comment by Sir Halfy ...Premier League Thread Master (U11570)
posted 15 minutes ago
Players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Traitor
If performances are out of the manager’s hands then I might get my mate the postman to apply next time the job is advertised. If the team loses then he can just blame the players for not doing as he instructed. Sounds like an easy life to me
Nuno has a great job. Gets praised when we do well and it’s not his fault if we don’t
There is also another small point to consider. If the players aren't good enough then that also reflects on the manager. After all, he chose them and he chose the coaches that make the players what they are.
This is Nuno’s team, Nuno’s tactics, Nuno’s motivation. So when we play poorly like Sunday he has to take part of the blame, as do all those players that performed below par.
My small point is that Nuno and his team have been excellent in all but two games this season, so let’s not over react to us being poor on Sunday
The only thing that hasn't worked well enough this season, is the lack of goals, not the system. We're not putting the chances we do get away and that's got naff all to do with the manager. That lies solely with the players, the same players who were scoring for fun last season.
If things are getting tight in central midfield, then keep the ball wide or simply by-pass them and keep the front three busy. That still works with a 3-4-3.
The system didn't work on Sunday because Huddersfield had a game plan to stifle midfield and it worked perfectly. They were then the better team by far.
We are having a good season so far apart from a couple of below par performances.
However, what does worry me is that when faced with the dilemma he had on Sunday, Nuno seemed unwilling or unable to change tactics/formation.
I agree with that Vinnie, we do need to be able to adjust when things aren't going to plan. We wont get the league position we want by getting the occasional point against the top teams, and then not beating the poorer teams because they stifle our game.
I do think we need to have more options to change the approach, and we do need to get more people into the opponents penalty area if we are going to score more. Bringing in a top striker and then leaving him alone in the area with 4 defenders isn't going to get us more goals. We need to end up with 3 players in the opponents area when we get forward.
Vinnie, that, precisely, is my point. We have good players (though we do need another striker), we play attractive football, we are still doing relatively well, but ...
we should most definitely have a plan B when needed.
We needed it on Sunday, didn't have it, and lost.
We had teams come and try and put us off our stride last season by getting tight and holding, niggly little fouls not enough to get booked for. Worrying Cardiff at home was a prime example. But generally we played our way out of those situations, looked after the ball and used the space that was created by the opposition having three blokes crowding the man on the ball. We kept our shape and stretched the opponents and ended up blunting their stifling tactics.
We didnt do that Sunday, I kept waiting for things to click in to gear and for that to start happening again but it didnt. As Coady has said we were sloppy in our play and couldnt get attacks moving.
As I said earlier in the thread, my fear is that a lack of confidence could start to kick in. The south bank morons have already started expressing themselves, happy to jump on the 'Nuno had a dream' bandwagon and quick to boo and moan as soon as the going gets tough. We cant have that, we need to regain the momentum that brought us to where we are. This is still a very young squad and even the more experienced heads in there are new to this country and this league. Im pretty sure Huddersfield will be seen as an isolated performance in the end and we'll be back on track soon enough.
Yes Oldgold, some teams did try that last season and few succeeded, but they were average to poor Championship sides, this season we have average to poor Premier League sides trying it.
Even Huddersfield and Watford are much better than most of the teams we encountered 12 months ago.
Huddersfield played a kind of 3511 formation so space in the middle of the park was all bottled up, and even our wing backs found no room. Its always difficult playing against a team that outnumbers you in midfield and maybe the plan B in those games is to field Neves, Moutinho and Gibbs White and go for a 352. The extra man Huddersfield had in the centre allowed Mooy, Billing and Pritchard to look better than our midfield players, which they certainly aren't.
On Friday I suspect Cardiff will play aggressively and try to unsettle us. But their recent formation has been 4141 which I think will suit us fine if they stick to that. Just then a matter of us performing as we know we can
comment by Spangles (U17289)
posted about an hour ago
Huddersfield played a kind of 3511 formation so space in the middle of the park was all bottled up, and even our wing backs found no room. Its always difficult playing against a team that outnumbers you in midfield and maybe the plan B in those games is to field Neves, Moutinho and Gibbs White and go for a 352. The extra man Huddersfield had in the centre allowed Mooy, Billing and Pritchard to look better than our midfield players, which they certainly aren't.
