Ok guys, I’ve been meaning to write this since the United gamedbut have either been too angry or couldn’t give a fack to actually get to it. Fortunately though, everything is still relevant. Quick summary, I blame all 3 parties - Levy/Paratici, Conte, Players - for the mess we are in (despite us currently 4th). So anyway here goes:
1. Levy/Transfers
As others have said, he simply never invests enough in this team, most painful examples when we were 3rd with Redknapp and he bought facking Nelson, Saha in Jan; 18months no signings under Poch; this past summer when we had a chance to kick on under Conte.
Seriously, the fans saying we “won" the transfer window? Have a word with yourself. All we did was buy depth, not a single player has been good enough to cement a first 11 with the exception of possibly Persic who I don’t rate anyway. Richarlison for £50/60m was and is a joke and is turning out exactly like many of us feared would happen deep down. He ultimately just replaced Bergwijn who had already found great form by then - our depth has not improves yet we’re about £30m net down with those 2 transactions. How we managed to only buy depth while still having a terrible bench and looking really light with a few injuries, I’ll never know.
What is the point in Champions League if we sign poor players that we could have attacted regardless?
In addition to this, look at players like Dier, Davies, Sanchez, Sess who were not good enough 6 years ago, they are now first choice pretty much - how can that be allowed to happen. Reguilon was far better than Sess, why the fack has he left? Ndom/Lo Celso/Winks - why can’t “Darth" levy manage to sell them? Absolutely disgusting squad investment and that’s perhaps the only area where I excuse Conte for.
2. Conte
Performances always catch up with results. When we were scrapping results, everyone was dancing and oblivious to what was round the corner. Its great to enjoy wins but you have to see the bigger picture and the trend was that the results wouldn’t last.
This is EXACTLY what happened with Mourinho - scrapped results, false position (top of the league). Those who advised caution were told they were moaners but then predictably the team slid down the table. Only difference I see is from Feb for about 3 months, Conte showed he is capable of getting the team to play great football. The fact hes had his preseason and weve gotten worse may actually be more worrying?
Lack of rotation. All the depth from the transfer window? This doesn’t exist and even in the positions where rotation is possible, Conte flogs the same players to death. Absolutely poor management which is contributing to the results catching up. I won’t mention Spence/Emerson as we all know the situation there.
Tactics. Always playing out from the back even when we can’t handle the press. Lack of ingame subs. Slow build up play that inevitably results in passing back to Lloris. Its absolutely brainless tactical management.
Mentality. I always hear he has a “winners mentality"? But the guy is so negative and defeatist in interviews. Not long ago he was crying like a B after Burnley beat us. But in all matches against the big 6 he comes out with “we cannot compete", “they are another level". Not only does this give the players a ready made excuse for crap performances, but sometimes hes talking absolute rubbish.
We have the players to do more. It feels like every week now where you could argue we’ve had the worse match/half of the season. Marseille away first half, Man U entire match, notts forest (both games), Chelsea, Arsenal, Bournemouth first half. These were absolutely disgusting.
3. Players
Touched on it earlier but a bunch of these guys are just not good enough. We all know who they are. Ultimately though, they aren’t the ones picking themselves and as bad as Emerson is, he tries his best and IMO is being exposed by Conte. Sometimes good management is taking a player out the firing line and helping to build up their confidence.
4. Conclusion
For me, while Levy and the Players are key contributors, I ultimately have the biggest issue with Conte right now. Our squad is probably still top 5 in the league, 6th at worse. So yes while we are CURRENTLY 4th, the type of football he has us playing is not acceptable. There are far worse squads and far more inexperienced managers in the league who play better.
I don’t know where we go from here. I’d like Conte to leave but my main preferences from last year (Ten Hag and Potter) are both gone now. I just think the club needs a change from top to bottom and any progress in the CL this year and currently being 4th in the league is just papering over the crack. Last thought to say if you bothered to get this far: to think at the start of the season, we were tipped for a title tilt! The squad can’t be that bad then afterall can it 😉
A structured rant
posted on 11/11/22
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 4 minutes ago
I mean we aren’t in a mess just a bit of bad form. We pretty much lost our attacking line up recently so it’s no surprise we’ve tailed off.
I think the way we finished the season got people far too giddy for this season. We was never going to be in a title challenge ffs.
This time last year these players were struggling to win in the conference league.
Everyone knows I back conte yet will be surprised to know I actually hate the 3 at the back formation but I’m also fed up with changing manager all the time.
We gave poch time and he did all right even though his first 12 months was pretty bad.
Arsenal gave Arteta time & Liverpool gave Klopp time and they’ve got their team firing after a few years.
