I cannot fault your maths.

You forget the

-gse

Not maths OOE, Chemistry

Rampant6393:

If it was a chemical equation, then it doesn't want
=
but
->

it's a tricky question and very few stumble across the answers easily, not least without spending the money that brings the answers with it.

I see it as a combination of things, and I'd probably think most people's answers are similar.

Firstly, I think the formula starts with C for collective, whilst it's nice to have star players who just ooze quality like your Stimacs, Saunderses and Eranios, the other players surrounding them must all have the same common objective and mindset. You cannot send XI men out with some wanting to win, some wanting to draw, some indifferent and some just trying not to lose.

The next in the formula is O for Organisation, the collective of XI needs a firm understanding of what his role is in the team and how he fits in. Brian Clough used to select players for specific roles, mainly what they CAN do, not what they cannot. Currently reading "Nobody ever says thank you" and in that it mentions someone mocking BC for signing Hinton based on what he cannot do, but BC knew and organised the likes of Hinton and McGovern to play solely to their abilities.

Next in the formula is SM for Self motivation. Whilst it's a team game, a team is only as good as it's weakest link and it's no good being the best player in your own back garden if you cannot play on the pitch. We have had a desperate history in recent years of players unwilling to make up for any lack of ability with motivated performances, and plenty more of decent players not playing with motivation.

The next in the formula is I for Influence. Every team in my opinion needs at least ONE leader, ideally that needs to be on the pitch and Derby have had loads throughout history with the likes of Mackay, MacFarland, Todd, Stimac, Hindmarch, Wright, Van Der Laan and even to some extent Savage. However, in the case of Savage, the leader didnt have the required respect from his team-mates to be able to drag the team from the jaws of defeat onto victory.

Then I'd say you need CR for Creativity. Pretty obvious but someone must possess the intelligence to see the pass and deliver to create opportunities.

Then I'd say A for Aggression. Not many people think having players with this attribute is important, but I challenge anyone to name a successful team that didnt possess aggressive players in it.

Then MS for Mental Strength. Perhaps not so much back in the 60s and 70s when fans and players mingled freely and there was no real gulf in wealth, attitude nor philosophy. But nowadays, every paying spectator acts as though football owes them something and each player is almost expected, if not demanded to produce 100% A-star performances at all times. Any player unable to handle the groans and moans of an expectant fanbase is destined to fail.

C.O.SM.I.CR.A.MS = awesome.

You also need a few quality players and the rest at least competent.

OOE, very true. I have an A in A-Level Chemistry, you'd never guess though! Don't need it now anyway

Mostyn

Great post and cleverly done to boot.

Particularly interested in your comments about players and what they can/cannot do. I believe John McGovern was another, like Hinton, who BC came under heavy critisism for buying not just from Fans and Media but his own Board. He was there, as far as I have learned, to win the ball and give it to those who could do something useful with it, a job which unfortuantely he continued to do under Cloughie at Forest.

I have to take a back seat when it comes to commenting on the team and their attributes these days (another reason for reaching out to those who can), so I would be very interested to read if there are similar players in the current set up who are there to do a specific job and do it well.

The article about Bryson and his workrate gave valuable insight into how the midfield engine runs. Is he the Guy that breaks things up and wins the ball for more creative players???

Also felt your comments about mental strength were spot on. The CCC is a highly competitive league, so I have always felt that those with a lack of MS seem to fall by the wayside. Could that be Cywka's weakness?

Bryson has tremendous workrate and several attributes (or quirks/qualities) that stand out for me in a player. One of them being his ability to run with the ball AND his head up looking for a team-mate to pass to. (Compare to Stephen Pearson and his head bowed and looking down at the ball, then passing to nobody). Bryson is more of a box-to-box player when it comes to things though and he seems to involve himself in many different roles as opposed to being a specific 'breaker-up' of play. He does attack and defend and cover far too much of the pitch to maximise his contribution in my opinion (a bit like Savage did, indisciplined) and the team would perhaps benefit from him being reined in a bit more.

AS for Cywka, I've never seen anything from his performances to suggest any issues mentally. In fact, I dont think he's ever been one of the worst performers on the pitch when playing and other than the scapegoating he received for losing the ball on the halfway line (when 10 other teammates were goalside of him) against Portsmouth, I cant think of owt he ever did wrong, certainly nothing above the usual that all of our players do! The Cywka case seems more to do with off the pitch, probably bad attitude, poor training or something.

Can't fault the formula which pretty well sums up what appears to be simple, but actually takes some thought/time to construct and just doesn't happen by simply throwing money at it.

I agree with I'mnotSpartacus about quality, the quick-thinking skilled players able to make a telling pass/deliver a decent free-kick/dead ball.

I'd also add that you need players who tend to be consistent, steady-eddies/unsung heroes. I remember Clough criticising McEveley, saying he had to offer more than one good performance one week and then a poor/disappointing one the next couple of games. Of course a player's form dips over the season, but that if a particular player doesn't perform as well as usual, you hope another is able to step up & take responsibility.

SDS

Add a pinch of depth with a spoonful of experience and mix in just a smidge of extra quality you might actually have a half decent chance

For a first article that's not bad MR Black will comment on it later mate, busy me owd china!!

5

Another vital component.. sheer hard graft, from the first minute to the last.. Championship games are so tough to win and you have to work hard, esp when things aren't going a teams way and make something happen..
It's great to see the work ethic that Clough has installed this season at Derby.. and against Coventry it showed, scoring late on in the game.. something that has been missing so much in recent times..