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Sounds like a plane mate, care to email it to Nuno?
Actually sounds more like a plan than a plane
Nuno deserves some criticism to me, until we have the ability to change the set up when things are clearly not working then we will continue to see results like that Sunday.
Also think Nuno takes too long to change starting line ups as well, basically waiting til we are poor before switching things up to keep folk on their toes.
Also don't like his substitutions generally as they are basically like for like most of the time.
Quite happy overall though and won't get too disheartened about Sunday but it does now increase the pressure on us Friday.
It seems to me that some on here want it both ways. Now it's 5 in the middle. Kind of contradicts the idea of having more players in the penalty area.
3-4-3 works fine and if our opponents stifle our central midfield, then we play it wide or bypass the middle altogether.
I read about posters wanting to change the system if things are going pear shape, but apart from a 3-5-2 suggestion, I'm not reading any other format.
We need players who can overcome this so called stifling and stick to a system that has got us here and got us points against better sides than Huddersfield. Players must know that teams will come to Molineux in particular and try and do exactly what they did.
Our problem right now is the inability to score goals and only playing 2 up front and 5 in midfield will not help that problem.
4-2-3-1 would be the system i would want to see, something like Neves and Moutinho with MGW ahead of them in the line of three.
The issue we have had goals wise is that our wide players have not been getting into the box and supporting Jimenez as much as they did a year ago and Costa and Jota have generally struggled and to a lesser extent so has Cav albeit he hasn't been back half as long he has been the one that knows where the goal actually is.
Our first goal conceded on Sunday was down to Neves' stray pass and then failing to track back. The second was a free kick that maybe Patricio should have got to.
Had that ball gone a further centimeter or two then we would have been at 1-1 and a different game.
So for me it was players having a bad day at the office and nothing to do with the system that has got us this far.
Apart from last season, remember how we always found it hard to break teams down when they came to our ground. This season is no different and if players like Neves are incapable of finding a way to combat teams who are going to do this to us, then 60m quid will probably buy the kind of player that will find a way.
Now I'm not suggesting we sell any of our players, but they must do a better job than they did on Sunday, if we're serious about making an impression in this league.
Cinci. Playing a 4-2-3-1 is us being more defensive at home and our problem at the moment is the inability to score goals. That won't help, mate.
comment by wolfieintheSunshineState (U16306)
posted 5 minutes ago
Our first goal conceded on Sunday was down to Neves' stray pass and then failing to track back. The second was a free kick that maybe Patricio should have got to.
Had that ball gone a further centimeter or two then we would have been at 1-1 and a different game.
So for me it was players having a bad day at the office and nothing to do with the system that has got us this far.
Apart from last season, remember how we always found it hard to break teams down when they came to our ground. This season is no different and if players like Neves are incapable of finding a way to combat teams who are going to do this to us, then 60m quid will probably buy the kind of player that will find a way.
Now I'm not suggesting we sell any of our players, but they must do a better job than they did on Sunday, if we're serious about making an impression in this league.
Cinci. Playing a 4-2-3-1 is us being more defensive at home and our problem at the moment is the inability to score goals. That won't help, mate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Four attacking players as opposed to the three we currently use
If you're going with 4 attacking players, won't that make our midfield even more exposed?
This makes a darn good read, highlighting the need for the PLAYERS to step up and be counted.:-
https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/football/wolverhampton-wanderers-fc/2018/11/27/comment-nuno-wont-trade-in-beliefs-for-wolves-success/
comment by wolfieintheSunshineState (U16306)
posted 39 minutes ago
If you're going with 4 attacking players, won't that make our midfield even more exposed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No because MGW would become the third midfielder when we don't have the ball.
comment by wolfieintheSunshineState (U16306)
posted about an hour ago
Our first goal conceded on Sunday was down to Neves' stray pass and then failing to track back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You mean Doherty?
comment by Cinciwolf---so glad I wasn't careful what I wished for!! (U11551)
posted about 2 hours ago
4-2-3-1 would be the system i would want to see, something like Neves and Moutinho with MGW ahead of them in the line of three.
