Spurs have been pretty unrelenting in their tactical approach to games.
The high line is not a new feature in modern football. But Spurs, with their full backs tucked into the midfield and often up front, this is a new approach and it certainly does leave the space in behind more exposed. The flip side being that we have so many bodies up field it is easier to put pressure on the ball making it harder for the opposition to accurately expose that space.
But it certainly is playing with fire. Sometimes it does take much quality for the opposition to be baring down on the goal 2 v 2 or worse. NUFC had an early chance.
2 things that come to my mind.
1. It is high risk, so it will cost us at times. But if it allows us to play the attacking way were are, is it a risk worth taking. Would we see Udogie tapping in from 2 yards if we didnt play this way?
I know fans will moan on the days that the strikers dont quite click and the high line costs us, but will it be successful more often than not?
I personally think fans need to really embrace this approach, risks'n all. Accept that we will not been water tight but that we will be prolific scorers/chance creators.
2. I hear pundits and others sound uncomfortable about this approach. It's not the norm, its something different, its very attacking and it is higher risk. It is therefore an approach that is not necessarily embraced by people like Neville and Carragher as it is so far from their comfort zone as defenders, it goes against their natural instincts, they cannot fully get on board and consider it rather naïve or foolish.
As a consequence you hear comments like - "Spurs fans will have a lot of fun this season" "It's going to be entertaining at Spurs". These i find slightly condescending, implying that its an entertaining, good fun approach but not one to be taken too seriously, o for Spurs to be taken too seriously.
You also hear comments like "Spurs won't win anything playing like this", presumably based on the view that you firstly need to be defensively solid before you can be successful.
Now until we win something playing in this fashion I suppose that will always be the claim. But i would challenge the view that it cannot be successful.
In the games we have lost this season, I would not put it down to suicidal high line defending, other than our 9 men vs Chelsea. WHU fluked a couple goals, Villa had a set piece and a play through our makeshift CB pairing, Wolves scored from 2 crosses with runners from midfield. Yes we could have conceded goals from breaks in those games, but generally we have let in very few like this.
No one criticises City for their high line and the ease that we broke on them and scored at Etihad. Its seen as a trade-off and an integral part of their tactics. Spurs, when fully fit, went to Arsenal and went toe to toe and were easily their equals. We should have put several passed high flying Villa. The attacking positive mindset saw us compete with City, despite missing half the team. We just pumped Newcastle.
The key is having the right players for the system, and with the starting XI or so, we have not been beaten. The drop off since Chelsea has shown that the depth is not yet there to make this system work all the time, but for me that does not mean the system cannot work or be successful.
How do Spurs fans view it. Right now there is a lot of enjoyment with Spurs and even in defeat there is still a lot of goodwill towards the team and Ange. But that will not last forever if we are not successful. Can we be successful playing in this fashion?
Spurs' high line
posted on 12/12/23
comment by LukaBrasi Ange-r management (U22178)
posted 39 minutes ago
It’s not about the highline, it’s that Davies is not as good as VDV and Dier is a joke - the Wolves pens = pure Dier. Watkins goal was us being carved open to easily and arguably Davies fault. Man City - poorly organised meant Son scores an own goal, Bissouma faaaack up and the second goal was Doku destroying Davies like Son did Trippier.
Wow apart from Dier there is so much BS here to unpick.
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You miss the point, totally.
posted on 12/12/23
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by LukaBrasi Ange-r management (U22178)
posted 30 minutes ago
Can these tactics be successful, bring us trophies, potentially challenge for the title. Are they too open too risky too attacking?
Yes, Pep has proved they work.
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Peps City are different. They have one FB in Walker who is the Insurance policy using his pace to cover. Their other is often a CB like Ake or Akanji who does not bomb forward so much , and often makes it 3 at the back. Ours are often in the opponents box or edge of the area.
If theirs is a high line, ours is a high line plus when you look at average positions.
Most teams play a high line and compress space to press the opposition, but not all high lines are the same and I see ours as the most aggressive, which is why I has the question whether our approach can be successful.
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Time will tell. In the meantime stay away from pundits and the media in general for your own health.
posted on 12/12/23
Ange's philosophy is sure we might get steal some results with a low block but 9/10 it serves only to delay the inevitable in a particular match AND the players do not develop how to play pressing, attacking football against better teams so it would be perpetuating the issue. On top of the stuff already highlighted relating to negative attitudes and mixed messages.
What also gets lost in the jealousy / ridicule of opposing fans is that if he gets a good early lead against a dangerous opponent or to counter a specific key opponent he will make subtle adjustments within his system. It is not normally immediately noticeable in game because it is so subtle but post-game analysis of average player positions can reveal that he is smarter than just all out Angeball.
posted on 12/12/23
comment by LukaBrasi Ange-r management (U22178)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by LukaBrasi Ange-r management (U22178)
posted 30 minutes ago
Can these tactics be successful, bring us trophies, potentially challenge for the title. Are they too open too risky too attacking?
Yes, Pep has proved they work.
