comment by mancini (U7179)
.
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Tommy like many peole across Europe, are not fans of "Islam" after the recent wave of terrorist activities..
Ask yourself, why is Budhism not treated the same way as Islam?
Regarding the breach of reporting restrictions, I would call him an idiot for that.
Majority of the rape gangs came from Pakistan and are Muslims.
Regarding your inference to other paedo rings, 2 wrongs doesn't make it right. And the majority of those have been prosecuted and jailed. Tommy is simply asking for the same treatment for the mainly Muslim male gangs.
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Lots of incorrect statements here
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 hours, 37 minutes ago
He is awesome. Also Ben Shapiro. Milo is funny as well. Lauren Southern also, and Gavin McInnes. They all give the looney lefties a hard time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person thinks Milo Yiannapoulous, Lauren Southern and Gavin McInnes are "awesome" people?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I thought Jordan Peterson was one of the options the dippers were looking at to replace Karius. Actually maybe he is.
On racism? His belief that African Americans don't face systematic social injustice, his 20 minute rant trying to justify Trump calling Haiti and some African Countries "shiiiitholes", his thoughts on the NFl protests (saying they should have stood for the anthem), blames black people for them having lower grades and a higher crime rate as if that is because of the colour of their skin, not because of a large proportion of them come from terrible situations, believing white people dont have an advantage.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's weird though, when he asks what privilege white people have over black people people come up short. It has been proven that black people convicted do not face more jailtime than white people in the states, also more white people shot by police etc. I think historically African Americans have had it bad(understatement of the year)But so did asians and japenese in the states yet they are flourishing and graduation at a ridiculously higher rate, coming from similar circumstances.
He also cites the fact that a lot of African Americans grow up without a father and poor family life being an issue that he feels should be addressed, so I don't believe you can call him racist.
I'm not for or against either side here, but you seem to just be attacking his views because you disagree with them, and i'm not sure how informed you are, or any of us brits are, on the actual figures and statistics of it all. I find white privilege, while affirmative action is in place, to be a ridiculous concept, but I believe the states is feeecked anyway.
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 5 hours, 21 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff John Brown - Wenger Till I Die (U7482)
posted 36 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 hours, 37 minutes ago
He is awesome. Also Ben Shapiro. Milo is funny as well. Lauren Southern also, and Gavin McInnes. They all give the looney lefties a hard time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person thinks Milo Yiannapoulous, Lauren Southern and Gavin McInnes are "awesome" people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person asks that kind of question? How would you like me to answer it? Do you want a break down of my appearance, education, personal life, sexual preference, eating habits or favourite colour?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's a rhetorical question to be honest. The kind of person must have very high tolerance for bigotry and anti-social behaviour as long as the "awesome" figuures he admires are upsetting the "libtards". And that's putting it lightly. The person is probably himself a racist.
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 55 minutes ago
On racism? His belief that African Americans don't face systematic social injustice, his 20 minute rant trying to justify Trump calling Haiti and some African Countries "shiiiitholes", his thoughts on the NFl protests (saying they should have stood for the anthem), blames black people for them having lower grades and a higher crime rate as if that is because of the colour of their skin, not because of a large proportion of them come from terrible situations, believing white people dont have an advantage.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's weird though, when he asks what privilege white people have over black people people come up short. It has been proven that black people convicted do not face more jailtime than white people in the states, also more white people shot by police etc. I think historically African Americans have had it bad(understatement of the year)But so did asians and japenese in the states yet they are flourishing and graduation at a ridiculously higher rate, coming from similar circumstances.
He also cites the fact that a lot of African Americans grow up without a father and poor family life being an issue that he feels should be addressed, so I don't believe you can call him racist.
I'm not for or against either side here, but you seem to just be attacking his views because you disagree with them, and i'm not sure how informed you are, or any of us brits are, on the actual figures and statistics of it all. I find white privilege, while affirmative action is in place, to be a ridiculous concept, but I believe the states is feeecked anyway.
