I notice there's been some words from Ukraine that a few there might not be feeling the love from Labour.
This isn't a dig at Ukraine (I pinky promise I voted remain 2016 and Labour 2024)
My main worries is and has been for a good few years..
1. The environment / climate change (now climate emergency because we've reached that point)
2. Ukraine
3. Cost of living
My 2016 vote in the final hours of that referendum came down to the environment / climate change. I figured as a nation economically not much would change for us in the UK whether we remained in or left the EU.
However I thought about that environmental policy (Paris 2015). That by remaining in the EU, the environmental targets of the UK for the next few decades would be sharpened.
But that wasn't to be and here we are and whilst not the UKs fault we see in the news more fire, more flooding, more displaced peoples by odd weather patterns, and god knows what else is incoming.
Anyway jumping back to Ukraine I have read that some in Ukraine are feeling abandoned by Labour
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/nov/08/relationship-between-uk-and-ukraine-has-worsened-since-labour-won-election
Even though I voted labour this summer just like the rest of us, I do have concerns toward labour whether they're actively promoting support to Ukraine or not? I bloody well hope they are!!
Now that Trump is in, Ukraine is now dependent on European support. Trump isn't a fascist he just sees everything in monetary value. Every meeting /discussion is about how many dollars can he make?
So the EU needs to forget about US support and get it's sh!!!t together.
The UK may not be in the EU anymore, but geographically and I think spiritually a lot of us here still think of ourselves as being European. I certainly do.
Going back to Ukraine and labour I would love to think that we will continue to support Ukraine by any means, but if Labour has suddenly distanced it's self a bit I will be disappointed even as a Labour voter.
Labour / Ukraine Relations
posted 3 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by #1 House - (U17162)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by RB&W - He kicked lumps out of them (U21434)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by #1 House - (U17162)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by RB&W - He kicked lumps out of them (U21434)
posted 24 seconds ago
I figured as a nation economically not much would change for us in the UK whether we remained in or left the EU.
_______
----------------------------------------------------------------------
During the 14 years of Cons, austerity and UC would have remained a thing in or out of the EU. Public services and support toward those most in need would remain 0 in or out of the EU for as long as the cons remain in charge. This cannot be disputed.
Economically bills and costs have been crap for everyone, not just brexitland
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Grow up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesting!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
really?
posted 3 hours, 18 minutes ago
comment by RB&W - He kicked lumps out of them (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by #1 House - (U17162)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by RB&W - He kicked lumps out of them (U21434)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by #1 House - (U17162)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by RB&W - He kicked lumps out of them (U21434)
posted 24 seconds ago
I figured as a nation economically not much would change for us in the UK whether we remained in or left the EU.
_______
----------------------------------------------------------------------
During the 14 years of Cons, austerity and UC would have remained a thing in or out of the EU. Public services and support toward those most in need would remain 0 in or out of the EU for as long as the cons remain in charge. This cannot be disputed.
Economically bills and costs have been crap for everyone, not just brexitland
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Grow up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesting!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
really?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah not really.
posted 3 hours, 18 minutes ago
Going back to Ukraine and labour I would love to think that we will continue to support Ukraine by any means,
____
By ANY means.
Do you really mean this?
posted 3 hours, 13 minutes ago
He's not.
….
Yes he is. Read the definition of it. It pretty much all applies to Trump.
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
comment by UmaThurmans_BigToe (U22864)
posted 4 minutes ago
I was with you OP until you said this “ Going back to Ukraine and labour I would love to think that we will continue to support Ukraine by any means, but if Labour has suddenly distanced it's self a bit I will be disappointed even as a Labour voter.”
I certainly don’t think UK Europe NATO ETC should support Ukraine “by any means” sorry but if that means the citizens of NATO are put in harms way then thanks Ukraine but we come first. It’s a crap situation but Ukraine isn’t worth risking WW3 for. Unless Russia attacks a NATO member directly there’s not much more NATO can and should be doing tbh.
