Yup, the great man is correct. If I want to watch people conserving tyres, I'll go on the M1.
The tyre situation is an absolute shambles
I see where your coming from but I disagree.
To me, any kind of racing is as much about strategy as it is about raw pace, and F1 is no exception.
I love to see drivers/riders pushing each other hard to fight for a victory as much as the next man, but I also respect that knowing when to push and when to bide your time is just as important.
You can do that with durable tyres as well. Not being able to push consistently is the problem
F1 markets itself as the pinnacle of Motorsport i.e the fastest. Cars from the V10 era are much faster. Plenty of reasons for that, in my view, not all justified.
I think its redicolous that we will be watchin 1.5 turbos next season. F1 should have put the price of fuel up to the teams, and you would have noticed a massive increase in investment to make F1 cars more economical
Agree on the tyres, disagree on the engines.
A smaller engine will be more economical than a big one, and the current trend in the motor industry is smaller turbo-charged engines.
This will enable them to make more strides in that area of tech, and further improve the efficiency/power output of commercially available engines, which benefits all drivers.
Did you actually watch F1 3 years ago?
After reading the article on the BBC by Gary Anderson, I now see why Schumi is complaining and why he did so well at his peak. Here's what GA had to say:
"When I was involved with Bridgestone tyres with Jordan in the early 2000s, in the middle of the tyre war with Michelin, Schumacher and Ferrari had tyres we were not even allowed to look at.
They cost so much money that Bridgestone could not afford to supply them to everyone. And whenever we did have an opportunity to run a derivative of those tyres, our lap times were much, much better."
So whilst the spectacle of watching people trying to conserve tyres is not much fun, at least they are ALL on the same boots. Surely then that is part of the art of racing. Maybe they should have a tyre that can last the race, and only able to use one compound for the whole race, so no compulsory pitstops. Then racing will be ON the track.
The link to the article:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/mobile/formula1/
Most of the racing already is ON the track. The pit-stop drama is an added bonus.
An added bonus that can ruin a persons race, and with the lack of tyre longevity the chances of that happening increasing, ie more pitsops.
My preference would be less pitstops.
I'm sorry, they tyres we have are a complete joke. Look at qualifying sessions, people do not bother anymore because they want to conserve tyres.
Look at races, push just a little bit and they fall off the cliff. This is a joke.
This is the pinaccle of motorsport. Make durable tyres, it really is that simple
Look at races, push just a little bit and they fall off the cliff. This is a joke.
This is the pinaccle of motorsport. Make durable tyres, it really is that simple
---------------------------------------------------------------
In 100% agreement
They should make tyres that last the duration of the race but enable re-fueling by halving the fuel tanks to have pit stop drama and it decreases costs due to less fuel being guzzled up by heavier cars.
I repeat, did you watch F1 3 years ago? I hope that wasn't the pinnacle of motorsport.
I've been watchimg f1 since the mid 80s. There was no DRS, no KERS, no dodgy tyres and it was exciting. Only during Schumis dominance was it boring.
3 years ago was 2009 so I'm not sure what argument you are trying to present here. There was overtaking and KERS.
You can tell that the people who like this tyre conservation exercise are not proper F1 fans because all they want to see is cheap overtakes.
Guys like Alonso and Hamilton still managed to do this without the useless tyres we've got now.
Yhe FIA have tried to attract fair weather fans to the sport at a detriment to the core fan base and the best drivers
Qualifying is now a farce and the races are akin to a drive down the M1
"Only during Schumis dominance was it boring."
Only seven years then?
"3 years ago was 2009 so I'm not sure what argument you are trying to present here. There was overtaking"
Hardly. The best race was annually Montreal, where tyres were unpredictable. The pole sitter routinely went 40 laps on a set of soft tyres with impunity.
"You can tell that the people who like this tyre conservation exercise are not proper F1 fans because all they want to see is cheap overtakes."
Classic. I'm not a proper fan because I'm not 50 and like to watch some racing.
"Guys like Alonso and Hamilton still managed to do this without the useless tyres we've got now."
Not that old chestnut?
"Qualifying is now a farce and the races are akin to a drive down the M1"
Sure it is
Do racing skills have to depend on how long the tyres will last or are we going to see fuel being made leaner too and bring that into the equation.