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Don't know...I wouldn't quite compare the history and profile of aspirational, upwardly mobile Korean or Japanese immigrants to the US with those coming off 3 centuries of slavery and another century of Jim Crow segregation and ostracism. I don't want to get dragged into debating that provocative notion of "white privilege" or otherwise (Trump's ascendancy to the US presidency despite his deep, deep pathologies might be the ultimate embodiment of "white privilege") or the glaring dysfunction in African American urban culture, but one of the remarkable things about Shapiro is that for someone so desensitized to racism, he is so acutely sensitive to "anti-Semitism". The kind of guy who can call Obama a "Jew hater" because Obama in line with US policy for decades was critical of West bank settlement expansion. Or casually calls pundits he has squared with on Twitter like Patton Oswalt "anti-semites" for ridiculing him when they never mentioned his Jewish background.
He's a clever, quick-witted guy but basically a hypocrite. And a provocateur (euphemism for arrsehole) whose polemics is harmful for free, civil discourse he purports to promote.
I think when you are in the limelight and obviously a confident person(like any actor, spokesperson or anyone in the public eye has to be) you will always rub people up the wrong way and become a hypocrite when you say so much on so many platforms. I guess it can be hypocritical of him, I have not seen the obama remarks myself. But Again in regards to japanese/african immigrants...the jews have also got a history of oppression several times over, and are flourishing in the US on the most part.
The difference between shapiro and peterson and others like gavin mcinnes and milo, is that I don't believe they go out with the intention to insult people.
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 6 hours, 26 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff John Brown - Wenger Till I Die (U7482)
posted 36 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 hours, 37 minutes ago
He is awesome. Also Ben Shapiro. Milo is funny as well. Lauren Southern also, and Gavin McInnes. They all give the looney lefties a hard time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person thinks Milo Yiannapoulous, Lauren Southern and Gavin McInnes are "awesome" people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person asks that kind of question? How would you like me to answer it? Do you want a break down of my appearance, education, personal life, sexual preference, eating habits or favourite colour?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All of the above please. Can you also add what your favourite meal is?
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 7 minutes ago
I think when you are in the limelight and obviously a confident person(like any actor, spokesperson or anyone in the public eye has to be) you will always rub people up the wrong way and become a hypocrite when you say so much on so many platforms. I guess it can be hypocritical of him, I have not seen the obama remarks myself. But Again in regards to japanese/african immigrants...the jews have also got a history of oppression several times over, and are flourishing in the US on the most part.
The difference between shapiro and peterson and others like gavin mcinnes and milo, is that I don't believe they go out with the intention to insult people.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your missing the point slightly here though. I don't disagree about the Jewish population, its been oppressed may times over - however its been at least a few thousand years since they were enslaved - they have had considerably more time to recover as a people and identity than the African-Americans have that we are discussing. I don't mean to downplay the events of the holocaust, far from it but its not really a like for like comparison.
In terms of the issues for Black America there are many reasons, historical and otherwise that have lead to this point. The trick that has been played by the American government is that once slavery ended that black people were free. It was actually far from the truth, and not just in the deep south as they would have you believe. The amendment to end slavery states explicitly that you cannot be a slave unless you have been convicted of a crime - its why the prison population in America has exploded ever since then, but more importantly over the last 40-50 years its nearly doubled. A huge amount of government structure has been based on this and frankly a lot of it comes down to money and who is making it. There are then other factors including leadership of the civil rights movements and others that either have been killed or imprisoned - in essence they have missed that to a certain extent. There are so many factors to discuss and not enough time or room here so I will leave it at that, even before we get into the CIA using Black America to fund the black ops - The Contra scandal didn't just have a political goal, it was almost considered 2 birds, one stone.
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 34 minutes ago
I think when you are in the limelight and obviously a confident person(like any actor, spokesperson or anyone in the public eye has to be) you will always rub people up the wrong way and become a hypocrite when you say so much on so many platforms. I guess it can be hypocritical of him, I have not seen the obama remarks myself. But Again in regards to japanese/african immigrants...the jews have also got a history of oppression several times over, and are flourishing in the US on the most part.
The difference between shapiro and peterson and others like gavin mcinnes and milo, is that I don't believe they go out with the intention to insult people.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Shapiro's post college pundit career started with great hits like proposing the forced expulsion of Palestinians from Palestinian territory, and probably more hilariously calling for the internment of Iraq war dissidents (and he was serious). He has ALWAYS been a polemicist. The guy sells "liberal tears" branded mugs. He does set out to insult people.
I take Peterson more seriously in substance and authenticity and I find some arguments of his convincing(if intuitive). He started out more sincerely, but his unexpected explosion of fame has led him down a darker path in my opinion. In Peterson's universe, white, straight males are the only people deserving of his empathy and compassion and vehement defense (the guy has literally teared up twice I've watched talking about how oppressed straight, white males are). Every other grievance is callously dismissed as some fascist identity politics in his view. One-eyed interpretations like that is what I can't abide.
