Pretty much every Spanish CB ever
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What is it you don't get about them?

I don't rate them and yet many seem to.

Pique looks quite average to me. Never liked Puyol either.

He doesn't have the positional sense or concentration to play centre back at the moment and isn't technically good enough to play in midfield.
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He hasn't been very suited to United's higher line right now.

In Blackburn's deeper line he genuinely looked world class. It will be up to him to adapt to United's defence. If he does that, I have no doubt he'll be as good as Ferguson said he would be.

Well I don't know what you expect from a CB.

Imo Puyol's got pretty much everything you could ask for. Good in the air, good on the ground, quick on the turn, fantastic leadership qualities, positional sense, adapts to high lines and deep defending equally, puts his body on the line whenever necessary.

Add too that CBs are as much about the above, as about how they complement each other and suit the side they play.

Combining all of the above and throwing in his consistency, Puyol was one of the best CBs in the world for years.

Maybe it's just that his hair confuses you.

As an aside: Hierro, Nadal, Sanchís, Abelardo, Ramos. Spain have had some fine CBs in the past 20 years.

Puyol is a fantastic player, barca look a shadow without him in defence

Hierro and Puyol were/are fantastic. Not sure about the other 4, though.

That's what I mean. I don't get what you see in them as I think they just ain't all that.

A Ferdinand in his prime is better than every single one of those players you've just listed. England have had some amazing CB's so maybe I'm just comparing it to them.

Hulk, Ramires, Vermaelen, Nasri and Robinho.

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Really average player. All he does is run. I've spoken to a few Chelsea fans that don't get how a cm that doesn't really possess any footballing ability can play so many games for a club like Chelsea. Glad to see the myth he's a good footballing is slowly but surely filtering into their own fan base.

Well, I asked what you expect from a CB and gave you a list of attributes I consider important. Still waiting to hear back.

SKA, Maybe you don't remember them.
Sanchís was a superb CB and a perfect complement for Hierro for many years. You don't get over 700 appearances and a career spanning almost 20 years for Real Madrid if you're not up to it.

To be fair he is shunted around positionally a fair bit and if you have Mikel and Lampard next to you then you will be running.

I don't think he fits Chelsea's midfield though. He'd walk into our side.

Whether he is shunted around or not doesn't excuse the fact his footballing ability is crap. I don't even think he'd get in the Liverpool side, Gerrard and Lucas are much better.

Puyol is a fantastic cb.

England have been blessed with some quality cb's over the years - it's probably the position in which we produce the most top class players - that's not to say Spain haven't had class cb's either.

Right now, I'd say Ramos is better than anything we have - albeit our better defenders are past their best and their replacements are yet to step up.

itsonlyagame (U6426)

I answered. I don't think they are as good at the aspects you mention as you do. I don't get why you rate them so highly. That's the point of the article. I imagine it would defeat the purpose of the thread if you were to arrogantly ignore my opinion wouldn't it?

Spain were shít for many years and no matter what era (from my lifetime so late seventies) I reckon I could name a better English CB. I think Puyol was a better RB than CB as despite his spring he is not the tallest. I prefer Ramos at CB. Nadal was not all that although massive. Heirro is probably the pick from years and years.

Not fussed about Spanish CB's and I think England have produced better and more quality in that position.

SKA, Maybe you don't remember them.
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It's more to do with your definition of "fine", to be honest.

Granted, all those players are good defenders and, so, if you meant fine as in they were more than good enough at their role, I would agree with you.

If you meant fine as in them being class acts and at the top of their trade, I'm not sure if I'd agree with that.

Completely agree with you on Ramires Darren.

SKA, the context was "players you just don't get" and more specifically in response to "Pretty much every Spanish CB ever".

Bar a couple of names, it's not as if Spanish CBs have ever been hyped up that much. I don't think any of those mentioned were ever considered in the 'world's best' bracket, yet they were all very tidy players.

The impression I sometimes get is that the emphasis is too often put on 'being good in the air', when there's so much more to a CB's game.

I've read 'ad nauseam' about Spain's defence never being tested because of the players in front of them, yet few ever seem to stop and consider is that one of the essential components for their system to work is to have CBs who are not only good enough on the ball, but more importantly capable of playing the extremely high line they do - hence my initial remark about how important it is for your CBs to suit your side's game. Has any other defence ever gone the entire knockout rounds of 3 consecutive major int'l tournaments without conceding a single goal? Yet some would have you think it's only because of Xavi and Iniesta.

Robbing, "Puyol was a better RB than CB as despite his spring he is not the tallest."

Robbing, your comment seems to imply that to be a good CB you have to be one of the tallest? I don't see the logic - aerial duels are only a part of it, and the way the game's been going over the past years, arguably an increasingly smaller part of it at that.

Also, the only CB I recall winning WPOTY in the time frame we've been talking about stands 5ft 9in. Now perhaps you'll tell me too that Italian defenders have never been all that either.

Finally, Puyol only ever played RB at the start of his career and at times under Pep as an emergency stand-in. Could you recall many games you've seen him play RB other than the '09 CL final? I'd venture to say that at least 90% of his appearances as a pro have been at CB. No offence, but I doubt you're onto something all the managers he's had down the years missed.

Puyol was an absolutely brilliant defender and still is a top player. I agree with IOAG in that he had pretty much everything and even if he wasn't the tallest his aerial ability is brilliant (mainly due to his aggression, bravery and jumping power).

The man is a gifted warrior, a near perfect defensive leader.

I honestly think a prime Ferdinand is the best CB I've seen (from late 90's to date) but Puyol is up there.

Wow. Just wow.

You've said a fair bit for me there. By that token I can fairly assume you consider Puyol as one of the best CB's ever then.

In reality I think he lacks a bit of natural talent but has a superb attitude. I think a peak Ferdinand was a far better player - same with Terry. Both of those as very good on the deck. I think Chiellini is better currently than any Spanish CB and Campbell was better. Adams I think was better, Keown would have given him a run for his money. That's just Puyol. Pique is no better than Agger in my opinion.

Nesta is Besta.

Keown would have given him a run for his money

Andy

IOAG, the perception from many pretty fans is that you have to be a bit battler with amazing aireal presence and all the other skills you'd expect from the archetypal British cb. It's why Ferdinand was often not rated as highly as Terry or Vidic by many fans despite being superior to both.

Many people are Anglocentric and don't judge foreign players on their systems and styles rather than judging them on ours.

Send John Terry to Spain when he was in his prime and he wouldn't be half the player he was for Chelsea in the premier league - look how badly Chygrynsky failed at Barca after being bought for £25m and had a reputation as one of the top cb's around.

Piqué didn't look anywhere as good as he did for Barca as he wasn't schooled in the art of British defending (even though he's been crap recently, he was very goo when he first went to Barca).

Which brings me onto Puyol an Rio - for me, both these players would be comfortable and playing in the top bracket of defenders were they playing in Spain, England, Italy or Germany such is the skills they posses on defending. That's why I rate them so highly.

Bit of a stretch but similar qualities really.

At their peaks Puyol was better than Terry, Campbell, Adams and considerably better than the likes of Chiellini and Keown!

I'm also a fan of Campbell, thought he was very good.

I think Campbell and Ferdinand could have played for whoever they wanted to. Ferdinand is the best I've seen in my lifetime. Rolls Royce of a defender.