And yes I know NATO sent Ukraine up sheeets creek without a paddle by egging them on to overthrow a democratically elected leader and install a puppet with the promise of letting them in but that’s just how the monkey gets forked sometimes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's fair. I can appreciate the concerns with 'by any means' in terms of supporting Ukraine.
This is just me from my own personal perspective, but I've never seen a world power invade a country so close to home in the manner in which they have. To me it seems as though there has been no legitimate justification for it other than a land grab. Yes NATO expansion etc. but NATO is already the most powerful security organisation on earth, why does it need to expand?
NATO does not, so the Russian arguments makes no sense for invasion.
I compare Russia to a world power still because Russia still has the power to blow up the world if it wants to.
posted 3 hours, 1 minute ago
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 8 minutes ago
He's not.
….
Yes he is. Read the definition of it. It pretty much all applies to Trump.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No he's not. He's an angry man baby when he doesn't get is way yes. He not a fascist. He's motivated by money.
Being one and 'pretty much' one are totally different things. Might as well say that pink is 'pretty much' red'. Not the same thing but you can understand they're in the similar range.
posted 2 hours, 53 minutes ago
No he's not. He's an angry man baby when he doesn't get is way yes. He not a fascist. He's motivated by money.
…..
He is also motivated by power. And he will use it to have his political enemies and anyone else who disagrees with him arrested. He has already said he is going to do this.
And he is going to use his military to do it. Again he has already said this. Four of his top advisers from his last presidency have stated they believe he is a fascist.
He is going to appoint people who will not tell him no. Again, he has already said this.
Have you not been paying attention to what he says and does?
posted 2 hours, 50 minutes ago
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 1 minute ago
No he's not. He's an angry man baby when he doesn't get is way yes. He not a fascist. He's motivated by money.
…..
He is also motivated by power. And he will use it to have his political enemies and anyone else who disagrees with him arrested. He has already said he is going to do this.
And he is going to use his military to do it. Again he has already said this. Four of his top advisers from his last presidency have stated they believe he is a fascist.
He is going to appoint people who will not tell him no. Again, he has already said this.
Have you not been paying attention to what he says and does?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
and there you have it.
Think Hitler in the late 1920s and 39s
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
https://x.com/ErikSolheim/status/1690958686875734016?t=EksU9LlMcfaSig5uzBXLlg&s=19
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by #1 House - (U17162)
posted 1 hour, 39 minutes ago
comment by UmaThurmans_BigToe (U22864)
posted 4 minutes ago
I was with you OP until you said this “ Going back to Ukraine and labour I would love to think that we will continue to support Ukraine by any means, but if Labour has suddenly distanced it's self a bit I will be disappointed even as a Labour voter.”
I certainly don’t think UK Europe NATO ETC should support Ukraine “by any means” sorry but if that means the citizens of NATO are put in harms way then thanks Ukraine but we come first. It’s a crap situation but Ukraine isn’t worth risking WW3 for. Unless Russia attacks a NATO member directly there’s not much more NATO can and should be doing tbh.
And yes I know NATO sent Ukraine up sheeets creek without a paddle by egging them on to overthrow a democratically elected leader and install a puppet with the promise of letting them in but that’s just how the monkey gets forked sometimes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's fair. I can appreciate the concerns with 'by any means' in terms of supporting Ukraine.
This is just me from my own personal perspective, but I've never seen a world power invade a country so close to home in the manner in which they have. To me it seems as though there has been no legitimate justification for it other than a land grab. Yes NATO expansion etc. but NATO is already the most powerful security organisation on earth, why does it need to expand?
NATO does not, so the Russian arguments makes no sense for invasion.
I compare Russia to a world power still because Russia still has the power to blow up the world if it wants to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://x.com/ErikSolheim/status/1690958686875734016?t=EksU9LlMcfaSig5uzBXLlg&s=19