To be honest, arguments about race would take up far too much of my time than I'm willing to commit and it's too fraught a topic for a footie forum like this.
I like Shapiro, Peterson and Larry Elder. None of them are perfect, they have their biases (as we all do), but they speak the most sense. When they talk, I'm actually interested in what they have to say
There's another guy called Steven Crowder. He's a bit up-his-own-ass for my liking, but he does interesting public debates about popular issues.
Dave Rubin is also worth watching.
comment by Tu Meke Arteta (U3732)
posted 17 minutes ago
I like Shapiro, Peterson and Larry Elder. None of them are perfect, they have their biases (as we all do), but they speak the most sense. When they talk, I'm actually interested in what they have to say
There's another guy called Steven Crowder. He's a bit up-his-own-ass for my liking, but he does interesting public debates about popular issues.
Dave Rubin is also worth watching.
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Don't even get me started on Dave Rubin. There's no bigger fraud than that clown. A highly inconsistent, intellectually dishonest, shamelessly hypocritical clown. And to be honest, he wouldn't rank in the top 100 of the smartest public commentators/pundits/critics I know.
For some reason, you always sounded like a leftist to me, but apparently not.
I don't mean I watch him for his own leanings, tbh I don't really know what they are.
That show he does on his channel where he invites guests of any political standpoint and just chats with them. He doesn't get aggressive, he lets his guests talk and make their points. Very different to all these scripted political segments on tv.
As for myself, I'm not really sure what I am. I believe we should be doing more to help people, but people should do more to help themselves. I really just have no time for this identity politics crap that's sweeping the western world now. Dunno where that puts me.
Channel 4 news have also gone up in my estimations over the last year or so.
comment by Tu Meke Arteta (U3732)
posted 14 minutes ago
I don't mean I watch him for his own leanings, tbh I don't really know what they are.
That show he does on his channel where he invites guests of any political standpoint and just chats with them. He doesn't get aggressive, he lets his guests talk and make their points. Very different to all these scripted political segments on tv.
As for myself, I'm not really sure what I am. I believe we should be doing more to help people, but people should do more to help themselves. I really just have no time for this identity politics crap that's sweeping the western world now. Dunno where that puts me.
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Well the pundits you love are all right-wing heroes so perhaps you lean there. Rubin's whole shtick is letting his guests do the talking. Except his guests are overwhelmingly on the right - many of them far right (self-avowed white nationalists and identitarians included). He knows where his bread is buttered so he spends his time pandering to his "base" while pretending to be some open-minded centrist at the same time he says things like "liberalism is a disease". If you've listened to him waffle for any length of time on his own opinions, he's an absolute mug.
The thing about this whole backlash against "identity politics" and "political correctness" is how it's come to overcompensate the actual level of "threat" it is supposed to pose to society. These days, it's more offensive to call someone a racist even when they explicitly prove to be so, than it is to actually be racist. Larry Elder was just rambling on his Twitter account about Roseanne's cancellation. The same guy who was offended a few weeks ago by a comedian calling Sarah Sanders a liar and cracking jokes about her eyeliner, pandered to his base by taking more offense at a racist's punishment than the racist likening a woman of colour to an ape. And of course, it's supposed to have more credibility because it's coming from him, a black man. I just don't get that set of priorities.
“These days, it's more offensive to call someone a racist even when they explicitly prove to be so, than it is to actually be racist. “
Very true. The goalposts are then moved because people don’t think they’re a racist unless they’re on a par with a member of the KKK...
At most, I'd say I'm in the centre, probably slightly right leaning. But then I love the NHS and other public services, so what the heck do I know.
With Rubin, I think it's ok to change your stance on certain issues if you feel the need to. With him, it's not his political views that change, it's how people perceive his leanings. He used to call himself a liberal, but now he believes in today's society those values make you conservative. Regarding his guests, he says he invites lefty guests on his show, but they decline and he implies they bottle it as they wouldn't be able to hold their own against him. How true that is about his invitations, only he knows.
Agree with your point about racism. I feel like a hypocrite in this regard as I do make jokes about it (even at my own expense), but there's situations where it goes too far. Roseanne Barr is a facking loon, and anyone could tell she was setting herself up for her current situation.
