comment by bat_out_of_hell (U13008)
posted 49 seconds ago
How can you compete on the field if you don't compete for top,top signatures???
The club cost monkey nuts for a worldwide brand,factor in the debt,put in the new sponsorship deals and wage slashing and they've still had a bargain!
It's all about opinions,that's mine,i respect yours,but i'm not easily fooled,my jury is still out on them.
And i'll be the first to eat my own head if LFC are any better for it come 2018
NOW THAT IS THE TRUTH!!
------------------------------
No, that's delusion. To expect to compete for the best players in the world in the position we are, is absolute delusion. To expect FSG and Rodgers to do that is absolute stupidity. Truth? Couldn't be further from it.
We haven't competed for the top, top players for decades
its not delusion toor ..the man speaks sense...
i understand fsg spunked money when they bought downing and co ...and possibly are afraid to risk it again....
but the last transfer window showed incredible naivety to leave us short of strikers ..when you , me , the cow out in the field , knew that we were going to struggle without 3 or four scoring strikers ....
look at ferguson and united..as much as i hate the forces of mordor , they have 4 strikers vying and competing and scoring ....
i understand rodgers has a massive job..but we are bloody liverpool , and whatever anyone else says we are an enormous club with an enormous fanbase.... we should be competing at the top.....
yet it looks like we are genuinely headed for a 12th place finish .....
I've nothing against BR and he deserves time to get it right but, to put things in perspective, Hodgson won more points in his first 10 games in charge than Rodgers has.
Yes, correct, there were mistakes in the last window when we didn't get a player in and let Carroll go before knowing we had one in but they've admitted to that and said they'll fix it. Regardless of what FSG do, it doesn't mean they can sign the top top players you two blab on about. Simply we haven't been in that position for a few years since the previous owners nearly had the club placed in administration and the current owners had to bail us out.
They're working towards getting back to that position but that takes time, they can't just click their fingers. They have went about setting the foundations firstly by improving funding and the stadium issue instead of diving in with bank loans to fund new toys, like the previous clowns done. One would think you'd be happy to see that happen again. Like I said, utter delusion.
ok toor...
ill settle for mid table mediocrity ....and wait out rodgers long plan ....
but what happens if we are in this position in ones years time....
what then ?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Then something needs to be done. Although there's no point trying to be mystics and slating for what might happen. Better to look at what the plans are and how things are progressing towards that. If we progress then it's working, if we don't something needs to change.
Saying we should compete the best players in the world then slating our position is not only stupidly delusional but hypocritical also.
we are not far away. one decent striker and a fully fit squad and we have a very handy side.
We've been saying that for two years mate.
Have Liverpool ever competed for the best players in the world?
I mean really?
Has any club in England or that matter?
The best players in the world change hands between Barca, Real, Milan, Inter, Bayern, Juventus.
That's about it, and it has pretty much always been thus.
Liverpool have helped make some great players but at no point would I ever in history look at a Liverpool signing and think 'we are buying one of the current best in the world'.
It is utter delusion to think otherwise.
As I said Man Utd don't either.
They tried it probably once with Veron, and it backfired, largely.
Every other signing they make/have made are promising players or players who are good team players.
Even Man City and Chelsea haven't signed many players that make you go WOW!
They have spent a lot on a lot of very good players, but generally speaking the best in the world just don't play in England.
You can bet good money that if Hazard or Mata turn into the best in the world, they won't be playing for Chelsea.
Same for Aguero, Balotelli etc.
righteous
Liverpool make good players great. This is what we have always done.
I expect FSG help the manager to bring in one of two players and give them the platform to become great.
If the 17 assorted billionaires and millionaires choose not to stump up the cash to bring in a couple of good players, then fans can justifiably ask questions. It is a fact the club was bought at a snip. They have advocated self sufficiency which is admirable, but have also said that they can spend money to compete with anyone if required.
Given the balls up, our league position, the manager stating the squad is weak and the lack of experience, the open letter... they absolutely have to help BR.
righteous.