The issue we have had goals wise is that our wide players have not been getting into the box and supporting Jimenez as much as they did a year ago and Costa and Jota have generally struggled and to a lesser extent so has Cav albeit he hasn't been back half as long he has been the one that knows where the goal actually is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cav probably put in the worst performance we have seen from any of the front 3 options at the weekend to be fair. He seemed to give the ball away every time he got it.
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Cinciwolf---so glad I wasn't careful what I wished for!! (U11551)
posted about 2 hours ago
4-2-3-1 would be the system i would want to see, something like Neves and Moutinho with MGW ahead of them in the line of three.
The issue we have had goals wise is that our wide players have not been getting into the box and supporting Jimenez as much as they did a year ago and Costa and Jota have generally struggled and to a lesser extent so has Cav albeit he hasn't been back half as long he has been the one that knows where the goal actually is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cav probably put in the worst performance we have seen from any of the front 3 options at the weekend to be fair. He seemed to give the ball away every time he got it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Costa gave the ball away more than cav this weekend as it goes.
Not defending any of them but Costa and Jota in particular have to contribute much much more, I don't think either has scored and I know Costa hasn't even got an assist, you need more than that from a key part of the set up.
Cav is probably just reaching 100% after injury but has still scored a couple already.
As for Traore, so far I think we have massively overpaid.
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Page 2 of 4
posted on 27/11/18
comment by Sir Halfy ...Premier League Thread Master (U11570)
posted 15 minutes ago
Players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Traitor
posted on 27/11/18
If performances are out of the manager’s hands then I might get my mate the postman to apply next time the job is advertised. If the team loses then he can just blame the players for not doing as he instructed. Sounds like an easy life to me
Nuno has a great job. Gets praised when we do well and it’s not his fault if we don’t
posted on 27/11/18
There is also another small point to consider. If the players aren't good enough then that also reflects on the manager. After all, he chose them and he chose the coaches that make the players what they are.
posted on 27/11/18
This is Nuno’s team, Nuno’s tactics, Nuno’s motivation. So when we play poorly like Sunday he has to take part of the blame, as do all those players that performed below par.
My small point is that Nuno and his team have been excellent in all but two games this season, so let’s not over react to us being poor on Sunday
posted on 28/11/18
The only thing that hasn't worked well enough this season, is the lack of goals, not the system. We're not putting the chances we do get away and that's got naff all to do with the manager. That lies solely with the players, the same players who were scoring for fun last season.
If things are getting tight in central midfield, then keep the ball wide or simply by-pass them and keep the front three busy. That still works with a 3-4-3.
posted on 28/11/18
The system didn't work on Sunday because Huddersfield had a game plan to stifle midfield and it worked perfectly. They were then the better team by far.
We are having a good season so far apart from a couple of below par performances.
However, what does worry me is that when faced with the dilemma he had on Sunday, Nuno seemed unwilling or unable to change tactics/formation.
posted on 28/11/18
I agree with that Vinnie, we do need to be able to adjust when things aren't going to plan. We wont get the league position we want by getting the occasional point against the top teams, and then not beating the poorer teams because they stifle our game.
I do think we need to have more options to change the approach, and we do need to get more people into the opponents penalty area if we are going to score more. Bringing in a top striker and then leaving him alone in the area with 4 defenders isn't going to get us more goals. We need to end up with 3 players in the opponents area when we get forward.
posted on 28/11/18
Vinnie, that, precisely, is my point. We have good players (though we do need another striker), we play attractive football, we are still doing relatively well, but ...
we should most definitely have a plan B when needed.