Patience is needed as for me we probably need another 10 players to come in and out over the next two windows.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So literally a whole new team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Like that will happen
posted on 11/11/22
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 3 hours, 55 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 16 minutes ago
I repeat, decent article and rant to he fair. Cannot argue against most of it. The only thing is the rotation bit. Who out of our better players can you actually rotate with? Richarlison for Son or Kane maybe, but then Richarlison has been injured. Midfield who is going to rotate with Bentancur and PEH? Skipp clearly not good enough to be starting, and Bissouma is starting to get played. The defence is all of a muchness, whoever starts doesn't matter they are all 3 or 4 out of 10 players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean, I agree with everything I Repeat is saying, but come on Sandy, it’s exactly the same shiiiiit I’ve been saying for ages an I got absolute pelters from you. You’ve changed your tune!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah you just moan 24/7 even when Spurs win. This article is fairly well constructed and the OP makes some decent points.
posted on 11/11/22
comment by Dave&Danny (U4428)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 4 minutes ago
I mean we aren’t in a mess just a bit of bad form. We pretty much lost our attacking line up recently so it’s no surprise we’ve tailed off.
I think the way we finished the season got people far too giddy for this season. We was never going to be in a title challenge ffs.
This time last year these players were struggling to win in the conference league.
Everyone knows I back conte yet will be surprised to know I actually hate the 3 at the back formation but I’m also fed up with changing manager all the time.
We gave poch time and he did all right even though his first 12 months was pretty bad.
Arsenal gave Arteta time & Liverpool gave Klopp time and they’ve got their team firing after a few years.
Patience is needed as for me we probably need another 10 players to come in and out over the next two windows.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So literally a whole new team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Like that will happen
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well quite!
posted on 11/11/22
Hengy/Devonshire
I think the point you are both missing is that on paper, 4th & CL last 16 looks great. Hell it is great on paper. But if you step back, we are in trouble. Perhaps mess is the wrong word, but the are significant issues with the club:
Recruitment is shocking, academy is poor, playing style is horrible, we can’t get rid of players, significant players are getting on a bit now/contract coming to an end, including Kane, Son and Lloris.
I also am sick of always sacking managers but when you have the wrong manager then unfortunately thats what you have to do. Conte isn’t the man for a big rebuild, nor was Jose and Nuno simply weren’t good enough.
Arteta and Klopp, like Poch, are more “project” managers and so giving them time made sense. You could also see what they were trying to do within the first year whereas with us, our football 12 months ago was just as bad, albeit our results were worse.
I struggle to see things getting any better in the near future (2-3 years) so maybe we should just enjoy this season while it lasts. Unfortunately though, the football is so bad that is basically impossible!
posted on 11/11/22
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 3 hours, 55 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 16 minutes ago
I repeat, decent article and rant to he fair. Cannot argue against most of it. The only thing is the rotation bit. Who out of our better players can you actually rotate with? Richarlison for Son or Kane maybe, but then Richarlison has been injured. Midfield who is going to rotate with Bentancur and PEH? Skipp clearly not good enough to be starting, and Bissouma is starting to get played. The defence is all of a muchness, whoever starts doesn't matter they are all 3 or 4 out of 10 players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean, I agree with everything I Repeat is saying, but come on Sandy, it’s exactly the same shiiiiit I’ve been saying for ages an I got absolute pelters from you. You’ve changed your tune!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah you just moan 24/7 even when Spurs win. This article is fairly well constructed and the OP makes some decent points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh give it a rest mate. This article is titled "a structured rant" which is exactly the same as I've been doing. Myself and I Repeat have already discussed the fact that we share similar thoughts regarding where the club is heading and I'm almost certain that he'd agree that even when we've won, there have been issues with the team and performance. It's not as linear as "three points means everything is rosy". You CAN be happy with the three points AND point out areas of concern. In fact, arguably the greatest manager of all time, Alex Ferguson, won the Scottish Cup with Aberdeen and tore into his players because although he won he wasn't happy with the performance. This is no different.
Anyway, you clearly have selective hearing because after the Liverpool game, I was one of the more positive voices in the post-match discussion because I thought the performance for an hour was decent and we deserved more from the game. You only hear what you want to here. As far as you're concerned, I'm moaning 24/7 and I'm an Arsenal fan. The absurdity of the latter claim discredits the former.
In short, there isn't a great deal of respect given to your opinions anyway. Most people on here find you ridiculous. I've been one of the kinder ones. You're welcome.
posted on 11/11/22
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 4 minutes ago
I mean we aren’t in a mess just a bit of bad form. We pretty much lost our attacking line up recently so it’s no surprise we’ve tailed off.
I think the way we finished the season got people far too giddy for this season. We was never going to be in a title challenge ffs.
