Agree about Westwood. He is a waste of space.
And the likes of Richardson and, at the moment, Grealish aren't doing much either.
Why isnt Kozak being given a chance? Why arent the likes of Traore?
Still just about in touch though.... and no more dumb international breaks to get in the way. So it isnt over yet.
25 games left .. So we pretty much have to win just over half of those to survive ... NOT A CHANCE ..
Days of ranting about it have gone still love the villa wherever they are but it is being proved that we have a weak squad of players and weaker than previous relegation scraps.
It is the state of the club at the top that has caused this I dont care what anybody says.
DLO thats exactly the scenario and its nigh on impossible.
UTV
On paper we do have a chance. Get another 10 points by the end of the year and 20 in the second half of the year and we would probably survive. Doable.
BUT, the bottom line is we have to start winning matches. MC was a good result and a good performance under the circumstances. Today was a likely result but a poor performance. The two HUGE challenges for Remi are to sort out our left back position and to give us a cutting edge up front.
Drop Richardson and Westwood. They aren't good enough, even if the alternatives are a risk. Drop Grealish, he doesn't contribute enough. Wondering Maybe bring Bacuna back for Watford.
35 points? not racing to BetFred with that one mate
I will always love my club, i am just being realistic. Staying up this season will be a miracle. The fact is we have been a shambles season after season for the last 4 or 5 years so it was inevitable that one day we would pay for it. Totally agree its Lerner's. The guy knows nothing about football and clearly lost interest in the club very quickly when we failed to get in the top 4 all those years ago under O Neill.
I remember when Lerner came in, some of my American friends said he hadn't done well at Cleveland Browns. At Villa, he's made mistakes constantly, whether it was giving O'Neill too much money to spend on average players, poor choice of managers (think Houllier might have turned us round eventually if he was healthy) and poor choice of people in senior positions at the club.
The club is rotten to the core.
Can't see us getting anywhere near 40 points at all, but I don't think Sunderland or Newcastle will either. Norwich and Bournemouth will also be vulnerable.
Will 35 points be enough? Might be. That would mean us getting 10 wins, or maybe 8 wins and 6 draws. We need to beat the likes of Norwich, Sunderland (how they got a point against us I'll never know), Newcastle, Bournemouth, Watford and maybe get a surprise result or too!
It does look bad. And I think Villa wont make it.
But you dont necessarily need 40 points or even 35. The likes of Bournemouth, Sunderland and Newcaslte arent setting the league on fire. They might all struggle to get to 30 points too.
You should of held on for Moyes - he could probably end up at Newcastle now.
There's still the transfer window in Jan to turn things around. And you've still got the 3 or 4 clubs directly above you, that are playing just as poorly, and inconsistently. So it's not as though you're completely sunk without trace.
A couple of wins, a couple of draws and you're back in contention of staying up.
It's not over until its over, as they say. But I think if things are still looking grim by Feb, then it really is game over.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Lerner got caught out by the twin wammies of the financial crash and an expensive divorce. The former may have halved his wealth. OK when you have a lot of money you can make a lot of money so he's probably recovered a fair amount. But the other factor is that the money is the Lerner family trust, which I think he controls but can't entirely ignore the family wishes. So he went from being in a position to shove in money without thinking too much about it to having to be a lot more careful. Hence him tightening the lending to MON, and MON going.
The other factor was that although MON's purchases now look expensive, when MON was doing it they and the salaries were around the going rate. Again the market dropped with the financial crash. So we were left with a load of expensive players on our books who took a lot longer to shift than anticipated.
What we are trying to do now is maybe what Houllier would have tried, but several years later and from a much lower base. Think we have to stick with it. The younger players we've bought have talent even if they lack experience, and I'd rather we stuck with them than try and save ourselves with older past-it players. A rocky time ahead.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Give the bloke a chance. He's only been in charge for 2 matches and achieved a draw when we all expected 2 losses.
Yesterday was bad but the real test begins next week against West Brom. Garde needs to hold his nerve and not take any panic measures.
Over the next 6 weeks we need to win 2 more games than most of our relegation rivals and buy a proven premier league goal scorer in January. If we don't then I will start panicking!
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Watford next. That really is a 6 pointer. Looking at the matches next weekend, nearly all the poorer teams have matches where they could easily lose. Beat Watford and we're back in with a chance.
It has to be said that Everton played out of their socks yesterday. When they attacked they attacked in numbers. They set out to smash us in the first half and they did.
Garde strikes me as someone who won't panic. He got it right for the MC match; we hardly looked like scoring but it was his first match. Amavi being out is a huge blow and Richardson isn't the answer. We have to score goals. If he can solve those two problems then there's hope.
Not wumming here guys but has any club ever survived in the prem after being on 5 pts after 13 games?
