Sheriff, i think that was the general concencus throughout the article
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Yeah, but when you interact with many average footy fans, they give you a different perception. Like when arguing about Messi and Ronaldo, some smarty pants trying to feel clever would often interject with "both of them couldn't lace Zidane's boots".
I was a big fan of Zidane but Messi is a comfortably superior footballer for me. It isn't that close either. And the only reason it's close between Zidane and fat Ronaldo is Ronaldo's injuries. At Ronaldo's '95 to '99 peak before he lost his devastating pace and power, Zidane wasn't a patch on him.
Sheriff that Brazil team of '82 have been widely acknowledged as the greatest team not to have won the world cup, Zico et al
They even beat my own country 4-1 cos we qualified
Ronaldo Mc Donaldo >>> anyone else.... Obviously before he got injured & fat...
How can anyone call Zidane over rated Ffs.
He's scored three goals in two World Cup finals. Scored a winning goal in a CL final. Any player who can come up and play when it really matters deserves to be one of the greats.
Three POTY titles too don't forget. Easily one of top 4 players of all time for me.
How can anyone say Nedved - basically a clogger who was gifted the Ballon d'Or - was underrated?
Messi and Ronaldo are the icing. Zidane was the cake.
If you don't rate Zidane then frankly I don't think you understand the game of football at all.
France 1998 were a decent-to-good side carried by Zidane. Hell, he carried them to the final in 2006 too, a much poorer England-esque side.
Ronaldo and Messi, as good as they are, have pretty much been average at international level. Messi also looks a bit of a bottle job in the latter stages of the CL.
Just saying
Ronaldo and Messi, as good as they are, have pretty much been average at international level. Messi also looks a bit of a bottle job in the latter stages of the CL.
//
Biggest load of bollox ever written on this forum. The same messi who's scored in both cl finals he's played in.
Messi has a gold medal at Olympics. How's that average? Ronaldo is Portugal all time leading goal scorer so to call them average at international level is pure idiot of you. In fact that paragraph you written alone is so bad that you should be forbidden to wrote on this forum again.
Messi has a gold medal at Olympics. How's that average? Ronaldo is Portugal all time leading goal scorer so to call them average at international level is pure idiot of you
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Right for a start, the Olympics? For real? The one where they beat those powerhouses Nigeria in the final? The competition Mexico won? He has scorer, yes, but what about the Chelsea game? V ten men? When the pressure was on he melted, and absolutely fluffed his penalty.
Great. Ronaldo has scored lots of international goals. So has Crouchy. In fact, Crouchy probably has a better starts-per-goal record. I'm not talking about tinpot teams, but games that matter.
The great great players can galvanise a good side to become great. Take the team by the scruff and lift them. Have either done that? Honestly?
Nedved was a great player, very unappreciated.
Messi also looks a bit of a bottle job in the latter stages of the CL.
-----
Darren I laughed at that comment too
Ridiculous
Sainty got seven one star votes. Very harsh.
Myself and another poster gave him 5.
I read that Messi is one of the all time leaging goal scorers (might even be top) in the CL knock out stages.
He has two CL final goals as well. What a bottler.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Aye but has Messi ever head butted someone in the World Cup final?
Zidane is a hero!
Zidane is hardly the past. Of course everyrhing is techically tge past if you want to be pedantic, but he got sent off in that final just 7yrs ago. Some of his best years will be remembered by people that aren't old enough to buy booze
Don't get me wrong, Messi and Ronaldo are two of the finest footballers to grace the game. Supremely talented.
A player like Maradona, or Zidane, had that ability to take an an average team to achieve. Diego with Argentina in 90 and apparently Napoli in Serie A. Zidane with France to a lesser extent in 98, and certainly more so in 2006. Dragging their sides to major finals/championships.
When the expectation is truly on Messi and Ronaldo, when playing for their countries rather than being at two of the 3 best footballing clubs in world football, they don't seem to have that ability. Is all I'm saying. Perhaps having had a drink yesterday I didn't come across as well as I'd liked.
