Itoje broken hand confirmed.

Sam Underhill anybody ?

JSpur

What a ridiculous depth you have in that department. Just please don't let it be Courtney, we need him at the Saints. Pleeeeeeaaaase.

comment by theresgonnaebeashow - Joseph Anthony Barton, just another jA. (U5686)
posted 1 minute ago
JSpur

What a ridiculous depth you have in that department. Just please don't let it be Courtney, we need him at the Saints. Pleeeeeeaaaase.

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Lawes is nailed on to start.

Hopefully not at openside though !

* the talk was Itoje was going to start at 7

Already been agreed with the club's that Underhill won't be selected whilst he is in Wales.

Kvesic needs a shot, but he doesn't seem to be in Jones' mind.

comment by Aristodemus (U3765)
posted 7 seconds ago
Already been agreed with the club's that Underhill won't be selected whilst he is in Wales.

Kvesic needs a shot, but he doesn't seem to be in Jones' mind.
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It's been agreed that 'special circumstances' means an injury crisis.

We have an injury crisis.

No we don't we have plenty of top players to pick from. Underhill won't be picked that's certain.

Maro

comment by Aristodemus (U3765)
posted 4 hours, 28 minutes ago
No we don't we have plenty of top players to pick from. Underhill won't be picked that's certain.
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The only reason it's certain though is because he's injured as well

They wouldn't pick him because it would upset the club's, regardless of anything else.

Huge blow that Itoje has a broken hand.

Stop reminding me

comment by Aristodemus (U3765)
posted 7 minutes ago
They wouldn't pick him because it would upset the club's, regardless of anything else.
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Dont see why it would. If you couldnt pick someome now under the exception provision, you never would be able to. I believe they would pick him if he was fit, but we won't find out now !

Yeah, losing Maro's a right kick in the knackers.

That rule would only be used if for example we lost 5 TH props to injury or something like that. Providing of course there was a good option playing overseas. It would be highly unlikely that they would use it for a back rower.

comment by Aristodemus (U3765)
posted 1 hour, 8 minutes ago
That rule would only be used if for example we lost 5 TH props to injury or something like that. Providing of course there was a good option playing overseas. It would be highly unlikely that they would use it for a back rower.
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What authority do you cite for that claim out of interest ?

JSpur

There may be a formal ruling but I'd have thought it might be the common sense that wants to prevent English players from wanting to leave for France for more money.

That might not be the case with Underhill, but he comes under the same ruling. Playing devil's advocate, it can't be that long before he can opt for being Welsh on the residency rule - a bit like Hughes to name but one 'Englishman'

comment by theresgonnaebeashow - Joseph Anthony Barton, just another jA. (U5686)
posted 3 minutes ago
JSpur

There may be a formal ruling but I'd have thought it might be the common sense that wants to prevent English players from wanting to leave for France for more money.

That might not be the case with Underhill, but he comes under the same ruling. Playing devil's advocate, it can't be that long before he can opt for being Welsh on the residency rule - a bit like Hughes to name but one 'Englishman'


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I appreciate and recognise the point you're making tgbas, but Jones wanted to pick Underhill in the summer claiming that the fact that he was at university meant the special circumstances provision applied. Jones will pick the best team that's available, I have no doubt about that. He wasnt allowed to select Underhill, because in the recent deal made with the Prem clubs, it was agreed that special circumstances shall be taken to mean only an injury crisis.

England have lost their first, second, third and fourth choice open sides. To me that is clearly an injury crisis. If they had wanted to restrict the exemption to front row forwarde, they wouod have made that clear. It was not made clear in the drafting of the policy, and it was not made clear in the reporting of the subsequent clarification with the clubs. I would suggest that there is no such restriction, and that in the current circumstances, were he not injured, he would have been selected.

You're missing the point.

The point is that we are far from desperate right now in the back row. A legitimate scenario for using the rule was one I suggested, I wasn't saying that is the sole reason it would be used.

And Show. ... stop with the fake English stuff, you're Scottish

Demus

Quite happy to have that discussion mate

With some recent exceptions (Visser, Nel and Strauss) all have good Scottish heritage. Heritage is a much better arbiter than some date chosen by a committee - usually swayed by somebody's need to recruit someone.

comment by Aristodemus (U3765)
posted 50 minutes ago
You're missing the point.

The point is that we are far from desperate right now in the back row. A legitimate scenario for using the rule was one I suggested, I wasn't saying that is the sole reason it would be used.

And Show. ... stop with the fake English stuff, you're Scottish

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With respect, you are just making it up.

I'm not doing the whole qualification discussion again Show. Pretty sure you know where I stand by now.

As for making it up, that's generally how opinions are formed. With respect though, mine are better informed

Real disappointment to have lost Itoje for the autumn, one of the most exciting young England players I've ever seen. Interesting to see how we cope without him.

....and Kruis, Haskell, a match fit Hartley...

Demus

Yeah, arbitrary dates set by a committee of vested interests is a way better system than generations of heritage.

comment by JSpur. (U1059)
posted 24 minutes ago
....and Kruis, Haskell, a match fit Hartley...
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Trust me guys, you can cope with losing all those much better than we can cope losing just one - Nel - because of the ridiculous strength in depth you have.

Not biting <3