This time last year these players were struggling to win in the conference league.
Everyone knows I back conte yet will be surprised to know I actually hate the 3 at the back formation but I’m also fed up with changing manager all the time.
We gave poch time and he did all right even though his first 12 months was pretty bad.
Arsenal gave Arteta time & Liverpool gave Klopp time and they’ve got their team firing after a few years.
Patience is needed as for me we probably need another 10 players to come in and out over the next two windows.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So literally a whole new team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No a better squad
posted on 11/11/22
I repeat
It wasn’t just great on paper it was unbelievable in reality.
It goes to show just how good we can be under conte when he has his trusted players fit & ready.
Our squad is a bit of mess though I agree. We have players from 4 different managers in it.
My biggest worry is of conte was to leave we will have no one who will hold the board accountable like conte does.
For all of the good poch done for him to let the board go god knows how long without a signing was his ultimate downfall. Could you imagine conte letting that happen?
I get some don’t like conte and his style I was never a fan and had those managers you mentioned too of my list to replace Jose.
Although he’s inter team played some lovely football.
posted on 11/11/22
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 59 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 3 hours, 55 minutes ago
comment by sandy, golden boot winner fa cup 1901 (U20567)
posted 16 minutes ago
I repeat, decent article and rant to he fair. Cannot argue against most of it. The only thing is the rotation bit. Who out of our better players can you actually rotate with? Richarlison for Son or Kane maybe, but then Richarlison has been injured. Midfield who is going to rotate with Bentancur and PEH? Skipp clearly not good enough to be starting, and Bissouma is starting to get played. The defence is all of a muchness, whoever starts doesn't matter they are all 3 or 4 out of 10 players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean, I agree with everything I Repeat is saying, but come on Sandy, it’s exactly the same shiiiiit I’ve been saying for ages an I got absolute pelters from you. You’ve changed your tune!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah you just moan 24/7 even when Spurs win. This article is fairly well constructed and the OP makes some decent points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh give it a rest mate. This article is titled "a structured rant" which is exactly the same as I've been doing. Myself and I Repeat have already discussed the fact that we share similar thoughts regarding where the club is heading and I'm almost certain that he'd agree that even when we've won, there have been issues with the team and performance. It's not as linear as "three points means everything is rosy". You CAN be happy with the three points AND point out areas of concern. In fact, arguably the greatest manager of all time, Alex Ferguson, won the Scottish Cup with Aberdeen and tore into his players because although he won he wasn't happy with the performance. This is no different.
Anyway, you clearly have selective hearing because after the Liverpool game, I was one of the more positive voices in the post-match discussion because I thought the performance for an hour was decent and we deserved more from the game. You only hear what you want to here. As far as you're concerned, I'm moaning 24/7 and I'm an Arsenal fan. The absurdity of the latter claim discredits the former.
In short, there isn't a great deal of respect given to your opinions anyway. Most people on here find you ridiculous. I've been one of the kinder ones. You're welcome.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Calm down fridgeboy, I like your passion, and although we have never met, I am sure we would get on just fine. But you really do need to try to enjoy the wins a bit more. OK it may not always be pretty, but a win is a win. And Spurs still sit top four, and are through to knockout stages of the CL. So, yes the football has not been brilliant, but plenty of clubs in the Prem would like to be where Spurs are right now.
They still have the basis of a very decent team, but they do need to get the defence sorted in the next couple of windows.
I am getting on a bit now, so I have to enjoy everything that comes along. I may never see Spurs win another trophy, but I will enjoy the wins however they come. I don`t like losing, but sometimes you have to bite the bullet, and accept you cannot win every match.
posted on 11/11/22
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 1 hour, 4 minutes ago
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 4 minutes ago
I mean we aren’t in a mess just a bit of bad form. We pretty much lost our attacking line up recently so it’s no surprise we’ve tailed off.
I think the way we finished the season got people far too giddy for this season. We was never going to be in a title challenge ffs.
This time last year these players were struggling to win in the conference league.
Everyone knows I back conte yet will be surprised to know I actually hate the 3 at the back formation but I’m also fed up with changing manager all the time.
We gave poch time and he did all right even though his first 12 months was pretty bad.
Arsenal gave Arteta time & Liverpool gave Klopp time and they’ve got their team firing after a few years.
Patience is needed as for me we probably need another 10 players to come in and out over the next two windows.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So literally a whole new team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No a better squad
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeh better squad is what is needed. The squad players are just not up to it.
posted on 11/11/22
Moan & Groan everywhere!
Conte is the problem, the players are the problem, Levy is the problem..........
I'd like to see this thread AFTER the Leeds game!