France's side had some of the very best players in football.
Can't say the same for Portugal or Argentina.
That's like saying Scholes and Gerrard weren't class because they couldn't drag England to a WC trophy.
Sheva must've been average as well.
France did have some good players in 98, but weren't really fancied.
Henry on the wing in those days, and so struggling up top that Guivarc'h started the final. Le Bouef starting the final. Zidane took that game by the scruff of the neck and powered two goals in. In 2006 they were a very average team. Had good players but had been labouring for a few years when he dragged them to the final.
Maradona did it in 90. Absolute monster of a player, with an average Argentina side, knocking out Baggio's hosts Italy and Brazil on the way.
Of course Scholes and Gerrard were very good players. Only the most biased of fans would think they are up there with the best ever though.
Messi and Ronaldo are class. They do their classiest work playing for probably the two most talent-packed sides in world football, who are set up to get the best out of them. Put them in their lesser national sides and they look a lot more mortal
people always hold players from the past in higher esteem than the current players.
---
Not true at all.
Di Stefano scored in no less than 5 consecutive European Cup FINALS, but very few people today would even entertain the idea that he was as good as Messi or CR.
My Dad loved Di Stefano, I think he might have been at his testimonial against us in '67. I can remember him telling me about us playing Madrid, although that could have been 1980!
So did mine. He drove up from London to Glasgow with my mum for the famous final vs Eintracht at Hampden Park.
Even after watching Cruyff, Pele, Maradona and so many other greats, he'd still say he was the best he'd ever seen. He was a Madrid fan though.
France did have some good players in 98, but weren't really fancied.
Henry on the wing in those days, and so struggling up top that Guivarc'h started the final. Le Bouef starting the final. Zidane took that game by the scruff of the neck and powered two goals in. In 2006 they were a very average team. Had good players but had been labouring for a few years when he dragged them to the final.
Maradona did it in 90. Absolute monster of a player, with an average Argentina side, knocking out Baggio's hosts Italy and Brazil on the way.
Of course Scholes and Gerrard were very good players. Only the most biased of fans would think they are up there with the best ever though.
Messi and Ronaldo are class. They do their classiest work playing for probably the two most talent-packed sides in world football, who are set up to get the best out of them. Put them in their lesser national sides and they look a lot more mortal
---------------------------------------------------
Zidane didn't drag France to anything in '98. That's one of the biggest myths in football considering his recklessness made him miss both the quarters and semis which France comfortably navigated. He did score twice in the final but he was hardly dominant in midfield against a subdued Brazil.
France in 2006 were an organized unit and even when they were outplayed, like against an emerging Spain or a more cohesive Portugal in the semis, they had a team of experienced pros and winners who took them over the line. Zidane did have great games in the Italy and Brazil games in the tournament but people disrespect the work done by players like Makelele, Viera, Abidal, Henry, Ribery etc in that tournament. And the equal mediocrity of the traditional top sides in the game also helped a lot considering a thoroughly unspectacular Italy went on to win the tournament.
I watched Zidane week in, week out in his time at Madrid and the player some people describe is far from the one I saw weekly. And his great career defining moments are often exaggerated too. He just had a strange effect on people because of his elegance on the ball. Messi and Ronaldo are simply more devastating footballers than Zidane. If Argentina could ever organize a decent defence, I have no doubt in my mind Messi can carry that team.
Don't see how anyone can watch Messi and Zidane and say Zidane is better. Honestly don't. I don't even think it's that close. The only thing Zidane does better is the ability to look like a ballerina on the ball. That makes him more comparable to Iniesta than Messi.
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Is Zidane overrated?
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posted on 7/9/13
Sheriff, i think that was the general concencus throughout the article
-------------------------------------
Yeah, but when you interact with many average footy fans, they give you a different perception. Like when arguing about Messi and Ronaldo, some smarty pants trying to feel clever would often interject with "both of them couldn't lace Zidane's boots".