With Rubin, I think it's ok to change your stance on certain issues if you feel the need to. With him, it's not his political views that change, it's how people perceive his leanings. He used to call himself a liberal, but now he believes in today's society those values make you conservative. Regarding his guests, he says he invites lefty guests on his show, but they decline and he implies they bottle it as they wouldn't be able to hold their own against him. How true that is about his invitations, only he knows.
---------------------------------------------
Sam Seder once publicly called him out asking to be on Rubin's show and Rubin turned him down apparently cos the guy was too antagonistic for him. He's probably spinning BS to claim that and hilariously over-inflating his own debating ability (he doesn't even debate - he hosts guest monologues). He invites right-wingers and allows them drone on endlessly without confronting their opinions. It is his safe space. And the business model has worked for him. Plenty of liberal commentators have publicly criticized him for not inviting left-wing guests and there is no indication any of those people turned him down.
I have zero problems with him changing his stance. It's watching his singular obsession with left-wing caricatures and pretending they are the ONLY problem in American politics that I find unbelievably, intellectually dishonest. And his spinelessness in his failure or impotence in confronting the opinions of avowed white nationalists that I find vile. There is something wrong with someone if a transgender activist winds you up more than the vile bigots you give a platform.
Peterson has some good material but has somewhat become a gimmick of himself. In my opinion, he’s stepped outside the boundaries of clinical psychology. He's starting to take on questions which have zero to do with clinical psychology and because he is smart and eloquent, he knows people will listen. I don’t think he says anything hugely unique though.
I think Rubin is a good host/speaker but as pointed above, has little integrity. He used to work for TYT so it shouldn't surprise anyone that he’s like that
As for the others like Shapiro – I think they’re right on some issues but are unbelievably unbalanced regarding others. It irritates the hell out of me, especially when he berates identity politics yet fanatically supports a nation built on the concept of identity.
I actually wouldn't consider Robinson far-right (take that from someone who actually does hold some far-right views ); he just seems more like a leftist who has a dislike towards Islam. This makes him even more insufferable because he doesn't offer anything outside of tedious rants against Muslims. Ann Marie Waters is another who is the same.
“A spokeswoman for Sanofi, the pharmaceutical company that makes Ambien, said in response to Barr's tweets about taking the sedative: "While all pharmaceutical treatments have side effects, racism is not a known side effect of any Sanofi medication."
On Roseanne Barr blaming sleeping pills on tweeting racist comments.
Now this was a conversation I didn't want to miss. Such a shame.
Yes, JP is brilliant.
comment by Sheriff John Brown - Wenger Till I Die (U7482)
posted 2 weeks, 1 day ago
With Rubin, I think it's ok to change your stance on certain issues if you feel the need to. With him, it's not his political views that change, it's how people perceive his leanings. He used to call himself a liberal, but now he believes in today's society those values make you conservative. Regarding his guests, he says he invites lefty guests on his show, but they decline and he implies they bottle it as they wouldn't be able to hold their own against him. How true that is about his invitations, only he knows.
---------------------------------------------
Sam Seder once publicly called him out asking to be on Rubin's show and Rubin turned him down apparently cos the guy was too antagonistic for him. He's probably spinning BS to claim that and hilariously over-inflating his own debating ability (he doesn't even debate - he hosts guest monologues). He invites right-wingers and allows them drone on endlessly without confronting their opinions. It is his safe space. And the business model has worked for him. Plenty of liberal commentators have publicly criticized him for not inviting left-wing guests and there is no indication any of those people turned him down.
I have zero problems with him changing his stance. It's watching his singular obsession with left-wing caricatures and pretending they are the ONLY problem in American politics that I find unbelievably, intellectually dishonest. And his spinelessness in his failure or impotence in confronting the opinions of avowed white nationalists that I find vile. There is something wrong with someone if a transgender activist winds you up more than the vile bigots you give a platform.
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https://youtu.be/Ev3-7HLcZ5o
Dave Rubin went on the joe Rogan podcast. I see what you mean now, I never really followed his opinions before, but listening to him here he seems very inconsistent and naive.
Sign in if you want to comment
Jordan B. Peterson
Page 5 of 5
posted on 29/5/18
comment by mancini (U7179)
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Tommy like many peole across Europe, are not fans of "Islam" after the recent wave of terrorist activities..
