I think the minimum tickets you are allowed to give the away support is either 10% (2,450) or 15% (3,675)

Would those numbers make a difference as to where they could be located?

I think the club would be reluctant to offer less than they do now. Only two clubs will fill that end this season, but there are so many empty seats in the home areas, I don't think creating more home capacity will go down well.

It's a good point though, and now it is logged..

The away end at Oldham is split into 2 sections and they sell season tickets for the home allocation, when the need arises to move them they simply ask them to change the stand for that match. No reason Town can't do that

Thanks Wakey..that's useful to know.

That to me is why the Kilner Bank Stand is the best option..the stand holds 7,300 or so..and apart from Leeds and possibly Hull City and Wednesday, no one else will bring 4,000. As such, a flexible partitioning which caters for variable numbers of away fans could be introduced. For the Leeds game they might have sold 6,000 tickets if they had been available...there was plenty of empty seats in the Stadium.

The problem will be those fans who have held season tickets for a number of years in the Kilner Bank...they won't be happy...but the club categorise stands as they wish, eg the FM Stand, regardless of what fans think...and I didn't hear Kilner Bank ticket holders objecting to the FM being family only..so maybe they won't get much sympathy...maybe an offer in the Riverside Stand at the same price would pacify them ?

I've had an email back from HTSA, and some movement seems to be being made as there is a SAG meeting this week apparently, so the issue can be sounded out there.

I'm not too bothered where they put away fans to be honest, if they do a risk assessment of all the options, they will come up with their own answer anyway...and if the FM is the safest, then they'll have to move the Families into the Kilner or something. The key is to ensure safety can be at least retained if not improved by moving the away fans out of the South Stand...that will be the critical issue.

Can they not just have half of the Riverside? Home fans in the South Stand would have to go up the steps on exit and it would be easy enough for visiting fans to get to their coaches which would be in the same place?

The very first home game v Wycombe, their fans were situated in that stand.

Champers, that is a possibility...I don't know what the criteria is when they assess the 'risk'. Splitting the Riverside (which is already divided, would provide about 3,500 seats in both tiers. It is already divided as you have said but some of the box holders might not like to be surrounded by away fans....

The FM Stand holds 4,600 but the problem there might be a 'holding area'...as was said about the Leeds fans being allowed out before Town fans. The Kilner has a holding area although it includes the steps.

There does seem to be a few options, and hopefully one of them will pass the safety test..... It would be brilliant if Town were selling season tickets for the South Stand next season...it might take a while to build up, but I'm sure over time it will be the only place to be at Town matches...

Wasting your time Jacko,,, We will never have the south stand,,, The htsa, Pfft spineless,,, No season ticket holder in the Kilner will want to move,, Hoyle and co dont have the bottle to split the Kilner for fear of upsetting folk,, Lots and lots of old folk,,,,, The htsa squares should not have let Hoyle turn the FM lower into a family stand,, End of,,,,, A campaign to have the FM lower turned back into a end anybody can enter without restrictions would be the best option, The easiest option,, Turn it into a lads end with unreserved seating, Pay on the day,, Offer the current family season ticket holders a seat upstairs for the same cost,,,,,, Easily done,,, Could even stick a little roof over it !

It should be the south end of the riverside for away fans,, Both upper and lower tier if needed,, We could just give the upper tier, We could just give the lower tier,,, But we would have to swap the dugouts around,, And am i right in thinking the current one we use is the bigger of the two ?? ,,,,,,, Anyway, Wherever you say you can put them, Offer all the explanations, Logistics etc etc,, Nothing will change,, Hoyle has no say in the stadium,,, How much was it again 40k above the agreed price !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

To be honest, I think Town would support anything that created a better home atmosphere...Dean Hoyle has been on the terraces, he knows what's what. Trouble is it's the SAG committee who make the assessments..and even though Town are represented there, no one is going to argue against the professional health & safety guys, or the Police are they.

It may well be that this committee would welcome a change to the housing of away fans..who knows until we ask ? I'm sure there will be a barrage of protests if an alternative is put forward...then it's up to those who would prefer to be in the South Stand to stand up (or sit down) and be counted.

All I'm doing is asking the questions...if it goes further, then it's not up to me, it's up to those that always complain about lack of atmosphere to speak up...otherwise it'll be a dead duck.

I wouldn't think the south end of the Riverside would be the best option due to the proximity with the home fans...that area is often sealed off anyway...as is the end bit of the Kilner bank...which I presume would stay.

The best stand for atmosphere is undoubtedly the South Stand..

As for HTSA, they would have more clout if more people coughed up the £10 a year or so and joined them, and maybe even went on the committee so they could have their say...? A good solid membership would also provide funds that could be used to promote the fans issues....as it is, most fans feel unrepresented and thus frustrated that nothing they say will ever be taken notice of.

I'm a member of HTSA because they have cheaper coach travel to away games, but I have no other involvement with them, for £10 a year it's worth it.

