Nkunku & Jackson would be a nightmare
posted on 16/1/24
comment by InBefore (U20589)
posted 14 minutes ago
prob wouldnt be the worst time to take ur points deduction would it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They would be in the mire if they had a 10 point deduction this season.
posted on 16/1/24
well why is that ?
posted on 16/1/24
HB, chatting blx, as usual
CFC 31 points , - 12 points =19 points
Luton> 19th -16 points
A max point deduction 12 , would put us in 15th place,as our G/D is + 5 over Brentfords - 5.
if we did get taken back to 19 points , im confident we will continue to build points at a better rate than Sheffield Utd, Burnley, Luton, Brentford Everton & forrest
? or have I got it wrong HB?
posted on 16/1/24
I think Chelsea's pain comes next season.
Your current 3 year rolling figures (4 allowing for Covid) are probably helped by a profit in 19/20, and record revenues since driven by UCL participation. Zero Europe with associated prize money, matchday and sponsor revenues will impact a lot. If you fail to make Europe again for next season it, the pain will continue unless you can plug that financial gap.
I don't think your owners will see you break the rules, but they will have to act to ensure you don't.
posted on 16/1/24
I think Chelsea's pain comes next season.
I knew you were going to say that
posted on 16/1/24
Chelsea should be stripped of titles just like City will be next year. They fudged the books for years. Lets not forget the transfer bans in the past too. Just another City when under Roman.
posted on 16/1/24
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 17 minutes ago
I think Chelsea's pain comes next season.
I knew you were going to say that
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ive given my reasons. Do you disagree?
posted on 16/1/24
I don't think your owners will see you break the rules, but they will have to act to ensure you don't.
Agreed
Yes, and this where we come to what levers can they pull.
Im not certain European football would benefit for that reporting period, as it will require the 8 year amortized contracts to be reduced to 5 years, That could increase the 5 year amortization bill by 30m +.
Will a European run bring that much in ?
C/L would be a different issue, but 6th. 7th 8th European football, I don't believe it would.
The only levers are increased sponsorship / advertising revenue and player sales.
The Bohley- Clearlake business model is centered around player trading.
So on the basis of that , i would expect the club to attempt to trade it's way to FFP compliance.
It is not an assured route , as the sales market is fraught with variables which may or may not work at the specific time.
But the club does have the assets, which has been the key to the huge risky spend.
How Cfc come out of this ?
I reckon the club maywell prevent an FFP breach, but i think it will come at the cost of players will have been sold that should have stayed, they probably will have had to weaken the squad to stabilise the clubs finances, due to their poor decision making in the transfer market.
The one thing that the new owners should be very good at is finance, they are on the learning curve as EPL club owners, i think once we get through all of this , they will be wiser and hopefully can continue build on the foundations/ legacy that Bates, Harding & Roman built
posted on 16/1/24
Kash,
Chelsea should be stripped of titles just like City will be next year. They fudged the books for years. Lets not forget the transfer bans in the past too. Just another City when under Roman.
Lots of big talk, without any substance.
You cannot compare the in- complete reporting under Roman for agents fees and commissions, to the charges City face.
posted on 16/1/24
Their 2017 PL title should be stripped and awarded to Spurs, clearly it was acquired by breaking financial fair play rules… 🤔
posted on 16/1/24
The crusty old SPu Nker has spoken
posted on 16/1/24
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 36 minutes ago
I don't think your owners will see you break the rules, but they will have to act to ensure you don't.
Agreed
Yes, and this where we come to what levers can they pull.
Im not certain European football would benefit for that reporting period, as it will require the 8 year amortized contracts to be reduced to 5 years, That could increase the 5 year amortization bill by 30m +.
Will a European run bring that much in ?
C/L would be a different issue, but 6th. 7th 8th European football, I don't believe it would.
The only levers are increased sponsorship / advertising revenue and player sales.
The Bohley- Clearlake business model is centered around player trading.
So on the basis of that , i would expect the club to attempt to trade it's way to FFP compliance.
It is not an assured route , as the sales market is fraught with variables which may or may not work at the specific time.
But the club does have the assets, which has been the key to the huge risky spend.
How Cfc come out of this ?
I reckon the club maywell prevent an FFP breach, but i think it will come at the cost of players will have been sold that should have stayed, they probably will have had to weaken the squad to stabilise the clubs finances, due to their poor decision making in the transfer market.
The one thing that the new owners should be very good at is finance, they are on the learning curve as EPL club owners, i think once we get through all of this , they will be wiser and hopefully can continue build on the foundations/ legacy that Bates, Harding & Roman built
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think this is about right. You'll need a reset to get you to a long term compliant position from where you can build.
The danger and difficulty is though that others are already on that path - Spurs, Villa, NUFC. Adding to Arsenal, Liverpool, City and United are also getting their house in order.
in a couple seasons time when CFC have reset and are in a building phase, there is no certainty you can get yourself back into Europe, let alone hit the heights you hit before.