Ask yourself, why is Budhism not treated the same way as Islam?
Regarding the breach of reporting restrictions, I would call him an idiot for that.
Majority of the rape gangs came from Pakistan and are Muslims.
Regarding your inference to other paedo rings, 2 wrongs doesn't make it right. And the majority of those have been prosecuted and jailed. Tommy is simply asking for the same treatment for the mainly Muslim male gangs.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lots of incorrect statements here
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 hours, 37 minutes ago
He is awesome. Also Ben Shapiro. Milo is funny as well. Lauren Southern also, and Gavin McInnes. They all give the looney lefties a hard time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person thinks Milo Yiannapoulous, Lauren Southern and Gavin McInnes are "awesome" people?
posted on 30/5/18
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/5/18
I thought Jordan Peterson was one of the options the dippers were looking at to replace Karius. Actually maybe he is.
posted on 30/5/18
On racism? His belief that African Americans don't face systematic social injustice, his 20 minute rant trying to justify Trump calling Haiti and some African Countries "shiiiitholes", his thoughts on the NFl protests (saying they should have stood for the anthem), blames black people for them having lower grades and a higher crime rate as if that is because of the colour of their skin, not because of a large proportion of them come from terrible situations, believing white people dont have an advantage.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's weird though, when he asks what privilege white people have over black people people come up short. It has been proven that black people convicted do not face more jailtime than white people in the states, also more white people shot by police etc. I think historically African Americans have had it bad(understatement of the year)But so did asians and japenese in the states yet they are flourishing and graduation at a ridiculously higher rate, coming from similar circumstances.
He also cites the fact that a lot of African Americans grow up without a father and poor family life being an issue that he feels should be addressed, so I don't believe you can call him racist.
I'm not for or against either side here, but you seem to just be attacking his views because you disagree with them, and i'm not sure how informed you are, or any of us brits are, on the actual figures and statistics of it all. I find white privilege, while affirmative action is in place, to be a ridiculous concept, but I believe the states is feeecked anyway.
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 5 hours, 21 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff John Brown - Wenger Till I Die (U7482)
posted 36 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 hours, 37 minutes ago
He is awesome. Also Ben Shapiro. Milo is funny as well. Lauren Southern also, and Gavin McInnes. They all give the looney lefties a hard time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person thinks Milo Yiannapoulous, Lauren Southern and Gavin McInnes are "awesome" people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person asks that kind of question? How would you like me to answer it? Do you want a break down of my appearance, education, personal life, sexual preference, eating habits or favourite colour?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's a rhetorical question to be honest. The kind of person must have very high tolerance for bigotry and anti-social behaviour as long as the "awesome" figuures he admires are upsetting the "libtards". And that's putting it lightly. The person is probably himself a racist.
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 55 minutes ago
On racism? His belief that African Americans don't face systematic social injustice, his 20 minute rant trying to justify Trump calling Haiti and some African Countries "shiiiitholes", his thoughts on the NFl protests (saying they should have stood for the anthem), blames black people for them having lower grades and a higher crime rate as if that is because of the colour of their skin, not because of a large proportion of them come from terrible situations, believing white people dont have an advantage.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's weird though, when he asks what privilege white people have over black people people come up short. It has been proven that black people convicted do not face more jailtime than white people in the states, also more white people shot by police etc. I think historically African Americans have had it bad(understatement of the year)But so did asians and japenese in the states yet they are flourishing and graduation at a ridiculously higher rate, coming from similar circumstances.
He also cites the fact that a lot of African Americans grow up without a father and poor family life being an issue that he feels should be addressed, so I don't believe you can call him racist.
I'm not for or against either side here, but you seem to just be attacking his views because you disagree with them, and i'm not sure how informed you are, or any of us brits are, on the actual figures and statistics of it all. I find white privilege, while affirmative action is in place, to be a ridiculous concept, but I believe the states is feeecked anyway.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't know...I wouldn't quite compare the history and profile of aspirational, upwardly mobile Korean or Japanese immigrants to the US with those coming off 3 centuries of slavery and another century of Jim Crow segregation and ostracism. I don't want to get dragged into debating that provocative notion of "white privilege" or otherwise (Trump's ascendancy to the US presidency despite his deep, deep pathologies might be the ultimate embodiment of "white privilege") or the glaring dysfunction in African American urban culture, but one of the remarkable things about Shapiro is that for someone so desensitized to racism, he is so acutely sensitive to "anti-Semitism". The kind of guy who can call Obama a "Jew hater" because Obama in line with US policy for decades was critical of West bank settlement expansion. Or casually calls pundits he has squared with on Twitter like Patton Oswalt "anti-semites" for ridiculing him when they never mentioned his Jewish background.
