If a player is weak mentally and can't cope then he isn't one of the best in the first place.
Mental health/Mentality develops for a lot of players over time.
Or doesn't. For me it's part of the entire package. At 21 you should already have it. If you don't then it's likely not something you've got. It's not as if he's a blossoming teen.
Agreed. I like Tammy but he also isn’t a miracle worker. He relies on service, and as I’ve said before n games we struggle literally any striker would struggle to score. It is also unlikely that Sarri even uses him. Recalling a young player midway through season to barely use him would only ostracise them further (see Ake). Happy for him to replace Giroud as early as next summer although a loan at top level will earn him the trust from fans/managers
He doesn't need our trust. At this point we trust anyone can be better than Giroud and Morata.
Good article, why put him in an unnecessary sink or swim situation?
Very true on Christensen (a player who was FAR better prepared for the first team than Abraham). One high profile error against Barcelona and he's not looked the same since, lost confidence in his ability to play out from the back. What's sad is he could've been a makeshift Jorginho backup if he was still the same defender we got back from Germany.
comment by RtM (U1097)
posted 33 minutes ago
Or doesn't. For me it's part of the entire package. At 21 you should already have it. If you don't then it's likely not something you've got. It's not as if he's a blossoming teen.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are still learning a hell of a lot about yourself and life at 21.
I only wish i knew what i knew at 21 what i do now.
In life yes. In football nah.
Sorry but this is such a flawed article for my point of view. We're talking about a 21 year old not a 17 year old.
And how do you justify making a differential from one player to another? Situations from individuals are completely null and void. If you think Christensen doesn't have what it takes, fair enough that's your opinion but it can't be leveraged as an argument against another player of a totally different personality.
If you think Christensen doesn't have the mineral obviously that's your opinion but please don't use him as a barometer to judge another player.
There's only one way to find if these young players are good enough and that's to try them. Hopefully Higgy will be a success and this won't bite us on the ar$e but please don't try selling me the same old lame excuses about pressure and mentality blah, blah, blah!
I don't get people giving up on Christensen after the first bad patch he's hit in his career. Terry was starting to get games in his late teens, but it wasn't all plain sailing from there. It rarely is for any footballer.
You might be a pretty well-rounded player technically at 21, but you still have a hell of a lot to learn about how to handle yourself in a huge variety of situations you're yet to come up against both on and off the pitch.
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 18 minutes ago
Sorry but this is such a flawed article for my point of view. We're talking about a 21 year old not a 17 year old.
And how do you justify making a differential from one player to another? Situations from individuals are completely null and void. If you think Christensen doesn't have what it takes, fair enough that's your opinion but it can't be leveraged as an argument against another player of a totally different personality.
If you think Christensen doesn't have the mineral obviously that's your opinion but please don't use him as a barometer to judge another player.
There's only one way to find if these young players are good enough and that's to try them. Hopefully Higgy will be a success and this won't bite us on the ar$e but please don't try selling me the same old lame excuses about pressure and mentality blah, blah, blah!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mental aspect equates to 99.9% of making it at the top in any field, when I was younger I worked in Tesco with lads who on talent alone could have been PL players.
In your teens to early 20s you are developing emotionally and mentally, it's not an excuse, it's a cold hard fact. There's a reason there's very few examples of players that age being leading players at top clubs. People cite Rashford but he has NEVER at any point been tasked with being United chief go to guy to fire United to top 4/titles, which is what Tammy would have had to be had we brought him back this window, he's been able to develop as a supplement to the main players.
I'm all for giving Abraham a shot as part of our squad ,but pining all our hopes on a player who has yet to do it outside the Championship is the kind of suicidal decision making that our board gets bashed for daily .
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 3 minutes ago
I don't get people giving up on Christensen after the first bad patch he's hit in his career. Terry was starting to get games in his late teens, but it wasn't all plain sailing from there. It rarely is for any footballer.
You might be a pretty well-rounded player technically at 21, but you still have a hell of a lot to learn about how to handle yourself in a huge variety of situations you're yet to come up against both on and off the pitch.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly, Luiz regularly makes horrendous mistakes, well into his 30s, yet still gets latitude to carry on regardless.
I find the attitude to younger players is noticeably of a lower threshold with newer fans eager for the quick success they crave.