I can't think of any reason why the F1 nobs think that tyre manipulation was going to increase the public's enjoyment of F1, I can only see it for what it is, a farcical blunder that may well add another facet of danger to F1, "blown tryes" with guys pushing the limits when they shouldn't be put in that position in the first place.
I'm not 50 dear boy. I liek racing. I watch motogp as well and they reduced the number of tyres available but kept the durability up there. A lot of teams do not bother setting a lap time in q3 because of tyres so quali is now a farce.
They've given the drivers who can't manage overtakes the DRS and KERS. We need durable tyres. Watchign racers not race is wrong
Lol Moto GP? You're actually bringing bikes into this? The comparison is laughable.
I don't know what you've been watching. I've seen a plethora of wheel to wheel racing throughout the race distance, different strategies coming to a head in the dying laps of a race etc.
If the price is that Force India or Williams try to gain an advantage by saving tyres in Q3, then fine.
Yes, I'm bringing bikes into this because those guys have got more guts than any F1 driver.
Watch motogp or even superbikes and see proper racing with guys pushing each other to the limit not the farcical situation we've got now.
The fact a 7 time world champion is criticising the tyres, tells you all you need to know
I do watch Superbikes, and Moto GP. My preference is British Superbikes and World Superbikes over Moto GP. I was at Silverstone to watch the bikes last year, and Brands. I was also at Spa to watch the F1 (try standing at Eau Rouge in Q3, I did. Then tell me it's like driving in the M1.
The two forms of Motorsport are ridiculously different. It's like comparing cricket and basebal. Actually I bet you think cricket and baseball are comparable
And if is 7 time WDC is criticising the rules it may mean many things. The only thing it guarantees is that he's not winning.
The tyres are a joke, look at Renault for example! Could be very competitive and could of won the other week but they had to preserve the tyres cos they just fall apart. It isn't like a small amount of degradation, it just dies.
You aren't very bright are you? Both sports are motorsport. They both use tyres. At a time bridgestone used to provide tyres for both. They both have tyre compounds, soft, medium, hard etc.
The difference is that the tyres available to both have different reliabilities.
If you pick a soft tyre, you know what to expect in motogp or a hard one.
In F1 even if you pick a hard tyre and push hard its wrecked. When you push you get punished by your tyres falling off the cliff by 2-3 seconds a lap. That happens nowhere else.
Look at all the races we've had this season, the one constant thing is tyre management. Manage your tyres, look after your tyres.
We should change this from motorsport to tyresport.
Schumi isn't the only person to complain about these tyres. Whether he wins races or not is irrelevant. It's clear to everyone apart from those who do not one to see racers do what they do best that the tyres are a joke.
Imagine is motorbikes used these useless tyres, what do you think would happen?
Its so funny, we all buy tyres and the one thing we do when buying them is look for tyres that are durable and reliable. Only in F1 is a durable tyre considered a horrible thing by some. Strange, really strange
You can tell that the people who like this tyre conservation exercise are not proper F1 fans because all they want to see is cheap overtakes.
---------------------------------------------------------
This is incredibly harsh on a large number of fans of any kind of racing.
If a grand prix was only 5-10 laps long then I could agree with you, but they have to do between about 50 and 70.
Take a look at any marathon race, and you will see runners hanging back, pacing themselves and preserving their energy, which they then use to push hard for the finish.
If one of these runners wins, do you really think that they deserve it less because there was someone further back who decided to try and sprint the whole 26 miles?
Guys like Alonso and Hamilton still managed to do this without the useless tyres we've got now.
------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, as hazsa puts it: that old chestnut.
I'm so sick of hearing this. The media seem to have branded Hamilton and Alonso as gods of motorsport. Therefore, if they don't dominate and win every single race, then it must be the sport that's wrong.
What's that old saying? "A bad workman will only blame his tools"?
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Have to agree with Schumi
Page 1 of 3
posted on 23/4/12
Yup, the great man is correct. If I want to watch people conserving tyres, I'll go on the M1.
The tyre situation is an absolute shambles
posted on 23/4/12
I see where your coming from but I disagree.
To me, any kind of racing is as much about strategy as it is about raw pace, and F1 is no exception.