We needed it on Sunday, didn't have it, and lost.
posted on 28/11/18
We had teams come and try and put us off our stride last season by getting tight and holding, niggly little fouls not enough to get booked for. Worrying Cardiff at home was a prime example. But generally we played our way out of those situations, looked after the ball and used the space that was created by the opposition having three blokes crowding the man on the ball. We kept our shape and stretched the opponents and ended up blunting their stifling tactics.
We didnt do that Sunday, I kept waiting for things to click in to gear and for that to start happening again but it didnt. As Coady has said we were sloppy in our play and couldnt get attacks moving.
As I said earlier in the thread, my fear is that a lack of confidence could start to kick in. The south bank morons have already started expressing themselves, happy to jump on the 'Nuno had a dream' bandwagon and quick to boo and moan as soon as the going gets tough. We cant have that, we need to regain the momentum that brought us to where we are. This is still a very young squad and even the more experienced heads in there are new to this country and this league. Im pretty sure Huddersfield will be seen as an isolated performance in the end and we'll be back on track soon enough.
posted on 28/11/18
Yes Oldgold, some teams did try that last season and few succeeded, but they were average to poor Championship sides, this season we have average to poor Premier League sides trying it.
Even Huddersfield and Watford are much better than most of the teams we encountered 12 months ago.
posted on 28/11/18
Huddersfield played a kind of 3511 formation so space in the middle of the park was all bottled up, and even our wing backs found no room. Its always difficult playing against a team that outnumbers you in midfield and maybe the plan B in those games is to field Neves, Moutinho and Gibbs White and go for a 352. The extra man Huddersfield had in the centre allowed Mooy, Billing and Pritchard to look better than our midfield players, which they certainly aren't.
posted on 28/11/18
On Friday I suspect Cardiff will play aggressively and try to unsettle us. But their recent formation has been 4141 which I think will suit us fine if they stick to that. Just then a matter of us performing as we know we can
posted on 28/11/18
comment by Spangles (U17289)
posted about an hour ago
Huddersfield played a kind of 3511 formation so space in the middle of the park was all bottled up, and even our wing backs found no room. Its always difficult playing against a team that outnumbers you in midfield and maybe the plan B in those games is to field Neves, Moutinho and Gibbs White and go for a 352. The extra man Huddersfield had in the centre allowed Mooy, Billing and Pritchard to look better than our midfield players, which they certainly aren't.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sounds like a plane mate, care to email it to Nuno?
posted on 28/11/18
Actually sounds more like a plan than a plane
posted on 28/11/18
Nuno deserves some criticism to me, until we have the ability to change the set up when things are clearly not working then we will continue to see results like that Sunday.
Also think Nuno takes too long to change starting line ups as well, basically waiting til we are poor before switching things up to keep folk on their toes.
Also don't like his substitutions generally as they are basically like for like most of the time.
Quite happy overall though and won't get too disheartened about Sunday but it does now increase the pressure on us Friday.
posted on 28/11/18
It seems to me that some on here want it both ways. Now it's 5 in the middle. Kind of contradicts the idea of having more players in the penalty area.
3-4-3 works fine and if our opponents stifle our central midfield, then we play it wide or bypass the middle altogether.
I read about posters wanting to change the system if things are going pear shape, but apart from a 3-5-2 suggestion, I'm not reading any other format.
We need players who can overcome this so called stifling and stick to a system that has got us here and got us points against better sides than Huddersfield. Players must know that teams will come to Molineux in particular and try and do exactly what they did.
Our problem right now is the inability to score goals and only playing 2 up front and 5 in midfield will not help that problem.
posted on 28/11/18
4-2-3-1 would be the system i would want to see, something like Neves and Moutinho with MGW ahead of them in the line of three.
The issue we have had goals wise is that our wide players have not been getting into the box and supporting Jimenez as much as they did a year ago and Costa and Jota have generally struggled and to a lesser extent so has Cav albeit he hasn't been back half as long he has been the one that knows where the goal actually is.
posted on 28/11/18
Our first goal conceded on Sunday was down to Neves' stray pass and then failing to track back. The second was a free kick that maybe Patricio should have got to.