Players like Osgood, Hollins, Harris and Wilkins were 1st teamers as teenagers, if they'd come through today they'd never have been heard of.
comment by DL11 (U21614)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 18 minutes ago
Sorry but this is such a flawed article for my point of view. We're talking about a 21 year old not a 17 year old.
And how do you justify making a differential from one player to another? Situations from individuals are completely null and void. If you think Christensen doesn't have what it takes, fair enough that's your opinion but it can't be leveraged as an argument against another player of a totally different personality.
If you think Christensen doesn't have the mineral obviously that's your opinion but please don't use him as a barometer to judge another player.
There's only one way to find if these young players are good enough and that's to try them. Hopefully Higgy will be a success and this won't bite us on the ar$e but please don't try selling me the same old lame excuses about pressure and mentality blah, blah, blah!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mental aspect equates to 99.9% of making it at the top in any field, when I was younger I worked in Tesco with lads who on talent alone could have been PL players.
In your teens to early 20s you are developing emotionally and mentally, it's not an excuse, it's a cold hard fact. There's a reason there's very few examples of players that age being leading players at top clubs. People cite Rashford but he has NEVER at any point been tasked with being United chief go to guy to fire United to top 4/titles, which is what Tammy would have had to be had we brought him back this window, he's been able to develop as a supplement to the main players.
I'm all for giving Abraham a shot as part of our squad ,but pining all our hopes on a player who has yet to do it outside the Championship is the kind of suicidal decision making that our board gets bashed for daily .
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Please don't tell me anything is a cold hard fact when it's anything but!
Tell me it's your opinion by all means but don't try and tell me white is black!
I'm with you Brummie. I actually have a lot of hope for Christensen but to make out that he's fragile mentally and we need to take it easy with him is nonsense. As a defender that never say die attitude should be part of who you are from the start.
Mistakes are fine....as long as you learn from them and move on. If a mistake haunts you and ruins the rest of your season then you simply don't have what it takes at this level. End of.
That's not true, RtM. Just because you don't bounce back immediately doesn't men you never will. You can have a poor season or half season and still go on to become a top player in your position.
Generally at another club. It's unlikely a top club will keep you around if you give a poor season.
Christensen is allegedly wanted by a host of top European clubs - there's probably a good reason for that!
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 7 minutes ago
Please don't tell me anything is a cold hard fact when it's anything but!
Tell me it's your opinion by all means but don't try and tell me white is black!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay sorry ill rephrase, in my experience of not only being that age myself but then going onto have close friends, family and work colleagues that age when i was a bit older i believe the average person doesn't develop properly in most aspects of life until their mid 20's.
Ofcourse there's exceptions (in football terms you're looking at Hazard, Mbappe Rooney etc al) but i have some big responsibility in my work RN and if i was given those same responsibility's at 21 i would have likely wound up sectioned, colleagues in a similar boat believe same applies to them.
In my opinion Tammy is the type of footballer that needs gradual evolution (similar to what Lingard had at United) and bringing him back next season to learn from and supplement one of the top strikers of the last decade (assuming he's a reliative success) is the appropriate next step for me.
comment by RtM (U1097)
posted 11 minutes ago
I'm with you Brummie. I actually have a lot of hope for Christensen but to make out that he's fragile mentally and we need to take it easy with him is nonsense. As a defender that never say die attitude should be part of who you are from the start.
Mistakes are fine....as long as you learn from them and move on. If a mistake haunts you and ruins the rest of your season then you simply don't have what it takes at this level. End of.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To a point, but if you're having a bit of a rut the manager should start managing game time a bit better.
Christensen had to go straight back out in both Manc grounds and the Camp Nou almost immediately after his Barca error, that is a relentless schedule for a 21 year old who's only recently returned from injury and had his conference shot.
comment by DL11 (U21614)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 7 minutes ago
Please don't tell me anything is a cold hard fact when it's anything but!
Tell me it's your opinion by all means but don't try and tell me white is black!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay sorry ill rephrase, in my experience of not only being that age myself but then going onto have close friends, family and work colleagues that age when i was a bit older i believe the average person doesn't develop properly in most aspects of life until their mid 20's.
Ofcourse there's exceptions (in football terms you're looking at Hazard, Mbappe Rooney etc al) but i have some big responsibility in my work RN and if i was given those same responsibility's at 21 i would have likely wound up sectioned, colleagues in a similar boat believe same applies to them.