He's a clever, quick-witted guy but basically a hypocrite. And a provocateur (euphemism for arrsehole) whose polemics is harmful for free, civil discourse he purports to promote.
posted on 30/5/18
I think when you are in the limelight and obviously a confident person(like any actor, spokesperson or anyone in the public eye has to be) you will always rub people up the wrong way and become a hypocrite when you say so much on so many platforms. I guess it can be hypocritical of him, I have not seen the obama remarks myself. But Again in regards to japanese/african immigrants...the jews have also got a history of oppression several times over, and are flourishing in the US on the most part.
The difference between shapiro and peterson and others like gavin mcinnes and milo, is that I don't believe they go out with the intention to insult people.
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 6 hours, 26 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff John Brown - Wenger Till I Die (U7482)
posted 36 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 hours, 37 minutes ago
He is awesome. Also Ben Shapiro. Milo is funny as well. Lauren Southern also, and Gavin McInnes. They all give the looney lefties a hard time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person thinks Milo Yiannapoulous, Lauren Southern and Gavin McInnes are "awesome" people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What kind of person asks that kind of question? How would you like me to answer it? Do you want a break down of my appearance, education, personal life, sexual preference, eating habits or favourite colour?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All of the above please. Can you also add what your favourite meal is?
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 7 minutes ago
I think when you are in the limelight and obviously a confident person(like any actor, spokesperson or anyone in the public eye has to be) you will always rub people up the wrong way and become a hypocrite when you say so much on so many platforms. I guess it can be hypocritical of him, I have not seen the obama remarks myself. But Again in regards to japanese/african immigrants...the jews have also got a history of oppression several times over, and are flourishing in the US on the most part.
The difference between shapiro and peterson and others like gavin mcinnes and milo, is that I don't believe they go out with the intention to insult people.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your missing the point slightly here though. I don't disagree about the Jewish population, its been oppressed may times over - however its been at least a few thousand years since they were enslaved - they have had considerably more time to recover as a people and identity than the African-Americans have that we are discussing. I don't mean to downplay the events of the holocaust, far from it but its not really a like for like comparison.
In terms of the issues for Black America there are many reasons, historical and otherwise that have lead to this point. The trick that has been played by the American government is that once slavery ended that black people were free. It was actually far from the truth, and not just in the deep south as they would have you believe. The amendment to end slavery states explicitly that you cannot be a slave unless you have been convicted of a crime - its why the prison population in America has exploded ever since then, but more importantly over the last 40-50 years its nearly doubled. A huge amount of government structure has been based on this and frankly a lot of it comes down to money and who is making it. There are then other factors including leadership of the civil rights movements and others that either have been killed or imprisoned - in essence they have missed that to a certain extent. There are so many factors to discuss and not enough time or room here so I will leave it at that, even before we get into the CIA using Black America to fund the black ops - The Contra scandal didn't just have a political goal, it was almost considered 2 birds, one stone.
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 34 minutes ago
I think when you are in the limelight and obviously a confident person(like any actor, spokesperson or anyone in the public eye has to be) you will always rub people up the wrong way and become a hypocrite when you say so much on so many platforms. I guess it can be hypocritical of him, I have not seen the obama remarks myself. But Again in regards to japanese/african immigrants...the jews have also got a history of oppression several times over, and are flourishing in the US on the most part.
The difference between shapiro and peterson and others like gavin mcinnes and milo, is that I don't believe they go out with the intention to insult people.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Shapiro's post college pundit career started with great hits like proposing the forced expulsion of Palestinians from Palestinian territory, and probably more hilariously calling for the internment of Iraq war dissidents (and he was serious). He has ALWAYS been a polemicist. The guy sells "liberal tears" branded mugs. He does set out to insult people.
I take Peterson more seriously in substance and authenticity and I find some arguments of his convincing(if intuitive). He started out more sincerely, but his unexpected explosion of fame has led him down a darker path in my opinion. In Peterson's universe, white, straight males are the only people deserving of his empathy and compassion and vehement defense (the guy has literally teared up twice I've watched talking about how oppressed straight, white males are). Every other grievance is callously dismissed as some fascist identity politics in his view. One-eyed interpretations like that is what I can't abide.
