Evening everyone.
Still feel our midfield balance has been wrong for the majority of the season. Fellaini and Pogba is never going to be a '2' that will have the right blend to successfully attack and defend. I would argue that almost every Utd fan on here would agree with that.
Most Utd fans have also called for a 4-3-3 to get the most out of Pogba, having a sitting midfielder to screen the defence and give greater freedom to Pogba and whoever else is selected to play alongside him. Herrera seems to have been tasked with the more disciplined role as the deepest CM, and whilst that may be sufficient enough for some games, I think it would be very naive to play with it every week.
Normally, I like a DM in the mould of Carrick, someone who orchestrates play from deep, using their intelligence to always be in the right position, and someone who isn't reckless and eager to put a foot in. Blind is the most natural replacement for Carrick if we wish to replicate this tactic, but for the suggestion I am about to propose, a different kind of DM would be required.
Juan Mata, a player who has thrived as a #10 and also deployed as an inside right for us, would surely be a player who could drop deeper into CM and play alongside Pogba. Mata is hard working off the ball despite his slight frame and lack of athleticism. He is the kind of player who can make things happen further back, has a good passing range and is more than adept at setting the tempo and keeping possession in tight and crowded areas. He could be key to starting counter attacks, receiving the ball deeper, rather than being the guy expected to carry the ball forward where he can often slow the play down. I use Cazorla as an example who has flourished in a deeper role, albeit in a system that suits him a lot, but Mata is of a simialr ability and style, and provided we have a strong and disciplined DM behind both him and Pogba, I think it is something that could really work.
With our current set of players, I don't think we have the right holding midfielder for it to work. Schneiderlin doesn't have the positional intelligence or the mentality to play that role at Utd for me. He looks lost and lacking the belief to be here. Dissapointing really as I thought he would be great for us, but it appears he was made to look a lot better in Saints' system.
In easier games, Herrera could play that DM role, and Carrick would be more than competent, but it would make our midfield painfully slow.
A defensive midfielder like Carvalho or Danilo could provide the right steel and athleticism. It's too late now, but Wanyama would've been a decent shout too.
Carvalho/Danilo
Mata Pogba
Lingard/Miki Zlatan Martial
I'd love to see Mata deeper provided we acquired a DM that could provide the platform for Mata and Pogba to do the damage offensively, but for now, it may be an option that we explore later down the line.
Carrick
Herrera Pogba
That midfield three above would be my pick for the majority of games for the near future, but that could still be improved upon, either in Jan or the summer, and I feel it is our missing piece from the jigsaw.
Mata in CM.
posted on 17/10/16
I don't quite understand people's desire to see him blooded there
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My reasoning is or was before we signed Pogba at least was we hadn't had anybody with his power, aggression and dynamism in that area for a good while and even though we have signed Pogba, we're still missing a real ball winner and somebody who's defensively very good.
That combination of attributes is why I'd have liked him to be given a chance in midfield and I still would.
I can't help but think of Michael Essien when thinking about Fosu-Mensah.
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What are your thoughts on moving forward with a regista in a 4-3-3, rather than a more physical, destructive defensive mid TRS? Do you like Herrera in there?
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I'm not against the idea but I'm not sure Herrera is right for the role long term because he can be quite careless in possession at times. I've doubts about his positional sense from a defensive point of view and his awareness of what's around him.
I prefer him linking play further forward but let's see how things develop.
The role in question seems ideal for Blind.
posted on 17/10/16
Yep, positional sense is my biggest worry with him being in there.
That is something that can be learned though, and he has, in my opinion, one of the very best to learn from in Michael Carrick. Hopefully Jose has them working together in training if he plans on continuing the experiment.
I also think Blind could also be a very good fit, but it would seem Jose only wants to deploy him at the back.
posted on 17/10/16
----------------Herrera
---------Mata----------Pogba
______________
Which one of these three will do the defending then?
I hope I'm wrong but I would expect that midfield to get murdered on the counter by the pace of Liverpool.
posted on 17/10/16
comment by redmisty (U7556)
posted 1 hour, 7 minutes ago
----------------Herrera
---------Mata----------Pogba
______________
Which one of these three will do the defending then?
I hope I'm wrong but I would expect that midfield to get murdered on the counter by the pace of Liverpool.
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All three will defend when required, obviously, but primarily Herrera, as he has in the last two league games and second half against City.
This same midfield wasn't murdered by the pace of Leicester.
posted on 17/10/16
This same midfield wasn't murdered by the pace of Leicester.
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Probably because Leicester don't play with three in the middle and don't get about you with the same aggression and intensity as Liverpool do and Leicester were pathetic that day if we're honest.
If Herrera, Pogba and Mata is our midfield tonight, I think we'll be thoroughly outfought and outmanoeuvred in the middle.
posted on 17/10/16
Leicester play angled balls through the midfield as well as over the top when they counter. Their attacking midfield and forward players are amongst the quickest in the league.
Yes, they were poor during our recent meeting but we still had to deal with that threat, and we did so very comfortably.
With Lingard providing support for the midfield and Zlatan and either Rashford or Martial as the out balls, we can match them without putting undue pressure on ourselves and isolating Zlatan or Rashford again, which has been an unmitigated disaster when it has happened, with us pinned back and unable to retain possession. Plus there's value in consistency; it's worked very, very well the last two league games.
I'm not even sure what sensible alternatives we have tonight. Would people rather see Fellaini in? Or an unfit and underprepared Carrick? Or Blind in an unfamiliar role?
posted on 17/10/16
Plus what better midfield players do we have at keeping possession of the ball under pressure than those three? Fellaini over Herrera maybe?
posted on 17/10/16
Plus what better midfield players do we have at keeping possession of the ball under pressure than those three? Fellaini over Herrera maybe?
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Mata has often been found wanting when pressed by good sides.
I'd personally bring Carrick back in if he's fit to start as we'll probably need someone with a bit of composure tonight who can give us some sort of a foothold. He knows how to properly sit and protect and he has the ability to beat Liverpool's press with his distribution.
posted on 17/10/16
Not saying TFM can't end up in midfield, plenty of defenders and midfielders switch roles in their career and TFM is still at a stage where he's learning his best role.
It just seems on here so many automatically assume TFM will be a CM because he can seemingly operate like Essien when I can't imagine many have even seen him to really know. Just seems odd the number of people who seem so sure that's where his future lays.
I've only seen him for the first team where he's only been tried in defence and from what I've read the U21s moved him there as they felt that was a more natural role but also gave him a variety of roles to develop his all round game.
posted on 17/10/16
What Red Side said. Hope I'm wrong though because we could well see that midfield for all I know.