Robb I dont ask that as much and why dont you visit your Aussie thread where we all went earlier
Barcelona were only poor after Vilanovas illness though, of the first 57 points available, they got 55. They lost twice all season in la liga, one of them to Madrid and lost in El Clasico again to Madrid.
Could Mourinho have done better last year? Absolutely, he should have been closer to them, he had fallen out with too many people by then. To say Barca were not as good is wrong though, it would have taken near perfection to win La liga last year instead of them.
Vilanova managing them, they played better football than they did under pep the season before. Messi in particular was on fire, I have no idea where the idea has come from that he had a poor season, he scored 46 goals in 32 games in la liga.
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 1 minute ago
Barcelona were only poor after Vilanovas illness though, of the first 57 points available, they got 55. They lost twice all season in la liga, one of them to Madrid and lost in El Clasico again to Madrid.
Could Mourinho have done better last year? Absolutely, he should have been closer to them, he had fallen out with too many people by then. To say Barca were not as good is wrong though, it would have taken near perfection to win La liga last year instead of them.
Vilanova managing them, they played better football than they did under pep the season before. Messi in particular was on fire, I have no idea where the idea has come from that he had a poor season, he scored 46 goals in 32 games in la liga.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agree entirely. Still a formidable side
meltonblue (U10617)
AMEN
It was Tito leaving the club that put us a few steps back, to SAY we were POOR is a disgrace by football fans and pundits like Savage and Keown to be fair.
Hmm, maybe I remembered last season a little differently to how it happened.
I still think Real could have kept up with them had they played to their potential.
Jose out
Bosman,
I wrote an article on you before the second leg against Milan, this was it -
Up to halfway through this season, this Barcelona team looked like surpassing anything they had done over the previous three years. Messi had broken individual records for goals in a calendar year and they had gone on a run in the league of 18 wins and 1 draw from the start of the season. Tactically, Villanova had just tweaked what was working so well under Guardiola. It wasn't really going to change much, Villanova was as much responsible for developing these players as much as Guardiola was, having worked at La Masia with them for so long.
If you watched Barca under Guardiola, you will know that the key to their pressing game was the 7 second rule. He believed that an opposition player was most vulnerable just after getting possession and chances of getting the ball back were far greater in that initial 7 seconds than after. Barca would press the man in an instant then, if they did not get the ball, go back to their shape and sit deep (not always a high press like some people think). This was the reason he experimented with midfielders in defence as well - the flip side is that what the Barca players did with the ball in that first 7 seconds was equally as important and so good passers were key to the system working.
Villanova preferred to keep the pressure on continuously and it was working very well for them. The shape stayed the same, but they pushed further up the pitch and the football was more direct than they were known for previously. His Barca had changed to be able to adapt more to the opposition if the tiki taka style was not working.
Up to that point, everything was looking rosy. Then, Barca went on a run of playing 10, winning 5, drawing 2 and losing 3 and conceding a goal in 13 straight games. Tactically, they were all over the shop and even in winning, did not look great and Milan probably deserved to win by more than 2 goals they did do at the San Siro. What had caused this slump, have teams now figured them out?
Villanova, the man who had spent as much time with those players moulding their style of play and relationships, had a reoccurrence of throat cancer and had to take an absence of leave from Barca for chemotherapy. The slump directly coincided with Villanova leaving and Jordi Roura taking over. Roura has no designs on being the Barca coach, he is purely in position due to Villanova's illness.
If you look at Barca now compared to earlier in the season, they are a mixture of Villanova and Guardiola tactically, with the pressing in defence being the most obvious example of it and why Milan (and Madrid recently) have ran out deserved winners against them. That is not to blame Roura for it at all, he just does not have the tactical ability or the relationship with the players that his predecessors had. Whilst Villanova still does video conferencing with the team, that ability to make changes on the fly is no longer there and the players are obviously not coping well with the man seen as a father figure to them being not there and being so ill.
Now, if any team in the world could cope without a coach, most people would probably say Barcelona. The past couple of months goes to show just how important that role actually is and why, even if you put the best 11 players in the world together in the same team, they are not always guaranteed to win, they still need someone to get them to react to the opposition. This is not the end of this team by any means though, they are still capable of utter brilliance, they are suffering from a lack of a leader to guide them and what has happened to Villanova. Any team in the world would be the same.
In terms of tonights game, my head is saying that Barca will win the game but go out of the CL as I think Milan will score. My heart, though, wants them to turn it around and go on to win the whole thing. For me, this team has been a joy to watch for the last few years and Villanova has been a massive part of that. For what he, Guardiola, and the team have done over the last few years, I want them to put on the performance they are absolutely still capable of.
Barca were most certainly poor in the CL though. That can't be debated.
I still think Mourinho facked it up, though I do agree Barca were good last season.
Robb,
Apart from that second leg against milan after I wrote that. Other than that, I agree.
Mourinhos big achievement was beating them they year before. Bear in mind, they've added bale and Barca have been far worse this season than last, with Messi definitely having a poor season by his standards. The likely difference between them at the end of the season is still only going to be a point or two though.