I love to see drivers/riders pushing each other hard to fight for a victory as much as the next man, but I also respect that knowing when to push and when to bide your time is just as important.
posted on 23/4/12
You can do that with durable tyres as well. Not being able to push consistently is the problem
posted on 24/4/12
F1 markets itself as the pinnacle of Motorsport i.e the fastest. Cars from the V10 era are much faster. Plenty of reasons for that, in my view, not all justified.
I think its redicolous that we will be watchin 1.5 turbos next season. F1 should have put the price of fuel up to the teams, and you would have noticed a massive increase in investment to make F1 cars more economical
posted on 24/4/12
Agree on the tyres, disagree on the engines.
A smaller engine will be more economical than a big one, and the current trend in the motor industry is smaller turbo-charged engines.
This will enable them to make more strides in that area of tech, and further improve the efficiency/power output of commercially available engines, which benefits all drivers.
posted on 26/4/12
Did you actually watch F1 3 years ago?
posted on 26/4/12
After reading the article on the BBC by Gary Anderson, I now see why Schumi is complaining and why he did so well at his peak. Here's what GA had to say:
"When I was involved with Bridgestone tyres with Jordan in the early 2000s, in the middle of the tyre war with Michelin, Schumacher and Ferrari had tyres we were not even allowed to look at.
They cost so much money that Bridgestone could not afford to supply them to everyone. And whenever we did have an opportunity to run a derivative of those tyres, our lap times were much, much better."
So whilst the spectacle of watching people trying to conserve tyres is not much fun, at least they are ALL on the same boots. Surely then that is part of the art of racing. Maybe they should have a tyre that can last the race, and only able to use one compound for the whole race, so no compulsory pitstops. Then racing will be ON the track.
The link to the article:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/mobile/formula1/
posted on 26/4/12
Most of the racing already is ON the track. The pit-stop drama is an added bonus.
posted on 26/4/12
An added bonus that can ruin a persons race, and with the lack of tyre longevity the chances of that happening increasing, ie more pitsops.
My preference would be less pitstops.
posted on 27/4/12
I'm sorry, they tyres we have are a complete joke. Look at qualifying sessions, people do not bother anymore because they want to conserve tyres.
Look at races, push just a little bit and they fall off the cliff. This is a joke.
This is the pinaccle of motorsport. Make durable tyres, it really is that simple
posted on 27/4/12
Look at races, push just a little bit and they fall off the cliff. This is a joke.
This is the pinaccle of motorsport. Make durable tyres, it really is that simple
---------------------------------------------------------------
In 100% agreement
posted on 27/4/12
They should make tyres that last the duration of the race but enable re-fueling by halving the fuel tanks to have pit stop drama and it decreases costs due to less fuel being guzzled up by heavier cars.
posted on 27/4/12
I repeat, did you watch F1 3 years ago? I hope that wasn't the pinnacle of motorsport.
posted on 28/4/12
I've been watchimg f1 since the mid 80s. There was no DRS, no KERS, no dodgy tyres and it was exciting. Only during Schumis dominance was it boring.
3 years ago was 2009 so I'm not sure what argument you are trying to present here. There was overtaking and KERS.
You can tell that the people who like this tyre conservation exercise are not proper F1 fans because all they want to see is cheap overtakes.
Guys like Alonso and Hamilton still managed to do this without the useless tyres we've got now.
Yhe FIA have tried to attract fair weather fans to the sport at a detriment to the core fan base and the best drivers
Qualifying is now a farce and the races are akin to a drive down the M1
posted on 28/4/12
"Only during Schumis dominance was it boring."
Only seven years then?
"3 years ago was 2009 so I'm not sure what argument you are trying to present here. There was overtaking"
Hardly. The best race was annually Montreal, where tyres were unpredictable. The pole sitter routinely went 40 laps on a set of soft tyres with impunity.
"You can tell that the people who like this tyre conservation exercise are not proper F1 fans because all they want to see is cheap overtakes."
Classic. I'm not a proper fan because I'm not 50 and like to watch some racing.
"Guys like Alonso and Hamilton still managed to do this without the useless tyres we've got now."
Not that old chestnut?