Trust and team spirit and everyone agreed on club strategy.

First The Manager.
Clough has already learned a lot on man management -perhaps his weakest area. He comes across as completely honest and not devious. What you see is what you get. He calls for honest and fair play and discourages refereee dissent. My guess is that we are one of the fairest, foul free clubs in the league. Dirty play is not even on the agenda. It is firmly discouraged, unlike some clubs we have seen at PP.

Player Recruitment and Team Selection..
Getting them to buy into the club philosophy. I thinkNigel would never have signed Savage because he was naturally disruptive and boasted of his high wages and exotic life-style. But recognising the huge cost and a need Derby had for experience, Clough managed to get the best out of Robbie rather than him languishing at Brighton. In other words - making the most of what assets you inherit - rather than the players you would like. Building a team with positive interaction between the various players (team-building) takes time. 3 years with current player contract durations is about what it takes.

The Team.
This needs a group of players with complementary skills and attributes and all players believing they are fully involved and therefore they give of their utmost in every situation. It needs experienced players and enthusiastic yougsters who believe anything is possible. The players need to know they will be treated fairly and looked after when injured.

I believe Nigel, withe the full knowledge and encouragement of GSE has very largely created these conditions within the club and it's why we are doing very well. On current form we must be regarded as promotion material. It's a great pity we had our injury and form slump period when we dropped so many points after a brilliant start. But with luck and continued belief I think we can finish points wise in the top four.

What do we need?

1) A deeper squad. At the start of the season, and again now, our form is 'top-6'. What these 2 periods have in common is only a couple of 1st teamers out. In between we had a period with 4,5 maybe even 6 players at one point who were unavailable, and we all know what happened.

That's not to say some of the teenagers who came in and did a job are at fault - far from it. However there's a big difference between having a few teenagers blended into an experienced team, and putting a team out with an average age that barely makes it into the 20's.

Included in that deeper squad should be cover for every position. Yes, that does include full-backs!

2) A midfield 'general'. No worries with Barks as captain, and you can see his influence in the way the defence has tightened-up since he's come back.

Actually this illustrates my earlier point nicely. O'Brien was magnificent for us, but Shaun brings something else as well as his personal performance.

Anyway, getting back to the point, obviously Barks has less influence when The Rams are in the attacking third, and that is what I see the 'midfield general' doing. Pulling strings, organising the attack, making good choices and keeping play at a tempo that hurts the opposition.

and that's it. We're really not that far froma top-6 side.

problem is 'midfield general' types are expensive, so I don't see GSE getting one for us as a new years' present.

Sds regarding Leicester and Forest trying to buy the league over the last few years, that's up to them. We've been there and done it with Arthur Cox, and it didn't happen to us the first season. But I will say this Nigel Clough as we all know wants players to train hard in training. Listen to the manager and training staffs instructions get you head down and knuckle down, if they do that they will be in the first 11. Nigel has said all the way along that is what he wants from his players. To tell you the truth he has got a lot of his dad in him.
Regarding the players, it's just the work ethic. they are all of the same caliber in mid field, their work rate is unbelievable. Even Ward and when Ben Davies plays, their work rate is unbelievable as well.
Like I've said if you put the work in Nigel will play you, week in week out and he will be happy with you, because you're doing your job, and that's what your being paid. It's no surprise that we're doing so well with Barker being back. His captaincy is second to none. (I Want to say this he will be a selling asset for GSE) I've seen him talking to the players, and organising them, and I think that's why Roberts is playing so well in this last month.
Finally, we all know, we need a creative mid-field player in the middle of the park to create the goals for our goal scorers, cause that's what we;re lacking, and we still IMO still need a dead ball specialist. Good article SDS. Do you fancy going Burnley Saturday?

Some great comments Guys, and very enlightening.

Ramdini

Your points about trust are bang on. When you know for sure what the man next to you is going to be doing, and how hes gonna do it and that he's damn good at it, I believe you'll get that trust. Interesting to note Cwyka is being released, and wonder if that is related to your points about trust. I thought he had a good amount of quality when I saw him a couple of seasons back, but he obviously either doesnt fit or isnt towing the line. Only my opinion though.

Wideboy

Thought your comments about depth in squad, Midfield Generals and the need to have reliable replacements when injuries are apparent are all prevolant and as you rightly state, will depend very much on some investment in the squad. Like you, I wont be holding my breath, Xmas is a long way away.

Wassa

Very encouraged to hear that Barker is stepping up to the plate as our Leader. I really do like it when the Captain is a centre half. There were comments about whether a Centre Half is in the greatest position to lead a team. I believe so, as he has pretty much the whole team in front of him, so when shape goes to pot he will be the first to know. Not just that but your best leader IMO should be organising that back line. Emphasis on line.

Id love to come with you to Burnley Mate, but payday aint til Wednesday and Im rostered to be working day shift anyway, but I am studying the fixture list as we speak to find an away trip thats I can manage

Thanks again for all the positive response, my equation was somewhat vague but I know alot more about the construct of our team now. Which ultimately was what I was looking for.

Cheers

ow' do sds? top thread

just finished a nite shift and read this but too tired to contribute anything useful - some really good points have been made..... ta

Alright Kernow

Not bad ere Mate, hope you and yours are fairing well in 2012. Know all about tired me owd. Hope youve got the weekend off.
Sorry I aint been in touch, been way too long.

Cheers for the compliment