I was a big fan of Zidane but Messi is a comfortably superior footballer for me. It isn't that close either. And the only reason it's close between Zidane and fat Ronaldo is Ronaldo's injuries. At Ronaldo's '95 to '99 peak before he lost his devastating pace and power, Zidane wasn't a patch on him.
posted on 7/9/13
Sheriff that Brazil team of '82 have been widely acknowledged as the greatest team not to have won the world cup, Zico et al
They even beat my own country 4-1 cos we qualified
posted on 7/9/13
Ronaldo Mc Donaldo >>> anyone else.... Obviously before he got injured & fat...
posted on 7/9/13
How can anyone call Zidane over rated Ffs.
He's scored three goals in two World Cup finals. Scored a winning goal in a CL final. Any player who can come up and play when it really matters deserves to be one of the greats.
Three POTY titles too don't forget. Easily one of top 4 players of all time for me.
posted on 7/9/13
How can anyone say Nedved - basically a clogger who was gifted the Ballon d'Or - was underrated?
posted on 7/9/13
Messi and Ronaldo are the icing. Zidane was the cake.
If you don't rate Zidane then frankly I don't think you understand the game of football at all.
France 1998 were a decent-to-good side carried by Zidane. Hell, he carried them to the final in 2006 too, a much poorer England-esque side.
Ronaldo and Messi, as good as they are, have pretty much been average at international level. Messi also looks a bit of a bottle job in the latter stages of the CL.
Just saying
posted on 7/9/13
Ronaldo and Messi, as good as they are, have pretty much been average at international level. Messi also looks a bit of a bottle job in the latter stages of the CL.
//
Biggest load of bollox ever written on this forum. The same messi who's scored in both cl finals he's played in.
Messi has a gold medal at Olympics. How's that average? Ronaldo is Portugal all time leading goal scorer so to call them average at international level is pure idiot of you. In fact that paragraph you written alone is so bad that you should be forbidden to wrote on this forum again.
posted on 7/9/13
Messi has a gold medal at Olympics. How's that average? Ronaldo is Portugal all time leading goal scorer so to call them average at international level is pure idiot of you
--------------
Right for a start, the Olympics? For real? The one where they beat those powerhouses Nigeria in the final? The competition Mexico won? He has scorer, yes, but what about the Chelsea game? V ten men? When the pressure was on he melted, and absolutely fluffed his penalty.
Great. Ronaldo has scored lots of international goals. So has Crouchy. In fact, Crouchy probably has a better starts-per-goal record. I'm not talking about tinpot teams, but games that matter.
The great great players can galvanise a good side to become great. Take the team by the scruff and lift them. Have either done that? Honestly?
posted on 7/9/13
Nedved was a great player, very unappreciated.
posted on 7/9/13
Messi also looks a bit of a bottle job in the latter stages of the CL.
-----
posted on 7/9/13
Darren I laughed at that comment too
Ridiculous
posted on 7/9/13
Sainty got seven one star votes. Very harsh.
Myself and another poster gave him 5.
posted on 7/9/13
I read that Messi is one of the all time leaging goal scorers (might even be top) in the CL knock out stages.
He has two CL final goals as well. What a bottler.
posted on 7/9/13
posted on 7/9/13
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 7/9/13
Aye but has Messi ever head butted someone in the World Cup final?
Zidane is a hero!
posted on 8/9/13
Zidane is hardly the past. Of course everyrhing is techically tge past if you want to be pedantic, but he got sent off in that final just 7yrs ago. Some of his best years will be remembered by people that aren't old enough to buy booze
Don't get me wrong, Messi and Ronaldo are two of the finest footballers to grace the game. Supremely talented.
A player like Maradona, or Zidane, had that ability to take an an average team to achieve. Diego with Argentina in 90 and apparently Napoli in Serie A. Zidane with France to a lesser extent in 98, and certainly more so in 2006. Dragging their sides to major finals/championships.