That's because Barca and Madrid are head and shoulders above everyone in the league, Atleti joining the party this season, and why La Liga often comes down to the head to head.
It was Mourinho facking things up at the start of the season that cost them because they were a better side and Tito, as well as he did, wasn't that good in the head to heads.
Yeah, but they have lost Ozil too. Ancelotti IMO was always a better manager than Jose because he is defensively strong but also good for him forward.
Chelsea won the league with him with a +71 goal difference which is amazing.
I'd love him at United. Jose is a very good manager but just not for United if I had my way.
meltonblue (U10617)
Barca could certainly have achieved higher then previous under pep but that is FATE.
Pep was the right man at the right time, he had all the majors players in their prime and in Messi's case injury free for 4 years.
Rijkaard had an equally dominant team during a period of 04-07 but not the same football luck as pep inherited.
I still believe tito was as equal as Pep if not better.
I agree Bosman, I was gutted then and even more gutted last week.
Darren,
Vilanova only took charge of three games against Madrid, which was one win, one draw and one loss.
I get what you are saying, he should have come closer than he did. If what happened to Vilanova hadn't happened though, that Barca side could easily have ended up on 106 or more points.
Possibly, melton. Sadly we'll never know.
I just wasn't that convinced by them against better opposition, even when they won.
Messi dragged them through so many games last season.
I think a full focussed Madrid would have had too much for them over the course of the season. Not by much, of course, I just think the head to heads would have told by the end.
Fair enough, I thought Messi dragged them over the line, so I do get what you mean, I just think that only really happened after Vilanova went - the decline of Xavi in particular, he just looked shot to me.
Yeah I suppose.
I think Tito was partly to blame for that, and Pep in seasons prior, as they just never rest him.
He's not started as many games this season, and I hope he gets a bit more rest with La Liga looking gone, because I want him to be fresh and on form for the world cup.
I don't want Spain to win it, but Xavi is probably my favourite player and I'd like to see him go out with a bang for Spain at the world cup as it will be his last.
Ditto. I don't want Spain to win it either, I don't think they will.
I think Roman should hire David Moyes next
Azipi will win the World Cup for Spain, of this I am sure. He was the perfect player to come at exactly the right time for Spain.
Yes I'm sure del Bosque is thinking the exact same thing.
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Mourinho
Page 3 of 3
posted on 30/4/14
Robb I dont ask that as much and why dont you visit your Aussie thread where we all went earlier
posted on 30/4/14
Bets everyone?
posted on 30/4/14
Barcelona were only poor after Vilanovas illness though, of the first 57 points available, they got 55. They lost twice all season in la liga, one of them to Madrid and lost in El Clasico again to Madrid.
Could Mourinho have done better last year? Absolutely, he should have been closer to them, he had fallen out with too many people by then. To say Barca were not as good is wrong though, it would have taken near perfection to win La liga last year instead of them.
Vilanova managing them, they played better football than they did under pep the season before. Messi in particular was on fire, I have no idea where the idea has come from that he had a poor season, he scored 46 goals in 32 games in la liga.
posted on 30/4/14
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 1 minute ago
Barcelona were only poor after Vilanovas illness though, of the first 57 points available, they got 55. They lost twice all season in la liga, one of them to Madrid and lost in El Clasico again to Madrid.
Could Mourinho have done better last year? Absolutely, he should have been closer to them, he had fallen out with too many people by then. To say Barca were not as good is wrong though, it would have taken near perfection to win La liga last year instead of them.
Vilanova managing them, they played better football than they did under pep the season before. Messi in particular was on fire, I have no idea where the idea has come from that he had a poor season, he scored 46 goals in 32 games in la liga.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agree entirely. Still a formidable side
posted on 30/4/14
meltonblue (U10617)
AMEN
It was Tito leaving the club that put us a few steps back, to SAY we were POOR is a disgrace by football fans and pundits like Savage and Keown to be fair.
posted on 30/4/14
Hmm, maybe I remembered last season a little differently to how it happened.
I still think Real could have kept up with them had they played to their potential.
Jose out
posted on 30/4/14
Bosman,
I wrote an article on you before the second leg against Milan, this was it -
Up to halfway through this season, this Barcelona team looked like surpassing anything they had done over the previous three years. Messi had broken individual records for goals in a calendar year and they had gone on a run in the league of 18 wins and 1 draw from the start of the season. Tactically, Villanova had just tweaked what was working so well under Guardiola. It wasn't really going to change much, Villanova was as much responsible for developing these players as much as Guardiola was, having worked at La Masia with them for so long.
If you watched Barca under Guardiola, you will know that the key to their pressing game was the 7 second rule. He believed that an opposition player was most vulnerable just after getting possession and chances of getting the ball back were far greater in that initial 7 seconds than after. Barca would press the man in an instant then, if they did not get the ball, go back to their shape and sit deep (not always a high press like some people think). This was the reason he experimented with midfielders in defence as well - the flip side is that what the Barca players did with the ball in that first 7 seconds was equally as important and so good passers were key to the system working.
Villanova preferred to keep the pressure on continuously and it was working very well for them. The shape stayed the same, but they pushed further up the pitch and the football was more direct than they were known for previously. His Barca had changed to be able to adapt more to the opposition if the tiki taka style was not working.