"Qualifying is now a farce and the races are akin to a drive down the M1"
Sure it is
posted on 28/4/12
Do racing skills have to depend on how long the tyres will last or are we going to see fuel being made leaner too and bring that into the equation.
I can't think of any reason why the F1 nobs think that tyre manipulation was going to increase the public's enjoyment of F1, I can only see it for what it is, a farcical blunder that may well add another facet of danger to F1, "blown tryes" with guys pushing the limits when they shouldn't be put in that position in the first place.
posted on 28/4/12
I'm not 50 dear boy. I liek racing. I watch motogp as well and they reduced the number of tyres available but kept the durability up there. A lot of teams do not bother setting a lap time in q3 because of tyres so quali is now a farce.
They've given the drivers who can't manage overtakes the DRS and KERS. We need durable tyres. Watchign racers not race is wrong
posted on 28/4/12
Lol Moto GP? You're actually bringing bikes into this? The comparison is laughable.
I don't know what you've been watching. I've seen a plethora of wheel to wheel racing throughout the race distance, different strategies coming to a head in the dying laps of a race etc.
If the price is that Force India or Williams try to gain an advantage by saving tyres in Q3, then fine.
posted on 28/4/12
Yes, I'm bringing bikes into this because those guys have got more guts than any F1 driver.
Watch motogp or even superbikes and see proper racing with guys pushing each other to the limit not the farcical situation we've got now.
The fact a 7 time world champion is criticising the tyres, tells you all you need to know
posted on 28/4/12
I do watch Superbikes, and Moto GP. My preference is British Superbikes and World Superbikes over Moto GP. I was at Silverstone to watch the bikes last year, and Brands. I was also at Spa to watch the F1 (try standing at Eau Rouge in Q3, I did. Then tell me it's like driving in the M1.
The two forms of Motorsport are ridiculously different. It's like comparing cricket and basebal. Actually I bet you think cricket and baseball are comparable
And if is 7 time WDC is criticising the rules it may mean many things. The only thing it guarantees is that he's not winning.
posted on 29/4/12
The tyres are a joke, look at Renault for example! Could be very competitive and could of won the other week but they had to preserve the tyres cos they just fall apart. It isn't like a small amount of degradation, it just dies.
posted on 29/4/12
You aren't very bright are you? Both sports are motorsport. They both use tyres. At a time bridgestone used to provide tyres for both. They both have tyre compounds, soft, medium, hard etc.
The difference is that the tyres available to both have different reliabilities.
If you pick a soft tyre, you know what to expect in motogp or a hard one.
In F1 even if you pick a hard tyre and push hard its wrecked. When you push you get punished by your tyres falling off the cliff by 2-3 seconds a lap. That happens nowhere else.
Look at all the races we've had this season, the one constant thing is tyre management. Manage your tyres, look after your tyres.
We should change this from motorsport to tyresport.
Schumi isn't the only person to complain about these tyres. Whether he wins races or not is irrelevant. It's clear to everyone apart from those who do not one to see racers do what they do best that the tyres are a joke.
Imagine is motorbikes used these useless tyres, what do you think would happen?
posted on 29/4/12
Its so funny, we all buy tyres and the one thing we do when buying them is look for tyres that are durable and reliable. Only in F1 is a durable tyre considered a horrible thing by some. Strange, really strange
posted on 29/4/12
You can tell that the people who like this tyre conservation exercise are not proper F1 fans because all they want to see is cheap overtakes.
---------------------------------------------------------
This is incredibly harsh on a large number of fans of any kind of racing.
If a grand prix was only 5-10 laps long then I could agree with you, but they have to do between about 50 and 70.
Take a look at any marathon race, and you will see runners hanging back, pacing themselves and preserving their energy, which they then use to push hard for the finish.
If one of these runners wins, do you really think that they deserve it less because there was someone further back who decided to try and sprint the whole 26 miles?
posted on 29/4/12
Guys like Alonso and Hamilton still managed to do this without the useless tyres we've got now.
------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, as hazsa puts it: that old chestnut.
I'm so sick of hearing this. The media seem to have branded Hamilton and Alonso as gods of motorsport. Therefore, if they don't dominate and win every single race, then it must be the sport that's wrong.
What's that old saying? "A bad workman will only blame his tools"?
Page 1 of 3