When the expectation is truly on Messi and Ronaldo, when playing for their countries rather than being at two of the 3 best footballing clubs in world football, they don't seem to have that ability. Is all I'm saying. Perhaps having had a drink yesterday I didn't come across as well as I'd liked.
posted on 8/9/13
France's side had some of the very best players in football.
Can't say the same for Portugal or Argentina.
That's like saying Scholes and Gerrard weren't class because they couldn't drag England to a WC trophy.
Sheva must've been average as well.
posted on 8/9/13
France did have some good players in 98, but weren't really fancied.
Henry on the wing in those days, and so struggling up top that Guivarc'h started the final. Le Bouef starting the final. Zidane took that game by the scruff of the neck and powered two goals in. In 2006 they were a very average team. Had good players but had been labouring for a few years when he dragged them to the final.
Maradona did it in 90. Absolute monster of a player, with an average Argentina side, knocking out Baggio's hosts Italy and Brazil on the way.
Of course Scholes and Gerrard were very good players. Only the most biased of fans would think they are up there with the best ever though.
Messi and Ronaldo are class. They do their classiest work playing for probably the two most talent-packed sides in world football, who are set up to get the best out of them. Put them in their lesser national sides and they look a lot more mortal
posted on 8/9/13
people always hold players from the past in higher esteem than the current players.
---
Not true at all.
Di Stefano scored in no less than 5 consecutive European Cup FINALS, but very few people today would even entertain the idea that he was as good as Messi or CR.
posted on 8/9/13
My Dad loved Di Stefano, I think he might have been at his testimonial against us in '67. I can remember him telling me about us playing Madrid, although that could have been 1980!
posted on 8/9/13
So did mine. He drove up from London to Glasgow with my mum for the famous final vs Eintracht at Hampden Park.
Even after watching Cruyff, Pele, Maradona and so many other greats, he'd still say he was the best he'd ever seen. He was a Madrid fan though.
posted on 8/9/13
France did have some good players in 98, but weren't really fancied.
Henry on the wing in those days, and so struggling up top that Guivarc'h started the final. Le Bouef starting the final. Zidane took that game by the scruff of the neck and powered two goals in. In 2006 they were a very average team. Had good players but had been labouring for a few years when he dragged them to the final.
Maradona did it in 90. Absolute monster of a player, with an average Argentina side, knocking out Baggio's hosts Italy and Brazil on the way.
Of course Scholes and Gerrard were very good players. Only the most biased of fans would think they are up there with the best ever though.
Messi and Ronaldo are class. They do their classiest work playing for probably the two most talent-packed sides in world football, who are set up to get the best out of them. Put them in their lesser national sides and they look a lot more mortal
---------------------------------------------------
Zidane didn't drag France to anything in '98. That's one of the biggest myths in football considering his recklessness made him miss both the quarters and semis which France comfortably navigated. He did score twice in the final but he was hardly dominant in midfield against a subdued Brazil.
France in 2006 were an organized unit and even when they were outplayed, like against an emerging Spain or a more cohesive Portugal in the semis, they had a team of experienced pros and winners who took them over the line. Zidane did have great games in the Italy and Brazil games in the tournament but people disrespect the work done by players like Makelele, Viera, Abidal, Henry, Ribery etc in that tournament. And the equal mediocrity of the traditional top sides in the game also helped a lot considering a thoroughly unspectacular Italy went on to win the tournament.
I watched Zidane week in, week out in his time at Madrid and the player some people describe is far from the one I saw weekly. And his great career defining moments are often exaggerated too. He just had a strange effect on people because of his elegance on the ball. Messi and Ronaldo are simply more devastating footballers than Zidane. If Argentina could ever organize a decent defence, I have no doubt in my mind Messi can carry that team.
Don't see how anyone can watch Messi and Zidane and say Zidane is better. Honestly don't. I don't even think it's that close. The only thing Zidane does better is the ability to look like a ballerina on the ball. That makes him more comparable to Iniesta than Messi.
posted on 8/9/13
Agreed.
posted on 8/9/13
100
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