Up to that point, everything was looking rosy. Then, Barca went on a run of playing 10, winning 5, drawing 2 and losing 3 and conceding a goal in 13 straight games. Tactically, they were all over the shop and even in winning, did not look great and Milan probably deserved to win by more than 2 goals they did do at the San Siro. What had caused this slump, have teams now figured them out?
Villanova, the man who had spent as much time with those players moulding their style of play and relationships, had a reoccurrence of throat cancer and had to take an absence of leave from Barca for chemotherapy. The slump directly coincided with Villanova leaving and Jordi Roura taking over. Roura has no designs on being the Barca coach, he is purely in position due to Villanova's illness.
If you look at Barca now compared to earlier in the season, they are a mixture of Villanova and Guardiola tactically, with the pressing in defence being the most obvious example of it and why Milan (and Madrid recently) have ran out deserved winners against them. That is not to blame Roura for it at all, he just does not have the tactical ability or the relationship with the players that his predecessors had. Whilst Villanova still does video conferencing with the team, that ability to make changes on the fly is no longer there and the players are obviously not coping well with the man seen as a father figure to them being not there and being so ill.
Now, if any team in the world could cope without a coach, most people would probably say Barcelona. The past couple of months goes to show just how important that role actually is and why, even if you put the best 11 players in the world together in the same team, they are not always guaranteed to win, they still need someone to get them to react to the opposition. This is not the end of this team by any means though, they are still capable of utter brilliance, they are suffering from a lack of a leader to guide them and what has happened to Villanova. Any team in the world would be the same.
In terms of tonights game, my head is saying that Barca will win the game but go out of the CL as I think Milan will score. My heart, though, wants them to turn it around and go on to win the whole thing. For me, this team has been a joy to watch for the last few years and Villanova has been a massive part of that. For what he, Guardiola, and the team have done over the last few years, I want them to put on the performance they are absolutely still capable of.
posted on 30/4/14
Barca were most certainly poor in the CL though. That can't be debated.
posted on 30/4/14
I still think Mourinho facked it up, though I do agree Barca were good last season.
posted on 30/4/14
Robb,
Apart from that second leg against milan after I wrote that. Other than that, I agree.
Mourinhos big achievement was beating them they year before. Bear in mind, they've added bale and Barca have been far worse this season than last, with Messi definitely having a poor season by his standards. The likely difference between them at the end of the season is still only going to be a point or two though.
posted on 30/4/14
That's because Barca and Madrid are head and shoulders above everyone in the league, Atleti joining the party this season, and why La Liga often comes down to the head to head.
It was Mourinho facking things up at the start of the season that cost them because they were a better side and Tito, as well as he did, wasn't that good in the head to heads.
posted on 30/4/14
*and the big games
posted on 30/4/14
Yeah, but they have lost Ozil too. Ancelotti IMO was always a better manager than Jose because he is defensively strong but also good for him forward.
Chelsea won the league with him with a +71 goal difference which is amazing.
I'd love him at United. Jose is a very good manager but just not for United if I had my way.
posted on 30/4/14
*good going forward
posted on 30/4/14
meltonblue (U10617)
Barca could certainly have achieved higher then previous under pep but that is FATE.
Pep was the right man at the right time, he had all the majors players in their prime and in Messi's case injury free for 4 years.
Rijkaard had an equally dominant team during a period of 04-07 but not the same football luck as pep inherited.
I still believe tito was as equal as Pep if not better.
posted on 30/4/14
I agree Bosman, I was gutted then and even more gutted last week.
Darren,
Vilanova only took charge of three games against Madrid, which was one win, one draw and one loss.
I get what you are saying, he should have come closer than he did. If what happened to Vilanova hadn't happened though, that Barca side could easily have ended up on 106 or more points.
posted on 30/4/14
Possibly, melton. Sadly we'll never know.
I just wasn't that convinced by them against better opposition, even when they won.
Messi dragged them through so many games last season.
I think a full focussed Madrid would have had too much for them over the course of the season. Not by much, of course, I just think the head to heads would have told by the end.
posted on 1/5/14
Fair enough, I thought Messi dragged them over the line, so I do get what you mean, I just think that only really happened after Vilanova went - the decline of Xavi in particular, he just looked shot to me.
posted on 1/5/14
Yeah I suppose.
I think Tito was partly to blame for that, and Pep in seasons prior, as they just never rest him.
He's not started as many games this season, and I hope he gets a bit more rest with La Liga looking gone, because I want him to be fresh and on form for the world cup.
I don't want Spain to win it, but Xavi is probably my favourite player and I'd like to see him go out with a bang for Spain at the world cup as it will be his last.
posted on 1/5/14
Ditto. I don't want Spain to win it either, I don't think they will.
posted on 1/5/14
I think Roman should hire David Moyes next
posted on 1/5/14
Azipi will win the World Cup for Spain, of this I am sure. He was the perfect player to come at exactly the right time for Spain.
posted on 1/5/14
Yes I'm sure del Bosque is thinking the exact same thing.
posted on 1/5/14
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