Had that ball gone a further centimeter or two then we would have been at 1-1 and a different game.
So for me it was players having a bad day at the office and nothing to do with the system that has got us this far.
Apart from last season, remember how we always found it hard to break teams down when they came to our ground. This season is no different and if players like Neves are incapable of finding a way to combat teams who are going to do this to us, then 60m quid will probably buy the kind of player that will find a way.
Now I'm not suggesting we sell any of our players, but they must do a better job than they did on Sunday, if we're serious about making an impression in this league.
Cinci. Playing a 4-2-3-1 is us being more defensive at home and our problem at the moment is the inability to score goals. That won't help, mate.
posted on 28/11/18
comment by wolfieintheSunshineState (U16306)
posted 5 minutes ago
Our first goal conceded on Sunday was down to Neves' stray pass and then failing to track back. The second was a free kick that maybe Patricio should have got to.
Had that ball gone a further centimeter or two then we would have been at 1-1 and a different game.
So for me it was players having a bad day at the office and nothing to do with the system that has got us this far.
Apart from last season, remember how we always found it hard to break teams down when they came to our ground. This season is no different and if players like Neves are incapable of finding a way to combat teams who are going to do this to us, then 60m quid will probably buy the kind of player that will find a way.
Now I'm not suggesting we sell any of our players, but they must do a better job than they did on Sunday, if we're serious about making an impression in this league.
Cinci. Playing a 4-2-3-1 is us being more defensive at home and our problem at the moment is the inability to score goals. That won't help, mate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Four attacking players as opposed to the three we currently use
posted on 28/11/18
If you're going with 4 attacking players, won't that make our midfield even more exposed?
posted on 28/11/18
This makes a darn good read, highlighting the need for the PLAYERS to step up and be counted.:-
https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/football/wolverhampton-wanderers-fc/2018/11/27/comment-nuno-wont-trade-in-beliefs-for-wolves-success/
posted on 28/11/18
comment by wolfieintheSunshineState (U16306)
posted 39 minutes ago
If you're going with 4 attacking players, won't that make our midfield even more exposed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No because MGW would become the third midfielder when we don't have the ball.
posted on 28/11/18
comment by wolfieintheSunshineState (U16306)
posted about an hour ago
Our first goal conceded on Sunday was down to Neves' stray pass and then failing to track back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You mean Doherty?
posted on 28/11/18
comment by Cinciwolf---so glad I wasn't careful what I wished for!! (U11551)
posted about 2 hours ago
4-2-3-1 would be the system i would want to see, something like Neves and Moutinho with MGW ahead of them in the line of three.
The issue we have had goals wise is that our wide players have not been getting into the box and supporting Jimenez as much as they did a year ago and Costa and Jota have generally struggled and to a lesser extent so has Cav albeit he hasn't been back half as long he has been the one that knows where the goal actually is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cav probably put in the worst performance we have seen from any of the front 3 options at the weekend to be fair. He seemed to give the ball away every time he got it.
posted on 28/11/18
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Cinciwolf---so glad I wasn't careful what I wished for!! (U11551)
posted about 2 hours ago
4-2-3-1 would be the system i would want to see, something like Neves and Moutinho with MGW ahead of them in the line of three.
The issue we have had goals wise is that our wide players have not been getting into the box and supporting Jimenez as much as they did a year ago and Costa and Jota have generally struggled and to a lesser extent so has Cav albeit he hasn't been back half as long he has been the one that knows where the goal actually is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cav probably put in the worst performance we have seen from any of the front 3 options at the weekend to be fair. He seemed to give the ball away every time he got it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Costa gave the ball away more than cav this weekend as it goes.
Not defending any of them but Costa and Jota in particular have to contribute much much more, I don't think either has scored and I know Costa hasn't even got an assist, you need more than that from a key part of the set up.
Cav is probably just reaching 100% after injury but has still scored a couple already.
As for Traore, so far I think we have massively overpaid.
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