It's all about perception. If players like Silva, Van Persie, Suarez, Aguero, Rooney, Toure, Bale and Ashley Cole were playing for the likes of Barca no one would question the fact that they are amongst the best players in the world.
We British tend to have an inferiority complex when we've no need to.
It's all about perception. If players like Silva, Van Persie, Suarez, Aguero, Rooney, Toure, Bale and Ashley Cole were playing for the likes of Barca no one would question the fact that they are amongst the best players in the world.
We British tend to have an inferiority complex when we've no need to.
---
Thats not true though is it.
Silva - If Barca or Real wanted him they would have signed him. He is one of 5 or 6 players that Spain have like him. He only stands out massively in England because we never produce anyone like it.
RVP - Same as Silva re Real and Barca, has he ever looked world class for Netherlands? No, he just looks like the good player that he is, not a world beater by any means just a very good player.
Suarez - Potentially one of the best around, but he won't be playing for us if he reaches that level. Is the perfect example of what the owners want to achieve. Buy a young player with potential to be great, have some good years from them and sell them when they reach greatness and the most value (if they want to leave).
Aguero - Another very capable centre-forward, if he reaches great status he will move to Barca or Real.
Rooney - Has never been as good as his hype, at least not since he was 18 when dazzled at Euro 2004. Typical of many British players, dazzles as a kid and gets progressively worse over time. Not relevant to my point anyway as not bought into England.
Toure - Already had his best years at Barca. Still a very good player and one of the few to come to England in the last decade who could be considered real top drawer.
Bale - Another one where they hype is nowhere near the performance level. Look at his goals and assist stats compared to the best of the best. He is nowhere near them. Not relevant to my point anyway.
Ashley Cole - Probably the only true World Class player England has produced in the last 20 years in their position, but again not relevant to my point as he was not playing abroad and bought by an English club.
Ok, you tell me some players at Milan or Inter or Juve who are markedly better than the best players in this country.
You're going to struggle because there aren't any.
None of those teams are currently at high points in their history.
Milan are dire, Inter not a patch on the team of a few years ago.
Juve are by far the best of those at present and players like Buffon, Pirlo, Vucinic, Isla and Vidal would all be amongst the best in their position if they played in England.
The best players in the world right now all play for Barca and Real. Neymar is the only one who doesn't, but that probably won't be the case for much longer when he decides the time is right to leave Santos.
The Italian sides are at an all time low at the moment
All the talent is at the big 2, a couple of German sides and the prem. Mostly La Liga though.
Shortlight,
Name me 10 non British players who at the time of purchase by an English club, were among the best in the world in their position.
Not players who developed into the best in the world, like Ronaldo, players who were actually one of the best when an English club signed them.
Ok. We're always going to quibble about how you judge 'the best in the world' and when they could be judged as such, but here goes!
Klinsmann
Silva
Tevez
Mascherano
Veron
Bergkamp
Zola
Ginola
Stam
Aguero
Shevchenko
Overmars
Pires
Vialli
Zeige
Ravanelli
Morientes
Ricky Villa
Ardiles
Schmeichel
Biscan
Robben
of that list only Veron, Shevchenko and Biscan fit the criteria. Maybe Klinsmann but that was ages ago.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
kaiser.
You're entitled to your opinion. As am I.
boys...
as other clubs have proved ..theres value for money without going bananas with money ..
don't buy that bat
taking a hundred transfers and thinking we could have picked the best 5 is too convenient.
yes value can be had but the odds of finding it are pretty slim
Tevez is the best player in the league right now
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for the rodgers supporters
Page 3 of 3
posted on 5/11/12
comment by bat_out_of_hell (U13008)
posted 49 seconds ago
How can you compete on the field if you don't compete for top,top signatures???
The club cost monkey nuts for a worldwide brand,factor in the debt,put in the new sponsorship deals and wage slashing and they've still had a bargain!
