John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
I think the case it more to do with the management than it is with Phil Jones at the moment.
Overrated I am afraid to say.
Look at Varane, Mangala, Zouma, Laporte to name a few CBs with incredible potential.
Still think Jones will be our CB for years though but has much to learn still
Jones is a bit like Vermaelen. His attacking/marauding style got plaudits as before people worked him out he looked a real threat... then you realise he can't actually defend for toffee.
Jones will probably have a decent career but will never be anything special.
in his defence hes hardly been given the opportunity to nail down the position when hes constantly played out of position because of injurys and squad deficiencys.
A great talent and still young who has the potential to improve and be a quality player but only if given games to learn and develop. He hasn't been that great recently and yesterday he had an absolute shocker but I genuinely feel there is plenty of time for him to come good and he has the ability.
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
He's still a young kid so he can hopefully improve.
His reading of the game is abysmal though and would have been better as a RB yesterday than Smalling who is miles better than he is at CB
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
Confidence is a big issue with United at the moment.
Not only can you be critical of Jones but you can pretty much be,rightly,critical of everyone else in the team.
Sorry,but it really does boil down to the management.
You look at how confident and positive Everton are now with Martinez.
Oh,and people shouldn't always take Ferguson's comments so literal.
Ferguson's comments regarding Jones show how fundamental it is to have people thinking positive about themselves and,if I can recall,wasn't Jones going through abit of a dip in form when Ferguson brandished the potential Jones had.
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
Not as good as John Stones
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If Moyes was still at Everton then Stones would not be getting a game even despite us having injuries to our central defenders.He'd have Barry or Hibbert playing there.
Phil Jones has been managed awfully. It's disgusting what Fergie did to him. He's played 3 consecutive games for us in the past in 3 different positions. He's played more games in midfield and at right back than he has in his best position.
Don't think it's a shock that he's making mistakes really. He's still young and he's not had the consistency of one position to iron out the mistakes.
I think he's still going to prove to be a top player at CB. He just just needs to be left alone now. Playing him all over the place isn't helping him.
comment by Stretford_Ender85 (U10955)
posted 11 seconds ago
Phil Jones has been managed awfully. It's disgusting what Fergie did to him. He's played 3 consecutive games for us in the past in 3 different positions. He's played more games in midfield and at right back than he has in his best position.
Don't think it's a shock that he's making mistakes really. He's still young and he's not had the consistency of one position to iron out the mistakes.
I think he's still going to prove to be a top player at CB. He just just needs to be left alone now. Playing him all over the place isn't helping him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly.
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
relax mudd
We all know what fergie left moyes and as it happens it was a team with a few duds in it but not a team that should have served up what we have seen this season for which moyes takes a huge part of the blame.
A shame really that its worked out like this because with players like baines, coleman , mirralas and now stones hes shown he has an eye for potential but it will be a miracle if hes given the time to bring the likes of that through at utd.
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
relax mudd
We all know what fergie left moyes and as it happens it was a team with a few duds in it but not a team that should have served up what we have seen this season for which moyes takes a huge part of the blame.
A shame really that its worked out like this because with players like baines, coleman , mirralas and now stones hes shown he has an eye for potential but it will be a miracle if hes given the time to bring the likes of that through at utd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mate, finding the players and making them play to their potential is another thing entirely.
Moyes has an eye for a player,but he's not a manager who can bring the best out of players.
Our players almost to a man have progressed under Martinez,whereas your players almost to a man have regressed under Moyes
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If Moyes was still at Everton then Stones would not be getting a game even despite us having injuries to our central defenders.He'd have Barry or Hibbert playing there.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Frankly I dont understand the animosity from everton fans toward moyes when at the end of the day he left your club infinately better off than when he first arrived.
At the moment it doesnt look like Jones is good enough to make it here as a cb. This feeling is perpetuated when ex footballers with experience like Redknapp and Carragher say he isn't good enough. However, I do think we need to be careful about judging these footballers based on this season as last season most of them never looked this bad! So I am going to wait until a get a new top manager to judge Jones, smalling etc...apart from valencia!
Frankly I dont understand the animosity from everton fans toward moyes when at the end of the day he left your club infinately better off than when he first arrived.
-------------------------------------------------------------
He was sounded out for the United job in January and yet he continued with the stance that he would be signing a new contract with us at the end of the season.
He then confounded matters by saying in the press that Everton FC should sell Baines and Fellaini to United as they deserve to play for a bigger team than Everton.He then put in a laughable double bid for them.
I will also point out that since he's gone we have all realised how much he hoodwinked everyone with his 'we are fighting above our weight' stance every season.