To be honest, arguments about race would take up far too much of my time than I'm willing to commit and it's too fraught a topic for a footie forum like this.
posted on 30/5/18
I like Shapiro, Peterson and Larry Elder. None of them are perfect, they have their biases (as we all do), but they speak the most sense. When they talk, I'm actually interested in what they have to say
There's another guy called Steven Crowder. He's a bit up-his-own-ass for my liking, but he does interesting public debates about popular issues.
Dave Rubin is also worth watching.
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Tu Meke Arteta (U3732)
posted 17 minutes ago
I like Shapiro, Peterson and Larry Elder. None of them are perfect, they have their biases (as we all do), but they speak the most sense. When they talk, I'm actually interested in what they have to say
There's another guy called Steven Crowder. He's a bit up-his-own-ass for my liking, but he does interesting public debates about popular issues.
Dave Rubin is also worth watching.
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Don't even get me started on Dave Rubin. There's no bigger fraud than that clown. A highly inconsistent, intellectually dishonest, shamelessly hypocritical clown. And to be honest, he wouldn't rank in the top 100 of the smartest public commentators/pundits/critics I know.
For some reason, you always sounded like a leftist to me, but apparently not.
posted on 30/5/18
I don't mean I watch him for his own leanings, tbh I don't really know what they are.
That show he does on his channel where he invites guests of any political standpoint and just chats with them. He doesn't get aggressive, he lets his guests talk and make their points. Very different to all these scripted political segments on tv.
As for myself, I'm not really sure what I am. I believe we should be doing more to help people, but people should do more to help themselves. I really just have no time for this identity politics crap that's sweeping the western world now. Dunno where that puts me.
posted on 30/5/18
Channel 4 news have also gone up in my estimations over the last year or so.
posted on 30/5/18
comment by Tu Meke Arteta (U3732)
posted 14 minutes ago
I don't mean I watch him for his own leanings, tbh I don't really know what they are.
That show he does on his channel where he invites guests of any political standpoint and just chats with them. He doesn't get aggressive, he lets his guests talk and make their points. Very different to all these scripted political segments on tv.
As for myself, I'm not really sure what I am. I believe we should be doing more to help people, but people should do more to help themselves. I really just have no time for this identity politics crap that's sweeping the western world now. Dunno where that puts me.
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Well the pundits you love are all right-wing heroes so perhaps you lean there. Rubin's whole shtick is letting his guests do the talking. Except his guests are overwhelmingly on the right - many of them far right (self-avowed white nationalists and identitarians included). He knows where his bread is buttered so he spends his time pandering to his "base" while pretending to be some open-minded centrist at the same time he says things like "liberalism is a disease". If you've listened to him waffle for any length of time on his own opinions, he's an absolute mug.
The thing about this whole backlash against "identity politics" and "political correctness" is how it's come to overcompensate the actual level of "threat" it is supposed to pose to society. These days, it's more offensive to call someone a racist even when they explicitly prove to be so, than it is to actually be racist. Larry Elder was just rambling on his Twitter account about Roseanne's cancellation. The same guy who was offended a few weeks ago by a comedian calling Sarah Sanders a liar and cracking jokes about her eyeliner, pandered to his base by taking more offense at a racist's punishment than the racist likening a woman of colour to an ape. And of course, it's supposed to have more credibility because it's coming from him, a black man. I just don't get that set of priorities.
posted on 30/5/18
“These days, it's more offensive to call someone a racist even when they explicitly prove to be so, than it is to actually be racist. “
Very true. The goalposts are then moved because people don’t think they’re a racist unless they’re on a par with a member of the KKK...
posted on 30/5/18
At most, I'd say I'm in the centre, probably slightly right leaning. But then I love the NHS and other public services, so what the heck do I know.
With Rubin, I think it's ok to change your stance on certain issues if you feel the need to. With him, it's not his political views that change, it's how people perceive his leanings. He used to call himself a liberal, but now he believes in today's society those values make you conservative. Regarding his guests, he says he invites lefty guests on his show, but they decline and he implies they bottle it as they wouldn't be able to hold their own against him. How true that is about his invitations, only he knows.