We're talking Derby's record for the taking.
comment by The Ace Face (U18814)
posted 1 hour, 47 minutes ago
comment by Protagoras (U20517)
posted 1 minute ago
Give the bloke a chance. He's only been in charge for 2 matches and achieved a draw when we all expected 2 losses.
Yesterday was bad but the real test begins next week against West Brom. Garde needs to hold his nerve and not take any panic measures.
Over the next 6 weeks we need to win 2 more games than most of our relegation rivals and buy a proven premier league goal scorer in January. If we don't then I will start panicking!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who will that proven PL striker be d'you think? Adebayor?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Charlie Austin hope.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by The Ace Face (U18814)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
comment by Protagoras (U20517)
posted 40 minutes ago
comment by The Ace Face (U18814)
posted 1 hour, 47 minutes ago
comment by Protagoras (U20517)
posted 1 minute ago
Give the bloke a chance. He's only been in charge for 2 matches and achieved a draw when we all expected 2 losses.
Yesterday was bad but the real test begins next week against West Brom. Garde needs to hold his nerve and not take any panic measures.
Over the next 6 weeks we need to win 2 more games than most of our relegation rivals and buy a proven premier league goal scorer in January. If we don't then I will start panicking!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who will that proven PL striker be d'you think? Adebayor?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Charlie Austin hope.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hmmm, no disrespect mate as I know villa are historically a big club, but as it is you're staring relegation in the face - could be a number of teams that are guaranteed PL football next season looking at him as well, will he want to risk being back in the Championship? I think a player like Adebayor, proven Prem player, short term contract til the end of the season, could score you the goals to dig you out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My problem with Adebayor is his lack of match practice. Has he actually been playing?
Might be right on Austin, but the other teams that have shown an interest are also threatened with relegation.
comment by heisenberg... (U4832)
posted 3 hours, 10 minutes ago
Not wumming here guys but has any club ever survived in the prem after being on 5 pts after 13 games?
We're talking Derby's record for the taking.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The more important statistic is how far are we off 17th place. The answer is 5 points. I would think it is not unheard of that a team has been able to make up 5 points with 25 games to go.
It isnt about getting 40 points or 35 points, it is about not finishing 18th or lower.
If three teams never got a point all season, then the team that finished 17th would survive with 1pt.
True, Villa are in a hole.
And they do look very likely to go down.
But whilst there are other teams within reach, it isnt over. And other teams are still in reach. You never know... keep your chins up!
Been looking at the figures, some are surprising. In spite of our much maligned defence, of the bottom 6 teams only Chelsea (23) have let in less goals than us (24).
The big whammy is of course our scoring. Only 10 goals. But... of the bottom 11 clubs only two (Chelsea and Norwich) have scored more than 14. 4 goals isn't much over 13 games.
Any more straws we can clutch at
I really think people here are clutching at straws regards saving our premiership status. I think it's a certainty we will go down this season. It is not the fact we are only a handful of points off the teams above it is the fact WE CANNOT score goals !! How can anyone be seriously confident Garde will wave a wand and change this ?? It was the same with Lambert, and Sherwood. Benteke was never replaced and we are now seeing in my view how poor we really are. We have nobody in the team that even looks like scoring a goal at the moment and this spells disaster. All the teams above us might not be a million miles ahead but they all still score goals !! And can any of us really see Lerner splashing the cash in January ?? Lets face it we need 2 defenders and 2 quality strikers and that's around 50 million in the market today. Not a hope of us spending that money !!
I know it seems that we cannot score goals. But we CAN; we've scored 10 of them. Just not enough. Stoke have only scored 1 more than us and are in 11th; OK, they defend a lot better than we do. The "bottom of the league" table for goals scored is:
Crystal P.........14
Swansea.........14
Bournemouth...14
Newcastle........13
Sunderland......13
West Brom......12
Watford...........12
Stoke...............11
Villa.................10
Yep we need to score more. But it's not as though there was a massive gap between us and them. Sherwood didn't solve the problem, Remi hasn't had time to solve the problem. But it doesn't look completely hopeless to me.
Give Remi time to see what he can do with the existing players, and look to strengthen in January. Gestede, Sinclair, and Ayew can all score goals, even if they aren't out and out strikers. Gil and Veretout are capable of chipping in. Sherwood didn't have much of a clue about how to solve it. We haven't yet seen what Remi can do, and we have to give him time.
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Page 1 of 2
posted on 21/11/15
Agree about Westwood. He is a waste of space.
And the likes of Richardson and, at the moment, Grealish aren't doing much either.
Why isnt Kozak being given a chance? Why arent the likes of Traore?