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Peps City are different. They have one FB in Walker who is the Insurance policy using his pace to cover. Their other is often a CB like Ake or Akanji who does not bomb forward so much , and often makes it 3 at the back. Ours are often in the opponents box or edge of the area.
If theirs is a high line, ours is a high line plus when you look at average positions.
Most teams play a high line and compress space to press the opposition, but not all high lines are the same and I see ours as the most aggressive, which is why I has the question whether our approach can be successful.
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Time will tell. In the meantime stay away from pundits and the media in general for your own health.
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Im not a filterer, so I will listen to pundits/other opinions etc and disagree with them if i want
posted on 12/12/23
The high line is not a new feature in modern football.
===
No it isn't.
posted on 12/12/23
comment by LukaBrasi Ange-r management (U22178)
posted 5 hours, 26 minutes ago
It’s not about the highline, it’s that Davies is not as good as VDV and Dier is a joke - the Wolves pens = pure Dier. Watkins goal was us being carved open to easily and arguably Davies fault. Man City - poorly organised meant Son scores an own goal, Bissouma faaaack up and the second goal was Doku destroying Davies like Son did Trippier.
Wow apart from Dier there is so much BS here to unpick.
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This is why I filtered you before Luka, for being boring and just making glib statements.
If you disagree, absolutely fine with that - but actually explain why, otherwise all you’ve said is that there is so much BS to unpick and then you’ve not unpicked any of it.
Devon and I rarely agree but at least he tells me why, then we can have, you know, a debate.
The way you make these glib statements - well it just plays up to the image of a Coke fuelled l, pound shop Ace who likes the sound of his own voice but contributes little and like I said before, I find it very boring and will just stick you on ignore unless you liven up a bit.
Cheers
posted on 12/12/23
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 6 hours, 22 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - There used to be a football club... (U18109)
posted 39 minutes ago
comment by Christopher huffing glou (U20930)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 hour, 29 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 8 hours ago
comment by JustCallMeTed (U21528)
posted 2 hours ago
The "high line" only works if you have a speedster run back man like VDV.
With VDV out of action the high line is dangerous.
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It works better with a speedster but has worked OK without one.
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If getting 4 points out of 15 is 'ok', what is bad?
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We're not talking about results per se, we are talking about the style and approach.
The poor results were not so much to do with the style and in particular the High Line (the clue about what we are talking about is in the title).
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But your talking about people 'condescending 'spurs fans..then you say its not about result per se...its always about results, and your 'high line' clearly is part of the reason of your recent results.
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which of the goals we've conceded during this period would you attribute to the highline?
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It’s not about the highline, it’s that Davies is not as good as VDV and Dier is a joke - the Wolves pens = pure Dier. Watkins goal was us being carved open to easily and arguably Davies fault. Man City - poorly organised meant Son scores an own goal, Bissouma faaaack up and the second goal was Doku destroying Davies like Son did Trippier.
The West Ham game was just bad luck from start to finish in that second half after we had destroyed them in the first. The goal we conceded against Newcastle was atrocious defending all round but to be fair we were 4-0 up with a few mins to go and had completely switched off at that point
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"Its not about the high line"
This thread IS about the high line!!!!
If you want to bang your drum about squad depth, then do it somewhere else.
You are preaching to the converted telling us that playing a LB at CB is a not a good thing. We know this.
We are talking about tactics not individuals, and how this may or may not be a success in the future. A future that we assume will see some better defensive cover.
So lets assume we have your preferred pick for back up CB and may be even a new striker and a replacement for Hojbjerg, which allows seamlessly maintain our style of play even when making changes.
Can these tactics be successful, bring us trophies, potentially challenge for the title. Are they too open too risky too attacking?
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Calm down you big girls blouse
I am specifically addressing the question of 4 points from 15 being ok - no it is not, no I do not think the highline is the issue, yes I think our lack of decent CB cover is.
I ain’t banging no drum
As for your question - yes I believe the highline tactics with the right balance of players and squad depth will bring success.
Now let’s all just move on
posted on 12/12/23
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/23985295.kilwinning-witness-appeal-man-performs-sex-act-train/
Between Kilwinning & Saltcoats!
Which of you cants...?
Stocky build
posted on 12/12/23
FFS wrong thread!
posted on 12/12/23
"But that will not last forever if we are not successful. Can we be successful playing in this fashion?"
Yes.
There's already an unbelievably good first eleven already and we've hardly started on a rebuild that is years overdue.
The VDV/Romero defensive axis is vital and needs to be bolstered first and foremost, and then a few additions and I'm looking at potentially the best and most complete Spurs side I've ever seen.
For me, Vicario looks better than Lloris ever did, Porro and Udogie edge Walker and Rose, Maddison, Bissouma and Sarr edge Erikson, Dembele and Wanyama/Sissoko, and VDV and Romero edge Vertonghen and Alderweireld. Deki is miles better than Moura.
Levy's lucked out again with a core of great, new, relatively inexpensive young players and last time under Poch when it needed that final push he failed to stump up. He had an excuse back then with the impending new stadium build, but he doesn't now so I expect funds to be forthcoming. If he doesn't then it's Levy Out without a doubt