tbab I don't doubt the intentions of people supporting air strikes, it's a complicated problem and there's no simple solutions. But some are also driven by the war mentality or revenge instead of a long term peaceful solution. Cameron says there's 70,000 ground troops which is half true, they're part of different factions, some fighting each other and most of them more interested in fighting Assad rather than IS. Why does Cameron need to mislead us making out there's a 70,000 strong army ready to support us on the ground.
We need to get real and figure out who's on our side and who's not, confront countries who are funding/supporting IS in any way. Swallow our pride and cooperate with Russia. Kurds have been the most successful in fighting IS but Turkey wants to eliminate them, but we don't hold them to account. We need a coalition who all have the same aims and doing the same thing which we're nowhere near to, and if countries like Turkey don't want to do that then we take a hard line with them. And we need to understand this is a war about ideology and you can't defeat an ideology with bombs alone. I'm not against air strikes as long as it's part of a bigger plan and the plan isn't in place yet.
Fair points 8bit,and cameron tried it on blair style,with that 70 k FSA troop propaganda,as they are factional,fighting assad,and not all near daesh,so that annoyed me too,as we have been lied to enough.
Cameron will not face daesh face to face,but ordinary people will.
I agree about russia and turkey and kurds,and outlined the real politik involved,whereby we ally alongside less bad guys,to counter worse one's.
The complex nature of the conflict confuses me,and it will not be a clean moral battle,or outcome,as humans muddle through,as in our daily life.
We need to dump political hias though,for humanity to progress,and radical islamism needs sorting,as does big business dictating foreign affairs.
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Then of course with calls coming from the Tories that he is more credible that Corbyn, one wonders why.
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On the contrary, the Conservatives are extremely keen to keep Corbyn as Labour leader, it is their best chance of being re-elected - anybody that thinks Hilary Benn would be less popular than Corbyn is delusional.
Hillary Benn
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posted on 5/12/15
tbab I don't doubt the intentions of people supporting air strikes, it's a complicated problem and there's no simple solutions. But some are also driven by the war mentality or revenge instead of a long term peaceful solution. Cameron says there's 70,000 ground troops which is half true, they're part of different factions, some fighting each other and most of them more interested in fighting Assad rather than IS. Why does Cameron need to mislead us making out there's a 70,000 strong army ready to support us on the ground.
We need to get real and figure out who's on our side and who's not, confront countries who are funding/supporting IS in any way. Swallow our pride and cooperate with Russia. Kurds have been the most successful in fighting IS but Turkey wants to eliminate them, but we don't hold them to account. We need a coalition who all have the same aims and doing the same thing which we're nowhere near to, and if countries like Turkey don't want to do that then we take a hard line with them. And we need to understand this is a war about ideology and you can't defeat an ideology with bombs alone. I'm not against air strikes as long as it's part of a bigger plan and the plan isn't in place yet.
posted on 5/12/15
Fair points 8bit,and cameron tried it on blair style,with that 70 k FSA troop propaganda,as they are factional,fighting assad,and not all near daesh,so that annoyed me too,as we have been lied to enough.
Cameron will not face daesh face to face,but ordinary people will.
I agree about russia and turkey and kurds,and outlined the real politik involved,whereby we ally alongside less bad guys,to counter worse one's.
The complex nature of the conflict confuses me,and it will not be a clean moral battle,or outcome,as humans muddle through,as in our daily life.
We need to dump political hias though,for humanity to progress,and radical islamism needs sorting,as does big business dictating foreign affairs.
posted on 6/12/15
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Then of course with calls coming from the Tories that he is more credible that Corbyn, one wonders why.
===
On the contrary, the Conservatives are extremely keen to keep Corbyn as Labour leader, it is their best chance of being re-elected - anybody that thinks Hilary Benn would be less popular than Corbyn is delusional.
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