His negativity stifled our club for his last 3 or 4 seasons and I thank him for his first 6 years at our club,but we are better off without him
Once he learns positioning, and to not be so rash, he will be a top CB. But he needs a consistent run of games there and time to gain experience
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 35 seconds ago
Frankly I dont understand the animosity from everton fans toward moyes when at the end of the day he left your club infinately better off than when he first arrived.
-------------------------------------------------------------
He was sounded out for the United job in January and yet he continued with the stance that he would be signing a new contract with us at the end of the season.
He then confounded matters by saying in the press that Everton FC should sell Baines and Fellaini to United as they deserve to play for a bigger team than Everton.He then put in a laughable double bid for them.
I will also point out that since he's gone we have all realised how much he hoodwinked everyone with his 'we are fighting above our weight' stance every season.
His negativity stifled our club for his last 3 or 4 seasons and I thank him for his first 6 years at our club,but we are better off without him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You should be nothing but grateful to moyes for what he done for you lot. He was offered one of the biggest jobs in football of course he was going to take it. As for the laughable double bid for baines and fellaini are you having a laugh. That valuation was spot on. What was laughable was the amount forked out in the end for fellaini. As for stifling players coleman and baines didnt look too stifled under him.
As utd fans weve probable cause for being dissappointed and upset with moyes utd career whereas you lot dont. In fact a lot more gratitude is warranted for his job at everton imo.
The fact you are jumping on utd fans legitiamit upset at moyes is somewhat distasteful to be honest
you can argue that palying in different positions has hindered him but it also given him lots of minutes on the pitch to gain vital experience.
Its probably more difficult for a cb to be switched around but loads of players have played out of position early in their carrerrs and gone on to be great players in their best position, cara and henderson are just two examples at lfc that immediatley spring to mind.
These mins on the pitch for jones, despite not being great (think how poor henderson was playing wide right under kenny) could prove huge for jones for his development.
Personally i never saw what the big deal was about him and i dont think hes improved at all since joining united but these past two seasons of game time could just be the making of him.
Sign in if you want to comment
Phil Jones
Page 1 of 2
posted on 21/4/14
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
posted on 21/4/14
I think the case it more to do with the management than it is with Phil Jones at the moment.
posted on 21/4/14
Overrated I am afraid to say.
Look at Varane, Mangala, Zouma, Laporte to name a few CBs with incredible potential.
Still think Jones will be our CB for years though but has much to learn still
posted on 21/4/14
Jones is a bit like Vermaelen. His attacking/marauding style got plaudits as before people worked him out he looked a real threat... then you realise he can't actually defend for toffee.
Jones will probably have a decent career but will never be anything special.
posted on 21/4/14
in his defence hes hardly been given the opportunity to nail down the position when hes constantly played out of position because of injurys and squad deficiencys.
posted on 21/4/14
A great talent and still young who has the potential to improve and be a quality player but only if given games to learn and develop. He hasn't been that great recently and yesterday he had an absolute shocker but I genuinely feel there is plenty of time for him to come good and he has the ability.
posted on 21/4/14
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
posted on 21/4/14
He's still a young kid so he can hopefully improve.
His reading of the game is abysmal though and would have been better as a RB yesterday than Smalling who is miles better than he is at CB
posted on 21/4/14
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
posted on 21/4/14
Confidence is a big issue with United at the moment.
Not only can you be critical of Jones but you can pretty much be,rightly,critical of everyone else in the team.
Sorry,but it really does boil down to the management.
You look at how confident and positive Everton are now with Martinez.
Oh,and people shouldn't always take Ferguson's comments so literal.
Ferguson's comments regarding Jones show how fundamental it is to have people thinking positive about themselves and,if I can recall,wasn't Jones going through abit of a dip in form when Ferguson brandished the potential Jones had.
posted on 21/4/14
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
posted on 21/4/14
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
posted on 21/4/14
Not as good as John Stones
posted on 21/4/14
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If Moyes was still at Everton then Stones would not be getting a game even despite us having injuries to our central defenders.He'd have Barry or Hibbert playing there.
posted on 21/4/14
Phil Jones has been managed awfully. It's disgusting what Fergie did to him. He's played 3 consecutive games for us in the past in 3 different positions. He's played more games in midfield and at right back than he has in his best position.
Don't think it's a shock that he's making mistakes really. He's still young and he's not had the consistency of one position to iron out the mistakes.
I think he's still going to prove to be a top player at CB. He just just needs to be left alone now. Playing him all over the place isn't helping him.
posted on 21/4/14
comment by Stretford_Ender85 (U10955)
posted 11 seconds ago
Phil Jones has been managed awfully. It's disgusting what Fergie did to him. He's played 3 consecutive games for us in the past in 3 different positions. He's played more games in midfield and at right back than he has in his best position.
Don't think it's a shock that he's making mistakes really. He's still young and he's not had the consistency of one position to iron out the mistakes.