It's all about opinions,that's mine,i respect yours,but i'm not easily fooled,my jury is still out on them.
And i'll be the first to eat my own head if LFC are any better for it come 2018
NOW THAT IS THE TRUTH!!
------------------------------
No, that's delusion. To expect to compete for the best players in the world in the position we are, is absolute delusion. To expect FSG and Rodgers to do that is absolute stupidity. Truth? Couldn't be further from it.
posted on 5/11/12
We haven't competed for the top, top players for decades
posted on 5/11/12
its not delusion toor ..the man speaks sense...
i understand fsg spunked money when they bought downing and co ...and possibly are afraid to risk it again....
but the last transfer window showed incredible naivety to leave us short of strikers ..when you , me , the cow out in the field , knew that we were going to struggle without 3 or four scoring strikers ....
look at ferguson and united..as much as i hate the forces of mordor , they have 4 strikers vying and competing and scoring ....
i understand rodgers has a massive job..but we are bloody liverpool , and whatever anyone else says we are an enormous club with an enormous fanbase.... we should be competing at the top.....
yet it looks like we are genuinely headed for a 12th place finish .....
posted on 5/11/12
I've nothing against BR and he deserves time to get it right but, to put things in perspective, Hodgson won more points in his first 10 games in charge than Rodgers has.
posted on 5/11/12
Yes, correct, there were mistakes in the last window when we didn't get a player in and let Carroll go before knowing we had one in but they've admitted to that and said they'll fix it. Regardless of what FSG do, it doesn't mean they can sign the top top players you two blab on about. Simply we haven't been in that position for a few years since the previous owners nearly had the club placed in administration and the current owners had to bail us out.
They're working towards getting back to that position but that takes time, they can't just click their fingers. They have went about setting the foundations firstly by improving funding and the stadium issue instead of diving in with bank loans to fund new toys, like the previous clowns done. One would think you'd be happy to see that happen again. Like I said, utter delusion.
posted on 5/11/12
ok toor...
ill settle for mid table mediocrity ....and wait out rodgers long plan ....
but what happens if we are in this position in ones years time....
what then ?
posted on 5/11/12
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 5/11/12
Then something needs to be done. Although there's no point trying to be mystics and slating for what might happen. Better to look at what the plans are and how things are progressing towards that. If we progress then it's working, if we don't something needs to change.
Saying we should compete the best players in the world then slating our position is not only stupidly delusional but hypocritical also.
posted on 5/11/12
we are not far away. one decent striker and a fully fit squad and we have a very handy side.
posted on 5/11/12
We've been saying that for two years mate.
posted on 5/11/12
Have Liverpool ever competed for the best players in the world?
I mean really?
Has any club in England or that matter?
The best players in the world change hands between Barca, Real, Milan, Inter, Bayern, Juventus.
That's about it, and it has pretty much always been thus.
Liverpool have helped make some great players but at no point would I ever in history look at a Liverpool signing and think 'we are buying one of the current best in the world'.
It is utter delusion to think otherwise.
As I said Man Utd don't either.
They tried it probably once with Veron, and it backfired, largely.
Every other signing they make/have made are promising players or players who are good team players.
Even Man City and Chelsea haven't signed many players that make you go WOW!
They have spent a lot on a lot of very good players, but generally speaking the best in the world just don't play in England.
You can bet good money that if Hazard or Mata turn into the best in the world, they won't be playing for Chelsea.
Same for Aguero, Balotelli etc.
posted on 5/11/12
righteous
Liverpool make good players great. This is what we have always done.
I expect FSG help the manager to bring in one of two players and give them the platform to become great.
If the 17 assorted billionaires and millionaires choose not to stump up the cash to bring in a couple of good players, then fans can justifiably ask questions. It is a fact the club was bought at a snip. They have advocated self sufficiency which is admirable, but have also said that they can spend money to compete with anyone if required.