In my opinion Tammy is the type of footballer that needs gradual evolution (similar to what Lingard had at United) and bringing him back next season to learn from and supplement one of the top strikers of the last decade (assuming he's a reliative success) is the appropriate next step for me.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If that's your opinion then fine I'm totally cool with it but from my perspective I don't feel you can pigeon hole people like that.
Individuals mature mentally and physically at different times.
I personally feel that at 21 a footballer is at the age were he either sinks or swims, I'd go further than that and say it's probably getting late in the day for someone.
Michael Owen was leading England's attack at 17/18 others might not come to the fore until later in life.
In my point of view a lot of it is down to the exposure you get in your chosen field.
No wrongs or rights but as far as I'm concerned, you don't try, you don't find out.
comment by RtM (U1097)
posted 19 minutes ago
Generally at another club. It's unlikely a top club will keep you around if you give a poor season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There will always be more players who don’t make it than those who do, but I could name quite a few just in our current Real Madrid side who struggled early doors and have gone on to be crucial for us. It took Marcelo years to break through. It took a few seasons for Higuaïn to establish himself, and then it took Benzema a few more to fully displace him. Varane has his ups and downs. I could go on, but I think you get the gist.
IOAG, i don't think anyone is writing AC27 off and maybe i was a bit harsh in my assessment but i feel Conte should have took him out of the firing line after Barca because he started second guessing himself in situations he was dealing with naturally prior to that.
True. The idea benching a youngster will destroy his confidence is silly. Virtually every player needs to be benched at times, more so earlier on in their careers.
It’s how they cope with that situation and what they learn from it that goes towards making or breaking them as top players.
Managers will always have a better knowledge of their players, but even they don’t always know how a lad will react to adversity until he has to go through it.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
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The summer is the time to bring Tammy back
Page 1 of 2
posted on 2/2/19
If a player is weak mentally and can't cope then he isn't one of the best in the first place.
posted on 2/2/19
Mental health/Mentality develops for a lot of players over time.
posted on 2/2/19
Or doesn't. For me it's part of the entire package. At 21 you should already have it. If you don't then it's likely not something you've got. It's not as if he's a blossoming teen.
posted on 2/2/19
Agreed. I like Tammy but he also isn’t a miracle worker. He relies on service, and as I’ve said before n games we struggle literally any striker would struggle to score. It is also unlikely that Sarri even uses him. Recalling a young player midway through season to barely use him would only ostracise them further (see Ake). Happy for him to replace Giroud as early as next summer although a loan at top level will earn him the trust from fans/managers
posted on 2/2/19
*succesful loan
posted on 2/2/19
He doesn't need our trust. At this point we trust anyone can be better than Giroud and Morata.
posted on 2/2/19
Good article, why put him in an unnecessary sink or swim situation?
Very true on Christensen (a player who was FAR better prepared for the first team than Abraham). One high profile error against Barcelona and he's not looked the same since, lost confidence in his ability to play out from the back. What's sad is he could've been a makeshift Jorginho backup if he was still the same defender we got back from Germany.
posted on 2/2/19
comment by RtM (U1097)
posted 33 minutes ago
Or doesn't. For me it's part of the entire package. At 21 you should already have it. If you don't then it's likely not something you've got. It's not as if he's a blossoming teen.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are still learning a hell of a lot about yourself and life at 21.
I only wish i knew what i knew at 21 what i do now.
posted on 2/2/19
In life yes. In football nah.
posted on 2/2/19
Sorry but this is such a flawed article for my point of view. We're talking about a 21 year old not a 17 year old.
And how do you justify making a differential from one player to another? Situations from individuals are completely null and void. If you think Christensen doesn't have what it takes, fair enough that's your opinion but it can't be leveraged as an argument against another player of a totally different personality.
If you think Christensen doesn't have the mineral obviously that's your opinion but please don't use him as a barometer to judge another player.
There's only one way to find if these young players are good enough and that's to try them. Hopefully Higgy will be a success and this won't bite us on the ar$e but please don't try selling me the same old lame excuses about pressure and mentality blah, blah, blah!
posted on 2/2/19
I don't get people giving up on Christensen after the first bad patch he's hit in his career. Terry was starting to get games in his late teens, but it wasn't all plain sailing from there. It rarely is for any footballer.
