Martinez is wrong here...

comment by toffeegod (U1345)



posted 5 minutes ago


Out senior team have apparently already played their most difficult game of the qualifying group in Switzerland and I don't think any games next summer for that side will (hopefully!) require us to go in with all our major players. As it is if you leave out all the players under 21 you can still make what should be a decent team.

Hart
Baines
Cahill
Jags
Johnson
Henderson
Lallana
Milner
Townsend
Rooney
Sturridge

I appreciate there may not be the most creativity or width on the midfield that Sterling or the Ox are giving you but that is an ok team to play against Slovenia which is our one competitive game next year.

You only have to look at Germany to see the wisdom in fielding a strong team in an under 21's competition to see the progression into the senior squad.
2009 - Win Euro u21's championship
2010 - Promote a good chunk of that squad into the world cup team and exceed expectations by coming 3rd
2014 - One full cycle later and that team still with a number of veterans from that u21 championship win the world cup.
I'm not saying it will happen for England but surely it is time to give something like that a go rather than plodding on disappointingly in the same manner, tournament after tournament?


==

Thankfully you understand

It's not that people don't "understand" the idea it's whether or not you agree, other teams have been successful by utilising the U21 team,others have been successful without doing so.

It's worth pointing out that Spain aren't exactly tearing it up at the moment, and even Germany, despite being World Champions, already look a shadow of the team we've seen over the last 4-5 years.

Too much copying others and not enough using the strengths within lately. Football works in cycles, if you spend your time copying the next best thing you'll be trying a new approach every four years.

Spain and Germany also utilise B teams, and at their peak were one or two team leagues, and players from these teams made up the bulk of the international teams.

You cannot just say 'oh, they did well at under 21 and then seniors, so if we go hard in the U-21s we will be successful at senior level'. There are lots of variables.

This is not copying the latest fad.

This is using common sense to bring together a group o players under a man many believe to be the next england boss and have them all work together at a tournament.

But feel free to give your ideas on how it should be done TOOR as the suck it and see approach way has not worked since 1967

I can't see that we'd be worse off trying it this way, we can't keep doing the same thing that has failed to bring us success for the last 40+ years and expect it to change. We've had good players in that time but we've never had a truly great team who looked like they thought they were going to win game after game at the highest level.
Letting proven premiership players who are u21 team up for this tournament could be the kick start for a group of them to experience winning at the international level and potentially it spill over into the senior team.

The definition of madness is doing the same thing time and time again but expecting a different result.

comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga... (U1308)
posted 1 hour, 21 minutes ago
This is not copying the latest fad.

This is using common sense to bring together a group o players under a man many believe to be the next england boss and have them all work together at a tournament.

But feel free to give your ideas on how it should be done TOOR as the suck it and see approach way has not worked since 1967
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Make take on how it should be done has many factors, simply copying others won't work, for me.

Firstly you have to get rid of negativity, this affects the players' massively. That starts with the manager. Bring somebody in British who can encourage players to play in their own way, an attacking style, which the English are good at. The media has to stop with the negativity which the sheep carry on.

B teams entering the lower leagues would help greatly also in my opinion.

There are many things which aren't right. I don't think stopping young players who are the best in their positions from playing is one of them.

Again who said copy others. I said that the talented group of young english players will got to a major tournament with their next senior manager.

And we are not stopping them from playing, we are playing them as a group, to develop an learn how each other plays over a longer period. This will introduce positivity as a winning group develop

The simple fact is, when you have better players the younger ones will play for the U21s. As it is a lot of players have retired recently and everyone was crying out for that so the new players can come in and now the new media agenda is to push the young players back to the U21s.

It's not the media agenda you fool, it is the desire of the current U21 manager Gareth Southgate, a strong willed Man who knows he own mind when it comes to what he wants

For some strange reason you think the Daily Mail picks what happens in the UK....that it drives opinions here. What it does is publish rubbish 50 year old middle class folks want to read. Now that is not the Emgland fanbase is it

Or is it how the people charged with stopping the rot we have been in since 1966