Given the balls up, our league position, the manager stating the squad is weak and the lack of experience, the open letter... they absolutely have to help BR.
posted on 5/11/12
righteous.
It's all about perception. If players like Silva, Van Persie, Suarez, Aguero, Rooney, Toure, Bale and Ashley Cole were playing for the likes of Barca no one would question the fact that they are amongst the best players in the world.
We British tend to have an inferiority complex when we've no need to.
posted on 5/11/12
It's all about perception. If players like Silva, Van Persie, Suarez, Aguero, Rooney, Toure, Bale and Ashley Cole were playing for the likes of Barca no one would question the fact that they are amongst the best players in the world.
We British tend to have an inferiority complex when we've no need to.
---
Thats not true though is it.
Silva - If Barca or Real wanted him they would have signed him. He is one of 5 or 6 players that Spain have like him. He only stands out massively in England because we never produce anyone like it.
RVP - Same as Silva re Real and Barca, has he ever looked world class for Netherlands? No, he just looks like the good player that he is, not a world beater by any means just a very good player.
Suarez - Potentially one of the best around, but he won't be playing for us if he reaches that level. Is the perfect example of what the owners want to achieve. Buy a young player with potential to be great, have some good years from them and sell them when they reach greatness and the most value (if they want to leave).
Aguero - Another very capable centre-forward, if he reaches great status he will move to Barca or Real.
Rooney - Has never been as good as his hype, at least not since he was 18 when dazzled at Euro 2004. Typical of many British players, dazzles as a kid and gets progressively worse over time. Not relevant to my point anyway as not bought into England.
Toure - Already had his best years at Barca. Still a very good player and one of the few to come to England in the last decade who could be considered real top drawer.
Bale - Another one where they hype is nowhere near the performance level. Look at his goals and assist stats compared to the best of the best. He is nowhere near them. Not relevant to my point anyway.
Ashley Cole - Probably the only true World Class player England has produced in the last 20 years in their position, but again not relevant to my point as he was not playing abroad and bought by an English club.
posted on 5/11/12
Ok, you tell me some players at Milan or Inter or Juve who are markedly better than the best players in this country.
You're going to struggle because there aren't any.
posted on 5/11/12
None of those teams are currently at high points in their history.
Milan are dire, Inter not a patch on the team of a few years ago.
Juve are by far the best of those at present and players like Buffon, Pirlo, Vucinic, Isla and Vidal would all be amongst the best in their position if they played in England.
The best players in the world right now all play for Barca and Real. Neymar is the only one who doesn't, but that probably won't be the case for much longer when he decides the time is right to leave Santos.
posted on 5/11/12
The Italian sides are at an all time low at the moment
All the talent is at the big 2, a couple of German sides and the prem. Mostly La Liga though.
posted on 5/11/12
Shortlight,
Name me 10 non British players who at the time of purchase by an English club, were among the best in the world in their position.
Not players who developed into the best in the world, like Ronaldo, players who were actually one of the best when an English club signed them.
posted on 5/11/12
Ok. We're always going to quibble about how you judge 'the best in the world' and when they could be judged as such, but here goes!
Klinsmann
Silva
Tevez
Mascherano
Veron
Bergkamp
Zola
Ginola
Stam
Aguero
Shevchenko
Overmars
Pires
Vialli
Zeige
Ravanelli
Morientes
Ricky Villa
Ardiles
Schmeichel
Biscan
Robben
posted on 5/11/12
of that list only Veron, Shevchenko and Biscan fit the criteria. Maybe Klinsmann but that was ages ago.
posted on 5/11/12
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 5/11/12
kaiser.
You're entitled to your opinion. As am I.
posted on 5/11/12
boys...
as other clubs have proved ..theres value for money without going bananas with money ..
posted on 5/11/12
don't buy that bat
taking a hundred transfers and thinking we could have picked the best 5 is too convenient.
yes value can be had but the odds of finding it are pretty slim
posted on 6/11/12
Tevez is the best player in the league right now
Page 3 of 3