You might be a pretty well-rounded player technically at 21, but you still have a hell of a lot to learn about how to handle yourself in a huge variety of situations you're yet to come up against both on and off the pitch.
posted on 2/2/19
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 18 minutes ago
Sorry but this is such a flawed article for my point of view. We're talking about a 21 year old not a 17 year old.
And how do you justify making a differential from one player to another? Situations from individuals are completely null and void. If you think Christensen doesn't have what it takes, fair enough that's your opinion but it can't be leveraged as an argument against another player of a totally different personality.
If you think Christensen doesn't have the mineral obviously that's your opinion but please don't use him as a barometer to judge another player.
There's only one way to find if these young players are good enough and that's to try them. Hopefully Higgy will be a success and this won't bite us on the ar$e but please don't try selling me the same old lame excuses about pressure and mentality blah, blah, blah!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mental aspect equates to 99.9% of making it at the top in any field, when I was younger I worked in Tesco with lads who on talent alone could have been PL players.
In your teens to early 20s you are developing emotionally and mentally, it's not an excuse, it's a cold hard fact. There's a reason there's very few examples of players that age being leading players at top clubs. People cite Rashford but he has NEVER at any point been tasked with being United chief go to guy to fire United to top 4/titles, which is what Tammy would have had to be had we brought him back this window, he's been able to develop as a supplement to the main players.
I'm all for giving Abraham a shot as part of our squad ,but pining all our hopes on a player who has yet to do it outside the Championship is the kind of suicidal decision making that our board gets bashed for daily .
posted on 2/2/19
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 3 minutes ago
I don't get people giving up on Christensen after the first bad patch he's hit in his career. Terry was starting to get games in his late teens, but it wasn't all plain sailing from there. It rarely is for any footballer.
You might be a pretty well-rounded player technically at 21, but you still have a hell of a lot to learn about how to handle yourself in a huge variety of situations you're yet to come up against both on and off the pitch.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly, Luiz regularly makes horrendous mistakes, well into his 30s, yet still gets latitude to carry on regardless.
I find the attitude to younger players is noticeably of a lower threshold with newer fans eager for the quick success they crave.
Players like Osgood, Hollins, Harris and Wilkins were 1st teamers as teenagers, if they'd come through today they'd never have been heard of.
posted on 2/2/19
comment by DL11 (U21614)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 18 minutes ago
Sorry but this is such a flawed article for my point of view. We're talking about a 21 year old not a 17 year old.
And how do you justify making a differential from one player to another? Situations from individuals are completely null and void. If you think Christensen doesn't have what it takes, fair enough that's your opinion but it can't be leveraged as an argument against another player of a totally different personality.
If you think Christensen doesn't have the mineral obviously that's your opinion but please don't use him as a barometer to judge another player.
There's only one way to find if these young players are good enough and that's to try them. Hopefully Higgy will be a success and this won't bite us on the ar$e but please don't try selling me the same old lame excuses about pressure and mentality blah, blah, blah!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mental aspect equates to 99.9% of making it at the top in any field, when I was younger I worked in Tesco with lads who on talent alone could have been PL players.
In your teens to early 20s you are developing emotionally and mentally, it's not an excuse, it's a cold hard fact. There's a reason there's very few examples of players that age being leading players at top clubs. People cite Rashford but he has NEVER at any point been tasked with being United chief go to guy to fire United to top 4/titles, which is what Tammy would have had to be had we brought him back this window, he's been able to develop as a supplement to the main players.
I'm all for giving Abraham a shot as part of our squad ,but pining all our hopes on a player who has yet to do it outside the Championship is the kind of suicidal decision making that our board gets bashed for daily .
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Please don't tell me anything is a cold hard fact when it's anything but!
Tell me it's your opinion by all means but don't try and tell me white is black!
posted on 2/2/19
I'm with you Brummie. I actually have a lot of hope for Christensen but to make out that he's fragile mentally and we need to take it easy with him is nonsense. As a defender that never say die attitude should be part of who you are from the start.
Mistakes are fine....as long as you learn from them and move on. If a mistake haunts you and ruins the rest of your season then you simply don't have what it takes at this level. End of.
posted on 2/2/19
That's not true, RtM. Just because you don't bounce back immediately doesn't men you never will. You can have a poor season or half season and still go on to become a top player in your position.
posted on 2/2/19
Generally at another club. It's unlikely a top club will keep you around if you give a poor season.
posted on 2/2/19
Christensen is allegedly wanted by a host of top European clubs - there's probably a good reason for that!
posted on 2/2/19
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 7 minutes ago
Please don't tell me anything is a cold hard fact when it's anything but!
