The ability to coach has nothing to do with the ability to shout at people (in which case Fergie would always win. Forgot about the famous Hairdryer treatments?).

Fergie is the better coach and manager. He's taken very poor United teams and won them trophies galore.

Wenger had the greatest side ever in the PL and won only a handful of PLs and no CLs.

I was with you until you completely spat your dummy in the last paragraph.

Fergie gets terrible players to play well as a team and win trophies.

For me, United have no individual stand out players that would make it elsewhere at a top club but Fergie manages to mould them into a unit.

It will be interesting when he finally retires.

who gets good results to equally bullying both his players and match officials.

bitter this early in the day?

Surely as a coach you have to be judged on taking young players from scratch and making the as good as they can be. Fergie has developed many world class players: Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Ronaldo, Rooney and more. Wenger only has Henry and Fabregas. So Fergie is unsurpassed in that regard.

Fergie has developed many world class players: Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Ronaldo, Rooney and more.
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Hold on a sec. Rooney and Beckham world class? You sure about that?

As an overall manager it's Ferguson. You can't dispute that. Yes he's had more money to work with I suppose, but he has still taken fairly average teams to unbelievable glory. We would have won something in the last few years if Fergie was in charge, of that there is no doubt. He is the better tactician also, although people claiming Wenger is a poor tactician have no clue.

However Wenger is still a marvellous manager. Keeping us among Europe's elite under financial constraints and a stadium move is not a picnic. And some of the players he has cultured into world stars have been a testament to the great man's faith in youth.

Fergie and Wenger the two greatest managers last decade

People throw the word world class about like its nothing these days

Wenger only has Henry and Fabregas. So Fergie is unsurpassed in that regard.

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Sure, forget the likes of Cole, Vieira, Ljungberg, Kolo toure etc.

Beckham has played for Man Utd, Real Madrid and AC Milan, you don't do that if you're not a top player. Rooney is regarded as one of the current top players I world football too and would walk into 99% of teams, so I wouldn't say I've got that wrong.

whilst its clearly fergie....you can't deny the impact AW has had....on the english game....grudgingly....

Viera was already a very good player before he played for Arsenal. So Rooney isn't world class and Ljungberg is? Wow

Ashley Cole I'll give you.

Fergie has developed many world class players: Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Ronaldo, Rooney and more.
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Hold on a sec. Rooney and Beckham world class?


Another funny guy.

Beckham has played for Man Utd, Real Madrid and AC Milan, you don't do that if you're not a top player.
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As you do, especially when you're a massive marketing magnet.

Beckham is a commericial dream for clubs, not a world class player.

*Yes you do.....

Viera was already a very good player before he played for Arsenal.
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Two first team appearances for Inter Milan and he's a very good player? Ok.

And yes Ljungberg was a top winger when he was in his prime for us.

I suppose he's a massive marketing magnet for being a terrible player then? People seem to forget that he's a very good player just because of all the other stuff that comes with him.

"Viera was already a very good player before he played for Arsenal."

You see, this is why your whole argument is bogus - I wouldn't argue that Fergie had a great influence on a number of players, but this particular point could be made about most of the players in your own list and that of the Arsenal fans here.

The whole thing is fairly dumb frankly.

People seem to forget that he's a very good player just because of all the other stuff that comes with him.
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I'm not arguing that he isn't a very good player. He has a wonderful cross and great work ethic.

But he is NOT world class. Never has been.

As for Rooney.....let's not go there.

Viera already played for Inter and France U21 before he was at Arsenal, Wenger hardly made him. Helped him along, yes but didn't make him in the sense that he completely turned Henry and Fabregas's careers around. I like Wenger but to say he's better than Fergie is ridiculous.

Beckham was decent when he left United and turned into a media clown then.

Viera already played for Inter and France U21 before he was at Arsenal, Wenger hardly made him. Helped him along, yes but didn't make him in the sense that he completely turned Henry and Fabregas's careers around.
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Yet you've listed Rooney as somebody who had his career turned around by Fergie? You don't pay 30M for those mate.

You could very much argue that Ronaldo was already a very special talent before he got to United. Plenty of clubs were interested and it's not as though Fergie completely shaped his fortunes around, rather just helped it along.

So in that sense, the only real "World-Class" that fergie can be credited with is Scholes and Giggs.

"Fergie is the better coach and manager. He's taken very poor United teams and won them trophies galore.

Wenger had the greatest side ever in the PL and won only a handful of PLs and no CLs."

Can't tell is srs.

"Surely as a coach you have to be judged on taking young players from scratch and making the as good as they can be. Fergie has developed many world class players: Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Ronaldo, Rooney and more. Wenger only has Henry and Fabregas. So Fergie is unsurpassed in that regard."

George Weah was playing his football in Liberia and despite being in his 20s, hadn't even been called up to said country's international squad when Wenger signed him. A few years later, he was voted World Player of the Year and African Player of the Century - awards which he dedicated to Wenger.

For the record, I think it's a simplistic argument just to point to players who have done well under a certain managers tutelage and suggest their performances are testament to the manager's ability.
Ferguson spent close to £30million on Rooney, so to dismiss Vieira on the basis that he was already established - very much contestable - and include Rooney is incredibly one sided.