A bit like United now, you are going to need the right people in the right positions at the club to get yourself moving forward with the sort of organised and effective strategy that City & Liverpool have, that NUFC, Spurs, Villa and Arsenal are progressing. So far, not seen too much of that from Chelsea.
posted on 16/1/24
I actually think it will take 3+ seasons for the club to get over the disastrous start that Bohely - Clearlake have made.The current round of 5 year amortizations will be on the wane, it will be easier to sell players.
What that will look like, I really would not know, going on the first two seasons decision making it is hard to be confident in the ownerships decision making.
The club may need to first totally restructure the footballing operation, new sporting directors, back room staff and so on. Getting the right people in is critical to how well the club will fare.
What we do know , is that the ownership has a track record of investing in the USA sporting franchises that they own.
They see CFC as an elite club, they want to rebuild the stadium, they have huge EGOs and want own a club that reflects their largess.
Importantly they have the means to do these things, but it will be dependent upon the club operating with FFP compliance & the quality and ability of the next Sporting directors , who hopefully will direct footballing operation , whilst they conjure up bright ways to turn the club into a cash cow.
posted on 16/1/24
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 3 hours, 22 minutes ago
HB, chatting blx, as usual
CFC 31 points , - 12 points =19 points
Luton> 19th -16 points
A max point deduction 12 , would put us in 15th place,as our G/D is + 5 over Brentfords - 5.
if we did get taken back to 19 points , im confident we will continue to build points at a better rate than Sheffield Utd, Burnley, Luton, Brentford Everton & forrest
? or have I got it wrong HB?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean 3 points above the relegation zone surely qualifies for being in the mire no?
posted on 16/1/24
yeah, putting like that you right
posted on 16/1/24
comment by ifarka, (B-C- out) (U8182)
posted 21 minutes ago
I actually think it will take 3+ seasons for the club to get over the disastrous start that Bohely - Clearlake have made.The current round of 5 year amortizations will be on the wane, it will be easier to sell players.
What that will look like, I really would not know, going on the first two seasons decision making it is hard to be confident in the ownerships decision making.
The club may need to first totally restructure the footballing operation, new sporting directors, back room staff and so on. Getting the right people in is critical to how well the club will fare.
What we do know , is that the ownership has a track record of investing in the USA sporting franchises that they own.
They see CFC as an elite club, they want to rebuild the stadium, they have huge EGOs and want own a club that reflects their largess.
Importantly they have the means to do these things, but it will be dependent upon the club operating with FFP compliance & the quality and ability of the next Sporting directors , who hopefully will direct footballing operation , whilst they conjure up bright ways to turn the club into a cash cow.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
By the time that CFC get their shiiiit in order they may well not be an elite club any more.
The current rules make it very hard to close the gap to the top. You have invested young so may be in 2 years this group will be purring but its a big if.
For me CFC need to really take a long term view to getting back up there, but you get the sense the owners lack patience. They clearly thought that doing what they did over the last 18 months would be quickly successful. It really had to work, but hasn't, so where they go from now, where their egos let them go is a difficult one. The longer CFC become irrelevant in the PL and Europe, the bigger the struggle will be to get back up there.
posted on 16/1/24
By elite club, they have the aspiration to return the club to such a level.
But will they get it right , ?
Currently i wouldn't bet on it, see how i feel at the end of the season
They are prepared to back the club, it really depends on how they build revenue streams.
Like i said , I believe that they are good with finance, it is what they do .
Its the footballing aspect they need to stay away from and bring in the best brains they can afford, as City have done.
Irrelevant ? look at the trophy cabinet, it carries weight.
A lot will depend on what % of the current squad works out and how many players it will take to get the club back to a top status.
I think we will finish 8th or 9th,and get to the final of the Carabao cup this season, if we finish strong, as in, starting to control games over 90ms , I won't be too disappointed tbh.
posted on 16/1/24
On getting it right ?
If we clear FFP, the Roman in- complete reporting issues in one piece and still have a squad valued at 1 bln along with a club that is operating on a healthy financial footing, then they wouldn't have totally failed in this initial phase of their tenure.
Unquestionably they have taken the club back years in terms of its ability to compete at an elite level, but if the club is running on a sound financial footing and progresses steadily then that will do.
posted on 16/1/24
To be fair Ifraka, its what I was expecting.
There has been a lot of noise over the last couple of years, if not on and off since Roman. Problem is people focus on specific areas, sometimes even confusing them with FFP activities or focusing on spend only whilst ignoring sales. There will always be the next year arguments, there nearly always have been.
posted on 16/1/24
Hi Jf,
Really positive news for the club for sure.
I think the next reporting window will be the crunch point. If the club can comply it should be an indicator that the club is able to operate & comply within a smaller economy.
I think compliance will be dependent upon the club raising enough funds through player sales.
We do have several players who are excess to the 25man squad.
Lets hope the club can keep hold of Gallagher
UTC!
Page 1 of 1