Still just about in touch though.... and no more dumb international breaks to get in the way. So it isnt over yet.
posted on 21/11/15
25 games left .. So we pretty much have to win just over half of those to survive ... NOT A CHANCE ..
posted on 21/11/15
Days of ranting about it have gone still love the villa wherever they are but it is being proved that we have a weak squad of players and weaker than previous relegation scraps.
It is the state of the club at the top that has caused this I dont care what anybody says.
DLO thats exactly the scenario and its nigh on impossible.
UTV
posted on 21/11/15
On paper we do have a chance. Get another 10 points by the end of the year and 20 in the second half of the year and we would probably survive. Doable.
BUT, the bottom line is we have to start winning matches. MC was a good result and a good performance under the circumstances. Today was a likely result but a poor performance. The two HUGE challenges for Remi are to sort out our left back position and to give us a cutting edge up front.
Drop Richardson and Westwood. They aren't good enough, even if the alternatives are a risk. Drop Grealish, he doesn't contribute enough. Wondering Maybe bring Bacuna back for Watford.
posted on 21/11/15
35 points? not racing to BetFred with that one mate
posted on 21/11/15
I will always love my club, i am just being realistic. Staying up this season will be a miracle. The fact is we have been a shambles season after season for the last 4 or 5 years so it was inevitable that one day we would pay for it. Totally agree its Lerner's. The guy knows nothing about football and clearly lost interest in the club very quickly when we failed to get in the top 4 all those years ago under O Neill.
posted on 21/11/15
I remember when Lerner came in, some of my American friends said he hadn't done well at Cleveland Browns. At Villa, he's made mistakes constantly, whether it was giving O'Neill too much money to spend on average players, poor choice of managers (think Houllier might have turned us round eventually if he was healthy) and poor choice of people in senior positions at the club.
The club is rotten to the core.
Can't see us getting anywhere near 40 points at all, but I don't think Sunderland or Newcastle will either. Norwich and Bournemouth will also be vulnerable.
Will 35 points be enough? Might be. That would mean us getting 10 wins, or maybe 8 wins and 6 draws. We need to beat the likes of Norwich, Sunderland (how they got a point against us I'll never know), Newcastle, Bournemouth, Watford and maybe get a surprise result or too!
posted on 21/11/15
It does look bad. And I think Villa wont make it.
But you dont necessarily need 40 points or even 35. The likes of Bournemouth, Sunderland and Newcaslte arent setting the league on fire. They might all struggle to get to 30 points too.
posted on 21/11/15
You should of held on for Moyes - he could probably end up at Newcastle now.
posted on 21/11/15
There's still the transfer window in Jan to turn things around. And you've still got the 3 or 4 clubs directly above you, that are playing just as poorly, and inconsistently. So it's not as though you're completely sunk without trace.
A couple of wins, a couple of draws and you're back in contention of staying up.
It's not over until its over, as they say. But I think if things are still looking grim by Feb, then it really is game over.
posted on 21/11/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/11/15
Lerner got caught out by the twin wammies of the financial crash and an expensive divorce. The former may have halved his wealth. OK when you have a lot of money you can make a lot of money so he's probably recovered a fair amount. But the other factor is that the money is the Lerner family trust, which I think he controls but can't entirely ignore the family wishes. So he went from being in a position to shove in money without thinking too much about it to having to be a lot more careful. Hence him tightening the lending to MON, and MON going.
The other factor was that although MON's purchases now look expensive, when MON was doing it they and the salaries were around the going rate. Again the market dropped with the financial crash. So we were left with a load of expensive players on our books who took a lot longer to shift than anticipated.
What we are trying to do now is maybe what Houllier would have tried, but several years later and from a much lower base. Think we have to stick with it. The younger players we've bought have talent even if they lack experience, and I'd rather we stuck with them than try and save ourselves with older past-it players. A rocky time ahead.
posted on 22/11/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/11/15
Give the bloke a chance. He's only been in charge for 2 matches and achieved a draw when we all expected 2 losses.
Yesterday was bad but the real test begins next week against West Brom. Garde needs to hold his nerve and not take any panic measures.
Over the next 6 weeks we need to win 2 more games than most of our relegation rivals and buy a proven premier league goal scorer in January. If we don't then I will start panicking!
posted on 22/11/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/11/15
Watford next. That really is a 6 pointer. Looking at the matches next weekend, nearly all the poorer teams have matches where they could easily lose. Beat Watford and we're back in with a chance.
It has to be said that Everton played out of their socks yesterday. When they attacked they attacked in numbers. They set out to smash us in the first half and they did.
Garde strikes me as someone who won't panic. He got it right for the MC match; we hardly looked like scoring but it was his first match. Amavi being out is a huge blow and Richardson isn't the answer. We have to score goals. If he can solve those two problems then there's hope.
posted on 22/11/15
Not wumming here guys but has any club ever survived in the prem after being on 5 pts after 13 games?
