1. Senna
2. Schumi
3. Fangio
4. Clark
5. Lauda
6. Prost
7. Alonso
8. Stewart
9. Villeneuve Snr
10. Piquet
11. Fittipaldi
12. Hakkinen
13. Surtees
14. The Finger

Fair enough

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I was gonna go to the trouble of inserting all Ferrari drivers above him but decided against it

These things are always a struggle, how do you compare era's, especially the likes of Vettel vs Fangio etc. In reality I bet Chilton could beat Fangio in todays cars whilst the 50's, 60's version of Chilton could beat Vettel in the old cars.

I know thats not the point of this sort of list but it highlights the problem. You are only as good as your era allows. Whether that is car, opposition or whatever related.

To be honest you can pick out the best drivers of each era but after that its becoming more guess work than based on substance.

No doubt he's a class act but as long as he keeps getting these blinding cars under him the doubt will always be there.

Ever since he moved to Red Bull he's constantly been protected and looked after by his team.

If he wants to really prove himself as one of the best he needs to step out of that comfort zone and rebuild it by himself.

Button leaving Brawn for McLaren, Hamilton leaving McLaren for Mercedes, even Schumacher leaving Benetton for Ferrari. They all made those moves to prove to themselves and to others that they had it in them to make their own way in the sport.

to be honest i honestly think it is just about impossible to say as i never saw any of the greats before prost and senna ,

vettel is not up there at prost"s level yet but might be eventually and is never going to reach senna level as nobody ever will , however i certainly rate vettel (and alonso) above schumacher , piquet . mansell so that probably puts vettel in the top 15 somewhere,

to be honest it is probably a bit to early to make a judgement on vettels all time great status we probably need another 3 years to gain a more accurate picture -

It amuses me when people mention Vettel as being one of the greatest of all time. Do these people know anything about the history of the sport? They should try studying it first and then take a view.

For me Vettel will never be great of any time until he has won at least two WDC's in a non dominant car and some or all of the following
1. win the Indy 500
2. win le Mans 24 hour
3. Go to a single race meeting and enter every single support race, driving different cars and winning every race.

Jim Clark and Graham Hill did most of the above. That is why they are great and Vettel isn't.

That sort of follows on to my comment WTCBU, times have changed. You can only be as good as your era allows.

Quite so N606. Some of the cars they drove and all of the tracks they raced on where death traps but they still went full out.

If we were to take a 10 year period for comparison (2003 – 2012) then what will future historians make of that period?

They would probably rate Alonso for ending Schumacher dominance, the duels between McLaren and Ferrari 2007/8 and Newey's genius 2010/12.

WTCBU

oh i see for any of todays drivers to be called an all time great FORMULA 1 DRIVER they have to win the indy 500 ( against drivers that are not good enough to race in F1 ),

win le mans ( against drivers that are not good enough to race in F1 )

and win a few races in a couple of souped up road cars -( against drivers that are not good enough to race in F1 )

why didnt we all think of that ---

Its fair to assume nostalgia is crowding in front of WCTBU's eyes.

WTCBU

just out of interest which world champions in the last 30 years have not won the WDC in a competitive car ?

In fairness WTCBU said dominant not competitive Martial. Whilst I'm sure many a driver has won in a non-dominant car few can claim to have won in a non-competitive car.

n six o six

hear what you are saying -- i said competitive because the word dominant is open to so much interpretation on here --

How can you say? I think the standard of driving has gone up quite a bit just over the time I have watched F1. Do you think Jesse Owens would compete with the best today? Would Bobby Moore be able to cope with Messi? I doubt it to be honest and it doesn't really matter.
All you can do is rank him to his rivals and I only see him as the third best on the grid today. The car is everything and Vettel has the gift of the best car and a weak team-mate. Nobody rates Hill, Villeneuve and Hakkinen as the same level of Schumacher for example. Did Schumacher make me think higher of him when all he had to do was crush Barrichello? No.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

I doubt it Martial. Would anyone of todays drivers drive a car as unsafe and relatively slow as the 250f as fast as Fangio drove it? On death trap circuits having grown up driving cars with more grip in one tyre than the whole of the 250f?

I don't think Fangio would enjoy the high G world of modern day F1 either, all the various buttons and controls and the minute adjustments of setup. If a driver is used to pushing it at 80 round a corner it will be a shock to the system trying it at 160.

n six o six

hear what you are saying , but racing is the lifeblood of these guys -

the point i am making is if todays drivers had drove in fangio" s era they would have known nothing else but the cars of the mid 50s and would have been able to have drove those cars ,

retrospectively if fangio was a top driver these days he would have known nothing else and would have access to the same neck exercises and gubbings they wear round there neck in a modern car and no doubt would have mastered all the parafanalia on the steering wheel in fairly short order -

That much is true Martial but then Fangio wouldn't be Fangio and likewise todays drivers wouldn't be who they are today. You can have the same genetics but environment factors have a huge effect on who you are.

This is a bit of a weird debate to be having btw

As far as I'm concerned you can only be as good as your era allows. You can put up valid arguments for various drivers to be the best ever but at the end of the day it's purely opinion based loosely on facts.

One interesting (read as pointless) thing to ponder is Senna A and B. Ayrton Senna told us that his nephew was better than him, now it was probably just Ayrton being a good uncle but its entirely possible that Bruno was better than him but just not in terms of the modern era.

(see, pointless and not really interesting )

n six

understand where you are coming from ---- i think

fully agree you are only as good as your era allows and any all time great opinion can only be based on who is the best of there era and any opinion on who is the best of the best is subjective ,

yeh i did read that about bruno and senna years ago - think it was when bruno was about nine and driving karts on senna"s private circuit ,

as for bruno being better than senna ( i know you are probably joking )
--- think there is more chance of me driving the wife"s chevrolet matiz -- and trust me i would rather suck on a dog t -urd than drive her car -

These assessments are always subjective and like some posters have stated above, it's nigh on impossible to look at the sport as a whole from the past till date and make an assessment as to who is the best.

I can safely say that of the current grid, Vettel is in the top 5. Will not be fair to compare him to previous champions in bygone eras

Vettel is defo as good as Nelson Piquet Sr. Both equally talented three time world champions

Not doubting senna or prost's brilliance, but if nigel mansell wasn't the unluckiest man in sporting history, he would have won 3 or 4 championships against them.

There's no way imo, mansell can be excluded from the top 15, especially when prost and senna are (probably rightly) both in the top 6.