Tell me it's your opinion by all means but don't try and tell me white is black!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay sorry ill rephrase, in my experience of not only being that age myself but then going onto have close friends, family and work colleagues that age when i was a bit older i believe the average person doesn't develop properly in most aspects of life until their mid 20's.
Ofcourse there's exceptions (in football terms you're looking at Hazard, Mbappe Rooney etc al) but i have some big responsibility in my work RN and if i was given those same responsibility's at 21 i would have likely wound up sectioned, colleagues in a similar boat believe same applies to them.
In my opinion Tammy is the type of footballer that needs gradual evolution (similar to what Lingard had at United) and bringing him back next season to learn from and supplement one of the top strikers of the last decade (assuming he's a reliative success) is the appropriate next step for me.
posted on 2/2/19
comment by RtM (U1097)
posted 11 minutes ago
I'm with you Brummie. I actually have a lot of hope for Christensen but to make out that he's fragile mentally and we need to take it easy with him is nonsense. As a defender that never say die attitude should be part of who you are from the start.
Mistakes are fine....as long as you learn from them and move on. If a mistake haunts you and ruins the rest of your season then you simply don't have what it takes at this level. End of.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To a point, but if you're having a bit of a rut the manager should start managing game time a bit better.
Christensen had to go straight back out in both Manc grounds and the Camp Nou almost immediately after his Barca error, that is a relentless schedule for a 21 year old who's only recently returned from injury and had his conference shot.
posted on 2/2/19
comment by DL11 (U21614)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by BrummieBlue! (U3487)
posted 7 minutes ago
Please don't tell me anything is a cold hard fact when it's anything but!
Tell me it's your opinion by all means but don't try and tell me white is black!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay sorry ill rephrase, in my experience of not only being that age myself but then going onto have close friends, family and work colleagues that age when i was a bit older i believe the average person doesn't develop properly in most aspects of life until their mid 20's.
Ofcourse there's exceptions (in football terms you're looking at Hazard, Mbappe Rooney etc al) but i have some big responsibility in my work RN and if i was given those same responsibility's at 21 i would have likely wound up sectioned, colleagues in a similar boat believe same applies to them.
In my opinion Tammy is the type of footballer that needs gradual evolution (similar to what Lingard had at United) and bringing him back next season to learn from and supplement one of the top strikers of the last decade (assuming he's a reliative success) is the appropriate next step for me.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If that's your opinion then fine I'm totally cool with it but from my perspective I don't feel you can pigeon hole people like that.
Individuals mature mentally and physically at different times.
I personally feel that at 21 a footballer is at the age were he either sinks or swims, I'd go further than that and say it's probably getting late in the day for someone.
Michael Owen was leading England's attack at 17/18 others might not come to the fore until later in life.
In my point of view a lot of it is down to the exposure you get in your chosen field.
No wrongs or rights but as far as I'm concerned, you don't try, you don't find out.
posted on 2/2/19
comment by RtM (U1097)
posted 19 minutes ago
Generally at another club. It's unlikely a top club will keep you around if you give a poor season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There will always be more players who don’t make it than those who do, but I could name quite a few just in our current Real Madrid side who struggled early doors and have gone on to be crucial for us. It took Marcelo years to break through. It took a few seasons for Higuaïn to establish himself, and then it took Benzema a few more to fully displace him. Varane has his ups and downs. I could go on, but I think you get the gist.
posted on 2/2/19
IOAG, i don't think anyone is writing AC27 off and maybe i was a bit harsh in my assessment but i feel Conte should have took him out of the firing line after Barca because he started second guessing himself in situations he was dealing with naturally prior to that.
posted on 2/2/19
True. The idea benching a youngster will destroy his confidence is silly. Virtually every player needs to be benched at times, more so earlier on in their careers.
It’s how they cope with that situation and what they learn from it that goes towards making or breaking them as top players.
Managers will always have a better knowledge of their players, but even they don’t always know how a lad will react to adversity until he has to go through it.
posted on 2/2/19
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Page 1 of 2