We're talking Derby's record for the taking.
posted on 22/11/15
comment by The Ace Face (U18814)
posted 1 hour, 47 minutes ago
comment by Protagoras (U20517)
posted 1 minute ago
Give the bloke a chance. He's only been in charge for 2 matches and achieved a draw when we all expected 2 losses.
Yesterday was bad but the real test begins next week against West Brom. Garde needs to hold his nerve and not take any panic measures.
Over the next 6 weeks we need to win 2 more games than most of our relegation rivals and buy a proven premier league goal scorer in January. If we don't then I will start panicking!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who will that proven PL striker be d'you think? Adebayor?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Charlie Austin hope.
posted on 22/11/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/11/15
comment by The Ace Face (U18814)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
comment by Protagoras (U20517)
posted 40 minutes ago
comment by The Ace Face (U18814)
posted 1 hour, 47 minutes ago
comment by Protagoras (U20517)
posted 1 minute ago
Give the bloke a chance. He's only been in charge for 2 matches and achieved a draw when we all expected 2 losses.
Yesterday was bad but the real test begins next week against West Brom. Garde needs to hold his nerve and not take any panic measures.
Over the next 6 weeks we need to win 2 more games than most of our relegation rivals and buy a proven premier league goal scorer in January. If we don't then I will start panicking!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who will that proven PL striker be d'you think? Adebayor?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Charlie Austin hope.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hmmm, no disrespect mate as I know villa are historically a big club, but as it is you're staring relegation in the face - could be a number of teams that are guaranteed PL football next season looking at him as well, will he want to risk being back in the Championship? I think a player like Adebayor, proven Prem player, short term contract til the end of the season, could score you the goals to dig you out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My problem with Adebayor is his lack of match practice. Has he actually been playing?
Might be right on Austin, but the other teams that have shown an interest are also threatened with relegation.
posted on 22/11/15
comment by heisenberg... (U4832)
posted 3 hours, 10 minutes ago
Not wumming here guys but has any club ever survived in the prem after being on 5 pts after 13 games?
We're talking Derby's record for the taking.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The more important statistic is how far are we off 17th place. The answer is 5 points. I would think it is not unheard of that a team has been able to make up 5 points with 25 games to go.
posted on 22/11/15
It isnt about getting 40 points or 35 points, it is about not finishing 18th or lower.
If three teams never got a point all season, then the team that finished 17th would survive with 1pt.
True, Villa are in a hole.
And they do look very likely to go down.
But whilst there are other teams within reach, it isnt over. And other teams are still in reach. You never know... keep your chins up!
posted on 22/11/15
Been looking at the figures, some are surprising. In spite of our much maligned defence, of the bottom 6 teams only Chelsea (23) have let in less goals than us (24).
The big whammy is of course our scoring. Only 10 goals. But... of the bottom 11 clubs only two (Chelsea and Norwich) have scored more than 14. 4 goals isn't much over 13 games.
Any more straws we can clutch at
posted on 22/11/15
I really think people here are clutching at straws regards saving our premiership status. I think it's a certainty we will go down this season. It is not the fact we are only a handful of points off the teams above it is the fact WE CANNOT score goals !! How can anyone be seriously confident Garde will wave a wand and change this ?? It was the same with Lambert, and Sherwood. Benteke was never replaced and we are now seeing in my view how poor we really are. We have nobody in the team that even looks like scoring a goal at the moment and this spells disaster. All the teams above us might not be a million miles ahead but they all still score goals !! And can any of us really see Lerner splashing the cash in January ?? Lets face it we need 2 defenders and 2 quality strikers and that's around 50 million in the market today. Not a hope of us spending that money !!
posted on 22/11/15
I know it seems that we cannot score goals. But we CAN; we've scored 10 of them. Just not enough. Stoke have only scored 1 more than us and are in 11th; OK, they defend a lot better than we do. The "bottom of the league" table for goals scored is:
Crystal P.........14
Swansea.........14
Bournemouth...14
Newcastle........13
Sunderland......13
West Brom......12
Watford...........12
Stoke...............11
Villa.................10
Yep we need to score more. But it's not as though there was a massive gap between us and them. Sherwood didn't solve the problem, Remi hasn't had time to solve the problem. But it doesn't look completely hopeless to me.
Give Remi time to see what he can do with the existing players, and look to strengthen in January. Gestede, Sinclair, and Ayew can all score goals, even if they aren't out and out strikers. Gil and Veretout are capable of chipping in. Sherwood didn't have much of a clue about how to solve it. We haven't yet seen what Remi can do, and we have to give him time.
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