Agree with your point about racism. I feel like a hypocrite in this regard as I do make jokes about it (even at my own expense), but there's situations where it goes too far. Roseanne Barr is a facking loon, and anyone could tell she was setting herself up for her current situation.
posted on 30/5/18
With Rubin, I think it's ok to change your stance on certain issues if you feel the need to. With him, it's not his political views that change, it's how people perceive his leanings. He used to call himself a liberal, but now he believes in today's society those values make you conservative. Regarding his guests, he says he invites lefty guests on his show, but they decline and he implies they bottle it as they wouldn't be able to hold their own against him. How true that is about his invitations, only he knows.
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Sam Seder once publicly called him out asking to be on Rubin's show and Rubin turned him down apparently cos the guy was too antagonistic for him. He's probably spinning BS to claim that and hilariously over-inflating his own debating ability (he doesn't even debate - he hosts guest monologues). He invites right-wingers and allows them drone on endlessly without confronting their opinions. It is his safe space. And the business model has worked for him. Plenty of liberal commentators have publicly criticized him for not inviting left-wing guests and there is no indication any of those people turned him down.
I have zero problems with him changing his stance. It's watching his singular obsession with left-wing caricatures and pretending they are the ONLY problem in American politics that I find unbelievably, intellectually dishonest. And his spinelessness in his failure or impotence in confronting the opinions of avowed white nationalists that I find vile. There is something wrong with someone if a transgender activist winds you up more than the vile bigots you give a platform.
posted on 30/5/18
Peterson has some good material but has somewhat become a gimmick of himself. In my opinion, he’s stepped outside the boundaries of clinical psychology. He's starting to take on questions which have zero to do with clinical psychology and because he is smart and eloquent, he knows people will listen. I don’t think he says anything hugely unique though.
I think Rubin is a good host/speaker but as pointed above, has little integrity. He used to work for TYT so it shouldn't surprise anyone that he’s like that
As for the others like Shapiro – I think they’re right on some issues but are unbelievably unbalanced regarding others. It irritates the hell out of me, especially when he berates identity politics yet fanatically supports a nation built on the concept of identity.
I actually wouldn't consider Robinson far-right (take that from someone who actually does hold some far-right views ); he just seems more like a leftist who has a dislike towards Islam. This makes him even more insufferable because he doesn't offer anything outside of tedious rants against Muslims. Ann Marie Waters is another who is the same.
posted on 30/5/18
“A spokeswoman for Sanofi, the pharmaceutical company that makes Ambien, said in response to Barr's tweets about taking the sedative: "While all pharmaceutical treatments have side effects, racism is not a known side effect of any Sanofi medication."
On Roseanne Barr blaming sleeping pills on tweeting racist comments.
posted on 31/5/18
Now this was a conversation I didn't want to miss. Such a shame.
Yes, JP is brilliant.
posted on 14/6/18
comment by Sheriff John Brown - Wenger Till I Die (U7482)
posted 2 weeks, 1 day ago
With Rubin, I think it's ok to change your stance on certain issues if you feel the need to. With him, it's not his political views that change, it's how people perceive his leanings. He used to call himself a liberal, but now he believes in today's society those values make you conservative. Regarding his guests, he says he invites lefty guests on his show, but they decline and he implies they bottle it as they wouldn't be able to hold their own against him. How true that is about his invitations, only he knows.
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Sam Seder once publicly called him out asking to be on Rubin's show and Rubin turned him down apparently cos the guy was too antagonistic for him. He's probably spinning BS to claim that and hilariously over-inflating his own debating ability (he doesn't even debate - he hosts guest monologues). He invites right-wingers and allows them drone on endlessly without confronting their opinions. It is his safe space. And the business model has worked for him. Plenty of liberal commentators have publicly criticized him for not inviting left-wing guests and there is no indication any of those people turned him down.
I have zero problems with him changing his stance. It's watching his singular obsession with left-wing caricatures and pretending they are the ONLY problem in American politics that I find unbelievably, intellectually dishonest. And his spinelessness in his failure or impotence in confronting the opinions of avowed white nationalists that I find vile. There is something wrong with someone if a transgender activist winds you up more than the vile bigots you give a platform.
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https://youtu.be/Ev3-7HLcZ5o
Dave Rubin went on the joe Rogan podcast. I see what you mean now, I never really followed his opinions before, but listening to him here he seems very inconsistent and naive.
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