I think he's still going to prove to be a top player at CB. He just just needs to be left alone now. Playing him all over the place isn't helping him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly.
posted on 21/4/14
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
relax mudd
We all know what fergie left moyes and as it happens it was a team with a few duds in it but not a team that should have served up what we have seen this season for which moyes takes a huge part of the blame.
A shame really that its worked out like this because with players like baines, coleman , mirralas and now stones hes shown he has an eye for potential but it will be a miracle if hes given the time to bring the likes of that through at utd.
posted on 21/4/14
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
relax mudd
We all know what fergie left moyes and as it happens it was a team with a few duds in it but not a team that should have served up what we have seen this season for which moyes takes a huge part of the blame.
A shame really that its worked out like this because with players like baines, coleman , mirralas and now stones hes shown he has an eye for potential but it will be a miracle if hes given the time to bring the likes of that through at utd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mate, finding the players and making them play to their potential is another thing entirely.
posted on 21/4/14
Moyes has an eye for a player,but he's not a manager who can bring the best out of players.
Our players almost to a man have progressed under Martinez,whereas your players almost to a man have regressed under Moyes
posted on 21/4/14
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by ManUtdDaredevil (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by blabla (U11635)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
John Stones is younger and far less experienced,but he's already twice the player that Jones will ever be
----------------------------------------------------------------------
didnt moyes sign him ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and what's your point?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
he left martinez a real prospect in that one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And fergie left Moyes a team of duds
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If Moyes was still at Everton then Stones would not be getting a game even despite us having injuries to our central defenders.He'd have Barry or Hibbert playing there.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Frankly I dont understand the animosity from everton fans toward moyes when at the end of the day he left your club infinately better off than when he first arrived.
posted on 21/4/14
At the moment it doesnt look like Jones is good enough to make it here as a cb. This feeling is perpetuated when ex footballers with experience like Redknapp and Carragher say he isn't good enough. However, I do think we need to be careful about judging these footballers based on this season as last season most of them never looked this bad! So I am going to wait until a get a new top manager to judge Jones, smalling etc...apart from valencia!
posted on 21/4/14
Frankly I dont understand the animosity from everton fans toward moyes when at the end of the day he left your club infinately better off than when he first arrived.
-------------------------------------------------------------
He was sounded out for the United job in January and yet he continued with the stance that he would be signing a new contract with us at the end of the season.
He then confounded matters by saying in the press that Everton FC should sell Baines and Fellaini to United as they deserve to play for a bigger team than Everton.He then put in a laughable double bid for them.
I will also point out that since he's gone we have all realised how much he hoodwinked everyone with his 'we are fighting above our weight' stance every season.
His negativity stifled our club for his last 3 or 4 seasons and I thank him for his first 6 years at our club,but we are better off without him
posted on 21/4/14
Once he learns positioning, and to not be so rash, he will be a top CB. But he needs a consistent run of games there and time to gain experience
posted on 21/4/14
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 35 seconds ago
Frankly I dont understand the animosity from everton fans toward moyes when at the end of the day he left your club infinately better off than when he first arrived.
-------------------------------------------------------------
He was sounded out for the United job in January and yet he continued with the stance that he would be signing a new contract with us at the end of the season.
He then confounded matters by saying in the press that Everton FC should sell Baines and Fellaini to United as they deserve to play for a bigger team than Everton.He then put in a laughable double bid for them.
I will also point out that since he's gone we have all realised how much he hoodwinked everyone with his 'we are fighting above our weight' stance every season.
His negativity stifled our club for his last 3 or 4 seasons and I thank him for his first 6 years at our club,but we are better off without him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You should be nothing but grateful to moyes for what he done for you lot. He was offered one of the biggest jobs in football of course he was going to take it. As for the laughable double bid for baines and fellaini are you having a laugh. That valuation was spot on. What was laughable was the amount forked out in the end for fellaini. As for stifling players coleman and baines didnt look too stifled under him.
As utd fans weve probable cause for being dissappointed and upset with moyes utd career whereas you lot dont. In fact a lot more gratitude is warranted for his job at everton imo.
The fact you are jumping on utd fans legitiamit upset at moyes is somewhat distasteful to be honest
posted on 21/4/14
you can argue that palying in different positions has hindered him but it also given him lots of minutes on the pitch to gain vital experience.
Its probably more difficult for a cb to be switched around but loads of players have played out of position early in their carrerrs and gone on to be great players in their best position, cara and henderson are just two examples at lfc that immediatley spring to mind.
These mins on the pitch for jones, despite not being great (think how poor henderson was playing wide right under kenny) could prove huge for jones for his development.
Personally i never saw what the big deal was about him and i dont think hes improved at all since joining united but these past two seasons of game time could just be the making of him.
Page 1 of 2