Am not saying it in a nasty way Jacko,,,, I agree,, But nothing will be done mate,,, Our ground was designed specifically for the south stand to be the away end,,,,And Elf n SSafety rules at our stadium.

Not taken that way mate......

Actually, they tell me the South Stand was designed for both home and away fans, hence the dividing wall at the back...and duplicate 'facilites'...I didn't know that.

I'm probably an optimist, so I will push it as far as I can...and then publish the reasons...costs nothing to check it out.

Why can't you fill the end opposite the away end and get that atmosphere going

That's far too obvious Liw

LIW,

Whilst that seems like a viable option, it's a strange one. I would happily move from my seats in the gods to sit in the South Stand (current away end) but I wouldn't even entertain moving to the opposite end.

Why? Well in my opinion that stand is flawed in its design. It's too damn steep to want to stand, bounce around and generally make some noise, which is probably why nobody bothers in there currently.

I like the gradient in the away end. It's conducive to standing and singing for a large percentage of the game, as a good travelling support shows. Look at your very own Kop end. No beggar sits down all game and it creates a great atmosphere. I know cos I've been in it. That's what I want at Town.

If not, I'll just pay more and watch the game in silence with a great view.

The away gradient is good.

If memory is right, the stadium only had 3 stands at first and then was later built with no lower tier, that was added later.

And was that lower retractable or something, am I sure at one bit it was there then it wasnt.

Am sure when I went with leeds for pre season game, around 1996, we has all back of goal and some on the side, the two tier stand

Restricted access knacked the fm end,,

Liw, you had the current away end & 2,000 in the big single tier to the right of the away end, I remember that 5-0 defeat.

I would have sweared blind it was too the left.

Unless I was not behind the goals and down the side

Is that the game where rush and bowyer made there debut, I thought it nil nil

I was a young un then so go be wrong

The pre season game I remember against you lot was about 1996,you were a strong Premier League team, taught us a lesson in football, Hasslebaink scored i think.

Am sure rush was playing and it was before hasselbiank

All 4 stands can easily be used for the away fans. As mentioned elsewhere on this thread the away stand is designed for splitting in half.
The Kilner bank has doors which can be changed at very little expense so they could put away fans in either side of the stand.
The Fantastic Media stand can also be used to house the away fans in both top and bottom or just bottom alone but the dibble won't have it because of the leisure facility's behind.
And finally the main stand, they did it before when Sunderland visited years ago they gave them the south stand and the main stand upper south end.

They can put them where they want but the safety officer hasn't got a clue, West Yorkshire Police aren't much better and HTAFC just hide behind them

I also remember that 0-5 friendly defeat. Harry Kewell ran the show. I'd never seen him play before that night but he played much like David Silva does now; so comfortable on the ball, gliding past people and just extraordinary vision. How did it go so wrong for him??

Also had a bloody car crash on the way home. A memorable night for all the wrong reasons

.....And yeah, Leeds fans had half the Kilner bank as well as the south stand.

5 Christmas Jacko.

And here in lies the problem. many of us 'want it'....but as I logged on, the thread had a one, '1 star' vote ???
That indicates the absolute apathy.

Look.
we are getting drawn in to too much detail !
Every scenario can be acted out & provided.
Why.
How,
Because even moderate or casual observation of just about every club shows the options mentioned above..already exist at other clubs. And the prem clubs in particular function with far higher numbers & potential for mishap.

Villa have moved the visitors from an 'end' to the side paddock.
Wolves house the visitors darn a side paddock.
Leeds have moved the visitors....
But Blah blah blah...it's all irrelevant.

WE WANT A HOME END. ......er, End Of .

Lets not 'look' for faults, or why it can't be done.
lets demand why we should have what we want. It's our ground, WE come 1st.

These are very important changes that I think have to be made.

Unreserved seating....along with Pay on the day (for the South stand) it will be full, every week, guaranteed.
BUT !!!!

It has to run...... none of this weak as 'peace' "We'll give it a trial run/exchange your regular ticket for a quid " against Bristol City or Watford nonsense.

Again, Those who have no interest in a standing end, & are quite happy with the way things are puzzle me !
It's NOT normal to sit in silence watching a game live..
&...
If all the standers, singers..agitators, whatever your view on that type of supporter.....surely it has to be better if they are all together, out of your way....?
It has to be a 'win, win' for ALL.

Lets focus.
We want the South stand....let 'the powers that be' sort out the so called problem of relocating the visitors....
United, we can achieve this.
bickering & nothing will change.

HOYLE...there's more to running a club than having a big pocket & surrounding yourself with 'yes' men...
You more than anyone can sort this out.
ACT.

Jacko.

Wakey - Just how i see it,, While Robinson is in charge, Not a chance of anything happening,,,,Has anybody at town mentioned wether they are in favour of the safe standing trial debate ?